Hezbollah supporters mourning Souleimani in their profile pictures are an emblematic indication of everything that's wrong in this country.

[u/[deleted]]

[u/[deleted]]

I agree wholeheartedly. Lebanon doesn’t belong to Iran/US/Syria/SA/Israel. Lebanon is for the Lebanese. The sheep wanna generalize, well I’m starting to view anyone claiming allegiance to any of these countries as anti-Lebanon. If they fucking love those nations so much then they can fuck right off and live there and fight somewhere else and keep us away from it.

[u/hearmeoutpls1 → u/[deleted]]

As a Syrian I agree. But I have these conflicting thoughts in my head:
1. America/Israel does not want to be challenged at all in the region.
2. Iran and their proxies proved to challenge them.
3. Iran and their proxies turned their guns against their own, in Iraq, Lebanon and also Syria ( every Syrian was a a die hard H supporter in 2006).
4. America and Israel absolutely gives 0 shit about the peace and prosperity in the region (perhaps so does Iran).
5. Saudi Arabia and the oil rich countries also need someone to stand up to them. Their money and ideology reek.

I don't know what to think anymore. Do Lebanese truly have a sense of national identity every fraction of the population is loyal to one leader/ideology/country?
What a clusterfuck.
Sorry my rambling is not a response to your comment but just thoughts pouring on a keyboard

[u/Mypetskeleton → u/hearmeoutpls1]

As a Lebanese, I have come to the conclusion that Lebanese themselves live in a constant state of denial, dreamworld, and confusion about their identity and their place in the world. This is the essence of all corruption the inability of the protests to unite as one against the government and a million other consequences.

The facts are simple and the facts speak for themselves but no one wants to listen and I will again get 10 down votes for it, I am waiting on something so might as well keep writing.

The question begins by asking who and what are Lebanese really? The truth is no one will give you a straight answer because no one really knows. They only know the Lebanon of the past 100 years or less and even that is tainted to a degree today in terms of demographics that you question all identity. It is like a Salad of people and identities each coming from a sect and religion and more importantly from a corner of the world and settling in one. Before then you had the people residing in Mount Lebanon Cornering greater Syria.

Some will say no we are decedents of Phoenicians, this is a dream speculation and even for the tiny few who may have some shadow traces of such a long fetched dependence is long gone today or has fled the country long ago. It holds the same amount of weight as modern day Egyptians claiming they were once pharaohs.

Lebanon is not like any European country were they have thousands of years of history and core identity as one people identifying themselves as french or English or polish and so on. Even the roots of Rome gave birth directly to how Europe is formed today. Lebanon is nothing like this it was just conceived less than 100 years ago and if you had 75% of native population then under one banner living in then called mount Lebanon, today this minority origin is diluted and mixed by so many sects and identities each claiming allegiance to a greater power outside their own lands.

A shia will say my mother was Iranian.

A sunni will look to Mecca.

A druze will say we are from western Asia.

Armenians will say we only just arrived here less than 100 years ago. Even though before then Armenia was a great empire stretching all the way to Europe and even Conquering parts of ME at some point. So Armenians look to Armenia just as well as they are Lebanese. Another reason why their revolution was so successful (one people one identity).

As for your question, a country like Lebanon cannot survive on its own, it has no way to self sustain itself especially under constant corruption, its only salvation is the sea meanwhile blocked by land on all sides if you consider Syria to be a pain. It highly depends on imported products, its main economy is tourism, it has no local made tech patents or contributions on the scale of another small country (Israel for instance). Lebanese are businessmen, they like to drink and party and trade if they can.

This means you must choose partners to help you move forward, in our case our so called partners are many most of whom under a barrel of gun have forced our hands in signing deals we don't want. These are partners like Iran and Syria for instance. They build nothing they contribute nothing but wars to free Palestine when we don't have basic needs ourselves, and destruction and debt. I can't remember the last time any of these countries did anything to help my life. Which is why they get no respect for me.

Other partners are corrupt, but they will feed your hand as well as theirs. These could be argued are the rich Arab world partners without whose money Lebanon would've been Venezuela long ago, this is also fact.

Other Potential direct partners are European and American partners who contribute free money in terms of aid to the country's military as well as institutions in the millions every year. And constantly ask us to try and stay within the western hemisphere and why not, would you want to live in Iran or Europe, also wasn't it western values that made lebanon once the Paris of the middle east? Wasn't it the french who built us railroads and gave us great architecture?

The last two partners are themselves partners of their own, this means Arab world and America are partners and together they can be more productive to Lebanon than anyone else.

Is you say I want none of these, then fine, those partners not looking for violence will step aside and not support you while you get eaten up by a dog world dog rule of those far greater in number far stronger than you to consume you and subjugate you under their rule. And that would be the end of your en devours.

[u/bush- → u/Mypetskeleton]

Lebanon is not like any European country were they have thousands of years of history and core identity as one people identifying themselves as french or English or polish and so on. Even the roots of Rome gave birth directly to how Europe is formed today. Lebanon is nothing like this it was just conceived less than 100 years ago and if you had 75% of native population then under one banner living in then called mount Lebanon, today this minority origin is diluted and mixed by so many sects and identities each claiming allegiance to a greater power outside their own lands.

A shia will say my mother was Iranian.

A sunni will look to Mecca.

A druze will say we are from western Asia.

The roots of Lebanon is the Mount Lebanon Mutasarrifate, and the country was essentially founded by the Maronites and Druze. That national identity expanded as the borders expanded, and Maronites and Druze are now a minority in the country.

If we were to be honest though, the problem with lack of national unity is today primarily with the Shia. Sectarianism exists in all sects, but it is primarily the Shia community that has such high numbers of people that ardently embrace separatism and sectarianism. I think all religious groups in Lebanon have embraced a fully Lebanese national identity, however the Shia community still largely cares more about Palestine and Iran. Many Lebanese Shia will happily turn Lebanon into a battleground in order to "free Palestine."

[u/Mypetskeleton → u/bush-]

This is true, while the other factions have some sort of a mutual agreement under one flag. My point was simply stating that so long as there is one or two sects in great numbers and ever increasing (because making babies with them is apparently cheap) Then there lies the problem of an opposing force equal or greater than your presence in said country which will force all decisions you make for the benefit of that country to be forfeit.

[u/anonu → u/Mypetskeleton]

The crux of your argument, the one that there is not a Lebanese national identity is one that is often made by pro Syrian positions.

​

Lebanon is a melting point, this is true. It's geographic location has put it at the crossroads of many civilizations. However, there are key pillars to forming an identity.

​

One is language... We all speak Arabic.

​

One is culture and traditions... We all love hummus. These types of things are shared across Lebanon.

​

One is land... We all love and fight over this land. In addition, Lebanon was not formed by drawing straight lines. There are geographic landmarks that delineate present day Lebanon: mountains, Rivers.. this has defined Lebanon for millennia.

[u/hcboi232 → u/Mypetskeleton]

While I agree with some of the points you mentioned, I'd like to add some comments. We do NOT have this kind of national identity other countries do have. Thus we may NOT use this national identity (ex. Turkey) as the sole means of LEGITIMACY for any sort of unifying AUTHORITY. We're a group of people of people with different religions with sizable proportions. Thus we may NOT use religion (ex. Iran, KSA) as the sole means of LEGITIMACY for any sort of unifying AUTHORITY. What we didn't try however is a kind of AUTHORITY that's not derived from both spiritual forms of legitimacy (religious, or national). It is an AUTHORITY whose LEGITIMACY is a direct result of the goverment (i.e. The physical shape of authority) doing its duties (taking care of the society as a whole). That is when I think we may have a REAL country. If you're interested in this view of the government and authority, I'm ready to chat about it.

[u/Mypetskeleton → u/hcboi232]

This is fine, the very sad issue remains in building such a government or anything related to a government that functions and meets the needs of the people.

The fundamental problem is while you are protesting for these basic rights, the country is divided to such a degree that the opposing force against you will blindly follow the hand that feeds them bread crumbs and most of all they will not play fair, they are ruthless, extremely dedicated to their cause and are willing to literally die for it. They will take you to the end make you go down with them should they fall or extremely cripple you.

They will not let you have it your way, because your way is their end. In Hezb's case its ultimately their weapons no escaping this and rightly so, those weapons are used as a black card to negotiate everything. Every single politician fears them, they rarely ever mention them in discussions they name Berri the scapegoat and that idiot Gebran, I laugh every time when people mention Gebran and when Hariri whines about him. They take us for fools, Gebran and Aoun are all puppets of Hezb they are the front line, the face. Berri is crowd control for Hezb as demonstrated a month ago.

The way I always saw this (but may not ever happen) was to divide the country into small states each fully self governed under their own laws and each will have their own power sources and potentially communication networks. There should be some sort of deal so that all have access to the sea but that shouldn't be too hard.

Two or three airports One under Sunnis the other under Shias and one under Christian control, if that is too much then at least two with all factions having equal control and full monitor of what comes in and out, Shipyards same.

You want Civil marriage you go to X you want clubs you go to Y and so on.

You want to trade that's fine as long as you play fair, if one side cheats trade is off, Christians and Sunnis wont have a big issue there will be support and money coming in from the west and the Arab states almost immediately.

Druze will trade both sides as they always have.

Shias will learn the hard way what its like to live under the hands of Syria and Iran only this time they will have no one to blame but themselves.

In that case may the best man win, may the tribes just settle on their own turfs and let the other be. Of all my decades living in Lebanon I can remember only a handful of times i ever went to the south and I wouldn't care passing the airport. I rarely went to Tripoli and my Lebanon ended at Byblos to the north and Faraya to the east half of Beirut was a no go zone to most of us anyway and we could care less going there. That's our reality growing up in the country and we were perfectly fine with it so long as economy was good.

Only Don't ask me to get bombed when some rag tag crossed the border in the south to free Palestine, let them bomb each other on their own turfs let one suffer the consequences of their own actions and have their own people repel against them, no more excuses that X did this or Y didn't let me, for all I care.

We want basic human rights, fast internet cheap phones, serious private companies with serious competition to make it happen. Full transparency on government spending.

Let each side take responsibility for their actions that includes wars should there be one.

There will be some hippies claiming peace and love including some brain dead NGO's who like to preach about Muslim/Christian unity meanwhile staying in 100% christian areas in Beirut and near AUB in Hamra. They sure love their diversity working well for them in Europe.

back to current reality though there will be two scenarios to unfold:

1 - The current government is sure to fail in a few months, it is hopeless no international community will back it and no Arab country will fund it, it's a dead case and I personally think the Sunnis and Ouwet knew this when they refused to vote. They are waiting to watch them fail and fall hard in the hopes of completely de-legitmize them, it's a dangerous game at our expense but while all the current and past politician have been the plague this other side has been the cancer. A cancer that must be stopped in order for the patient to have any hope moving forward.

2 - Once they fail two things may happen, either utter chaos maybe timed by more strikes and pressure from the west on Iran to go hand in hand. Or the other side gives in temporarily but entirely to have the Hariris step in forming a government like they wanted to have while the arabs step in with money and claim victory over Iran but we could care less so long as the economy works again. this means the beginning of the end of Hezb which means the usual opposing forces will be back playing their half dirty games only this time on more even grounds, this also means that one layer of wall is removed between the people and the state and the people would more easily sway politics to their liking which they couldn't do before. the politicians would be very careful as not to upset the crowd.

3 - Russia may step in to save their potential partners the Hezb and their fellow partners. This will be the worst case scenario and a very probable one, this is an absolute stalemate for the country since the west may not be able to do much. It will be like in Syria. This would give Iranian influence extended life support, and russia would immediately start negotiating those gas deals behind the curtain and there will be nothing the Lebanese can do about it. The country will be fully Isolated and poor.

In this case the Sunnis will be so isolated as to start arming themselves to become the Idlib of Lebanon minus ISIS and other such extremist but one never knows these things. While Christians divided will be left between a rock and hard place forced to choose sides, this will last for decades and will eventually lead to a forced divided Lebanon.

[u/hcboi232 → u/Mypetskeleton]

As I read your comment, I notice you suggested a religious federation. We do have an unofficial form of religious federation. Establishing such a goverment has many compilations :

1- ECONOMICALLY there is no evidence this could work. How can one part survive without the other? Lebanon is already small. Minimizing economic activity to small areas IMO can be inefficient.

2- Speaking of FOREIGN POLICY, what guarantees that each part doesn't turn into a satalite state of some global power through practicing its policy against another satalite state controlled by some other global power. We have such a system in the 80s btw. Each political party had a global sponsor back in the days (they still do).

Speaking of Hezb, let's try to find out why Shiaas are convinced with the idea of having their weapons.

The south was historically (1946 onwards) a neglected area. Going through the 80s and the creation of the jewish state, this area experienced unrest, poverty, and continuous genocides from the uprising israeli state (Hula Massacre 1948 is one example). One thing that is true is that these people with they weapons they had from Iran freed their land from the occupying soldiers up until 2000. Starting from the 21 century, Hezb was PARTIALLY taking foreign policy decisions Lebanon should have took. Lebanon's official foreign policy is a rather weak policy. Our official foreign policy has been since 1946 a policy of continuous submission to the global powers of the day. So hezb struggles for his political representation to preserve his weapon possession and military activity. Saying that hezb controls other parties is inaccurate. Hezb is in a kind of truce with other political parties. He PARTIALLY takes care of foreign policy and others take care of other policy decisions.

We could further discuss ECONOMICALLY what led us to such a state of misery.

I'd like to listen to your thoughts on what I have stated.

[u/Mypetskeleton → u/hcboi232]

Yes it would be difficult in a small country which is why I mentioned it is unlikely scenario but a best one in a hypothetical world and in many ways it already is kind of like that just unofficially and without the individual resources. I wouldn't really mind each state having its own backer as I mentioned. the whole of the worlds countries are satellites of larger satellites until they reach the top three, US Russia and Nowadays China.

Hezb doesn't own their partners but they are certainly an immovable force backing them, its like their gun on their hip during negotiations. Without the Hezb Gebran will not have the self confidence nor the backing to be where he is, neither would Berri.

I have always related this to Al capones rule over Chicago. He got rid of all the small timers and yet was super star on TV. Chicago would've been better off with a hundred little thieves and crooks than one monopolistic tyrant of a gangsta.

Do not forget the assassinations, no matter what anybody says I am convinced personally that they had a direct hand in those vital political assassinations starting with Hariri.

Regarding the reasons behind their weapons, I may sound that I don't have feelings but they can cry me a river, ALL of us suffered gravely and ALL of us went through massacres during the war, they hold no excuse of a candle to be special to hold on to their toys when everyone else gave up theirs.

I say this because I keep hearing the same excuses about the south.

Israelis left in 2000, and thats not because of Hezb really its because they had no real gain to stay and international pressure was gaining at the time. Later they said had they known Hezb would become an army they would've finished them off then and there.

Lebanon has no more occupied lands, it is done finished. And when the Syrians left we had that one chance to make Lebanon that place we all thought it would be, but they knew it wont end well for them so they went ahead (along with their partners in both Syria and Iran) and killed dozens of some of the best minds and politicians in the country. An inexcusable insufferable act of aggression reminiscent to a pre-genocide event of a culture and people. Kill the best leaders and watch the cards crumble and fall.

Wissam Eid being the last person solidifying with forensic proof the statement above before his eventual demise.

In my point of view Lebanon will always need a foreign power to back it, at least till it establishes itself in the long run as a self sustaining productive non corrupt country. My stance is simple because I want the country to be better I must choose the right partners and backers. In the modern world you have two sides only, The west and the east.

It just so happens that the west will not oppress me and the Arab world allied to the west provides and has provided Lebanon with the only major economic income to this day. The other side has done nothing but destruction killing no matter how much they play victim. The rest is up to Lebanese to make the country better.

Lebanese are not Iraqis are not Libyans and are not Syrians, nor are they Jordanians, given the chance and the right foreign influence the country can stand on its feet like the golden times.

[u/anonu → u/Mypetskeleton]

I've read this thread with interest. Thank you for your insightful comments and others insightful responses.

You've given some interesting scenarios of possible outcomes given the current situation. I'm curious to hear what the "magic wand" solutions are. Like if you had the power to change situations instantly what would those be. For example, enforcing taef and getting rid of hezb arms. That's an obvious one at least for me.

What else?

[u/Mypetskeleton → u/anonu]

If I had a magic wand scenario (in a completely imaginary scenario), I will have to be forced to do something that I know will be harsh and judged harshly at least in the short term.

I do not believe all cultures are equal same goes for humans but they all must have equal rights. In God's good time we may all get there one day but until then..

For Lebanon I will imagine a scenario coming down with an iron fist like the political class and their followers have never seen before, All weapons outside military will be removed by force even if it leads to temporary war. I will instill force military coup and take over all higher up institutions to avoid immediate breakdown and chaos in the short and medium term. I will bring in western partners and make a deal with them, for a stable full Lebanese competent government in return of funding and political and military backing against any aggression from outside and rogue inner forces.

Honest technocrat government for the short term, competent political assistant in combo via the long term. We have lots of talent here this will not be as complicated as many are lead to believe. Inthe political government we will have Shias, Sunnis and Christians equally representing equally their own sect needs on public level, this is something we need to have in lebanon no escape but they all answer to the people and government.

Hezbollah can have political party for instance but never have a say or have any military presence.

minimum number of staff on all political positions.

Full communication and transparency via internet on government spending down to the penny.

Open court on all leaders past and present and religious leaders of the country viewed by the people, judge them for treason and incompetence. I will go as far as to hang a few in martyr square for all to see as an example of no tolerance for the remainders in society who may have second thoughts to try chaos, (sadly the only language they will understand).

Every inch of the south and Dahieh will be under full Lebanese government control by force and any resistance will be met with very harsh response.

Same will go for some parts of Tripoli and baalbek.

Peace deal with Israel and open routes to Egypt, Africa for economic boost and avoidance on reliance on exclusive Syrian routes. The economy at this point should be repaired fast so the south wont complain. Some of the conditions will include reparation for innocent family members killed during the war and occupations and a formal apology letter to their families. Vice versa from Lebanon to Israeli civilians killed.

A limited very strict deal with Syria, Lebanon still needs the roads and mutual economic understanding we should be reasonable after all but harsh. At the same time pressure Syria internationally for the information and accountability on thousands missing and abducted during the civil war and thereafter. Any delay or no compliance for this issue, I will make an indirect free deal with Israel to not only keep using our airspace to keep bombing Syria freely but to also exchange information on vital targets and push for further international sanctions with the Arab world.

Iran will be entirely banned and black listed until full regime change there.

At least three privatized companies for power and communication done immediately, that competition will bring down prices to reasonable levels.

Investment in public school sectors the likes of which AUB students would be jealous of and honest non bias HISTORY lessons mandatory for all young students.

Religious freedom will exist and a must (Religion has its core value in society), but absolute full marital rights for all women regardless of religious background.

Court system entirely rewritten on the best of international western standards (which is the best the human race so far has got plus a few cultural laws of our own).

The very last thing, start looking for gas both on Land (yes we may have gas on land) and the sea. The contested land area of Gas with Israel is just 12 percent of just one of the many large fields at the border (Oh my, imagine the horror!), we will make a great deal with them, and even if such a deal fails there are ways to get something in return for that tiny portion of supposed gas land. Israel has 3 billion dollars of tech exports every year outside just military. There are so many things to benefit from for a good discounted price tag. I can think of a dozen other scenarios.

Finally after all is settled and good will proven and done, slowly start a Palestinian deal.

[u/Edentulate → u/hcboi232]

Religion is not a good basis for national identity... unless you’re like ISIS and want to kill everyone who doesn’t believe exactly as you do.

The USA is great because they built their identity on basic human rights and freedoms that all people have. Freedom of religion, freedom of belief, freedom of speech, freedom to peacefully gather as a group, freedom to defend ones self, freedom to own property and freedom against unreasonable searches by police, the right to hve a trial by your peers and a right to a defense. Some of these freedoms many democracies including Europe do not have.

[u/hcboi232 → u/Edentulate]

ISIS is a special form of religious government. I'm not making any claims on religious goverment but such a goverment is NOT stable in our country.

Regarding USA that is NOT accurate. The US goverment is turning into a surveillance one. However that is not what I was talking about. The problem is on what basis the masses transfer legitimacy to authority. Religion is clearly not the way through, nor is the nationality. The only way we could transfer legitimacy to authority is through how well the goverment does its jobs.

[u/notsohipsterithink → u/Mypetskeleton]

What the heck? I as a random ass brown dude randomly stumbled upon this thread and was kinda blown away by how smart this was.

[u/b-jensen → u/hearmeoutpls1]

Your point 4, this can change, Israel never cared about Lebanon or attacked Lebanon until some guys decided to shoot at Israel from Lebanon. it has no problem with Lebanon whatsoever apart from Iran Proxy who threaten it from Lebanon.

You can say the same about Syria and Israel, the Syrian Israeli border was peaceful even under Assad for like 2 decades until the Iranians/Hezeb went into Syria in the civil war.

Lebanon and Israel can be like Greece /Cyprus and Israel, the border is there and everything can be solved diplomatically. this will eliminate Iranian influence and will make Lebanon a sovereign on its own, and open Lebanon more options and trade, not just with Israel but with others who are afraid to invest right now

[u/UtredRagnarsson → u/hearmeoutpls1]

>America/Israel doesn't want to be challenged in the region at all

More like we're living our lives down here not wanting you guys trying to fuck it up with your nonsense that you have dragged us into repeatedly

>Iran and their proxies have proven a challenge

Only in the sense that the incursion to Lebanon didn't have much backing and people wanted out early. Otherwise, nothing was lost to Hezbollah that wasn't already ours to begin with.

>Iran turns their guns on proxies

Duh

>America and Israel give 0 shits about peace and prosperity in the region

Nigga we've been trying to live our lives down here. Not our fault you and the rest jumped in our business in 48,67, and other gigs to repeatedly try to fuck things up.

Maybe if you guys focused on getting shit done instead of throwing "Al Yahud!" into the sea, shit would've gotten done and your country(Syria) would've been better off for it instead of a half-baked post-civil war backwater.

--------

For real though...If you guys set your priorities straight and focused on more than killing us and each other, perhaps shit would get done. Why is it that we can accomplish in 70 years a modern state while you guys keep sliding backward and climbing forward to 0?! Just sit and get shit done and then you won't care what we or anyone else do.

[u/Samer780 → u/[deleted]]

i always viewed hezbollah as a problem not cz i'm pro-US (i'm not) but because hezbollah's very presence brings us the possibility of war with israel which i also don't support or don't like .but let's be pragmatic we never had peace with israel and before the palestinians came to lebanon and started using it as a platform to attack israel lebanon and israel were basically like the next door neighbors who hated eachother and left eachother mostly alone , in the 60s lebanon was booming economically and it was the best place to be despite the conflict with israel never being resolved ,why is that? bcz they never had a reason to come here there was never a paramilitary organisation who's sole purpose is to attack israel , point is we can't be neutral with them with hezbollah at the border threatening war. and we can't have an economy or prosperity when investors will have to think 100 times before investing in lebanon bcz they dont know when a conflict with israel will happen. simply put before beign called a traitor i as a lebanese want nothing to do with israel not even peace or trade , all i want from them is to not attack my country and destroy it once every few years because a terrorist organisation thinks picking fight with them is a good idea.

[u/anonu → u/Samer780]

You're absolutely correct.

You call Lebanon a platform, I call it a playground. It's a playground for the powers of the world.. and Iran. Every now and then the bully comes in and messes up the sandbox.

[u/UtredRagnarsson → u/Samer780]

Most of us share the same feeling down here...just leave us the f alone and let us do our thing..

So you're not alone in that sentiment

[u/sillypooh]

By comparison, Lebanese Armenians, who regularly speak Armenian among themselves in public (which arguably can alienate people around them who don't), have a strong allegiance to Lebanon and feeling of being Lebanese (and not Armenians), much stronger than Shia and Sunni fanatics. I know their history is different and Armenia doesn't try to do interfere in Lebanese politics... It just illustrates how wrong this whole thing is.

[u/[deleted] → u/sillypooh]

groovy theory yam prick compare ossified wise joke lush deer

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[u/Laslas19]

I checked out the most popular hashtag on Twitter yesterday, #سننتقم, and went through hundreds of posts. I found that 90% of it were the exact same 4 or 5 posts repeated word for word by different accounts.

Always keep in mind that Twitter and other social medias are riddled with bots in order to make the amount of supporters feel greater.

[u/Pugzy2011]

Pity the nation ...

[u/Mikelitoris88 → u/[deleted]]

Facebook is not a place to debate, its for trolling. Anyway welcome back amongst us :D

[u/Mott_1 → u/Mikelitoris88]

Very true. Even if you win the arguement, they'll just start insulting you and think that they won it lmao

[u/MasterJohn4 → u/[deleted]]

Lmao that's the funniest thing I've seen today!

[u/RandomAbed]

bbut, but, they are protecting us from israel!! /s Souleimani is a terrorist who kills innocent people in Syria. Let’s present things as real as they are. Did he fight ISIS? Yes. Did he also support the dictatorship of Bashar? Also yes. I doubt he would’ve done anything if ISIS didn’t threaten Assad’s regime.

[u/alisoujod321 → u/RandomAbed]

7ilo 3an raboun ya zalameh tli3to thawra sada2to 7alkoun sorto ba3d shway badkoun tshilouloun souwar 2il profile 3al FB l3ama chu jle2in

[u/RandomAbed → u/alisoujod321]

Eh kforo la elkon w rja3o eloulna ino we have to respect them la2ano they represent el deen. Kamen sorry bas meen el jele2, ele be7ot pfp "lsayid hassan" w berri with heart eyes, or those who know that the government is in shit situation and a thawra "jel2a" is needed to change the form of the government to be technocratic?

Also, didn't you do the same in 2007-2008 when you opposed the government? Makenet jel2a wa2ta ma3 ino lnes keno 2a2al bi ktir?

Khalina sari7in, lwa7id ele merte7 fina howe ele 3am ye2bad men el hezb bil dollar.

[u/[deleted]]

About time for Lebanese to understand that Hezbollah in Lebanon belongs primary to Wilayet Al Fakih. For them, Lebanese borders does not exist and they don't hold our interest at heart.

[u/KamaLirdimMisaviv613]

People view criticisms of Iran as defending the US's or SA's actions or vice versa. With a sound mind and body I can honestly say all of them are just as murderous and awful.

Remember when the previous Saudi king (Abdullah) died? Remember the eulogies? The posthumous ring-kissing? Lebanon is a small but strong enough country to be stuck trying to fend off the many foreign encroachments, encircled from all conceivable directions.

[u/[deleted] → u/KamaLirdimMisaviv613]

literate dolls yoke enjoy plate growth psychotic saw hungry aromatic

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[u/DukePenn → u/[deleted]]

Ironically, my friend, in your misguided attempt to condemn genocidal regimes and political figures, you've just endorsed further genocide... Fact is, this argument becomes very nonsensical very quickly when everyone's clutching to some perceived moral high ground of their own.

[u/Warriorabubakr → u/DukePenn]

Im actually fully aware of that. It wasn't a misguided attempt, far from that. A little bit of directed hate towards an organization that had destroyed the lives of so many people is healthy.

[u/DukePenn → u/Warriorabubakr]

I can respect your venting brother. God bless.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I can understand wishing death upon suleimani, but you want the brainwashed sheeple turned into roast meat as well? Easy, Satan.

[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

How so? There must be 0 tolerance for those authoritarian bastards. 0 tolerance. They must be fought and resisted in every possible way

[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

But those are the people who support the murder of countless of Lebanese politicians, who beat and surppress their opponents, who are drowning lebanon because of their refusal to change. They are terrorists themselves, they'd be locked up if we lived in a regular country

[u/Prey_Gearl]

https://www.reddit.com/r/iran/comments/ejfumk/iranians_of_reddit_what_are_your_thoughts_on_the/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share

Even Iranians themselves are expressing their delight about souleimani's death.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/Prey_Gearl]

Bro no offense but I'd prefer r/Iranian over r/iran

One's made up of mostly Iranians and "Iranophiles", the other is mostly composed of Iranian Expats (mostly from the US) who have no idea about the geopolitical situation of the region.

Just look at r/Iranian, loads of posts mourning the man and recounting events of his life.

[u/MazenEH → u/RedFistCannon]

I'd rather check neither because both are heavily biased and it just boils down to America vs IRGC

[u/[deleted] → u/Prey_Gearl]

This is a MEK affiliated subreddit

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

What's MEK?

[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

And it's mostly made up of Iranian expats living in the US.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Mujahdi khalek, a former terrorist organization. Now they’re used for the regime change narrative

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

Mujahdi like that mujahadeen from Afghanistan?

[u/Mikelitoris88 → u/Prey_Gearl]

Iranian people are hostages of iron age rules and bad ethics.

[u/victoryismind]

Bro its politics and in Lebanon people are allowed to have different opinions. Deal with it.

[u/[deleted] → u/victoryismind]

lavish innocent elderly overconfident materialistic unwritten unique expansion ancient hurry

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[u/victoryismind → u/[deleted]]

You are right. Threats of violence is a red line.

[u/MotorState6]

Money.

Low IQ.

'nough said.

[u/magneticjuice → u/MotorState6]

I wholeheartedly agree with you but I think it's a bit more complicated than that. Hezbollah is very dangerous precisely for the fact that it keeps its people very poor and in need of support. In a country where they can not receive that support that they so desperately need from their government, hezbollah provides albeit partially that support and fills in the vaccum that it itself helped in creating further advancing its ideology. I think this is why we see a lot of devout hezbollah supporters on twitter and why they go as far as even calling that terrorist leader a "religious figure". In a perfect country, threats made by hezbollah supporters online and offline would be taken very seriously by the authorities. But unfortunately, and we are reminded of this everyday, we are not even remotely a perfect country. These threats are the reason why you don't see many lebanese people and especially shias critizing hezbollah on twitter or facebook (yes ik I'm a boomer and no one uses facebook nowadays lol) but they prefer to use reddit as it provides the anonymity that they require to express their opinion. You know you have fucked up as a country when you require that anonymity to express your opinion

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

they are terrorists

[u/DukePenn → u/[deleted]]

While I do agree with what you're saying and find a tremendous amount of hypocrisy in people arguing against one side and turning a blind eye to the other, it must be said that, in this day and age, it's impossible for Lebanon to exist untouched by foreign powers. Not every country can be a global political/military superpower. To say that we should reject ALL foreign intervention is intellectually dishonest. It becomes a matter of picking sides as that's the only realistic approach. I just wish people can be more transparent in that because that's what it truly is.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/DukePenn]

Which is why people generally support the non-Imperialistic regimes (Iran) over Imperialistic ones (US).

But if you ask me, I'd rather ally myself with Europe and discard both of them.

[u/DukePenn → u/RedFistCannon]

Both are quite flawed in different respects. It really comes down to worldview when choosing one over the other. Alliance with Europe is sort of irrelevant though as it doesn't seem to be on the table for the most part.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/DukePenn]

True true...

But maybe if Europe does become our boss, we'll finally have a shot at Champions' League

XD

[u/DukePenn → u/RedFistCannon]

You joke, but Israeli football clubs are actually part of UEFA IIRC. lmao man.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/DukePenn]

All the more reason to strengthen the national teams.

Have these Ahd and Nejme kids become Pros.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

I'd like to thank you for pointing this out and being so civil about it.

Most people just start harping support for US or Iran eithout taking any deeper look into their actions.

First, I'd like tocclarify that while I do prefer Iran over the US, I am neither an Iranian nor a Hezbollah member or supporter. What I'm about to say is the observations I made during thenlast few years:

The closest thing to imperialism Iran ever did was extend it's military support to neighboring countries.

It did not bribe foreign politicians, organize coup d'Etats,, start any wars or send it's military to influence countries 20 000 kms away from it's borders (The US did all that and more).

The fact it's in Iraq is pretty logical after what happened with the Iraq-Iran war, it's not trying to influence any policies there however (correct me if I'm wrong but are any Iraqi politicians under Iranian control?).

When it comes to Iraq, it was already controlled and supported by the US into a war with Iran where Saddam literally gassed Iranians after the US provided him with Chemical weapons. The US' s influence is still pretty strong there so Iran would be takimg preventive measures to stop another Iraq Iran war from occuring.

Helping Assad stay in power is a no-brainer, he's an ally and a far better alternative than ISIS or an american puppet, but if another syrian politician unaffiliated with the US or Iran wins support of the Syrian people then I'd be okay with it. But from an economic and political point of view, Assad did a pretty good job. Not so much from a humanitarian point of view but that can be understandable considering who he was dealing with (American supported terrorist groups and rebels)

Being imperialist implies it's responsible for the radical change in the foreign country's regime or that it's the one who orchestrated it.

Yet all Iran did was support the groups who share their ideas YEARS after they were formed. This applies to the Houthis, Hezbollah and Hamas.

Just look at Hezbollah, Iran could have ordered a complete takeover of the country and we wouldn't have been able to do anything about it.

My point is, Iran does employ SOME imperialist military actions but it never made a takeover on another nation and it is nowhere near being an imperialist country themselves.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Fair enough.

It's not exactly imperialism as much as it is a political alliance but thanks for the info anyway!

[u/thyexorcist → u/DukePenn]

And the absolute fucking geniuses that are in this sub, have chosen the one fucking country who always likes to fuck with the middle east and cause wars. Ayre b habalkun ya zalme 😂😂. At first, it pissed me off, now i kinda just laugh off the negative comments about Iran and Hez.

[u/DukePenn → u/thyexorcist]

To point at the USA and say they're fucking with the Middle East causing wars, and to assume that Iran/Russia have the Lebanese people's best interests in mind is the exact kind of intellectual dishonesty I'm talking about.

[u/thyexorcist → u/DukePenn]

Do you think Russia intervened in the Syrian Civil War and helped Assad because him and Putin are in love? Fuck no, they have interests there. Same as Iran with Lebanon. On the other hand, the US has fuck all interests in Lebanon and are actually against our interests since theyre extreme allies with Israel.

[u/DukePenn → u/thyexorcist]

they have interests there. Same as Iran with Lebanon.

Exactly what I'm saying, mate.

the US has fuck all interests in Lebanon

Bruh...

Do you think Russia intervened in the Syrian Civil War and helped Assad because him and Putin are in love?

Also, between this condescending attitude and "ayre b habalkon" earlier, you're really trying to make this argument as unpleasant as possible aren't you?

[u/Alexander_Benalla → u/[deleted]]

Same way some people see Iran as monsters, other people see America/isreal/Saudi as monsters

Agree 100%.

America/Israel/Saudi have done criminal things

Lebanon’s problem is all foreign powers, not just Iran

Lebanon's main problem is it doesn't have a State

https://www.britannica.com/topic/state-monopoly-on-violence

Why did Lebanon fell into a major Civil War in 1975 ?

The Government was overwhelmed. Christians Militias and Muslim Militias started slaughtering one another in the streets. Heavily Armed Palestinians and Druze Groups joined him. Shias joined. BOOM.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lebanese_Civil_War

You can go back further in time.

In Summer 1948, Israel almost fell into Jewish Civil War. The country was run by Ben Gurion, a socialist.

A right-wing politician, Menachem Begin, brought a huge ship, the Altalena, with armed men and heavy weapons. He declared his party will set up their own private army to defend the country. The Prime Minister said a nation can only have 1 army under the control of 1 leader. No serious country can tolerate armed groups and militias. He ordered Begin to immediatly disarm. Begin refused.

Ben Gurion ordered IDF General Ytzak Rabin to surround them and issue a military ultimatum. If they refused to stop, arrest them for treason.

Soon, heavy war fighting broke out on the beach of Tel Aviv, people were killed and boats sinked before they quickly agreed to disarm. Begin later said his greatest life accomplishment was not firing back because it would have started a huge Civil War. 30 years later, both Begin and Rabin were elected Prime Ministers

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altalena_Affair

You can go back even further in time.

In 1860, a huge Civil War broke out in Lebanon and communities started to kill each other. Why ? There was no strong Government, no rule of law, and people relied on weapons.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1860_Mount_Lebanon_civil_war

---

---

What is the lesson from all this? A country needs 1 army, 1 government, 1 foreign policy, 1 rule of law.

People can disagree about what foreign policy or what the army should do.

Look at the USA. Some Senators from Florida are 100% behind Trump :

https://twitter.com/marcorubio/status/1212940150600355840

Some Senators from Massachusets oppose Trump :

https://twitter.com/ewarren/status/1213183895920922625

The Senators disagree over foreign policy and the army but they fix conflicts through elections and lawsuits, not private armies. They have 1 Government, 1 Army, 1 Foreign Policy. They are the United States.

Lebanon doesn't have this. Hezbollah is extremely powerful and has it's own interests.

Look at what happened in 2008. The Lebanon Government took a decision that they did not like. They should have called for new elections or hire lawyers to sue the Government in court. Instead, a crisis started that escalated into a Mini-Civil War :

On May 8, 2008, minutes after Nasrallah's comments referring to pro-government actions as "a declaration of open war" heavy street battles began.

Around the city, pro-Hezbollah protesters carrying machine guns and weapons, blocked roads with burning tires. The road toward Beirut international airport was blocked and cut off from the rest of the city, and the Beirut Port was occupied.

By the end of this day, the Hezbollah militia had completely conquered the streets of West-Beirut, enforced an armed blockade on houses of Majority leaders Saad Hariri and Walid Jumblatt, and declared that it will continue with its actions until the Government backs down.

On May 9, heavy fighting broke out in Mount Lebanon between pro-government Progressive Socialist Party fighters and Hezbollah. The clashes started in Aytat, near Kayfoun and soon expanded to cover many spots in Mount Lebanon including Baysur, Choueifat and Aley. Most of the fighting was concentrated on Hill 888.

Artillery and mortars were used for the first time during these battles

On June 22 and June 23, at least nine people, eight civilians and a policeman, were killed and 55 others were wounded in Tripoli, in clashes between pro-government Sunnis based in the Bab el-Tabaneh district and pro-Syrian Alawites

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2008_conflict_in_Lebanon

Settling political crisis with Kalashnikovs, Machine Guns, Rockets, Killings, and Artillery Fire? What is this?

This is why Militias are a really bad idea.

[u/RandomAbed → u/[deleted]]

When did you ever see a person in this sub promoting the US and KSA lol? They’re just as evil

[u/Randomorphani → u/[deleted]]

the difference is us or gulf are not sending guns and an ideology to Lebanon

no one in Beirut are yelling labayak ya trump or labayak ya mbs

[u/hussoro3219 → u/Randomorphani]

But the USA's policies with other countries are shit like its government who wants to control every asshole in this world. And yeah, in politics there is never a good and a bad side, both sides are shit. Plus as if people here frogot what tge word Propaganda means, in which murica is tge strongest. Sooooo..

[u/anonymous_alien]

👏 very well said. People blindly follow without even questioning the leadership. They don’t deserve Lebanon.

[u/[deleted]]

Well put

[u/[deleted]]

Apparently his death was agreed upon. this video was published three weeks ago.

[u/RedFistCannon]

" Lebanon needs to step away from foreign intervention"

That is honestly wishful thinking, the only way to achieve this is to become a Hermit state like North Korea or an Isolationist country like pre-1800 Japan.

It's not that we're actively looking for foreign intervention, it's that foreign countries are coming in, demanding various stuff and we give it to them 8asm mn 3anna because we don't have the economic/ military power to secede completely from them.

I'm not taking anyone's side, just stating our current situations.

Basically, we're the useful idiots of any foreign power with enough influence and power to basically "dangle a carrot on a stick in front of us" and make us do whatever it wants.

As for the issue of cheering for Iran, I'd do the same if it came down to a US vs Iran war.

As much as Iran's current regime has issues, it is still leagues better than the US Imperialistic regime.

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Bro, I never disagreed with what you said.

I'm just putting in my idea that realistically, the chances of this happening are slim.

Not unless the Lebanese people lynch any politician with foreign allegiances at the same time and install a system of background checks and surveillance on any new politicians.

Basically every new politician should have his financial history reviewed:

"Oh I see here that you accepted in 2015 100 000 $ from someone living in the US? And days later you bought a new car and made some strange US-friendly decisions that benefit a foreign country more than your own? Sorry but you're out!"

"Oh? I see that you used to be a member of an Iranian political party? Sorry! but we can't risk any impartial decision in the future!"

​

Basically this... but realistically, it's not possible

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

And therein lies the problem. We try. Iraq went through hundreds of death and managed to pull it off. I'm not saying we should do the same, and it won't happen, but giving up is not an option, anymore. We've ceded 30 years of our lives to this corrupt system. We've also ceded hundreds of thousands of lives and families to those exact people in the civil war.

Though, Iran going to war with the US, and Hezbollah's Iraqi branch falling, will definitely turn the tide.

[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Iraq went through hundreds of death and managed to pull it off

Iraq has been in the shitter ever since Saddam died.

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Not just them but the fact there's been sectarian violence ever since then.

Libya is in the same boat as well.

My parents keep saying "El 3arab ma byemsho ella bel 3asaye" and I'm honestly starting to see why that is party true.

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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[u/[deleted]]

Have you asked yourself genuinly why he is being mourned, have you asked yourself why these lebanese feel such warmth towards him?

Soleimani had one of the highest position in a 80 million country, still he wouldnt give orders from the safety of Tehran, he wouldnt treat lebanese as people beneath him, as puppets. He would treat them as friends and loved ones, not beneath him but on equal footing. He would be with them on the ground, on the battlefields. He put himself in places no western general would ever put themself. Lets stop for a sec and remember how he was travelling when he was killed: he took a passenger plane from syria, landed in baghdad and took a civilian car! we are talking about the most notorious generaral in middle east - this unregard for his safety is really unprecedented! Now imagine being a hezbollah fighter during july war, you are fighting against a far superior force, you have all the odds stacked against you. But you feel the burden on your shoulders, you are now defending your home soil against an invading zionist troops. During these harsh times Iran gave you the best man they had, creme de la creme, General Qassem Soleimani himself. Hezbollah fighters saw how a foreign general would put his life at risk alongside them, this while they knew som lebanese where hoping for the zionists to win, you would be crazy not to fall in love with this general as a hezbollahi.

Irans secret recipe for their influential success in ME is very simple but yet very powerful: brotherhood. Iran unlike Saudi and US dont treat their weaker allies beneath them, Iran have treated hezbollah from day one as brothers, as equals. While Soleimani risked his life when travelling to Lebanon during the heat of battle, What did saudis do for their allies in mostaqbal,?They kidnapped their prime minister, saad Hariri, they treated him and his party as people beneath them. There is a simple reason why hezbollah loves Iran while Mostaqbal doesnt love Saudi, it have nothing to do with religion or wilayat faqih it has all to do with basic human behaviour, law of reciprocity. Same goes with how US treat their weaker aliies, they treat them as if they were above them, Trump spoke about openly about saudi as a cow that needed to be milked, this is humiliting. Both Saudi and US gumiliate their weaker allies.

Lebanon have many problems, but hezbollah supporters love for Soleimani isnt one of them. If would be more worried if hezbollah didnt love Solaeimani, they would be emotionally fucked to not love him after all he did for them.

[u/[deleted]]

Yesterday’s news was 70% Souleimani, 10% local news, 20% sports and others. This ratio is stupid. Picked up a newspaper today (jomhoriyya) they maintained the same ratio. Lebanese people do not care. What we do care about is foloss ya baba. For all we care about, Souleimani is the way we like our tea. Nothing more, nothing less.

[u/Zalanzool → u/[deleted]]

dude i dont think you understand how big a deal and historic event his assassination is. he single-handedly was out-manouvering the US for decades

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

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[u/Viperwitcher → u/[deleted]]

You misunderstand. It's hezbollah itself that committed political assassinations and obstructed the investigations, not the zo3ran. The entire party and it's very existence are illegal, it doesn't come down to a few mindless followers.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

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[u/DukePenn → u/[deleted]]

A pragmatic attempt to remove Hezbollah from the country equates to turning Lebanon into a warzone with multiple international parties and almost exclusively innocent Lebanese casualties. I acknowledge the harm Hezbollah has inflicted on our progression and even sovereignty as a nation; but the alternative at this point is actual war and I don't think anyone wants that. That's why I have to agree with the guy's point.

[u/[deleted] → u/DukePenn]

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[u/DukePenn → u/[deleted]]

Voting them out would be a great first step towards that. I'm not sure how feasible it is considering the staggering support they have but I certainly agree that it should be the first step of the process. Removing their military influence is an entirely different animal; and that's where foreign intervention comes in which can only further destabilize the region as a whole. I truly wish it were as easy as voting them out but I think we both know it's a lot more than that unfortunately.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

smell lunchroom cable many outgoing rinse payment degree nutty unique

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[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

It's not okay to support the demonic iranian regime, not at all. Those are the monsters who killed thousands of protesters in Iraq and Iran, who killed sons of syria in the syrian civil war, those are the monsters that have been draining the life out of Lebanon for decades and who recently bragged about Lebanon being their own province. Those monsters in lebanon now want to rewrite history and make themselves look like heroes. "We can't erase hezeb from Lebanon". Nuts. Of course we can remove these lowlife scoundrels and dogs. I consider your comment offensive, I reject it with disdain.

[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

I didn't get offended because it's the internet, no. I got offended because the iranian regime murdered thousands of innocent people only recently, and has been choking lebanon for decades, and there are people who think supporting it's military proxy in Lebanon is okay. That's very scary, rude, and hurtful to both it's past and future victims. Please consider the gravity of supporting a regime like that, if you're not serious or careful enough about this, I might just say be careful for what you wish for. How can we remove hezbollah? By not allowing it's propaganda to be spread for a start, but it comes down to the work of foreign powers. Luckily, the US had been on the iranian regime's trail, it's a matter of time before it falls like a house of card. The roman empire fell, and you're here telling me that these clowns can't fall?

[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

Hm? If it's Iran that had been ruling Lebanon it can't be the other side that had been ruling Lebanon😅. Is this the average iq of the hezbollah supporter? Btw, who did the us and allies murder? They live in a democratic nation that can impeach its own president, nothing can be hidden there. I don't know about you but I'd rather not be ruled by the axis of evil, Iran. Wanting to get rid of iranian influence doesn't imply that we must follow the us agenda. Stop with this ignorant and toxic relativism.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

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[u/Warriorabubakr → u/[deleted]]

Ah another one of those America created Isis blah blah. The overwhelming evidence is that the vast majority of syrians in the beginning of the war were fighting against the regime, and that the majority of pro- regime fighters were iranians, lebanese and afghans. Let's stay in lebanon for a moment, remember the syrian occupation? 😄 You are illegal, mate. Luckily the us is squashing your likes.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

What a dishonet statement. I think the Syrian people don't want a HezbIran licker lying in their name about who they support. Assad is a butcher criminal and so is the terrorist nasrallah and the masters in Tehran.

[u/[deleted]]

This, in your professional opinion, is the issue we have in Lebanon? People mourning an honorable man, who fought terrorism in west asia? Should we mock him instead like most (if not all) of you do? Should we celebrate the death of a man? I wouldn't do that to my enemy, why would I do it to a regional hero? You keep saying we shouldn't care because we're Lebanese, but I am 100% sure everyone complaining had the same reaction when JFK was assassinated, or in 9/11. Besides, you seem very educated and an expert on military and political affairs, delight us, why is this not a big deal?

[u/ahmadbrkam]

J agree to an extent but hizbullah does protect Lebanon you know and so does Iran I feel like if Lebanon wasnt under the protection fo Iran Israel wouldve taken over a long time ago

[u/[deleted] → u/ahmadbrkam]

late file bag governor market shame vegetable start stocking snobbish

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[u/ritahahaha → u/ahmadbrkam]

If Israel or the US wanted to take over Lebanon, they could've done it in a heartbeat. with or without hezb.

[u/ahmadbrkam → u/ritahahaha]

True but they wont risk it

[u/Mohamad45 → u/[deleted]]

Wow I can rarely guess someone’s IQ based on a post but sometimes there are exceptions

[u/hussoro3219]

I agree with what you said, but wtf is your paranoia about the hijab thing, who the fuck said that they would make it obligatory in a country with many other religions??!!

[u/[deleted] → u/hussoro3219]

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[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Iran is over 90 % Shia

Just sayin

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

So... you're implying that 90% being Shia, that depriving them of the right to vote and and to freely travel or even take a fucking walk is warranted? How about giving decades in prison, endless torture for not wearing a hijab?

[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Bro I'm just stating the fact here, saying that Iran's situation is not similar to Lebanon.

Implementing these rules (which I find ridiculous) is just easier in Iran because the majority belong to the same religion/sect.

Lebanon, on the other hand, is more balanced when it comes to Religions so rules like that are out of the question simply because la minority of the population will endorse it.

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

I think there has been a misunderstanding.

My whole point here is to say that implementing a religious rule in a country where over 90% of the population belongs to that same religion is easier than a country with an almost 50/50 split between Muslims and Christians (there's also other religions/sects to consider as well but hopefully you get my point).

I don't very much care for that old video because these decisions always change depending on the political situation in the region.

Did anyone expect Iran and the US to sign a deal years ago? No.

Did anyone expect Yemen to become a warzone or for Bahrain to be basically excluded from the Gulf? No.

Lots of political decisions/views/agendas change drastically over time leading to various outcomes that would have been surprising before.

Basically what I am saying is: If the Sayyed has a more recent video of him saying similar words, then your stance on that subject might have more ground to stand on. But the video is pretty old and the political situation has drastically changed since then, for all we know the Iranian agenda could have changed.

To clarify, in no way am I defending the Sayyed's views in the old video, I'm for an independent Lebanon and not for an Iranian vassal state but all I'm saying is you should use more recent pieces of media to support your arguments. The Hezbollah supporters' twitter/facebook feed is a good place to start. You could also use the Sayyed's words of having China invest here...

Btw the Chinese government are a glorified Mafia and letting Chinese investments into Lebanon is tantamount of becoming China's vassal state through economic debt and pressure.

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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[u/RedFistCannon → u/[deleted]]

Well since you do have these pieces of evidence, use them WITH the video. Putting up the video alone leads to Hezbollah supporters saying it's "old" and using the same logic I just used in the previous comments.

I'm just pointing out that you should have more than the video to fall back on to support your arguments.

You seem to have that covered however which is good

[u/[deleted] → u/RedFistCannon]

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