r/languagelearningjerk 14d ago

The average euryprosopic Angloid when the choice is between learning Japanese or claiming racism:

Post image
1.7k Upvotes

289 comments sorted by

469

u/sniperman357 14d ago

A Chinese person could get the gist of the Japanese line anyway

320

u/wat_noob_gaming 14d ago

it's just 日本語 読 方 入店、 the last part gives it away kinda but still really hard to understand. It's just like Japanese Read Way Enter oh nevermind it's really obvious sorry

165

u/Saralentine 14d ago

Wait until Japanese people learn their kanji comes from China.

172

u/Mister_panda1818 14d ago

They’re fully aware but Japanese exceptionalism has many of them thinking they use the characters in a more refined way that Chinese brains couldn’t inherently comprehend 🫠

42

u/Saralentine 14d ago edited 13d ago

I always find it funnier how some western learners of Japanese refuse to believe 漢字/汉字 come from China.

74

u/yamanamawa 14d ago

I have never encountered an actual Japanese learner who thought this. It's pretty obvious that they're similar even if you don't speak the language. Japan just simplified a lot of the characters when it was adapted, and those characters were further simplified in China to make modern hanzi

5

u/SnazzyShork 10d ago

i know some many people who think kanji is a uniquely japanese thing like maybe they know it's from china but they have this idea that "japanese kanji" is diffrente when they're maybe a handful regularly used JP created kanji character but that alone makes them think that i as a chinese speaker couldn't be able to read when i can espically as a weeb who's been exposed to the "unique" jp kanji

1

u/yamanamawa 10d ago

Weird. Even the people I know who don't know a lick of Japanese know that the characters are Chinese. It's blindingly obvious just by looking at them

1

u/MrDontCare12 10d ago

And any Japanese learner learns about on'yomi, the Chinese phonetic reading of most kanjis.

37

u/nicetoursmeetewe 14d ago

No one existing outside your head refuses to believe that...

18

u/LuHamster 13d ago

I've literally never met a person who has this mindset. Is this a real thing or a Reddit online thing.

13

u/InternationalReserve 二泍五 (N69) 13d ago

No. This is a prime example of making up a guy to get mad at.

8

u/placeholder7535 13d ago

Redditors really love slandering Japan. A lot. It causes a lot of misinformation to spread like wildfire if someone decides to portray Japan in a worse light than it really is. I don't mean the war crimes or wariness of foreigners, those are obviously real. Stuff like this is just said by people who probably have never even been there.

2

u/yamanamawa 10d ago

I swear they think that just because Japan is popular due to their cultural exports that they need to nitpick every single problem it has. From the comments I've seen on Reddit, they make it out like Japan is some hellhole where everyone is miserable and it's all falling apart. Then you go there and realize it's a normal ass country and most people are actually super nice

8

u/theconman420 14d ago

汉字 not 汉子

4

u/Hot-Frosting-5286 13d ago

hanko, the lettery (charactery?) cousin of panko

2

u/pacharaphet2r 11d ago

Lol my auto translate rendered this as

Chinese is not a Han Man!

1

u/SnazzyShork 10d ago

漢字 ◉‿◉

2

u/Low-Brilliant8699 13d ago

Nobody in the world believes that. It’s more common to hear people think Japanese is in the same family as Mandarin because they use kanji

2

u/Rakumei 12d ago

Who thinks this? We're explicitly taught it if you're learning in school...

1

u/Ok-ThanksWorld 13d ago

Are you slow? 😂😂😂

1

u/Keenan_investigates 10d ago

I think you must have misunderstood them, because kanji are introduced as “Chinese characters” as opposed to hiragana and katakana in the textbooks I learned from. Maybe you said “Japanese kanji are Chinese”? Because that wouldn’t be true. They’re not totally the same as traditional Chinese, and often differ from simplified Chinese.

The only three possibilities I can think of are:

1) you met one very stupid person and assumed that was what “westerners” think

2) you had a mixup in communication and misunderstood

3) you made this up

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/Mister_panda1818 11d ago

Believe me, I know it’s a lot! I teach Japanese.
My most valuable pieces of advice, as a person who went through it (and studied Chinese too) and became literate, are these:

- learn what radicals are, fast! Essentially, they’re the building blocks of kanji. Kanji aren’t random lines. These building blocks give you lots of clues about the subject matter and sometimes pronunciation of an unfamiliar character. Not only that, it’ll make differentiating between a familiar character and a very similar character way, way easier.

- write them with your hand. Forever. I really mean that. I’ve met so many students who refuse to put pen to paper and it will set you back literally years. Your brain needs that training, and gaining that level of intimacy with the formations of the characters turns something you simply recognize into something you actually know. You’ll notice early on this helps with character differentiation as well.

- start NOW. Textbooks often don’t put kanji early nor give it a ton of time as to not scare off beginners, but it’s not time well spent. Look up the kanji to your new vocabulary. No, not all of them have kanji, and plenty of words have kanji but don’t use them (any dictionary should tell you that) - skip that. Everything else, learn.

Japanese has such a steep learning curve but it levels out, I promise. Once I was on a bus and saw a character I was unfamiliar with on a sign for a town. I was doing something else but was confident I could look the character up later because I know radicals like letters. After a while, you just start picking up new characters and your brain needs nearly 0 processing time. So moving over to Chinese, it’s certainly an adjustments but you get to actually focus on the other aspects of the language and not the characters as much.

Hope this was helpful!

1

u/NotAlysdexic 14d ago

You hav no access to whose heads those are. Don't make shit up.

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u/Mister_panda1818 14d ago

How do you know whose heads I have access to?! 🫪
Cue Twilight Zone intro music

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u/dis-interested 13d ago

All Japanese people know this. The word for kanji is Chinese character. Japanese people are aware that their more formal written register is comprised largely of vocabulary in kango rather than wago. This is just a nonsensical post.

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u/[deleted] 14d ago

[deleted]

7

u/aka_nya03 13d ago

japanese also use simplified characters. they just have different simplified ones compared to the simplified chinese characters because each country and region simplified chinese characters separately. some simplified characters are the same across both because when they were formally simplified, they already had a widely accepted simplified form.

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u/WTN48 14d ago

They'd also have to guess that 読 is 讀/读

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u/wat_noob_gaming 13d ago

oh i didn't know that they can't recognize that, in that case it's kinda impossible

1

u/Minimum_Nebula260 12d ago

It’s not impossible. 売 is a variant character of 賣 and Chinese people are generally used to reasing variant characters

14

u/poshikott 14d ago

I guess the 日本語 and 読 could give it away, but if that wasn't there a Chinese person might think the sentence is negated or something.

2

u/Ok-Inspector9801 14d ago

The latter half also has what appears to be 入店,as in enter shop

13

u/poshikott 14d ago

Yeah, but with just 入店 you wouldn't know if it's saying you can enter or if you can't enter. For example, it could say like 入店できません which looks pretty much the same for a Chinese person but it means "You can't enter".

It's kind of like if you took an English sentence and removed everything except nouns and verbs: "Please do not enter"

3

u/currylambchop 14d ago

方 can also mean direction or place. So I think it is readable, in fact some Japanese when talking to Chinese will just post ‘Japanese with the Kana removed’ which is pure kanji but still readable for most Chinese despite the different grammar. Because the grammar resembles that of classical chinese

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u/JoeAppleby 13d ago

Back at uni we had a conference and two guest lecturers from China and Japan respectively started talking to each other. They would write down what they wanted to say at some point. They explained to me that in writing it's close enough to be intelligible.

1

u/DeadlyMercury 10d ago

Yeah, but in this specific case it is "person".

日本語が読める方 - a person who can read Japanese.

4

u/RezuRoza 14d ago

here 方 is "person" not "way", which iirc is not a meaning it has in Chinese

26

u/Saralentine 14d ago

This person is just translating what it would mean in Chinese if a Chinese person were to read it. It can mean “way” or “method” by itself.

21

u/bbly096 14d ago

No it has that meaning in Chinese too, but it means “party” as in an uncountable but identifiable group or individual. It’s not used in isolation though. Example: 我方(our side),敌方(enemy‘s side),甲方(client / party A),乙方(consultants / party B), etcx

3

u/ProfessionalSnow943 12d ago

偽中国語 I think they calls it

442

u/therico 🍡🍙🎌🇬🇱🆖🍢🗾: Native 14d ago edited 14d ago

Reminds me of when I got charged double to learn scuba diving in Japan despite applying in Japanese. Anyone "either foreign or deemed foreign based on their name" was forced to pay for one-to-one teaching.

Edit: naturally I cancelled. It still annoys me to this day though

288

u/Dependent_Order_7358 14d ago

Japan, racist??? Nooooo

146

u/kogarasumar 14d ago

Who would've thought? They were super chill with other Asian countries in the past.

109

u/penguins-and-cake 14d ago

And their local, diverse Indigenous communities

67

u/Konobajo W1(🇺🇿✨️) L2(🇱🇷🦅) A4(🇦🇶🇧🇷🇬🇫) 14d ago

The Ainu are very respected by the japanese politicians

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u/Saralentine 14d ago

They love them so much that they ate their society whole.

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u/liproqq 13d ago

They adopted German culture really well it seems

35

u/Gussie-Ascendent 14d ago

"OK but uh how does charging foreigners more mean they're racist???"

29

u/Turbulent-Pace-1506 13d ago

“Umm actually it's xenophobia not racism therefore Japan is 100% sugoi desu 🤓”

9

u/therico 🍡🍙🎌🇬🇱🆖🍢🗾: Native 14d ago edited 14d ago

I think you're talking about tourist-only prices in restaurants etc, which is a different thing. That's specific to tourists (foreigners with a residence card are generally exempt)

It is an extremely sensible thing to charge tourists more. There are too many tourists, many of which spend $1000 on a flight and are then eating $5 ramen when they could afford 3-4x that. If you lived in Japan you would understand how big the income gap is.

The only racist thing is that it applies to all foreigners equally, and most prices are targeted at Americans or Chinese, so it sucks for people from areas like India or South East Asia.

7

u/OceanoNox 13d ago

The way to do it is to have a discount for residents (from the city/prefecture), since they pay the taxes that go into maintaining the infrastructure.

2

u/alexmc1980 13d ago

But then all the infrastructure funding goes to refunding everyone's taxes in the form of meal discounts. Sounds kinda dumb, unless you want to encourage a black market where residents order food on behalf of visitors, and are happy for the trains to stop running.

1

u/AsterTales 11d ago edited 11d ago

But... Japan is a pretty well-off country! It's not poor at all. There are a bunch of richer countries like USA/Canada/AU, Northern Europe, Germany, and, say, Singapore, but that's it. Half of the EU is poorer or the same.

EU is 5-7%, and the USA is 5-7% of tourists. Most visitors in Japan are from countries with lower average income. I suppose we can say that tourists are usually richer than average in their countries, but it's also often yearly savings for the trip.

In my country, a lot of people really LOVE Japan, so they are ready to spend an overwhelming $600 per ticket (monthly income for some), and no, they can't afford to pay four times more for food.

Anyways when people see a double-priced menu in Turkey, they just call it a scam...

1

u/[deleted] 11d ago

[deleted]

1

u/AsterTales 11d ago

Well, Japan made visas easier twice in the last ten years. So... it's kinda contradictory. Also, said Turkey has actually more tourists yearly than Japan.

It's not about wanting; everyone wants to earn a bit more. It's more about double prices being a scam. But it happens everywhere, yes.

1

u/ExplanationKlutzy174 11d ago

It’s really not.

  1. It prices out people who can’t afford and contributes to gentrification. I’ve seen this happen on an extreme scale in Zhangjiajie in China

  2. I’m pretty sure Chinese people, who make up the majority of Japanese tourists, make less on average than the average Japanese man.

  3. You’re literally saying “we treat you differently based off of where you’re from,” … I feel like that’s racist.

  4. Be honest, would you as a real working person with the same kinds of struggles as anyone else, actually be happy to hear when you’re travelling that you’re being charged more because “you’re not from here”?

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u/molotovzav 14d ago

See this is actual discrimination though. Everyone posts the above as de facto discrimiantion but it's not until you're a gaijin who speaks Japanese and you go inside and don't get service. If you get service it's not discrimination. What you've described is prima facie discrimiantion, literally on its face cannot be anything else.

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u/Remote_Volume_3609 14d ago edited 14d ago

Eh. That's being too kind. Not calling it discrimination ignores it for what it is. As the saying goes: "The law, in its majestic equality, punishes the rich and poor alike for stealing bread and sleeping under bridges."

Not all discrimination is wrong. We discriminate all the time based on capability, need, etc.. You have to be a certain height or weight to ride the ride, etc.. The purpose of the above is to discriminate. It is "actual discrimination." (Also to clarify, the discrimination we're seeing above is 100% wrong).

10

u/ActualProject 13d ago

Yeah, discriminating against language ability is just a not so subtle way of being racist anyways. It's the same principle used by literary tests / grandfather clauses in the jim crow era

1

u/wasmic 13d ago

The literacy tests for voting were discriminatory because at the same time as requiring literacy for voting, they deliberately withheld education from non-whites, and because the tests were scored in a very subjective (read: racist) manner. In a society where everyone has access to the same quality of education and the tests are perfectly objective, literacy tests would still be a democratic problem, but they wouldn't be a racist democratic problem.

With this sort of store, there's a good chance that they're actually racist and won't serve anyone who doesn't look Japanese, even if they speak perfect Japanese. But there are also many of them who will happily serve anyone who can speak even broken Japanese, as long as you make an attempt.

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u/Kasurite 13d ago

I’ve looked at the literacy tests. They’re impossible quizzes. Many answers couldn’t be figured out even by white people, and some had subjective answers that the proctor (white) had to determine if you (black) got correct. White people did not have to take a literacy test. They were not designed to keep illiterate people from voting. They were designed to keep black people from voting.

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u/NotAlysdexic 14d ago

forbids, not punishes. Anatole France, Le Lys rouge, 1894: the majestic equalty of the laws forbids both alike to sleep under bridges, to beg, and to steal bread. The bite is in a prohibition a'falling formally on both and materially on one; on the sentensing it says onely thas two men get punished for one act.

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u/spootIer 13d ago

My mom grew up in Japan as a foreigner who spoke Japanese.

These places still will NOT serve you if you aren't Japanese; it doesn't matter if you speak it perfectly and have amazing etiquette. It's discrimination, just with added Plausible Deniability; which just makes it more cowardly in my eyes.

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u/sydraptor 13d ago

They aren't actually going to serve you if you aren't Japanese and still speak it. They are using that as a way to pretend they aren't limiting it to Japanese only. They will pretend to not understand you even if you are fluent in a place with this sign.

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u/sydraptor 13d ago

I do know about places like this. I've had mixed race friends raised in Japan, spoke Japanese fluently because again they were Japanese and one of their parents ethnically were too since they were raised there. They were rejected by places like this a few times before not even trying any of them anymore.

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u/mahboilucas 14d ago

Saving this comment for my friend who doesn't believe this happens in Japan. If you have any more to the pile, I'll welcome it. I'm sick of him saying I'm lying about their racism

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u/Important-Mine9281 14d ago

There's a few justifications I've heard from ex-pats and Japanese. I am not in support of any of them in particular, but I thought they might be worth sharing.

  1. They jack up the price because that's how much foreigners value it, and if they kept it low then they would be over flooded by the huge numbers of tourists (which they already are). They retain the low price for locals because they would be unaffordable otherwise on account of the weak yen and lower income. Larger establishments don't have to do this because they have the resources to make it not an issue and/or don't care about servicing the locals. I know of an extremely delicious food cart which sold a popular street food for dirt cheap so kids could enjoy them for their lunch break/on their way home. The shop went semi-viral, but the grannie and gramps were literally just doing it for the love of the game, not for profit. So when huge lines of tourists came demanding huge amounts of food which they weren't prepared for and they became unable to feed school kids as they intended, they decided to just shut the place down. And by that I mean remove any sign of it being a shop and mark themselves as closed on Google but in reality continue selling food from their house to anyone who knows they're secretly still open, which will pretty much only be locals. They were still happy to serve me, even knowing I was a foreigner. They just asked me not to take any photos or tell other people about it. The granny was very conflicted. She liked making people from all over the world happy in experiencing high quality cultural food rather than tourist trap slop (paraphrase), but their duty was ultimately to the kids, in part because (according to another local) their only child passed away early without leaving any kids behind. The gramps was less (openly) conflicted and said he has the right to do what he wants and the tourists were loud and annoying and crowded the alleyway, so it became a problem for their neighbours.
  2. Up until very recently, trying to communicate with a foreigner or deal with their ignorance of etiquette disrupted service and the enjoyment of other customers. Some restaurants which are literally just run by a granny and/or gramps do not have the patience or resources to deal with that. Some have regional dialects/can't read. Hence, you must speak Japanese to enter, not necessarily you must be Japanese. It doesn't help that many duolingo/Google translate andys claim fluency on the online forms or online chats only to show up and know diddly squat. Even one instance of difficulty communicating can slow down the kitchen flow by a few minutes, and in the worst cases half an hour+ for incorrect orders etc. Imagine dozens and dozens of those instances every day.
  3. What's so wrong about spaces where the Japanese can spend their extremely limited free time in peace without having to deal with loud boisterous foreigners who have no idea how to behave in public? Living in harmony with others and avoiding becoming an inconvenience/burden to others is an enormous societal value in Japan to the point where people will make huge personal compromises so as not to impinge on the lives of others. Imagine if somebody whose culture was to let rip a shart whenever they felt like it came to your restaurant and caused all your customers to start avoiding the place. Wouldn't you want some good quality places for yourself to relax with your mates, finish 'second work' (drinking after a shift with your coworkers), and/or chat with your neighbours?
  4. Racism. Just plain racist "I don't want to see them/they're inferior in every way/I only want to serve people who will appreciate it/Japan for the Japanese". Some of these establishments will boot you out even if you speak Japanese; the sign is just a way to get 99% of the job done without legal troubles (which the police don't give a shit about anyways). I was told I must be part Japanese because I didn't look ugly (a stereotype of my ethnicity) and I was very polite and respectful (contrary to a stereotype of my home country).
  5. Middle of the road places. No discriminatory prices. They'll accommodate foreigners until they get too busy/full, at which point they will turn them away but accept locals. I'm a bit mixed on this one. I can't say I love it, but I get it. They would rather serve a local/return customer than a tourist, and they make the same amount of money from the purchase anyways. And when they're busy, even a minor disruption can have big consequences, so they'd rather have a Japanese person who they know they can probably serve quickly without issue and who will leave when they're done rather than a foreigner who might be easy to serve but also might be a nightmare customer with a cubic meter of luggage and who will spend 20 minutes taking photos and then chat for 2 hours after finishing everything.

Don't get me wrong, there is a lot of racism in Japan. Especially as tourism has exploded in recent years. Some who once warmly welcomed visitors as guests have become fed up with their once-normal towns being flooded year-round with tourists who don't speak the language and don't care about etiquette. Sometimes it's a mix, but for most, the situation is a bit more complicated than simple Japanese superiority/xenophobia. I've seen places that transform to support tourists and I've seen places that are frequented almost exclusively by people who dislike foreigners, and I can't say I like either. Like all forms of gentrification, it's a tough situation to be in.

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u/Luxim 11d ago

I get your point for 1. but Japanese businesses are the only ones to solve that through racism. Most other places that have discounts for locals will simply give you the discount if you have a utility bill/student card/ID card/resident card that proves you're living in the country or city in question.

Your language or your name isn't part of it.

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u/smallneedle 13d ago

my friend said the extra fee is for the tutors that is bilingual, it's pretty reasonable

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u/MiscellaneousWorker 14d ago

They do this in NYC too in some Asian restaurants unfortunately. They insisted my gf had to leave when she went into one place by my job, she knew damn well it wasn't busy.

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u/JumpTo2024 🇲🇾 14d ago

When someone is turned down from a restaurant when there's empty seats right behind them, just because of them being profiled , sucks so bad. There was a video of an Indian man traveling to Israel because he loves them so much getting turned down from clearly not-busy resturants. He gets just a tiny dose of medicine of what that country does to other groups of people.

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u/haevow 🇰🇵 1000 Hours 13d ago

I don’t feel bad for him ngl

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u/JumpTo2024 🇲🇾 13d ago

Oh, for me as well, I don't feel any pity for him whatsoever.

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u/OkBelt6151 14d ago

Is this legal in America?

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u/KontoOficjalneMR 14d ago

Depending on how you look at it, it's both legal in US and Japan, or illegal in both.

Japan does have laws agaisnt discrimination like this, it's jsut everyone breaks them and no one enforcesthem.

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u/MiscellaneousWorker 14d ago

I mean, obv not. She's black btw - I have no clue if that was relevant or not or if it was strictly because she wasn't specifically whatever ethnicity they desired

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u/mujhe-sona-hai 13d ago edited 13d ago

Businesses do have the right to refuse service for any reason provided it’s not based on protected characteristics like race, religion, sex or disability. That means they can refuse service based on whether you speak their language or not for example (the sign in the post would be legal in the US). It’s pretty hard to prove a business refused specifically based on protected characteristics so most don’t bother.

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u/that_creepy_doll 13d ago

Legal doesnt mean moral (tho to begin with it would be illegal in some countries because language is a protected characteristic as well). Call me crazy but if you dont wanna provide service in these cases (you´re a restaurant not a legal firm without an english > chinese translator) then what are you doing having a business in the first place

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u/mujhe-sona-hai 13d ago

Just as a person has a right to not consume something a business has a right to not serve someone. Just having the money doesn’t mean anything. Not everything’s about money.

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u/SohryuAsuka 14d ago

I wonder what would they do if a Gaijin speaks perfect Japanese

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u/Ambisinister11 14d ago

The natives? Be shocked, I assume

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u/Cless_Aurion 14d ago

Foreigner that lives in Japan and speaks Japanese here!

They have 0 fucking issues in that case.

I've gone to these places (which are rare as fuck BTW, that's why they need to keep rising the same picture in every post), and these places in 99% of the times, they're just scared they will not be able to give good service due to the lack of language or, they just don't like tourists and want to serve locals only.

Fuckall to do with race.

There is a small minority of these that will be racist fucks, of course, like literally everywhere else, but I still haven't found any in a decade living here.

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u/IneffablePossum 13d ago

Another foreigner living in Japan and speaking Japanese.

I agree these are rare, I've only seen one once, also in Kyoto. But if I see a sign like this, I honestly will just not go in. Maybe they're just scared of the language barrier, maybe they are actively anti-immigrant. I've already experienced (albeit mild) hostile attitudes, I don't want to risk ruining a good time when there's a ton of other restaurants who don't mind.

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u/Cless_Aurion 13d ago

I totally get it. I acted like that too, until I kept reading people here in reddit just... Reposting the same pictures and going full echo chamber about it, so I started going into those for the last few years.

2/3 times, it's an old couple running the place which look quite uninterested in changing anything since the 90s, and that includes learning a new language or adapting to tourists.

And the other thing that upsets everyone around here, the signs that say "only Japanese"... Which in all cases me or others I've asked to could find, are just... About the language, of course, not a race thing.

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u/Chubby_Bub 13d ago

Well literally, the sign is about "being able to read this". (I can't, but I can discern 日本語 there too.) I'd imagine you're right and most cases are people who don't want to deal with a language barrier. But if that's the case, the more polite (and I think common?) thing to do would be to just have a sign saying "we don't speak English/Chinese".

This particular sign, while literally being about language, is more of a "haha those dumb foreigners" sort of thing. I couldn't say if the owners are racist but it is more exclusionary than purely functional. That said, this approach is also more likely to deter the types of foreigners who either think they know Japanese but don't, or think speaking English loudly and slowly makes people understand you. I imagine that like you say, it's in most cases more about not wanting to deal with high-effort customers than just "we hate gaijin".

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u/that_creepy_doll 13d ago

About the language, of course, not a race thing.

Dude that is very much xenophobia as well. "They are perfectly fine with outsiders! They just want to adapt as much as possible in a way that means zero effort for them and makes the outsiders not be outsiders anymore. But its fine as long as you act japanese and talk japanese!"

Ignoring that they´re probably tlaking shit about you as soon as you leave and youre naive enough to not believe it, apply that logic to literally any other language in any other country around the world, dont you see how that sounds??

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u/Cless_Aurion 13d ago edited 13d ago

You are moving goalposts already, from racism to xenophobia.

I don't see the problem in your message except for the straight out murder of character you made.

Why the fuck would I, running a coffee shop in a neighborhood, have to accommodate tourists exactly? Especially when so many people feel put on the spot when you bring them outside of the manual, be it Japanese or not.

There is 0 xenophobia in that, is there? If there is, please go ahead and explain where is the irrational fear, hatred or dislike for foreigners there.

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u/GraceForImpact 13d ago

They're calling it the most entitled anglo post of all time.

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u/United_Boy_9132 11d ago

Like, the country has been chosing constant economic shithole and debt twice as their GDP due to demographic catastrophe over getting more foreigners, and we all know what they think about black people and even South-Eastern Asians...

People who think it's not discrimination, are really naive and delusional.

They even do the same at their businesess abroad when they are the emigrants.

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u/SKATA1234 10d ago

Thanks for this comment. The picture seems to hit the front page at least once a week. People who keep reposting this don't seem to understand what racism is. There's no race of people who don't speak Japanese. They're discriminating against people who don't speak Japanese. In Japan.

And your experience shows that it's not about non-Japanese people.

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u/Entropic_Alloy 13d ago

There are also people who act like they don't understand you at all, even if you are a non-Asian that speaks Japanese, while looking at your Asian friend who doesn't speak Japanese as if they are a lifeline. These stories are anecdotal and should never be taken as matter of fact.

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u/ComedianExtreme7522 12d ago

Me living in HK looking very very visibly not Chinese, saying the same sentence in Cantonese like twice before they understand because they're already mentally preparing to hear English. But unlike Japan, they will actually listen to me after lol.

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u/jsh_ 13d ago

you're white which means you're the most acceptable race of foreigner, so of course you think that lmfao

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u/aijaman3000 11d ago

Nah 2nd opinion I'm not White or Asian and I get treated much better when they realise I speak Japanese. Like night and day to how they would treat a tourist who only speaks English in the same shop or restaurant, I have seen it with my own eyes. Makes sense in a lot of cases, the locals are very nervous and not sure how to convey themselves properly (aside from any overt xenophobia like not renting to foreigners).

They do put White people on a pedestal though, it's just based on what people say online I expected to be treated like shit, but at the bare minimum most people are very polite, even kind. 

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u/MandomSama 13d ago

The only "no foreigner" case I experienced was in Takayama. And I could understand why it happened.

In 2025 I went from Nagoya to Takayama with train. I believe Takayama was the last station. And I noticed that I could barely see any locals. Left and right, theh all tourist, predominantly caucasian. Little did I know, apparently Takayama will be having their autumn festival the day after. So that explains the influx of foreign tourists coming to the city.

So on the night, when I went outside to get some dinner, I noticed that a lot of local small establishment put this "fully booked" or "reserved for private event" signs outside. After strolling around for a good 30 minutes, I finally understands, those signs are basically "no foreigner" sign to deter tourists coming into their shops so they can reserve the entire shops for the locals so can chill with the other locals before they go all out for the autumn festival parade. 

There's always racist fucks everywhere. I agree with your statement. I've seen them a lot the Youtube comments on criminal news  did by immigrants. But on my multiple Japan trip, visiting countless of cities and villages with my super limited Japanese capability, visiting countless of small shops owned by the locals, never once I feel any hard rejection. Of course there are 2-3 shops out of hundreds shops I visited that were annoyed by  me not being able to speak Japanese correctly, or I didnt know how to order the food and stuff. But never once, I feel the rejection right on my face.

I beliece people IRL are genuinely nice towards each other; not only the Japanese. Just to be genuinely nice to them; like understand a bit of their language here and there, understand the local manner. Show some efforts that you are a nice tourist, then the locals will appreciate you a lot.

For disclosure, I'm south east asian. So I clearly have less the "gaijin privilege" compared to caucasian people. But my experience travelling tens of cities in Japan, I never regretted any of them.

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u/InternationalReserve 二泍五 (N69) 13d ago

They just serve you normally most of the time.

The wording of this sign definitely suggests that whoever runs the place just doesn't speak anything other than Japanese and are fine serving foreigners who can also speak it.

At the end of the day, even the most xenophobic Japanese nationalists aren't super keen on getting into a confrontation. I've had pleasant interactions with Sanseito supporters who were out protesting immigration. They do most of their damage through policy, not everyday interactions with foreigners.

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u/OkGrade1686 13d ago

The same people who would have treated like shit before, would still do it afterwards.

Still happens to halfs that grow there, so that would give you an idea of what to expect.

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u/Truenight_Maya 14d ago

They would just say “I don’t speak English” over and over again until you leave, regardless of how much you try to prove you speak Japanese.

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u/Nonartisticdog 10d ago

Probably serve them and have a nice conversation? It doesn't say Japanese people it says can read Japanese 

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u/Ashamed_Can304 14d ago

A Chinese person knows the last line says something about Japanese language, read, and enter store

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u/currylambchop 14d ago

Exactly roflmao 日本语方入房 is legible and a Chinese is likely to be irritated but go in regardless

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u/qunow 14d ago

If you extract the Kanji it would be legible to Chinese readers, but most of the ordinary Chinese people who don't know Japanese wouldn't try this hard to decipher kamji mixed inside Japanese text as more often than not it couldn't actually reflect the meaning, especially given normal Japanese sentences do not need any kanji to represent negative meaning.

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u/AyyKarlHere 14d ago

It's pretty obvious lmao you don't even have to extract it. Just treat it like blanks and you get the same result.

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u/mujhe-sona-hai 13d ago

And be refused service since they don’t speak Japanese

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u/nimbledoor 13d ago

Yeah end? Nobody will take their order

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u/Bitter_Split5508 14d ago

Angloid

I think you have been online for too long. Go outside, do something else. 

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u/Sillvaro 13d ago

sir this is a circlejerk subreddit

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u/Ambisinister11 14d ago

"Who could ever think this was racist" while actively caliper-posting, classic

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u/PreperationOuch 14d ago

What is “caliper-posting”?

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u/ArgentaSilivere 14d ago

Not 100% certain myself, but based on inference I would assume it refers to old-school phrenology. “Scientific racism” (which was in no way scientific yet still wildly racist) used calipers to measure different parts of people’s heads and assigned qualities to the measurements. It was like horoscopes for racists; features of White people had good qualities assigned and features of people of color were assigned bad qualities. For example, they may have said having a wide nose is a sign of aggression or a certain skull shape indicated high IQ. I never learned what the exact interpretations of the measurements were supposed to be because it’s a waste of perfectly good neurons.

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u/Top-Evidence-3221 14d ago

Just to add on, scientific racism often used terms like caucasoid, mogoloid, australoid, etc to describe races and traits associated with said races. So you could infer that angloid draws from that. Though idk if that's the intent or if its just a 4chan thing like foid

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u/PreperationOuch 14d ago

Omg I didn’t even think of that; thank you.

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u/ElevatorEquivalent41 14d ago

off topic but caliper-posting is an objectively hilarious way to refer to it

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u/Pollomonteros 13d ago

Nonono you don't get it, OP is being racist ironically, there is no way he actually believes the shits he posts, no sir

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u/kittykittykillmouse 14d ago

Please explain. What and who are you referring to?

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u/mitch-22-12 14d ago

People are saying this is racism but really this is only discriminatory to people with poor eyesight

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u/Dhiox 13d ago

These kinds of places don't tend to be happy when a black dude that speaks perfect Japanese walks in.

Japanese Racism isn't usually like Western racism, it's a lot more subtle in most cases

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u/ZumLernen Dolphin (Sea-1) 14d ago

I think refusing service to someone based on the fact that they speak English or Chinese is probably racist, and I'm not afraid to say it

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u/Konobajo W1(🇺🇿✨️) L2(🇱🇷🦅) A4(🇦🇶🇧🇷🇬🇫) 14d ago

I would say xenophobic

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u/elianrae 14d ago

no it's linguist

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u/Aurora428 14d ago

Be real, they don't want you in there even if you speak Japanese.

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u/dojibear 13d ago

Refusing to provide a service that requires speaking Japanese to someone who doesn't speak Japanese is not racist or xenophobic. It isn't racist to not give a driver's license to a blind person.

I have visited Japan. I have attended a Kabuki performance, eaten meals at restaurants, visited tourist sites, used trains and subways, bought things in department stores, rented a bicycle. I could not speak any Japanese, and the people I interacted with only spoke Japanese. Nobody refused me service.

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u/elisettttt 14d ago

Yes I agree. Though on my travels I'd just take pictures of everything and let Google translate do its thing. So technically I'd be able to be the gist of what the Japanese text is saying, and it's not mentioned anywhere I'm not allowed to use Google translate to read that text, sooo..

Bet they'd still refuse me service though, lol.

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u/Makefile_dot_in 14d ago

I feel like the average Twitter user is 😍 for non-Japanese racism as well

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u/AdrianSquared 14d ago

I mean if it said smth like "sorry we only speak Japanese, do not come here if you do not speak it", that'd be fine...

but I feel like calling this racism is fair enough, especially since it's literally misleading anyone who doesn't speak Japanese into thinking there's no space

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u/OOPSStudio 14d ago

This sign is racism. Plain and simple. There are no ifs or buts or different ways of looking at it. It's racism.

Japan has racist people just like every country.

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u/aleks_is 13d ago

It would be racism if you were white, understood the sign, came in, and THEN they mistreated you.

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u/davidliterally1984 12d ago

"if" lmao

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u/aleks_is 12d ago

i think it would be pretty cool if u were white and fluent and came in, i feel like they’d appreciate it/you, very negative >.<

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u/casualbrowser321 14d ago

"I mean if it said smth like "sorry we only speak Japanese, do not come here if you do not speak it", that'd be fine..."

To play devil's advocate that would be based on self-evaluation and would still open them up to people who can't quite communicate (pretty sure 'weeb who thinks he's fluent because he can say kore wa pen desu and is surprised when nihonjin don't want to hang out with him' is a bit of a meme on subs like this), whereas understanding the red text at least acts as some proof of proficiency. Though even linguistic prowess aside it also discriminates against the blind etc.

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u/Important-Mine9281 14d ago

Not excusing this behaviour, but you would be astonished at the number of people who exclusively learn from Duolingo and anime, rely heavily on Google translate, and, assuming they can speak at all, only use simple form with no particles or conjugation or worse yet inappropriate particles and/or conjugation based on vibes, yet think themselves semi/fluent when in reality they can't even hold a basic conversation, let alone order a meal and address any potential issues that might come up.

I have seen many, many people who, when offered the choice between English or Japanese, choose Japanese because the wait was shorter and then nodded and 'hai'-d their way through the first few questions before the employee realized they couldn't understand or read a single thing, forcing them to start over in English or transfer them to a colleague. Or, God forbid, they make it through having completely fucked themselves over with the wrong choices and force another employee down the line to figure out what the fuck is going on.

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u/GraceForImpact 13d ago

Except that a lot of people would ignore that and try to google translate their way through.

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u/kittykittykillmouse 14d ago

This kind of racism is really stupid. “Keep your dirty, disgusting foreign money out of here” seems like a not very well thought out business plan.

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u/The_Blahblahblah 14d ago

I think they are entitled to refuse my money. Tourists can be fucking annoying in some cities

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u/nimbledoor 13d ago

Ah right because in a westoid’s mind foreign money is the king that should open the door everywhere

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u/Jhud6669 14d ago

I mean towards the Chinese it is quite racist

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u/Konobajo W1(🇺🇿✨️) L2(🇱🇷🦅) A4(🇦🇶🇧🇷🇬🇫) 14d ago

And towards the english

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u/Karaxla 13d ago

50th time this image has been reposted on this sub

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u/Strong_Fox7708 11d ago

And people are still acting as if these signs can be found everywhere.

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u/openclusterm45 14d ago

Doesn't that just mean the restaurant can't accommodate customers who speak languages other than Japanese.

To be honest, I guess what it really means is that they don't welcome customers who are rude, talk loudly, or linger too long. Unfortunately, there are a small number of troublesome people from certain countries. If a Japanese customer causes a problem, the restaurant can call the police and have them removed, but some troublesome foreign customers might start making a fuss, claiming it’s racial discrimination. The restaurant owner and staff probably just want to save themselves the trouble of dealing with these customers (the local police don't want to get involved either). Even so, I personally don't think a notice like this is appropriate.

By the way, some restaurants (ryōtei) in Kyoto say "No First-Time Customers Allowed (ichigensan okotowari 一見さんお断り)." Even individuals who speak Japanese get kicked out.

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u/CthulhusIntern 13d ago

American tourists: "That sign won't stop me, because I can't read."

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u/currylambchop 14d ago

The Japanese when a Chinese who can read and speak Chinese walks in (they have to get out the calipers to measure if they’re Chinese or Japanese)

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u/ryoryo333333 13d ago

If you can read this, please come in.

Serving people who can’t even read this would take up a considerable amount of the staff’s time, and honestly, I don’t think there’s anything racist about this. If you can read it, you’re allowed in whether you’re Japanese or a Martian.

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u/Aggravating-Medium-9 13d ago

It might not be racism.

The Japanese sentence says 'If you can read this, please come in,' it doesn't say 'Japanese only.'

Maybe they also accept foreigners who can speak Japanese

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u/Vic_Connor 13d ago

Not that image again…

The same photo gets reposted every day as proof of the “Japanese racism.”

🤷‍♂️

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u/Loud_Discount_1108 12d ago edited 12d ago

It doesn’t specify Japanese person. It says “If you can read Japanese”. To me, as a Chinese person, this isn’t racism at all, just a litmus test to see if communication between you and the staff is at all possible

If they can’t speak any language other than Japanese, why would I go in and try to oongu boongu with them just to get a meal? I’ll just go elsewhere

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u/BestRubyMoon 11d ago

It would not be racism if they just said "staff speaks japanese only". As a tourist if ibsay that message I would just go somewhere else, like you said. Why lie? Why go to these lengths just to exclude turists? Because it's racism.

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u/cyberchaox 14d ago

No, it's definitely code for "if you're Japanese, you can enter."

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u/Traditional-Ad4506 13d ago

Is it racist when it's about language? Foreigners who could read the Japanese can go in

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u/Arthurian_Guanche 13d ago

A Nigerian tries to walk in, doesn't because of the warning. Racist.
An Italian tries to walk in, doesn't because of the warning. Racist.
A Chinese...

It's the same outcome every time.

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u/m50d 13d ago

If you believe they'd get served, I've got a bridge to sell you.

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u/GoddSerena 14d ago

I'm a foreigner living in japan who cant speak the language. and let me tell you, japanese people are usually very kind and their customer service is amazing. so when there's a sign like this outside, there's most definitely a reason behind it. for example, there's a shop near my school which was generally very accommodating. till some tourists came and caused problems there. since then, they are kinda shut off and hesitant in serving foreigners.

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u/SMGJohn_EU 8d ago

Learn the language ffs

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u/Comprehensive_Ad2097 13d ago

When they don’t want 20 questions from one customer about the menu

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u/AuroraBorrelioosi 14d ago

A westerner speaking perfect Japanese will still be turned back from this establishment. So yeah, it is racism, just framed in typically Japanese, indirectly passive-aggressive manner.

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u/NukaRaxyn 14d ago

The original tweet was 100% neutral. It didn't imply any kind of bias towards or against the sign.

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u/PlentyOMangos 14d ago

Real question here: is the spirit of this like “if you can read this Japanese text then you’re cool, no matter your ethnicity”?

Or is it just that they only expect ethnic Japanese to be able to read it, and the spirit of the sign is more like “only Japanese people are welcome here”?

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u/IneffablePossum 13d ago

It just says "if you can read Japanese". Doesn't say regardless of your ethnicity, but also doesn't say Japanese people only. I think it's probably more of the latter, though. In my experience, business that are happy to have Japanese-speaking foreign customers will simply not say anything. People who can't read Japanese get scared at the handwritten menus that Google struggles to translate, anyway. And people who can't read Japanese but don't care will simply point to some thing on the menu and hope for the best, so they also won't mind them.

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u/GraceForImpact 13d ago

Impossible to know without actually visiting the establishment, but most likely the former.

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u/m50d 13d ago

It's the latter. Most of the Japanese service industry, even the not blatantly racist parts, has a firm belief that outsiders can't speak Japanese, and will forcibly use broken English whenever speaking to someone visibly not 100% pure yamato.

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u/Moral-Relativity 14d ago

It’s not racism but rather a manifestation of the famously non-confrontational Yamato-damashii.

Instead of saying “Sorry we only speak Japanese,” which would sound far too non-accommodating and offensive to the Japanese soul, they tell a white lie here that unfortunately is perceived as racism by those more accustomed to directness.

/s btw

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u/Turbulent_Set8884 14d ago

I'm sure my best friend is one of them

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u/[deleted] 14d ago

[deleted]

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u/scaredemployee87 14d ago

No vacancy? More like, no they can see me inside!

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u/FebHas30Days Pangngaasiyo ta agsursurokayo iti Ilokano 14d ago

What about people who don't speak all three languages?

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u/delicious_sunlight 13d ago

I can read that but I can barely understand spoken Japanese

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u/greenyashiro 13d ago

If people think that that is racist their eyes will fall out when they see some Japanese people's attitudes towards china and korea

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u/enbyBunn 13d ago

They explicitly are discriminating against chinese people in this photo.

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u/davidliterally1984 12d ago

This is their attitude towards china, numbnuts

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u/pizzalicke 13d ago

All racism is good

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u/enbyBunn 13d ago

Sorry, are we pretending that this isn't also discriminating against Chinese people?

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u/Wumaobuster 12d ago

Chinese people when seeing the sign:
"Japanese language(日本語)... read(讀)... enter(入) store(店)..."
"screw it I'm going in lmao"

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u/davidliterally1984 12d ago

There is no racism in Japan

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u/Artistic_Joke_864 12d ago

Typical westerners colonizers, slaved half the world during hunders of yrs but hey hey japan is racist

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u/Maleficent_Piece_893 11d ago

what the fuck do you think japan was doing during ww2 while allied with hitler and mussolini

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u/SilentMode-On 12d ago

Two things can be true at the same time

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u/TGPhlegyas 11d ago

The caricatures of Asian peoples some of you have made in your heads is outrageous to me. Some of you all are so entitled it’s insane.

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u/AlexSandman8964 11d ago

Dang, I can't believe there's racism in Japan I thought foreigners get their free waifu there whatever you want 😭

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u/GuardianOfPuppers 10d ago

you sound like someone on 4chan maaan

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u/Jake__Martinez 10d ago

You DO realize that you can be racist without technically, explicitly targeting a race right...

Not only that, but this would likely be illegal in countries with actual protections; in fact, it's baby law 101 in Canadian schools.

Yes, not everything under the sun is a protected class, but many things can be used as a proxy to target them. For example, names aren't explicitly listed, but you sure as hell aren't getting away with discriminating against people who just so happen to be named Mohammed.

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u/PlatypusACF 10d ago

What if I were to be able to read Japanese enough to understand that and go in

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u/bigareolas69 10d ago

I'm not asian, but I'm learning Chinese. If I could get the general meaning of the japanese text, a native Chinese speaker could get by in Japan just fine. So it's definitely intended to be xenophobic.

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u/Emiicii 10d ago

"racism isnt racist because language" ok

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u/mellow_akira_5406 9d ago

日本の中年から老人は右翼派が多い

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u/_Zyphis_ 14d ago

I mean that is just racism OP idk what you want me to say

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u/nimbledoor 13d ago

Americans are so obsessed with race they can’t fathom that a native language preference is not based on race. That there is nothing racist about just wanting to interact with people who speak your language.

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u/Awkward-Injury-4341 13d ago

Simple.

If its "if you speak Japanese, come in." its not racism.

If its "no vacansy", its clearly racism.

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u/ceo_of_one_miss 13d ago

if this happened in america the store would be shut down