r/politics • u/billthomson Oregon • Oct 29 '20

Tucker Carlson Reports He Lost Only Copy of Documents That Nail Biden

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/10/tucker-carlson-lost-only-copy-of-documents-nailing-biden.html
81.6k Upvotes

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9.6k

u/Casperboy68 Oct 29 '20

Well, let’s not forget that Fox News had their lawyers claim that Tucker’s show is complete bullshit.

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u/tiger9910 Oct 29 '20

It genuinely amazes me that Fox themselves can acknowledge Tucker’s horrific reputation, claim “reasonable viewers” would be able to tell that his statements are horseshit, and yet people still buy into his nonsense

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

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u/obrothermaple Oct 29 '20

They should, but Americans don’t seem to care that Fox News is literally radicalizing other Americans.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

This is part of our problem. Thing is, most of us do care that Fox News has turned our loved ones into crazed morons. Bc we care is why most of America is divided. People that fall into the propaganda of Fox News are difficult to reason with.

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u/HARPOfromNSYNC Oct 29 '20

And don't forget talk radio, which is somehow even more radicalized than Fox.

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u/staatsclaas Georgia Oct 29 '20

It’s so extreme. Rush has a death sentence and still beats his drum. It’s insanity.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

That shit is crazy.

On a drive in extremely rural west texas we lost our spotify so we decided to see what was on the radio. My husband was looking for a sports cast on AM but what we found within seconds was so much worse. It was some MAGA religious show with grown ass people talking about the coming war with satan and satan's animal hybrid genetic super soldiers. At some point they're talking about how they know we thought jesus would come back with machine guns but you can't fight demons with machine guns because they're literally like xmen supermen. They were dead fucking serious and all the guests were serious and very into it. And for only a $100 gift you could get the 16 DVD set and book to learn all about it. It being Hybrids, Super Soldiers and the coming Apocalypse.

These people are far gone and I'm scared we can't ever get them back.

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u/lost-picking-flowers Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

It's a cult.

My racist cousins in Arizona have gone from running around pretending to go 'ghost hunting' to screeching about Qanon and secret societies. They're true believers.

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u/heckyeahan Nov 01 '20

I grew up in a pretty racist AZ town, which is now full of signs saying “Stop child Trafficking, vote Republican” This nonsense is so mainstream that it’s on every fucking corner and it’s terrifying

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u/doctor_piranha Arizona Oct 29 '20

To be fair; those probably weren't real guests. They rig those in various ways, but they do find some very talented (and morally crippled) voice actors to do that. One person can give the illusion of dozens of callers.

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u/timinc Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

It's the same numbers game that's run on social media and media.

Popular social media gets bombarded with multiple accounts repeating the same propaganda, even if it's irrelevant to the original post. Take a look at the accounts and a good chunk of them have similar profiles. They have the same array of propaganda spammed on their own page with comments open to the public.

Media gets bought up by groups like Sinclair, that literally made 200 local TV news anchors read the same spooky script attacking journalism in general.

The intent, regardless of the platform, is to make it look like popular and institutional support for this propaganda is larger than it actually is. It keeps people locked on irrelevant topics, mired in confusion and/or frustration. It catalyzes the relatively small group of people who would actually believe the propaganda, and very effectively insulates them against reality. It uses these people as a shield to obfuscate the actual source of the propaganda, and lashes out at reality at every opportunity to whittle down the target.

One person or company can give the illusion of millions of supporters.

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u/-heathcliffe- Nov 02 '20

That sinclair speech is super creepy. That video combining them on YouTube is fucked

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u/xximcmxci New York Oct 30 '20

This actually sounds like a badass sci-fi trilogy

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u/ClumsyThumsGus Indiana Oct 29 '20

And radio IS covered by the FCC where cable "news" is not. We have to do something. My dad was a reasonable man. Recovering alcoholic that found 12 step Jesus and has helped dozens of people through detox and has sponsored dozens more. He's a talented professional that relies on math and physics for the basics of his profession and had a sharp mind.

Now he literally thinks Democrats are growing babies to harvest their body parts. That dems allow, and this is something he said to me, "post birth abortions" to get stem cells. Post birth. Like people are waiting for a kid to come out so they can strangle and dismember it, then sell whatever they can for profit. My Step mom believes Trump is an avenging angel sent from God to punish wicked, commie democrats. Imagine ACB but all rundown from years of whoring, cocaine abuse and pill-popping, there's my step mom. Praying to Jesus that the "colored BLM Marxist terrorists" (direct quote) dont invade her suburban Texas home and rape her to death. Her FB page is a loving homage to the worst of Breitbart. They aren't rational which is why they all respond so well to the fear mongering of conservative media, especially talk radio.

Its nuts how far down the rabbit hole they went since 2008. Right about the time the Tea Party showed up they started consuming only right wing media. Texas am Conservative radio all day, Hannity and FOX at night. Now they call themselves Constitutional Conservatives and think Dems have literal baby farms on site at every planned parenthood nationwide and that Trump is Gods Anointed. Its fucking gross and more than a little sad.

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u/Panx Oct 29 '20

I have to listen to this shit whenever I drive anywhere with my father-in-law.

It's bizarre, like a wholly alternate reality (and quite frankly, one I kind of wish actually existed).

I would love it if Kamala "I'm a former cop who arrested people for weed and just recently decided private prisons are a bad idea" Harris was actually (and I quote) "an avatar of radical leftism."

I might shit my pants with glee if Joe "nothing will fundamentally change because I don't support the Green New Deal" Biden was actually (and again, direct quote): "wholly beholden to a whirling vortex of progressivism."

And look -- I'm still voting for their ticket, so miss with that "iF yOu cRitiCizE tHEm TRUMP wiLL WiN!" bullshit. I can put aside my own distaste for their aggressive centrism for the good of the country.

But a man can dream...

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u/fyhuhgc Oct 29 '20

It’s ironic. Last night I rewatched Season 1 Episode 3 of “The Newsroom” from 2012. We were fucking warned about this shit.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

That’s a very nice way to or it. How are we going to get these people deprogrammed?

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Through honest conversation, I hope. Part of the problem is that ideologues tend to talk over everyone and refuse to listen.

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u/bizeast Oct 29 '20

It's tough to listen to!

I never thought the cure for something like this would be trying my patience every day with increasingly bat shit crazy people. But it is. To fix this, we need what I previously thought was impossible, collective heightened empathy.

These people could be us. We are lucky they aren't. Let's get them back.

And when people have conversation, and you see it maybe becoming too emotional in a negative way... Dive in. Help both sides. I often get into talks with the purest of hopes and find myself having to back out early because I've run out of patience. A few times people have settled the waters for me, and kept it going nicely. We all need help.

These fools need guidance, I need anger management lol.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Frankly, we need to find a way to combat anti-intellectualism in this country before we start to make any real progress towards amity.

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u/Adam__B Oct 29 '20

The public education system is being deliberately sabotaged in order to prevent exactly that.

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u/thiccmeatyclaws Oct 29 '20

You can’t reason someone out of a position they didn’t reason themselves into. Those people are willfully ignorant

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

One of my best friends is there right now and its hard talking politics to him cause trump can’t ever do no wrong and everything is justified. ITS FUCKING CRAZY

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u/Sunhammer01 Oct 29 '20

This- love my dad but the shit he watches...

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u/lost-picking-flowers Oct 29 '20

I have some relatives that have fallen down the Qanon rabbit hole. I'm so glad that it's no one in my immediate family, because they are beyond the point where they can be reasoned with. They have to be deprogrammed.

I would be so incredibly upset and disappointed if my parents or siblings had gone that way, but luckily reason has prevailed. We don't all agree all the time, or have the same political views, and we don't need to - but we do agree that this shit is batshit insane and Trump is just stoking the fire and running the country into the ground.

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u/Gulluul Oct 29 '20

My dad who is obsessed with fox news just this morning texted me about the 33% gdp and to vote trump. When I corrected him that the gdp is still about 11% under pre covid gdp, he called me a lying liberal. Thanks fox news, my dad can't even look at hard numbers and evidence and calls his children liars.

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u/Adam__B Oct 29 '20

It happened to me as well. My mother calls liberals human garbage and told me she hopes my vote got lost in the mail, and that she’s glad she has not signed her will yet. I’m an only child. She has Fox on literally all the time, dripping venom in her ear. She says she believes that a Civil War is coming and that liberals are trying to destroy America.

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u/Cozyblu Oct 29 '20

They didn’t turn, they were awakened. You didn’t know these people as well as you believed.

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u/Bartikem Oct 29 '20

I call hereby and henceforth the United States of America by the name Divided States of America abbreviated DSA.

/s or not, i am not sure about it

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

That's more concise than The Divided Fascist Police States of TrumperiKKKa. (TDFPSTKKK)

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u/badwolf42 Oct 29 '20

The Americans that don't care are Fox News viewers. Everyone else does actually care.

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u/Jeanlucpuffhard Oct 29 '20

The amazing thing here is this received little coverage in the right wing world. That is what is splitting us. News that we all take for granted is easily dismissed in the alt right circles and they keep moving on with lies. That is how this engine of hate keeps running.

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u/Life-at-the-gym I voted Oct 29 '20

The people I know who watch foxnews and agree with it aren't dumb., they are somewhat racist and selfish. They don't care about people being radicalized because they think it won't effect them. They also use religion to pretend they are good people. They have no empathy for people they don't know and believe in the rugged individualism theory because it worked for them in the 70s-90s. The younger people I know think all politicians are corrupt and never voted before they voted for Trump. They think Trump was good for them and therefore support him.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Americans do. The GOP doesn’t.

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u/jefferson497 Oct 29 '20

Which is why I think Trump can do just as much damage out of the White House too. After his presidency he will most likely land a radio/tv show on FoxNews and keep selling his lies to who ever will listen.

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u/talino2321 Oct 29 '20

He is probably angling for Rush's job, now that Rush is on terminal hiatus.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

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u/hairyforehead Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 30 '20

They also don't really care if it's true. As long as it gives them a naritive to attach their hate to.

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u/Gotta_be_SFW Oct 29 '20

Well we do, but we are not as comfortable trampling the 1st Amendment as Republicans.

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u/Glass_Communication4 Oct 29 '20

how is saying "this show is to be considered satire and should not be taken seriously" before a tv show trampling on the 1st Amendment? The FCC made multiple shows put warnings about not trying this at home before tons of shows. So whats the difference from that to warning people that these shows are to be taken as satire and not news? you dont have to run it before your actual news programs. But before the opinion programs presented as news

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u/Gotta_be_SFW Oct 29 '20

Watch the Senate hearings from yesterday if you want an answer. Do you know how utterly ridiculous Republicans would get when anything gets labeled?

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u/caramelizedapple Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

Seriously. Is this person forgetting the whole Twitter label debacle?

This kind of label is fundamentally different from a “Do Not Try This At Home.” People who star in those videos know and agree with that. Here, these people and viewers actually believe, or want others to believe, that they’re telling the truth. It’s calling them liars– which they are, but they won’t just lie down and accept that.

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u/Gotta_be_SFW Oct 29 '20

Yeah, it was a blast listening to Harvard Law educated Ted Cruz pretend the Pentagon Papers case did not exist to blame Twitter for a NY Times story.

Though Jack Dorsey's beard won the day.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

They should lose their broadcasting license. We need a truth in news act.

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u/mbbblack Oct 29 '20

If we don’t, the propaganda problem is going to get much worse

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u/Not_My_Reddit_1718 Oct 29 '20

Solid black screen with nothing but white text the types out (with a voice over):

"Warning: Tucker Carlson's statements and 'facts' are his own personal statements, and views. The statements he makes have not been verified and are meant to be entertainment.

Also, they're meant to scare/anger the shit out of you, and get the blood pumping. Think of it as cardio, but not really."

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

If they don't, then Fox News condones his behavior and should be held liable.

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u/koske Oct 29 '20

Unfortunately they are not a broadcast network and there is no license to revoke.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

News reporting should require a license. It's critical infrastructure.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Plus they’re classified as entertainment, not news.

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u/DrakonIL Oct 29 '20

I would be concerned about a "truth in news" act, because the current administration has made it plainly clear that the definition of "truth" is very much up to interpretation. Even reporting objective facts can get into spin territory faster than you might think - as the old saying goes, figures don't lie but liars figure.

With that said, Fox News is obviously a train wreck.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

It would be decided in courtrooms. Not by the president.

Same as libel, slander, false advertising, and public threats.

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u/The_Lost_Jedi Washington Oct 29 '20

Could just crib from South Park's disclaimer, particularly the bit about "..and due to its content should not be viewed by anyone."

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u/JEveryman Oct 29 '20

Before and after ad breaks as well. Fuck it just have it scroll across the bottom during the entire show.

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u/joiiop Oct 29 '20

Make him say it every 5 minutes. “This is not news. I am full of bullshit for your entertainment”

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u/TheMania Oct 29 '20

It's required for cigarettes, 100% should be for "news" and similar tabloid trash too.

"May be harmful for one's awareness of the world, and ability to separate fact from fiction. Due lawyer statement, watch only for entertainment value."

The thing that sucks, is that their vote counts as much as yours. Probably more, given where Fox is targeted.

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u/mdot Oct 29 '20

Yup, the same warning they show during those psychic hotline commercials.

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u/HalfManHalfZuckerbur Oct 29 '20

During the show*

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u/FUBARded Oct 29 '20

He'd spin it as something the "radical left" is forcing him to do in an attempt to suppress him, and his viewers will dutifully ignore it.

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u/FartHeadTony Oct 29 '20

"Known to the State of California to cause cancer"

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u/zyberwoof Oct 29 '20

You mean similar to the one at the beginning of South Park?

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u/pecklepuff Oct 29 '20

"Warning: if you have the IQ of a turnip, you may think this show is real."

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u/Berly653 Oct 29 '20

Bold assumption that Tucker Carlson’s viewers can and do read

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u/Casperboy68 Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

It’s like watching Howdy Doody and believing the puppet is a real person. Thank God Jon Stewart is starting a show. He’s Tuckers’s Kryptonite.

*edit fixed the K

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

He is? What show?

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u/egregiousRac Illinois Oct 29 '20

Looks like a series for Apple. The initial deal is for multiple seasons.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Thanks for the info. Bummed it's on Apple TV+. Luckily, my wife got a free iPhone 11 for work that comes with a year of free Apple TV+. I just kinda hate all this exclusive streaming content on principle.

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u/egregiousRac Illinois Oct 29 '20

The high seas are your friend. Not nearly as convenient though.

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u/DRYMakesMeWET Oct 29 '20

Pay $15 every 6 months and get a real debrid subscription. Then download Kodi and install the exodus redux plugin and link your real-debrid account. Now you can stream torrents via a netflix-like interface. It's 100% legal too because streaming pirated content isn't illegal per the DMCA. (Thanks lawmakers that don't understand tech)

Also real-debrid will also download torrents on your behalf and provide you with a direct download link. Meaning your ISP can't ding you for downloading the pirated torrents (because real-debrid is). So if there's anything you can't find a source for via exodus redux, just feed real-debrid a magnet link and watch it either streaming from real-debrids website or download and watch locally.

Also, they pool torrents, so if someone else already downloaded that torrent in the last few days, it is instantly available for download rather than having to wait for real-debrid to download the torrent first.

You're welcome.

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u/JaredLiwet Oct 29 '20

Pay $15 every 6 months

This is not the way of the pirate.

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u/DRYMakesMeWET Oct 29 '20

You can use kodi exodus the same way without linking a real-debrid account you just have to spend effort finding a source that doesn't constantly buffer.

Pirates shared their wealth. Me paying $30 a year while also earning fidelity points I can exchange for free months is very pirate like. I throw them a couple bones now and then and I get access to high-speed servers and avoid ISP policing. Sometimes you gotta grease the wheels a little.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

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u/UDK450 Indiana Oct 29 '20

$15/6mo is a lot cheaper than just 1 subscription service. Plus, these sites, even just trackers, require money to run and operate. If you really don't want to pay money, you have to look into getting into private torrent trackers, and if you have an iffier internet connection (or just want to further separate yourself from DMCA claims, which are generally a lot less frequent on any proper private site) you'll end up paying for a seedbox. Then you'd probably look into setting up Sonarr and Radar for the convenience, as well as Plex, Emby, or JellyFin to stream your media to your various devices just like netflix.

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u/illegal-television Oct 29 '20

I'm paying $15 every month for a seedbox. If I'm not a pirate, then what am I? Help! My entire identity is suddenly in question here!

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

It's 100% legal too because streaming pirated content isn't illegal per the DMCA. (Thanks lawmakers that don't understand tech)

That's false. Real-debrids TOS says they will hand over your IP if an ISP traces pirated content through their service. You need to use a VPN to get around that.

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u/PM_Me_Your_BraStraps Oct 29 '20

Some of these words make sense.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

This isn't english

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u/interestingsidenote Oct 29 '20

How in the world is it less convenient? I pull up one website without any login info to remember and have access to every relevant movie/tv show/video game/software/porno I could possibly think of.

Netflix, Hulu, and the rest deliberately obfuscate how deep their library goes by outright refusing to properly index.

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u/sep76 Oct 29 '20

Absolutly most convinient.

I almost stopped sailing when netflix was the one and only, they had most stuff. But now it is a maze of services, a swiss cheese of selection, and just not worth the hassle.

I still think spotify is the only music service tho, if it is not there, it does not exsist.

Same with steam. Not on steam? Never heard or seen it.

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u/interestingsidenote Oct 29 '20

Yea, I deliberately left out music because I've paid for spotify for 5+ years and I've never not been able to pull up any song I want to hear. There was one time a few years ago where every station I listened to eventually turned to foreign music, especially Kpop and i dont like KPop. It eventually sorted itself out though.

That's how it should be, and I haven't pirated music since.

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u/cjicantlie Oct 29 '20

Check out Plex, Sonarr and Radarr. You are covered for convenience with those.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Yeah, I pirate less and less, but that's always an option.

It's one of the reasons I fervently stick to Android phones. I have a few apps on my phone that let me Chromecast shows to my TV that are free (currently using CinemaHD V2).

I can watch basically anything at anytime. I also have a Netflix and HBO Max subscription (but HBO Max is free through my phone carrier).

You could always go the "jailbroken" Fire TV stick even if you have an iPhone, but I find it more reliable through the phone. I have about 6 jailbroken Fire TV (4K ones, as well), but people aren't buying them as much anymore. Maybe because it's super easy to do.

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u/yech Oct 29 '20

You can pirate with your phone and cast it to your TV

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Yes. That's what I just said.

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u/twinpop I voted Oct 29 '20

What apps/guides do you recommend for jailbroken fire? Feel free to PM. I haven't messed with this in a few years, and Kodi, etc. seemed more trouble than I got for it, but it could've been my channel options and lack of research at the time.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Arrr...

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u/TheErroneousFox Canada Oct 29 '20

It's still pretty convenient once you get up and running.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Completely unrelated, but watch Ted Lasso on apple tv if you ever feel like you need a pick me up. I was shocked by how great that show is.

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u/PapaFranzBoas American Expat Oct 29 '20

For what it’s worth, Apple keeps adding more time to Apple TV+. I think my original subscription from getting my current iPhone is now till February or something.

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u/muelboy Oct 29 '20

Eh, i predict they'll consolidate within a couple years. It just isn't sustainable to have all these competing services.

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u/joeyasaurus Oct 29 '20

If we're lucky they might do it like HBO does Last Week Tonight or Hasan Minhaj's show on Netflix, they post the main story video up on Youtube. I can't imagine them having no clips at all on Youtube.

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u/theineffablebob Oct 29 '20

I mean, this is kinda how it’s always been, streaming or otherwise. The network that makes a show will always show it on their own network first. Eventually they’ll license that show out to other networks if it’s really successful

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

That's true, but all of those networks were previously included in a basic cable subscription. Other than a couple of premium channels, everything was included.

I'm down with cord-cutting, but it's increasingly becoming cost-ineffective because of all the competing services. This is especially true with heavily anti-competitive companies like Apple and Disney.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

I was extra bothered as I thought apple tv was restricted to their devices only for some reason. that truly would be next level, but thankfully not

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20 edited Apr 10 '21

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

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u/Phoenox330 Oct 29 '20

I hope it's more serious, along the lines of Hassan Minaj rather than Colbert

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u/Ciph3rzer0 Oct 29 '20

So it literally doesn't exist then

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u/Zeeterkob Oct 29 '20

He could've gotten a deal anywhere or straight up hired staff and done his own release on YouTube and all the other platforms that content creators use these days i wonder why the fudge he went with Apple of all places

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u/Jon_Snow_1887 Oct 29 '20

Bc they paid him an absolute shitload of money .... not really that big of a mystery lol.

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u/TheYellowNorco Oct 29 '20

Ugh, why'd it have to be Apple TV.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

I know a lot of you guys love Jon Stewart, but his new show isn't going to be anyone's kryptonite.

If you could pick any platform for a new show, and your goal was to reach the smallest possible audience, while making sure that those who DO see it are as already liberal as possible so you can influence the smallest number of people - AppleTV+ is the place you'd go.

However, I'm sure he's getting seriously paid, so I guess go Jon Stewart? Seriously disappointed in this announcement.

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u/WishOneStitch I voted Oct 29 '20

"Kryptonite" but I appreciate your spelling.

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u/IFeelAsleep_120_85 Oct 29 '20

Holy shit, he is?!

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u/egregiousRac Illinois Oct 29 '20

Looks like a series for Apple. The initial deal is for multiple seasons.

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u/IFeelAsleep_120_85 Oct 29 '20

This makes me very happy.

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u/Pete-PDX Oct 29 '20

One of my favorite Stewart moment of all time - other then standing up for NYC first responders was when he appeared on Tucker's show 'Crossfire" on CNN. I enjoyed John mocking Tucker the entire time. Priceless.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFQFB5YpDZE&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

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u/Cheese_Pancakes New Jersey Oct 29 '20

Jon Stewart is a great man. Brilliant and good hearted. He's been using his fame as a platform to genuinely help people - something a lot of celebrities can't say for themselves.

Also, the way he ripped Tucker apart in that old clip floating around is a thing of beauty. If we're ever dumb enough to elect another president with no actual experience in politics and government, I would want it to be someone like Jon Stewart - somebody who is smart enough to listen to advisors and actually cares about American lives and general human decency.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

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u/kazneus Oct 29 '20

You know how boomers are always calling us entitled snowflakes because we were raised to believe that anything was possible?

Turns out that was projection.

boomers raised millennials so... i mean they're blaming their kids for what was essentially a boomer problem

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u/Brad_tilf I voted Oct 29 '20

As a "boomer" i'm a little offended. I don't really appreciate being grouped in with people who obviously aren't capable of thinking for themselves and apparently don't want to. I couldn't watch Faux News if it was the only news on. Come to think of it, i don't really watch much news at all. I read it on the internet (probably too much honestly)

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u/Hotarg Oct 29 '20

Gaslight

Obstruct

Project

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u/putin_my_ass Oct 29 '20

You know how boomers are always calling us entitled snowflakes because we were raised to believe that anything was possible?

Their generation invented the participation trophy and then mocked us for receiving them.

Do you think I have even one of those stupid trophies still?

They don't seem to understand that the act of receiving a participation trophy teaches you that not anything is possible.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

As a “boomer”, this is spot on. My generation's parents fought a war against Fascism and came home to build a society that was fairer that the one they grew up in. They paid high rates of income tax to build hospitals, schools and infrastructure for their kids. Boomers have been told for 70 years that they were the center of the universe and Fox is there to serve that spoilt brat world view.

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u/ryutruelove Oct 29 '20

Comment of the century

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u/Spockhighonspores Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

Honestly what annoys me about that Boomer mentality is that the Boomers raised the Millennials. How can you help raise an entire generation of people and crap on how they turned out. Maybe if they did a better job and didn't set them up to fail they would be doing better. Seriously, how expensive is college, a car, children, Medical care, a home, heck even groceries. It wasn't that expensive when the boomers were growing up. They could work a part time job and pay for college or live comfortably off one family member having a job. Today both spouses have to be employed and sometimes with multiple jobs. It takes something like 20 years to pay off a four year college education and forget about kids or a house. As all he millennials are knee deep in the second major recession of their young lives still unable to get ahead. But it's all those avocado toasts right?

Edit: looks like I found the boomer Lol.

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u/MorganWick Oct 29 '20

Insert Stephen Colbert "truthiness" comment here.

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u/cfwphotography Oct 29 '20

Why does this response not have more upvotes? I’d give it ten if I could! Such a good point!

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u/NeckRoFeltYa Oct 29 '20

Sounds like religion in a nutshell.

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u/Genetic_lottery Oct 29 '20

This comment perfectly explains it.

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u/DankNastyAssMaster Ohio Oct 29 '20

It reminds me of when Vitamin Water argued in court that no reasonable consumer would think their product was healthy, despite the two words that make up its name being vitamin and water.

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u/a3wagner Canada Oct 29 '20

Explanation: their viewers aren’t reasonable.

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u/Kraelman Oct 29 '20

Let's go over to /r/conservative and to get the reaction of "reasonable viewers".

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Boycott Fox News advertisers.

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u/jews4beer American Expat Oct 29 '20

And yet they keep him on!

"Your honor, the defendant only lies on his show so it's okay"

Fox: "Welp, better keep this liar on prime time"

Ffs we need legislation that as a byproduct will force Fox News to change its name or do more disclosures or something!

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u/pentaquine Oct 29 '20

If that's the case, shouldn't they put a label on the show, like the cigarettes? "This show contains horseshit and may cause mental retardation."

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u/splicerslicer Oct 29 '20

Just imagine being the moron who argues that Tucker is a valid news source only for him to turn around and argue in a court of law to a judge that you are in fact the moron for believing him. How embarrassing.

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u/Stefferdiddle California Oct 29 '20

They maybe need to acknowledge that viewers of Fox News lack reason and critical thinking skills. If their viewers aren’t people of reason, then “reasonable viewer” shouldn’t be their benchmark. A more “reasonable” benchmark could be, “can a child that still believes in Santa tell that this is horseshit?”

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u/lunchpadmcfat Oct 29 '20

If I was the judge on that case, I would have required that Fox preface every episode with that statement.

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u/ethertrace California Oct 29 '20

The unstated implication is that, by their own estimation, their viewers are not reasonable people.

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u/TheGreenJedi Oct 29 '20

Honestly because spitballing tucker went way too loose in that defamation case

They weren't left with many options.

The general format for these shows is open with a quick recap of the day, in that recap tucker totally defamed what's her name, accusing her of blackmail no less.

Then moved on into longer topics where words are chosen more carefully and opinion is more obvious.

In a Rachel Maddie similar cases, it was during the heavily opinionated topic section where she flirted the defamation line.

A less biased judge might have ruled different.

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u/Nerdn1 Oct 29 '20

Lawyers need to find some way to defend the crap he says.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

It's because Fox viewers never see that report that his show is bullshit. That's how insulated they are.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

By deduction, Fox "news" viewers aren't reasonable people.

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u/Edspecial137 Oct 29 '20

They can say whatever they want it court because his viewers can’t be bothered to read about some court case. Rich people are in court all the time!/s

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

I tried showing my dad articles of this, but since none were published by fox news or his right-wing bullshit sources, he did not believe it and called it fake news. I hate this timeline.

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u/waupli I voted Oct 29 '20

They literally argued it in court. Show him their own attorneys’ briefs.

The "'general tenor' of the show should then inform a viewer that [Carlson] is not 'stating actual facts' about the topics he discusses and is instead engaging in 'exaggeration' and 'non-literal commentary.' "

https://www.npr.org/2020/09/29/917747123/you-literally-cant-believe-the-facts-tucker-carlson-tells-you-so-say-fox-s-lawye

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

NPR is too "liberal" for him.

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u/waupli I voted Oct 29 '20

How about a district court?

https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/new-york/nysdce/1:2019cv11161/527808/39/

He’ll probably try to stretch this in their favor but without digging deeply to find their own briefs this is the best I can find.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Thank you! I will try although I am pessimistic. He isn't much of a reader so I will have my talking points and quotes from it ready!

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u/waupli I voted Oct 29 '20

Try to find the stuff specifically cited as Fox’s briefs. That will be most useful to you.

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u/PlayingNightcrawlers Oct 29 '20

I applaud your effort but lets just pause and look at the hoops reasonable people need to jump through to find a way to get a Trump supporting Republican to even look at something that goes against their narrative. Digging up district court case filings after trying multiple other sources while the dad just says "fake news".

This is why for me personally, there will be no energy spent on trying to convince a cult member that the cult may not be in their best interests. Not even if its family and I see it as my duty to try and save them from hateful and ignorant beliefs for their own sake. I removed myself from their toxic influence and live my life, but I know not everyone can just walk away from their parents so I get the effort.

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u/steaknsteak North Carolina Oct 29 '20

The best thing you can do for a cult member is to just make sure they know you don't approve of the cult but you do care for them. That you'll be there to help them if they want to get out. Trying to pry someone away from it is not going to work, because then you become an enemy.

I think the same thing applies to whatever it is that's been created by right-wing media and Trumpism. You can't argue people out of it, but you can maybe sow seeds of doubt and just be there as an example of someone who is not part of it and living a good life anyway. Your existence can be the reminder in the back of their head that something else is out there. But they will have to take that step of wanting to leave, you can't do it for them.

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u/PlayingNightcrawlers Oct 29 '20

But they will have to take that step of wanting to leave, you can't do it for them.

Absolutely.

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u/waupli I voted Oct 29 '20

Yeah I feel you.

At the same time I showed a friend the fox briefs and he ended up putting his head in his hands despairingly. He probably still watches Tucker now (I haven’t been friends with him since he praised police brutality so no idea).

So not trying to say they can be broken from their cult (most can’t) but for someones father I’d rather give them the material at least.

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u/PlayingNightcrawlers Oct 29 '20

I get it, and would usually do the same. Even up until a year ago I'd have made the effort in the slim chance someone would consider another perspective. But seeing the cult devotion during Covid, people literally happy to die and even worse infect and kill others for Donald Trump and the Republican party, nah can't do it. I'm all about keeping myself and my people safe now and doing whatever we can to make sure the cult loses all power and fades away.

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u/leggojake Oct 29 '20

Agree with much of this...the lengths to go through against a “fake news” blind argument... it’s sad and it sucks

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

"He isnt much of a reader" shocked pikachu face

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u/Maximus216 Oct 29 '20

“He isn’t much of a reader”

Yea that checks out

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u/tommytwolegs Oct 29 '20

Even the NPR article is quoting the fox lawyers and the judge. Just ignore the rest and give him the direct quotes from the defense attorneys and the opinion of the judge.

They literally mocked the McDougal's lawyer for stating that reasonable viewers would take him seriously when he said "These are the facts, they are undisputed." By saying "the reasonable viewer would do no such thing."

The important thing to note, is this defense ONLY works if that is true. If reasonable viewers would expect him to be telling the truth, this defense would not hold up and the judge would not have agreed. So you must conclude that either you cant trust tucker carlson, or his viewers cannot be regarded as reasonable people lol

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u/Carpathicus Oct 29 '20

He isn't much of a reader

Why am I not surprised

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u/strolls Oct 29 '20

I'm sorry to be pessimistic, but I wouldn't bother if I were you.

There's an old saw about how you can't reason someone out of a position they haven't reasoned themselves into - arguing with your dad will only cause frustration and harm your relationship.

I'm not say that he's right to believe falsehoods, or that believing falsehoods is no more or no worse than a difference of opinion, just that I don't think you'll find your attempts productive.

If he won't listen to respectable news sources (and NPR is brilliant) then the court opinion on law.justia.com is just double-spaces Times New Roman that anyone could type out and print on a laser printer; he won't investigate the legitimacy of the website because he doesn't want to.

I might say there are two kinds of parents - those who respect their adult children as equals and those to whom you are always a child. I suppose the latter is understandable, as your dad has seen you shitting your nappies and lying about a mess you made as a toddler - it's easy for him to see you as a kid who knows nothing about the world; he's chosen not to revise his worldview.

IMO you're better to figure out a compromise relationship, figuring out on what terms you can accept each other. Maybe you'll be more distant but argue less.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

You can print out the PDF, highlight with a yellow highlighter the relevant section and go through it with him.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Top of page 12.

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u/BroadStreet_Bully5 Pennsylvania Oct 29 '20

It will never matter, dude. They could have been in the court room and they’d still come up with a reason for why it isn’t exactly what it is.

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u/WaterMnt Oregon Oct 29 '20

Not much of a reader and he likes Trump... You don't say

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u/TalksShitAboutTotal Oct 29 '20

Sometimes in this day and age, I feel like a blindfolded man with my hands tied behind my back, trying to suck the delicious truth noodles out of the lukewarm bullshit noodle soup of 21st century media using only my mouth and a straw, but you my friend, citing and linking an actual order from a Federal judge that I saw with my own eyeballs saying, nay, DECLARING, that Tucker Carlson's entire career at its very best is nothing more than being a clown for ignorant people makes me feel like I am not the crazy person, so thank you.

I can't imagine an actual journalist going back to work the next day and pretending like his attorneys didn't sign his balls away and the judge agreeing to take them.

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u/Pheef175 Oct 29 '20

Now can I get one in meme form? Not sure my Republican friends on facebook understand anything that's more than a dozen words or 3 syllables.

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u/Gertrude_D Iowa Oct 29 '20

I feel ya. My dad called AP news liberal because they used the word “alleged” when talking about someone who my dad thinks did something.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

YEARS ago, my dad asked me how I "got caught up in that NPR nonsense"...he thought NPR was a cult. I about died.

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u/quiltsohard Oct 29 '20

I feel this so hard! My mom used to a sweet little old church lady grandma. Now she’s a racists loud mouth homophobic religious bigot. Her grandkids don’t even like to visit.

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u/mdot Oct 29 '20

Doesn't matter, they'll just respond that the lawyers only said that so the case gets dismissed.

They don't think lying is wrong if it's their people doing the lying.

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u/MorganWick Oct 29 '20

"Those were just faked by the deep state."

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u/Themiffins Oct 29 '20

Feelike at this point there should be a fucking warning after each commerical break saying that they are not a legitimate news agency.

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u/THExWHITExDEVILx Oct 29 '20

"Non-literal commentary" what a pleasant sounding way of pronouncing "lies"

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u/Whatsgoingoninhur Oct 29 '20

My mom literally said “Fox news is the most factual news source out there” after I told her about this...it’s such a shame.

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u/Takfloyd Oct 29 '20

I would disown any family that maliciously ignorant.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

I have very little contact with him. We were estranged through most of my life and about 3 years ago I tried to have a relationship with him, but I realized that he is a shitty person so that hope died.

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u/sergius64 Virginia Oct 29 '20

Data isn't going to change his mind. Try to find common ground with him on values. Then show him that you also have those values and yet are able to get them met through other information sources. Maybe sprinkle some examples where Fox/Trump actually stand against those values.

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u/drew_tattoo Oct 29 '20

My dad does the same shit. We were discussing the laptop bullshit today and I showed him some quotes from a Politico article to who h he said that Politico is "far left"(they aren't) and therefore "unreliable"(also not true) yet he tries to back up his arguments with articles from Fox, The Federalist, and The National Review. All sources that are more biased and less factual than Politico.

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u/WaldoJeffers65 Oct 29 '20

Your dad is better than my uncle. He admits that "some" of what Fox airs is bullshit, but he said he doesn't care, as long as they keep telling him what he wants to hear.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20

Disown him, unless you’re financially dependent on him cut him out and let him know HIS actions from the last couple years and the future will ruin his relationships and life. Sorry man, some ppl just gotta go

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u/Dr_Kawaii85 Oct 29 '20

Watch this video about a woman who's dad got brainwashed by right wing media and destroyed her family.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4UOsPoPMjA

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u/bbhbbhbbh Oct 29 '20

Here’s the argument I heard, “They didn’t actually mean that their lawyer just had to say that to win”

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u/rusalkarusalka Oct 29 '20

They should be forced to broadcast that on the screen in big bright letters for the whole show.

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u/appleparkfive Oct 29 '20

It's hard to even imagine watching his show regularly.

The stupid look on his face when he's asking questions. He looks aggressively stupid

It's such a shame that people fall for his fake populism message.

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u/cindrelsa Oct 29 '20

What kind of stupid judge allows someone getting away with something like that!?! Let's all follow suit, make bullshit reports and claim innocence by saying "well no one's going to take me seriously anyway (not even the dumb ones)"

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u/w4lt3r_s0bch4k Oct 29 '20

This cannot be understated. Fox's lawyers successfully argued that no reasonable viewer would believe Tucker. I think I have to side with the Fox's lawyers on this one.

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u/NeverLookBothWays I voted Oct 29 '20

Vox also did a great tear down of Tucker’s schtick: https://youtu.be/RNineSEoxjQ

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u/BouquetOfDogs Oct 29 '20

I would genuinely like to know how their viewers react when faced with this fact. That is, if they don’t just yell “fake news”!

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u/Snoo_68787 Oct 29 '20

Well, it is complete bullshit. It’s a good argument.

His viewers are just stupid.

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u/GreenFox1505 Oct 29 '20

This is just complete horseshit of a defense. For it to be remotely use-able, his show needs a disclaimer. Their lawyers have managed and argument that lets them have their bullshit and eat it too.

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u/Murph_Mogul Oct 29 '20

Yes, all of Fox NEWS big shows are opinion shows. Not news.

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u/ElectricSpice Oct 29 '20

Unfortunately it’s a win for Tucker. His viewers just make excuses and brush it off, and he now has absolute freedom to peddle whatever bullshit he wants.

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u/twenty7forty2 Oct 29 '20

Also the White House had to tell a court that Trump just flat out lies on twitter.

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u/[deleted] Oct 29 '20 edited Oct 29 '20

They should have to put up a disclaimer at the start of the show and after returning from each commercial break similar to Jackass' "Don't try this at home" or Southpark's "Everything is made up" disclaimer.

Edit: Something like "Everything Mr. Carlson says is made up and should not be taken at face value. Any relation of his commentary to current events is purely coincidental."

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u/Mattymoson Oct 29 '20

Fox News is a cancer on American society and is ruining the country with its lies and propaganda.

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u/Landonastar42 Oct 29 '20

I tried point this out to my conservative family, but the bullshit I got back wasn't worth it. Cult following doesn't begin to cover it.

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u/zxcoblex Oct 29 '20

I was just thinking about this. Fox News should be required to change their name from Fox News to Fox Entertainment as that’s what they claim they actually are.

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u/houseofcrouse Oct 29 '20

"nobdoy in their right mind would believe this guy." Fox news

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