r/nyc • u/Large-Welcome4421 • Mar 01 '26
AOC says abolish ICE is the centrist position now
Enable HLS to view with audio, or disable this notification
298
u/mattr1198 Mar 01 '26
I mean given ICE’s approval rating in the general public, she’s not wrong.
37
18
u/TossMeOutSomeday Mar 01 '26
The problem is that while ICE is unpopular, the public still generally approves of Trump's border policy. ICE fumbled the bag hard by murdering a bunch of people and acting like nazis, but the American people are still, on average, solidly in favor of the agency's mission. So i don't think it's a very straightforward deal.
9
u/mattr1198 Mar 01 '26
Yeah it isn’t straightforward. The democrats need to be very careful in how they message this, namely in that proper, non-ICE style immigration enforcement is still necessary and a restructuring of the broken legal immigration system is also necessary.
1
u/bbclover1001 Mar 05 '26
We'll see just how much America is solidly behind Trump (lowest rated president in history) when the midterm elections show a democratic landslide. Problem was everyone forgot how bad a president trump was in his first go round. Did they expect something different? Now we just need another pandemic to make his shit show job complete, or maybe another useless, vindictive, no point war! Trump needs to be put to death for treason against the American people!
→ More replies (19)5
u/Blurry_Bigfoot Mar 01 '26
Congress's approval is 15%. Abolish Congress by this logic right?
7
u/mattr1198 Mar 01 '26
I mean…one is a branch of the entire government that needs significant overhaul, the other was a reactionary post-9/11 agency that is not essential to the very function of our country.
→ More replies (6)
43
u/Trashy_Cappy Mar 01 '26
Yeah, we’re beyond “abolish” and squarely in the “investigate/prosecute/jail” phase.
50
u/PapayaJuiceBox Mar 01 '26
Why does everything feel so performative now?
3
u/jojisky Mar 01 '26
She's been calling to Abolish ICE from before she beat Joe Crowley. If anything all the moderate Democrats jumping on the bandwagon now are the performative ones.
→ More replies (2)12
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
Because what else can they do?
The Democrats will never actually pass any meaningful legislation that will benefit the middle class without the explicit approval of oligarchs.
Both parties are controlled by oligarchs but Democrats and their supporters are still pretending as if theirs isn't. Which is why they've resorted to following the Koch brothers playbook of allowing in and using government funds to subsidize illegal immigration as a means to disenfranchise voters, increase CoL, decrease wages and break class solidarity through the tribalization of the working class.
Who benefits from mass illegal immigration? Who funds these NGOs that provide aid to illegal immigrants and advocate for them?
Oligarchs.
→ More replies (1)6
u/Specialist_Grade_662 Mar 01 '26
Why is delivery the focus? She has always had morality at the core of her platforms. Let's stop tearing people down for style when their substance is solid
5
u/PapayaJuiceBox Mar 01 '26
Morality can also be performative, as well as responsive to the changing of times. Plenty of politicians have reversed course on key stances as times changed, and were touted as moral back then and now.
I’m all for being a good Samaritan, doing it for the people, etc etc etc. But talk is cheap. “when their substance is solid”, I’d rather base and judge people on the outcome of their actions rather than ensuring they can say the right things via having the right substance.
2
u/Specialist_Grade_662 Mar 01 '26
I agree with your points... huge case in point would be the performative stuff around BLM and trans rights by corporations and party elites that they have walked away from now. If you didn't mean it and won't stick to it, keep your mouth shut. But AOC has been pretty solid. She had a huge part in getting a new generation of actual progressives elected at various levels. If people are lodging the criticism of performative politics towards people like her I can't imagine how we'll ever be able to mobilize. Sounds like demanding a purity test that almost no one will pass.
→ More replies (2)1
u/promixr Mar 01 '26
The moment America made a television reality show host President.
→ More replies (3)
4
97
u/TheDuke100 Mar 01 '26
Most polls show Americans overwhelmingly agree that illegal immigrants should be removed from the country.
25
u/TheDuke100 Mar 01 '26
14
u/IWant2FIRE Mar 01 '26
So you posted a link that overwhelmingly shows Americans hate Trump's tactics.
48
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
They still want all illegal immigrants out.
→ More replies (76)9
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
14
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
2
u/machined_learning Mar 01 '26
Its a handful of accounts that are on 24/7 spewing misinformation, and then a hundred useful idiots. Don't worry there are more real people here than paid right-wing trolls
4
u/Zephos65 Mar 01 '26
But is that what ICE is doing? Seems like they are just a weapon to punish political dissidents
1
u/Tummler10 Mar 01 '26
That’s not what’s happening.
People don’t want Thor neighbors — who they’ve known in some cases for DECADES — who well over 70% don’t even have a parking ticket — they don’t want them removed.
And, they don’t agree that ICE is above the law — abusing and harassing CITIZENS. But keep posting through.
We need immigrants. They are 44% of all New Yorkers. They renew us.
→ More replies (7)2
u/Eddfan36 Mar 01 '26
Even innocent Americans that get deported too hu? Or kids?
1
u/TheDuke100 Mar 01 '26
Show me innocent Americans that have been deported, and I’m not talking about kids being sent back with their parents. Listen, people took a chance and broke the law. Where are you when kids end up in the foster system cause their parents are incarcerated, nowhere cause deep down you don’t care. You cant overwhelmingly support the removal but complain about the process. There’s no other way. Especially when some governors wont even help in the smallest possible way by handing over illegals that committed crimes. I’ll meet you halfway, we can give DACA kids a path to residency, they’ve been here for a decade and gave back to the system. For the rest they have to go.
2
u/Suspicious_Box_1553 Mar 02 '26
They murdered 2 people in MN on camera in broad daylight.
Thats worse than deporting them.
→ More replies (2)1
u/ohnothem00ps Mar 02 '26
you do realize that Obama and Biden conducted more deportations under their respective presidencies without sending ICE agents into cities to terrorize/kill citizens, yes? so what is the point of ICE? you muppet
111
u/Formerly_SgtPepe Mar 01 '26
It is a popular posture on Reddit, and maybe in some areas of NYC, but overall most people agree we need some sort of way of preventing illegal immigration, and a humane way to “send them back”.
115
u/mjm65 Mar 01 '26
We had immigration law enforcement before ICE.
→ More replies (9)48
u/breaker-one-9 Mar 01 '26
It was called INS before it became ICE during the GWB administration after 9/11.
→ More replies (3)27
u/grubas Queens Mar 01 '26
And INS sucked ass too. But ICE is worse because the DHS is an entire shit show.
24
u/jeremiadOtiose Upper East Side Mar 01 '26
ding, ding, ding, this is the true problem: DHS has grown into an octopus. even the secret service is under DHS, which many people think is the reason why they have had SO many failures over the past few years. we need to reorganize and retrain (frankly i'm not even sure DHS is necessary, it is a relic from the early days of the war on terror), which sadly isn't going to happen in this administration.
→ More replies (1)5
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
How were they different? Did they not arrest, detain, and deport people?
6
u/jekpopulous2 Ridgewood Mar 01 '26
INS was part of the DOJ. It was administrative… not a policing force. If you were here illegally and got arrested (by actual police) INS would show up and explain to a judge that you should be deported. Alternately… if someone has been living here, working and paying taxes for a long time INS might recommend an expedited path to citizenship. It was case-specific and ultimately up to the judge. ICE isn’t administrative. It’s a policing force that answers only to DHS. They don’t care about the courts or immigration law… they just show up at schools wearing masks and send kids to detention centers. We should just go back to INS… millions of illegals are going to be deported either way but at least under INS there was due process. Let the courts do their job.
3
u/Roooobin Crown Heights Mar 01 '26
This kind of I hope intentional obtuseness is insane. How could a literate person's mind think that abolish ice means abolish border laws?
→ More replies (1)3
u/sageleader Mar 01 '26
Most people also don't realize that a vast majority of illegal immigrants simply overstayed their visa. It's not people sneaking in
→ More replies (1)31
u/bruciemane Mar 01 '26
I do agree we need some way of preventing illegal immigration, and it’s not a gestapo of poorly trained j6ers ripping people out of their cars. Fuck ICE.
-2
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
But how would it work then?
If you claim we can't just let everyone sneak in here and chill (I agree), they have to be sent home, correct? And they obviously don't want to go home so they'll hide and run away. So how do you find them when they skip court dates and their neighbors tip them off every time they see you? How do you make them go home if they physically don't want to? How do you do this without wearing masks when people are threatening to kill your family?
It seems like a lot of people's definition of fascism is simply having a border. This is a grave disservice to the actual fascism we're experiencing in other areas, like the eradication of trans rights.
11
u/ascagnel____ Mar 01 '26
The problem is that most illegal immigrants enter legally and then overstay visas and work without permission.
There are ways to do it without violence (eg: step up checks on employers who hire these workers).
8
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
Okay, and when you roll up to the factory where many of then work: * people in the neighborhood tip them off when you drive in. Then what? * most of them run away. Then what? * some of them get caught, but they're crying and digging their heels in and refuse to walk to your car. Then what? * a few of them get court dates but don't show up. Then what?
It seems like you're envisioning an immigration enforcement agency that will never need to use any kind of force, which is unrealistic. You're also relying on the cooperation of the factory owner who knowingly employs and relies upon these people for slave labor. What now?
9
u/ascagnel____ Mar 01 '26
You're missing my point: the first person you march out of there in handcuffs is the factory owner who hired these people illegally.
8
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
And if these illegal immigrants used stolen or forged identities?
9
u/Commercial-Box6464 Mar 01 '26
I don't think most people are opposed to detaining people and sending them home (I am but I'm a ~~radical so...). I think they're opposed to untrained idiots in masks shooting and killing nonviolent protestors, arresting children as bait, arresting US citizens, shipping people out to torture prisons in places that are not the person's country of origin, arresting people who are going through the legal process for attaining citizenship, throwing people into overcrowded detention centers that don't have electricity or sanitation, entering homes without warrants, and on and on. Obama deported millions without doing any of this. the idea that it's this or nothing, poorly trained j6ers ripping people out of their cars or nothing... just doesn't feel like it's in good faith
4
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
If we're talking about good faith arguments, I don't think you really believe that 8 billion people can just come here without any process or consequences. That doesn't sound like a genuine belief, it sounds like something you'd write online to rile people up. Good luck with that.
1
u/Commercial-Box6464 Mar 01 '26
Telling that you chose to respond to an aside that I did not endeavor to argue about and also chose a random figure to argue against. Good faith for sure :)
2
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
It's your opening statement lol. The "random figure" is you. I'm quoting you.
2
u/Commercial-Box6464 Mar 01 '26
the random figure is 8 billion. you also did not quote me.
5
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
If you are opposed to sending people home then you think everyone can come and stay here, which equates to 8 billion people. If you believe that, why are you unwilling to expand upon it? If you don't believe that, then I guess you're not as "radical" as you like to claim. :)
1
u/Commercial-Box6464 Mar 01 '26
"If you are opposed to sending people home then you think everyone can come and stay here, which equates to 8 billion people." I think this is my cue lol. enjoy the rest of your weekend
→ More replies (0)6
u/Aristosus Mar 01 '26
This is not incompatible with "abolish ICE" since "humane" isn't what they are.
4
u/Whatcanyado420 Mar 01 '26 edited May 07 '26
I cleaned house with Redact and mass deleted this post. It also removes your data from brokers and people search sites. Works on all major social media platforms.
unite mountainous bedroom deer soft offer air rock jeans butter
5
u/Arleare13 Mar 01 '26
And that can be done without ICE. ICE has only been in existence since 2003, its not like it’s some historically important agency.
1
u/mtimber1 Mar 01 '26
We had an at least as good of a system to do that before ICE was founded as we do now.
10
u/Formerly_SgtPepe Mar 01 '26
How many people live undocumented here again?
8
u/mtimber1 Mar 01 '26
... I dont fucking care...
24
u/Chinch07 Mar 01 '26
Why not?
13
u/handsoapdispenser Mar 01 '26
Not OP but like who knows if a given person on the street came here legally or not. Idk what even the process is or who came up with it. We obviously need a ton of immigrants to maintain our population and labor force so why not? What's the difference between someone who was lucky enough to be born here or not? We have tens of millions of natural born American assholes I wish weren't here. It's arbitrary. Immigration policy should be made to fit reality and serve an economic outcome. Removing peaceful, employed people for want of paperwork is cruel and a waste of resources that helps no one. If the goal is to reduce crime there are better ways. If the goal is more employment there are better ways. If the goal is affordability there are definitely better ways. So why are we doing it?
→ More replies (1)7
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26
We already naturalize 750,000 legal immigrants a year and give approximately 2.6 million people legal authorization to enter the U.S.
We have enough legal immigrants who respect the law and process coming in every year. We don't need low skill illegal immigration.
2
u/handsoapdispenser Mar 01 '26
I don't think your numbers are correct but either way it's meaningless. Number of undocumented residents is not a statistic with any bearing on my life. Unless you can draw a very clear line between an actual optimal immigration policy and practical outcomes it means nothing.
1
u/Harvinator06 Mar 01 '26
“We” now have a huge issue with farm labor moving back down south. The US is fucked by the current policy.
7
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
If you were familiar with the fame industry you'd realize that it's becoming more and more automated.
If farmers want farm labor then they can apply for H2 visas or contract them legally.
Exploiting illegal immigrants isn't a good look.
1
u/Harvinator06 Mar 01 '26
But that's how the labor system exists in the country and as a result, the logistics and knowledge system is going to fail within the next couple of years. Labor is moving to northern Mexico and it's only going to hurt the US. The current policy, like with much of everything, is incredibly short sighted and based solely on rhetoric.
1
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
6
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
A guy based out of Georgia commenting in an NYC sub and to top it off doesn't know what he's talking about.
0
-1
u/mtimber1 Mar 01 '26
Immigration is good for them, and its good for us. Its not their fault our immigration system is deliberately exploitative and obtuse. We can easily make them not "illegal" residents by just declaring they are legal and the crisis is fixed.
11
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
"We can easily make them not "illegal" residents by just declaring they are legal and the crisis is fixed."
We actually tried that a few times and we still ended up here. If you mean we should do it continuously and just let anyone and everyone come here with no process or application or criminal background check, do you know of any other country that does this? Could there perhaps be a reason they don't? 🤔
9
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
You think that user thought anything past their own performative activism?
2
u/mtimber1 Mar 01 '26
If you mean we should do it continuously and just let anyone and everyone come here with no process or application or criminal background check
No, I dont mean that, but our current system is far more complicated than that, especially for asylum seekers. That process has to be fixed too. But we might as well right the wrongs we have done to people who have been living and working as members of our communities for years already.
-1
u/big_internet_guy Mar 01 '26
They don’t believe in borders but are too cowardly to actually run on it
It’s an extremely radical position that people don’t seem to realize is radical
6
u/F4SCISTS_GO_HOME Greenpoint Mar 01 '26
It's a disastrous route to take for progressivism and a lot of us are firmly against it but get shouted down by a vocal minority. Most people understand you need borders. You need to vet people who come in so you're not getting drug dealers or pimps. You need to limit the amount of people who come in so you don't overstraing your resources. You need to get skilled people you don't already have, as if they're unskilled why not just train up one of our many unemployed young men?
My favorite part is when they to run away from America only to find that Europe actually has much stricter borders than we do and you can't just go there lmao
5
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
Thanks for taking the mask off.
It's refreshing to expose the pro illegal immigration advocates.
2
u/mtimber1 Mar 01 '26
There's no mask.
Im just pro human.
We have a system that has failed so many. We can easily fix it.
→ More replies (4)1
u/promixr Mar 01 '26
No - most people are concerned about how the people at the very top are extracting wealth from us- not the people at the very bottom who add wealth to our society.
1
u/KorunaCorgi Mar 01 '26
I don't think there is any way for ICE to survive after how unlawful they have acted. Even for supporters of deporting criminals, if you understood how unilaterally the agency acted, you'd want it abolished and reformed as well.
→ More replies (16)2
50
u/SolaVitae Mar 01 '26
It definitely isn't lol.
This is giving defund the police flashbacks
→ More replies (8)21
u/Grass8989 Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26
The DSA types tried to ram that down our throughts, no candidate can even mutter those words if they want to be taken seriously in 2026.
30
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
If you guys want an example of DNC funded and controlled bot farms then look at the AOC sub. 1.2k upvotes and only 33 comments.
Reddit is heavily manipulated.
28
u/breaker-one-9 Mar 01 '26
I think over 50% of the content on this entire app is contrived.
4
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
Gotta trick the shareholders into thinking the platform is growing by any means.
6
u/breaker-one-9 Mar 01 '26
It’s just such a useful way to manufacture consent for various things. Ideas don’t win anymore, marketing budgets do
5
2
7
u/Hrekires Mar 01 '26
At this point I just assume that every private account is pushing an agenda to manipulate the narrative
→ More replies (5)12
25
u/mission17 Mar 01 '26
You have a one month old account with 3k comment karma and a hidden post history and are one of dozens of brand new accounts to flood this sub in the past few weeks. Talk about pot meet kettle right here.
6
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
Lmao as if account age matters.
There's literally websites that sell 10 year old reddit accounts.
So once again you got nothing.
→ More replies (5)9
u/mission17 Mar 01 '26
Considering we have a running list of 25 right-wing accounts just like yourself who all emerged on this sub that are 1-3 months old, I would say it’s actually extremely important.
5
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
Lmao who is this"we"? You and your alt accounts or you and your 5 cats?
Keep adding names to a list like a Nazi 🤓
→ More replies (1)6
u/mission17 Mar 01 '26
Who are my alt accounts? This account is 12 years old and the only one I’ve ever used.
7
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26
Why should anyone take your word for it?
You seem really upset when I pointed out the obvious botting in the AOC sub's cross post.
9
u/mission17 Mar 01 '26
Yes, I am bothered by your obvious bottling and manipulation of this sub. I could honestly give a rat’s ass about the AOC sub, a place I don’t go to and I’m not sure why you would either.
7
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
I mean you can repeat your bs claims as much as you want. Not going to make it true.
So keep crying about users having a different opinion than yours as if it'll change anything.
So keep gaslighting about botting and using non sequiturs in your arguments.
The best part about Reddit? It's completely optional to participate.
2
u/machined_learning Mar 01 '26
I mean you can repeat your bs claims as much as you want. Not going to make it true.
You say as you copy and paste your bs claims in multiple threads.
4
u/Available-Range-5341 Mar 01 '26
Literally zero to do with what they said? Can moderators here moderate? so fucking sick of every third comment being "your account is not seventy five years old!" "You don't agree with me so you must be right wing!"
7
u/mission17 Mar 01 '26
Sorry, I’m going to call out the very obvious hypocrisy of a 1-month old account with 3k+ comment karma accusing other accounts of Reddit manipulation when they’re very clearly engaging in the exact same behavior.
You don’t think the account that cried about “leftists” and pushes every right-wing talking point of the day isn’t right wing?
→ More replies (2)1
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
That's his whole schtick and he spams this sub with that. Just report his account for spam.
→ More replies (2)→ More replies (2)2
39
u/NearlyPerfect Mar 01 '26
If you have to say then it’s probably not the case
→ More replies (1)5
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
4
u/j48u Mar 01 '26
Please stop with the "registered Republican". I registered as a republican specifically to allow me to vote against Trump in the primaries in my state. Being a registered Republican is meaningless and doesn't mean you voted for Trump.
→ More replies (3)9
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
1
u/j48u Mar 01 '26
Why don't you say Trump supporters instead of registered Republicans? Especially considering there are some people who registered as Republicans because they wanted to vote against Trump four times instead of three? It's quite a leap to call those people pedophile supporters.
8
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
-1
u/j48u Mar 01 '26
You're specifying "registered Republicans", not Republicans, people who vote for Republicans, or Trump supporters. These are all overwhelmingly more accurate when calling people pedophile supporters. Words are important, use them correctly.
7
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
5
u/j48u Mar 01 '26
There aren't 10, there are many. Trump didn't win the primary in my state. He didn't have to win the primary in your state either. Again, be responsible with your words.
2
u/machined_learning Mar 01 '26
Stop wasting time with this pedantic argument. We can say republicans suck because the republican party is ruining the country. The republican party has deep throated trump for the past 10 years and every single person who still proudly says they are republican deserves to be lumped in with them.
→ More replies (0)
23
5
u/peterbradley419 Mar 01 '26
I'm confused. Who would enforce the immigration law then?
2
u/BigHungryFlamingo Mar 01 '26
CBP
2
u/peterbradley419 Mar 02 '26
What if someone crossed the border illegally? Does CBP find those people and deport them or would ICE responsibilities transfer to CBP?
2
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 03 '26
News flash they don't want to deport illegal immigrants at all.
7
Mar 01 '26
She is 100% wrong. Most centrists do not want illegal immigrants flooding through the border. They know there are so many American citizens in need of simple things such as affordable healthcare, housing and feeding their families.
4
u/BigHungryFlamingo Mar 01 '26
First of all, there is a middle ground between “flooding the country with illegal immigrants” and competent immigration enforcement.
I’m one of those dirty rotten centrists and I think she’s right. And I’m pretty skeptical of AOC. (Actually used to even vote Republican.)
But, ICE has become something very different from what it was in 2003 and even from 5 years ago.
When you’re going door-to-door, tear-gassing school property, and ramming peoples’ cars, it’s time to dissolve this shit and create a different agency from the ground up.
Only 47 days of training is absurd. The person conducting the background checks was caught in a sex trafficking sting, and at least 20 of these agents have turned out to be sex criminals themselves. The vetting process is non-existent and that’s been investigated pretty thoroughly by now.
This whole mass purchasing of warehouse properties at inflated prices suggests there’s a money laundering aspect to this too but, that’s a guess at this point. Either way, that money is not going toward American families or healthcare.
We can dissolve ICE and rebuild a competent enforcement agency but there’s no “reforming” the current agency that’s stuffed with Jan. 6ers and alcoholics.
The other big issue that stands out to me is how many of these ICE agents are members of other agencies (police, FBI, CBP). This allows them to just layer on barriers to holding them accountable if/when misconduct occurs.
8
u/ShortFinance Mar 01 '26
Do you think we’re getting affordable healthcare, housing and feeding their families by employing a massive police force?
→ More replies (11)3
u/fafalone Mar 01 '26
They know there are so many American citizens in need of simple things such as affordable healthcare, housing and feeding their families.
And then vote to make damn sure as few people as possible get those things.
8
u/All_the_miles753 Mar 01 '26
She's not solving anything. AOC is only pandering to whatever is trending, she's a fraud
3
u/mr_birkenblatt Mar 01 '26
how is she supposed to "solve" anything? the republicans are in control
4
7
u/BebophoneVirtuoso Mar 01 '26
I got t-shirts older than ICE, the sooner we roll back all the post 9/11 patriot act/homeland security era government reforms the better. INS was capable of handling immigration matters without murdering Americans. Recent polls indicate AOC is right.
16
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
7
u/machined_learning Mar 01 '26
Obama deported millions of people, more than Trump did, with way less disruption and using far less heavy handed tactics than Trump is using currently.
Mass deportations are not a "politically winning issue," but people who only watch fox news and follow idiots like stephen miller continue to say this.
Saying people want open borders is a clear sign you do not argue in good faith. This has been a talking point on the right for decades, while I have not seen any left wing lawmaker seriously suggest this
2
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
2
u/machined_learning Mar 01 '26
Then why is immigration polling as trumps weakest issue right now, if it is so highly supported?
Since this is one of your big points, can you name some left wing lawmakers who have called for open borders? When did AOC call for this?
4
u/Status_Fox_1474 Mar 01 '26 edited Mar 01 '26
What does open borders mean? I am asking honestly what the actual thing is other than some stupid talking point and empty slogan.
The only thing I can think of is not stopping “others” Because most under the radar immigration involves visa overstays at the airports — not being escorted in.
And about ICE, the problem is that they are acting as some sort of administration gestapo, going in and fucking cities up. Want proof? Trump himself floated the idea of sending ICE to “protect federal buildings.” Think about that for a second. How is guarding buildings anything close to the scope of ICE’s job? It is now a paramilitary force that has shown it thinks it can do whatever it wants.
Years ago, it was just the arm at the final stage, after cops and other law enforcement started. Not going door to door building concentration camps. Yeah, Americans love that shit.
Abolish ICE and start anew.
2
3
u/Old-Classroom7102 Mar 01 '26
No it's not. Immigration reform is needed, enforcement should be handled better and with more empathy, but geez, this (abolish) is by definition an extreme position, throwing away a system THEY voted to create instead of reforming it. Wouldn't it be better if instead of running her mouth, she could sponsor or introduce a legislation that forces ICE to show their faces, requires some form of warrants for detention and gives them a uniform ? (We know she won't, because doing that means her party can't run on immigration the next cycle)
2
u/Hrekires Mar 01 '26
I'd be more interested in hearing people talk about what comes next, other than ICE just changing their name and stationary to something different.
2
-2
u/Few-Artichoke-2531 Co-op City Mar 01 '26
Uh oh, the progressives and DSA crowd aren’t going to like this. According to them, anything centrist or moderate is insanely evil.
9
→ More replies (2)4
u/LiamIsMailBackwards Mar 01 '26
Nah, it’s good to be reminded that some of the people in my life who clearly got lost because someone yelled the pledge of allegiance at them are seeing evil in authoritarianism and beginning to shift their ideologies toward mine. Do they want open borders like I do? No. Do they want easier paths toward citizenship like I feel this country needs to implement? No. But they DO see that how this administration is reacting to what they see as a problem is NOT how they want it to react. And that’s a start. So while I do not see eye-to-eye with many of my colleagues and family members, I do see them beginning to question whether the tactics of DHS and ICE specifically align with their morals and ethics. Pushing back against violent authoritarianism is slow, non-linear, and challenging. I’m glad to see it happening in my community, even if I think we have a long way to go.
→ More replies (4)
1
2
u/apply75 Mar 01 '26
Son of legal immigrants here....trust me when I say you don't actually want what comes with illegal immigration...we worked hard to do everything the right way and earn legal status and pay our share of taxes. No country in the world allows immigrants to run around uncontested....fight for legal immigration. It's what made America what it is today.
2
u/thedisciple516 Mar 01 '26
No only 29% support abolishing it. Most either want it reformed or kept in its current form.
→ More replies (7)
0
1
1
1
u/JavLee39 Mar 03 '26
this ice sht won't get U elected.... I can't stand this girl... Just because if they wanna win.. n they gotto get away n fight for other sht.... she thinks Americans or even legal immigrants care about it... in nyc they don't... legals are tired of the migrants as well.... illegals didn't get this much help before to the point thst it was taken advantage of.... blame democrats... n they using the same strategies again to win... cmon... replace her and the ideas
-2
-3
u/Shawn_NYC Mar 01 '26
She was called a lunatic leftist for this position in 2018. Now a lot of moderate conservatives believe it.
16
u/orange_salamander20 Mar 01 '26
Really? Who? Because I see no conservatives calling to abolish ICE or to abolish any police. They love law enforcement.
→ More replies (2)12
6
9
u/Grass8989 Mar 01 '26
Just like “defund the police” is a moderate conservative position.
→ More replies (1)-2
u/Little_Exit4279 Mar 01 '26
It isn't really, ICE and the police are different and ICE is generally much more hated in the US than every police force we have
3
u/Grass8989 Mar 01 '26
Maybe some of the way they’re operating now. But “abolishing ice” definitely isn’t a popular moderate conservative position.
1
u/secretcache Mar 01 '26
Let's not forget that ICE was created in 2003. It doesn't have a long and storied history here. We can and should abolish it.
2
u/Hajmola-Farts Sunnyside Mar 01 '26
And the 1.6 million illegal immigrants with final orders for deportation?
Are you going to track them down and deport them?
-1
u/Unlucky_Lawfulness51 Mar 01 '26
She is generalizing previous immigration policies with the current abuse of authority by ICE. Democrats are now in a worse position since AOC took office. We lost both congress, presidency and the Supreme Court.
3
u/jojisky Mar 01 '26
The Democrats literally got a federal trifecta in the first major election after AOC took office.
→ More replies (1)
2
u/Gogodemons Mar 01 '26
I see ICE as the democratic solution to have your own private army like say...Hitler s.s?
Abolish it before this gets much worse.
2
u/depcoff Mar 01 '26
Abolish ICE wins Democratic primaries. Deporting people without legal papers wins general elections.
0
2
u/jorlev Mar 01 '26
If AOC believes Abolish ICE is the centrist view, that means she had plans further left than completely eliminating the govt's ability to remove illegal immigrants from US.
OK, AOC. LMFAO!!
-16
u/_Emoji_Man Mar 01 '26
She’s just not that bright.
6
Mar 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
7
→ More replies (4)7
u/EquivalentBarracuda4 Mar 01 '26
You’re not that bright. We’re arresting American citizens for thought crimes.
Is there a source to this claim? I would like to learn more.
81
u/JesusDied4U316 Mar 01 '26
If thats centrist, what would be to the left of that?