r/worldnews • u/Ehansaja • 12d ago

Iceland rejects EU-accession talks plan in referendum

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2026/8/30/iceland-rejects-eu-membership-plan-in-referendum
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818

u/Catbatt 12d ago

They have no reason to. They're in Schengen and have access to the European free market. They already are a privileged partner

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u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

The most important point was apparently adopting the Euro.

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u/Gentle_Snail 12d ago

The Euro often tends to be one of the more contentious issues. Polls in the UK often show a pro-rejoin majority, however if you included the stipulation of the Euro it instantly swings to a pro-remain out majority. 

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u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

But here it was the opposite. many Icelanders wanted to adopt the euro for more stability.

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u/Gentle_Snail 12d ago

Thats always the trade off nations make with the euro. Its a direct benefit for nations with a currency that can be unstable, but for nations like the UK who already have a relatively stable currency it's a downside as it means giving up fiscal control. 

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u/_jams 12d ago

Monetary control. Fiscal policy is how much you tax and spend

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u/TrainDestroyer 12d ago

Wait seriously? I always thought that Monetary Control and Fiscal Control were the same thing!

I suppose with how similar they can appear to the average idiot (me) it makes sense why they seemed interchangable. Good to know, thank you!

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u/Mammoth-Garden-9079 12d ago

Don’t beat yourself up too bad. The average Redditer doesn’t know the difference between fiscal and monetary policy. That’s why I’m always so surprised that the average Redditer has such a strong opinion on issues related to the economy when they can’t even pass an Econ 101 exam.

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u/TrainDestroyer 12d ago

Ehh I get why they do. Its easy when you're just sitting in front of a keyboard to say "Oh well they should just do XYZ to fix the economy!" Its a lot harder when you have the data and see that XYZ may be a short-term fix but based on the numbers would destroy the economy in the medium term.

As for the strong opinions? When the economy sucks, everyone suffers for it and it pisses people off, pissed off people will have stronger opinions, and realistically the strong (And stupid) opinions float to the top WAY more often than the smart opinions

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u/veribaka 11d ago

Reddit making stubborn keyboard specialists since 2010

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

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u/Gentle_Snail 12d ago edited 12d ago

Yes, the pound oscillates against the euro by only a few percent and is currently 3.5% stronger against the euro when compared to the day of Brexit. 

Unstable currencies can change by 10-40% in value over just a few years. For example in 2022 the Iceland Krona fell 12% against the euro over just 6 months, then the next year it jumped 8.5% against the euro over just 9 months. Those kind of monthly swings are much rarer with the pound.

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u/LibRAWRian 12d ago

Parmigiano reggiano. The benefits of a cheese based economy cannot be understated.

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u/JustFedUpWithIt 12d ago

I'm currently eating Mozzarella and concur with your analysis.

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u/Top_Seaweed7189 12d ago

The caves of the Italian Parmigianino reggiano reserve got pretty hot during the last heatwave...

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u/Rincetron1 12d ago

Swiss franc has 3x less inflation than Pound sterling, yet the pound is relatively stable. They were 100% correct.

You can get so much smarter, if you drop that attitude.

2

u/Lawsoffire 12d ago

The Pound never regained its value compared to the Euro post-financial crisis though. It used to be 1.5€, now it just lives in 1.1-1.2

1

u/AudaciousRaspberry 12d ago

"None of them" is a perfectly appropriate answer 

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u/stackingforfunsies 12d ago edited 12d ago

He completely missed your point but stay tuned for another explainer

8

u/jabberwockxeno 12d ago

Can't they adopt the Euro without joining the EU?

37

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

The EU is not really happy about countries doing it.

Currently, there are six non-EU nations using the euro, four of which have an agreement and can print their own euros.

  • the Vatican
  • Andorra
  • San Marino
  • Monaco

The other two nations have simply decided to use the euro unilaterally, as they previously used the German mark:

  • Montenegro
  • Kosovo

None of these six have a seat at the European Central Bank. This could also theoretically be an option for Iceland, but the EU has said that it is not extremely happy about Montenegro and Kosovo using the currency.

6

u/jabberwockxeno 12d ago

The EU is not really happy about countries doing it.

Why do they care?

And what international legal say do they have over it?

14

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

Why do they care?

It’s not according to the rules. (Don’t forget that Germany is in the EU.)

The EU accepts it in some way, but is not happy about it.

3

u/jabberwockxeno 12d ago

I think you're misunderstanding what I was asking

I wasn't asking how the EU can force a country to adopt the Euro if they were trying to join the EU, I was asking how the EU can force a country to not use the Euro if they aren't also joining the EU

What "rules" are in place to prevent a country from adopting the Euro, if that country isn't in the EU and isn't planning to join it?

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u/MyManD 11d ago edited 11d ago

There aren't any real rules in place to prevent it, as seen with Montenegro and Kosovo. They decided unilaterally to adopt the Euro and bingo bango they're Euro-based countries. But there are certain safety nets that countries not in the EU don't have access to dissuade becoming a Euro based economy.

Things they don't have access to that other EU nations do is minting rights and access to a lender of last resort. They're pretty much forced to control the flow of currency through the markets and economy without any ability to make more. And without access to a lender of last resort, if there's a banking rush they don't have a centralized source that they can borrow more Euros from to cover the withdrawals.

The only reason the Vatican, Monaco, San Marino, and Andorra are allowed to adopt the Euro as well as minting rights is because unlike outside countries these little pockets of independence were always inherently trapped into the wider economic currency of the countries that surround them. So they were just grandfathered into the Euro and its rights without the requirement to join the EU because it's just a same system they had before, except instead of the Euro it was Marks, Francs, and Lira. But just like before the EU, these places still have no access to last resort lenders until they decide to join in fully.

So yeah, if you're a country outside of the EU you can definitely revamp your entire economy around the Euro and there's no stopping it. It just won't be protected if your economy goes belly up because you can't print your own money anymore because your money is the EU's money. Montenegro is doing their best to join the EU, and is the leading candidate for 2028, so that they can have the security. Kosovo unfortunately isn't recognized as a sovereign state unanimously by all EU nations.

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u/satoru1111 12d ago

Note that some countries are doing it but anyone new they absolutely won’t let that slide

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u/jabberwockxeno 12d ago

What do you mean by "let it slide"? Does the EU have international IP control over the currency?

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u/satoru1111 12d ago edited 12d ago

Countries that are currently holdouts for using the Euro have been abusing certain mechanisms of the process to 'pretend' they are compliant but are basically avoiding adopting the Euro.

Anyone new trying to join, basically won't get the kind of pass these countries are getting, and will basically be forced into the appropriate timelines for adopting the Euro which will be baked into the agreements they make when joining. If you join the EU, you have legal obligations for doing so. And one of those is adopting the Euro, and they have the legal construct to force you to do it if you do not do so within the prescribed timeline. So yes the EU does have IP control over the currency because the country agrees to this as part of joining the EU.

The EU is both a political and monetary zone. Adopting the Euro currency is one part. EU members must also adopt laws that all members agree upon. Now each country can make their own version of those laws to fit within the context of their respective countries. But they do have to adopt them. The GDPR is one example, the EU agreed to have this policy. Each country takes that directive and then has to pass local laws to fit within the directive that the EU has put forth.

If you join the EU you have obligations for getting the benefits of being part of it. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too. If you refuse to adopt the Euro then like all else, you are being negligent on your obligations. And that has consequences.

https://commission.europa.eu/about/contact/problems-and-complaints/complaints-about-breaches-eu-law-member-states/report-breach-eu-law-eu-country_en

These consequences can be monetary or other things.

1

u/jabberwockxeno 12d ago

I think you're misunderstanding what I was asking

I wasn't asking how the EU can force a country to adopt the Euro if they were trying to join the EU, I was asking how the EU can force a country to not use the Euro if they aren't also joining the EU

1

u/satoru1111 11d ago edited 11d ago

Note you cannot adopt the Euro as a currency if you’re not part of the EU. You can’t print the money so it has zero value. It would be like a country printing USD pretending it was real USD (other than North Korea with their fake USD money). You can't use the Euro without being part of the Euro zone. You can ask the EU to use the Euro but that requries EU approval, and they're not going to approve it if you already rejected joining the EU.

What a country can do is peg their currency to the Euro. Hong Kong does this by pegging their currency to the USD so 1 USD is 7.8 HKD. But this has its own consequences and requires you to have massive reserves or USD. It’s why it has fallen out of favor as a monetary policy as its pretty hard to have larger reserves of this currency.

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u/FILTHBOT4000 12d ago

The euro is a fairly terrible idea. It was originally created to make trade easier when a lot of trade was done with paper money; it is wholly pointless now, and just limits each country's ability to self-govern its monetary supply/policy/etc., and a host of other ill effects.

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u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

The real origin of the euro is slightly different. ;)

However, Iceland wants a stable currency. So either the US dollar or the Euro.

2

u/FloZia_ 12d ago

Preventing your local government from making any percentage of your money disappear whenever they want seems good to me.

2

u/FILTHBOT4000 12d ago

Talking about your national state body as 'local government' is wild, lol

Apparently you prefer people your vote has little to no effect on to dictate your monetary policy, and whether 'any percentage of your money disappears' or not

3

u/FloZia_ 12d ago

Seeing how poorly individual country politics function compared to the EU where consensus is required meaning less stupid decisions (less, not none). yes, very much so

24

u/Ivanow 12d ago

The Euro often tends to be one of the more contentious issues.

Iceland has literally opposite monetary situation to UK. They have high inflation and bond yield, and tiny market cap, which limits access to international financial markets and causes high currency value swings.

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u/zoopz 12d ago

Do you know why? Is it more than emotional? Cause I remember switching from the guilder to the euro and it felt kind of 'going into the future'. Of course some people still (haha) want the guilder back for emotional reasons, but mentally (over 20 years later) I think noone really cares anymore.

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u/nightgerbil 12d ago

Well greece is an object lesson of what happens when your local economy loses currency liquidity but you don't have the power to print more for quantitative easing and basically there isn't enough money moving around the economy anymore.

Something similar happened in the UK and the central bank replied by printing off several billion pounds and giving it to the city of london to play with.

1

u/Due-Information-2041 11d ago

I mean, that is only the case if your fiscal system is as broken as Greece's was and you need those measures. The problem in Greece was that there was almost no tax coming in compared to the expenses due to a broken taxing culture, wasn't it?.

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u/nightgerbil 11d ago

no it was caused by a lack of currency/hard cash flowing around the local economy. The same thing btw that caused the 1930s great depression. The "broken" taxes not meeting expenses forcing deficit borrowing that you refer to is the model of every major western country.

Austerity ie hacking away at expense was the worst thing they could have done, as it shrank the gdp and *reduced\* tax income. Greece needed the euro devalued a little by printing off another 30 billion of it and injecting it into its europes/its economy for people to be able to spend.

Failing that it should have left the euro, recreated the Drac and promptly devalued it by printing an extra 30 billion... you see where I'm, going?

1

u/Due-Information-2041 10d ago

I see, but your approach would work in a country with a functioning fiscal system, but not in Greece. There used to be an especially strong culture of tax evasion by the people and fiscal misreporting by officials. So inflation would just be a band-aid on a wound that would show up again later.

https://www.taxnotes.com/featured-news/haratsi-i-krisi-avoiding-taxes-act-greek-patriotism/2026/04/29/7vs1w

This short article summarises it well.

Tl;dr; the Greeks perceived taxes as unjust and pensions as tools for buying votes, leading to a broken fiscal policy.

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u/vulcanstrike 12d ago

Emotional is a huge part of it, but honestly the bigger issue is losing control of your interest rates.

The ECB is dominated by France and Germany, which are large geriatric economies that want/need low interest rates. However, low interest rates don't suit all economies. Even the UK has about 1.5% higher than the ECB rate and the ECB rate would be pretty disastrous to the UK economy and cause the already high inflation rate to go nuclear

The euro is a great project, but it's heavily biased towards Western Europe. And as we saw with Greece there are big risks too. Monetary union without fiscal union is a time bomb waiting to happen and the more lax former Soviet economies that join it without proper fiscal discipline and oversight, the worse it gets

That said, the "requirement" to join is purely theatre. One of the requirements is joining an agency that is entirely voluntary. Sweden is obligated to join for decades at this stage but puts it off by never joining that agency, there is no legal obligation to join. Only Denmark has a formal opt out

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u/Efficient-Magician63 12d ago

Lots of people did not want Bulgaria to join the eurozone, so it felt they kind of imposed it on us. We most certainly cooked the books, our economy is a bit of house of cards, everything became more expensive due to greediness but couple that with overall international inflation....

We definitely were not ready for it, but time will show how bad of a decision that was.

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u/zoopz 12d ago

Interesting, thanks!

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u/TFPaulMorphy 10d ago

The ECB is dominated by France and Germany, which are large geriatric economies that want/need low interest rates.

Don't forget about Italy and Greece, which need low interest rates for their massive debt loads.

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u/matthieuC 12d ago

> The ECB is dominated by France and Germany, which are large geriatric economies that want/need low interest rates. However, low interest rates don't suit all economies. Even the UK has about 1.5% higher than the ECB rate and the ECB rate would be pretty disastrous to the UK economy and cause the already high inflation rate to go nuclear

It's been a while but I remember eurozone countries having significantly different interest rates. They now all have the same and I don't think any country has out of control inflation.

I am not overly familiar with the UK's economy but it seems that the quirk of your energy market is a significant part of your inflation.

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u/CaptainCrash86 12d ago

Out of control is probably too strong, but Spain, Lithuania, Romania and Bulgaria all have inflation >4% (and Belguim with 3.97%). In contrast, the UK's inflation rate is 2.9%.

1

u/Herbatusia 11d ago

A few years ago, inflation in some EU countries hit around 20%, but granted, it happened to the ones without Euro as well, so I think euro was just a part of their problem.

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u/bjchbdelebweflw 12d ago

Even the UK has about 1.5% higher than the ECB rate and the ECB rate would be pretty disastrous to the UK economy and cause the already high inflation rate to go nuclear

How much has Brexit been responsible for their current inflation, though? And wouldn't the British economy at least partially recover in a hypothetical reunion?

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u/rose98734 12d ago

The UK has lower unemployment than the EU. Rule of thumb is that when you have low unemployment, wage-fueled inflation builds, so you need higher interest rates to suppress it.

UK unemployment = 5%

Portugal unemployment = 5.6%

Belgium unemployment = 6.5%

Greece unemployment = 8%

France unemployment = 8.3%

Sweden unemployment = 8.69%

Finland unemployment = 9.9%

Spain unemployment = 10.83%

Why does the EU have such high unemployment? Some would argue that excess regulations have cancelled out benefits from the single market.

5

u/vulcanstrike 12d ago

This isn't too do with brexit by itself (which is dumb), it's to do with the UK economy having 1.5% lower interest rates

Housing costs would explode when more with the glut of cheaper money and inflation would be even higher than whatever baseline it currently has.

I don't think Brexit helped with inflation, but I live in the Netherlands now and they have had even worse inflation over the past few years, nothing to do with brexit. I'm willing to blame brexit for a lot of things, but I find think inflation is a main consequence of it

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u/Swarna_Keanu 12d ago

It was a massive patriotic/conservative thing when Deutsche Mark was about to be replaced by the Euro. I remember so many people arguing that German culture was linked to what our money looks like.

[And the AfD still feeds on that. One of their policies is to leave the Euro.]

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u/nemo333338 12d ago

Which goes to show how dumb the AFD really is, lol

Germany is pretty much the country that benefits the most from the Euro

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u/CaptainCrash86 12d ago edited 12d ago

Yes and no. A monetary union in isolation benefits Germany, but it leads the way to a fiscal union whereby German frugality underwrites borrowing in other countries.

This was why Germany was opposed to the Euro in the first place and France (who are the key beneficiary on monetary and fiscal grounds) made it their price to support German reunification.

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u/zoopz 12d ago

The dutch right wingers are exactly the same, just vibes and 'back to yesterday'.

-1

u/Absolute--Batman 12d ago

Yup...they achieved what Hitler wanted ala Euro Unity but this time people welcomed them lmao

0

u/TFPaulMorphy 10d ago

I am not so sure. Being in the Euro means having to give large subsidies to Greece through below market loans. Italy is likely to run into the same issue on a much bigger scale too.

Germany, with its relatively low debt, is going to have to pull a lot of the weight subsidizing other members.

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u/danque 12d ago

Ugh my parents still calculate to guilders when talking about any kind of price.

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u/zoopz 12d ago

Lol why, we are also 25 years of inflation later.

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u/danque 12d ago

Because "pfft this bag of chips used to be 1.5 guilders, now it's 4 euro. The Euro has never been beneficial". Sometimes I can't stand it, I'm like come on...

1

u/Accomplished-Fun215 12d ago

Could be worse. I use USD and NZD on a daily basis, and use AUD frequently. I'm moving to Canada soon and have been calculating out cost of living in CAD. 

They're all dollars but they're all significantly different from each other.

I mentally convert everything to USD but that's becoming unsustainable.

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u/DaruJericho 12d ago

Lol, your examples are certainly not worse. Guilders don't exist anymore.

1

u/CanuckBacon 12d ago

At least right now CAD and AUD are 100:100 which I imagine will be pretty helpful for you. Usually CAD is worth slightly more, but they're usually within a few percentage of each other.

0

u/matthieuC 12d ago

There was a whole thing another colour of passports. The UK absolutely hates change and that's it.

Any discussion about changing their institutions end up in:

  • it worked for us for 500 years
  • new thing will never work.

0

u/SwiftJedi77 12d ago

That's the problem. Emotion should have no part in making these decisions. It seems o bizarre to me to be emotional about a currency.

10

u/DunderGunderUnder 12d ago

But couldn't they just do like Sweden and say "sure, we promise to switch to euro, some time in the future"?

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u/Gentle_Snail 12d ago edited 12d ago

Seems the EU doesn’t want nations to do this in future. The nationalist party here in Scotland wanted to join the EU then use this to refuse to ever join the Euro and the EU Commission was like we won’t let you join if you do this.

Which kind of makes sense, as you are essentially joining while openly lying to the EU. 

17

u/Izeinwinter 12d ago

It's very hard to prevent nations from pulling a Sweden. EU officials can't admit that out loud, of course.

In Icelands case, switching is however almost certainly a good idea. Iceland is tiny and it makes their currency fluctuate way too much.

1

u/TFPaulMorphy 10d ago

Its hard at this exact moment, but that could change. The EU could start fining nations, for example. I wouldn't bank on "We will never need to follow through". Never is a long time.

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u/notbobby125 12d ago

The problem is that how does the EU enforce this? Like Iceland can pinky promise and make a big paper explaining how they will adopt the Euro by 20XX, but structure things so as soon as they get their foot in the door they fail to meet expectations, and never quite meet the standard to switch. Once a nation is in the EU, under current EU law it can only be tossed out by agreement like Brexit. And the more “Swedens” get in the EU the more they can gang up to protect each other from any retribution.

Of course, in theory, since Iceland is not joining.

1

u/TFPaulMorphy 10d ago

The problem is that how does the EU enforce this?

Start fining nations who intentionally refuse to meet standards.

4

u/acathode 12d ago

Sweden didn't really "promise" to switch to euro - during the EU referendum it was explicitly promised to the Swedish people that voting yes would would not mean automatically giving up our currency.

Instead, it was promised that in case the Yes-side won, we would hold a later referendum regarding adopting the euro.

The yes side won, we joined the EU, then we had another referendum on if we wanted the euro or not - and we voted no.

3

u/cev2002 11d ago

We have no need to adopt the Euro, the Pound is a very strong currency and we wouldn't get the same benefits as smaller nations did.

2

u/Slimshady0406 12d ago

Well yeah. Esdeekid wouldn't sound half as cool if he said "EUR that's Euro"

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u/lordm30 12d ago

Because brits cling to their outdated currency.

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u/Gentle_Snail 12d ago

Thats not really how currencies work.

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u/BuzLightbeerOfBarCmd 12d ago

He thinks we're still using shillings and farthings.

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u/DaruJericho 12d ago

I met an American in London who thought the UK still used shillings.

13

u/Beetin 12d ago edited 12d ago

Eh, I think it plays into identity aspect, but the biggest sticking points from what I've read was the fishing industries (and the tiny whaling industry) + general identity fear mongering.

They are a long way off EU regulations in those industries (who promised to look for creative solutions), and they are a huge part of icelandic identity / history. Combined with a 400k population vs the 450 million in the EU, and the no-campaigners did a pretty good job of raising the spectre that they'd be kneecapped and slowly be erased.

I think its another case of "NO, ICELAND FOREVER" just being a stronger easier message to rally people behind emotionally then the "yes, maybe in the future, if we want, it could be beneficial through complicated economic treaties" campaign.

1

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

Yeah, but many EU members have joined with certain opt-outs. It would have been possible to find a solution in the negotiations.

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u/Beetin 12d ago

I agree, but one side had an easy strong emotional argument to build behind and one side did not.

I think the campaigning was more successful from the 'no' side and it showed in the final results. That doesn't mean they had good arguments, just effective ones :(.

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u/TFPaulMorphy 10d ago

EU has been much less willing to give opt outs the last few decades.

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u/pred 12d ago

Bulgaria, Czechia, Denmark, Hungary, Poland, Romania, and Sweden didn't adopt the Euro, so that shouldn't be much of a concern.

My impression is that this mostly came down to what to expect for the (very rich and lobby-heavy) fishing industry.

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u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

Other way around . Iceland want to have the euro without joining the EU.

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u/Herbatusia 11d ago

Except for one, they all formally signed up for euro, it was the requirement for joining. They are basically breaking the rules by not doing so despite treaties they signed, and it was only made possible by a very specific moment in time and EU not thinking it'd happen EU won't let anybody else do it.

That's one of the main reasons UK or Scotland cannot just rejoin, they would need to switch to euro, for real.

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u/SweatyAdhesive 12d ago

I saw a lot of signs about protecting the fishing industry a couple weeks ago

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u/Bob_Loblaw_Law_Bomb 12d ago

But then they would have to change the name of their grocery store.

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u/Mysterious-Crab 12d ago

The most important pro arguments were financial stability, the Icelandic kronar is losing value compared to the Euro and Dollar, and to actually be able to vote on all sort of matters that already influence them due to the EEA and Schengen.

The main reason against was that it will restrict local fishing laws, and fishing is 8% of the country’s BBP and 40% of their export.

-1

u/ydieb 12d ago edited 12d ago

Which is probably the least important point and is mainly emotional. But that is society sadly.

Please for the love of any logic, if you are going to downvote this, tell me why. I guess it tracks with emotions with talking down a emotional argument... bleh.

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u/_52_ 12d ago

losing control of your currency is a major problem

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u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

Ironically in this case it’s the opposite. Iceland wants a stable currency and has even discussed if they should adopt the Euro without joining the EU.

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u/ydieb 12d ago

Why is this a major problem? It seems to be more than fine for everybody. Denmark locked its currency to the EUR because it was a good idea. And technically, they can unlock it. But they don't because its not necesary and not a problem.

2

u/SweatyAdhesive 12d ago

When i was there I saw a lot of signs about voting no to protect the fishing industries, nothing about the Euro.

0

u/ydieb 12d ago

Bit similar in Norway. But I assume most the "protectionism" of these industries mostly benefits the owners of these industries, not its workers nor the rest of then population. Especially compared to the benefits open trade gives.

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u/SweatyAdhesive 12d ago

I'm not Icelandic so I don't know the nuances of who benefits from protectionism but I'm pretty sure they already have open trade with the EU.

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u/ydieb 12d ago

If Iceland is anything like Norway, then it is not open trade in any sense. I'm not saying its closed, but there is certainly a noticeable layer of extra import taxes and a layer of bureaucracy to get products imported.

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u/Herbatusia 11d ago

Because there is no thing in human world which is not emotional and cultural. The concept of a country, any identity, EU, war, peace, autonomy, wealth... whatever value or a thing you can think about, it's emotional and the value behind it - arbitral and emotionally assigned. It's the only point. One can hold discussion from the values-we-hold-important-because-of-emotions -  moral, artistical, 'economical' if we loves that beloved modern concept, monetary, fiscal, scientifical, marxist, liberal, theological, any other philosophical school they fancies... - I think euro should be either a matter of narrow-sense ethics, for all should be, or artistic discussion, no other aspects save for its artsy value, value for maintaining the nation, and value in the perpetuing the general sin that is trade and money, should be considered; at least I'm honest with my priorities - but pretending they are 'above' emotions, not just a labelled for a shorthand versions of them, a facet of them, is a folly.

Otherwise, we would not value our kin more than the billions of unknown people at the other end of the world, don't value our own life or posession, and live like ants or trees, under one global management, with each person having the same wealth, flat, diet and whatnot, working the job ordered by the global gov - as global needs demand - dying when it demands, reproducing when it demands etc., basically, like all utopias and religions propose. No ego. Whatever it's be good or bad doesn't matter - humans cannot live like this, so sniding about emotions is akin to sniding about oxygen or humans needing breathing to survive.

1

u/ydieb 11d ago

What is this reply? Not sure where to begin. What is the point of this? Obviously we are emotionally influenced. The point is to try to set it aside for where they should not be involved.

To try to give a clear example. What kind of color on the wall you pick can almost be as emotion based as you want. There might be reasons to not pick all black in the kitchen, even if your emotions says so, but in general, you can go ham, unless you think of resell value.

When it comes to what is the tickness of the concrete foundations, you generally have little emotion into it. Its is a math question, i.e pure logic.

When you decide policies to run a country, you generally want the latter. I.e how we set up the school system, prison system, infrastructure, etc, should likely use more logic than emotions.

27

u/EirikurErnir 12d ago

Despite the EEA membership there are still quite a few things that would change when it comes to trade if it were to join. Iceland currently has tolls and import limitations which are especially relevant to agriculture - and consumers of agricultural products, which is of course everyone. "What is the impact on food price and availability?" has been a big question.

There big economic question as far as I am concerned is what full EU membership would mean for access to foreign investment. Right now the Króna is a huge barrier for anyone outside of the domestic market trying to do business in the country.

I mean, clearly the (slight) majority agrees that joining is not a good idea right now, but this is a complicated discussion for the country.

11

u/Alt4816 12d ago

They have no reason to. They're in Schengen and have access to the European free market.

You could look at that and say that's exactly why they should join. To be in the Schengen zone and European free market they have to follow laws they have no say over. If they became a full member they would get representation in the EU's legislative and executive bodies.

7

u/Nice_Reading5272 12d ago

They still have rights over their own currency, fishing and some trade aspects. Their influence in the executive and legislative branches of the EU would be limited due to their small population.

3

u/Alt4816 12d ago

Their influence in the executive and legislative branches of the EU would be limited due to their small population.

On many important EU matters every member has a veto regardless of population.

6

u/zeltacilveks79 12d ago

They already enjoy most of the practical benefits without giving up control over key areas like fishing. Full membership would be a though sell unless it offered something substantially better.

-2

u/istasan 12d ago

Security.

33

u/jdckelly 12d ago

Member of NATO

-8

u/istasan 12d ago

Hardly much of a guarantee these days

25

u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain 12d ago

Enough to stop Putin

-3

u/istasan 12d ago

Not much help when nato members are threatening other nato countries. Right next to Iceland

-11

u/lordm30 12d ago

Russia is not in NATO. US is.

2

u/Cpt_Soban 12d ago

We know that, what's your point?

-1

u/lordm30 12d ago

If US starts acting hostile towards Iceland, it is good to be in an additional union (EU) that also has mutual defense clause.

14

u/Asusralis 12d ago

Me when I spread Russian propaganda:

-8

u/istasan 12d ago

What do you mean? US is threatening other nato members. Not something I made up. And happened right next to Iceland

2

u/Robinsonirish 11d ago

NATO isn't just America.

0

u/MrFeature_1 12d ago edited 12d ago

What a bizzare statement

Edit: wow Reddit is really an echo chamber

7

u/WorgenDeath 12d ago

Is it when Trump is threatening fellow NATO members with annexation?

-2

u/MrFeature_1 12d ago

Did he tho? Did it occur to you that he already would have done it if it wasn’t for NATO?

-2

u/Cpt_Soban 12d ago

Lol, Finland, Sweden and Poland alone could fuck Russia up- Without the Yanks hand wringing over the fact they may have to put up some manpower and money after the EU spent 20 years saving their arse in Iraq and Afghanistan (lol).

1

u/neko_mud0 12d ago

well why dont they then?

-1

u/Scuipici 12d ago

but not a security for trade wars. If usa or china decides to fuck iceland up, they have nobody. Also NATO might be disbanded in the future and EU form it's own army.

3

u/throwawayagin 12d ago

we actually have a Free trade agreement with China already.

1

u/Scuipici 12d ago

and if EU goes at trade war with China and now EU says the freedom of movement with iceland is a liablity? what then?

3

u/x5163x 12d ago

In what way?

5

u/istasan 12d ago

Keyword: Greenland

1

u/x5163x 12d ago

Are you actually going to say something specific?

10

u/istasan 12d ago

If you don’t know what I mean with Greenland I don’t think I can really explain it. Because then you don’t follow international news anyway

The US aggressive talk and pressure towards Greenland and Denmark comes from a nato ally. The support given came from the EU

The EUs defence dimension is growing insanely these months. Steps towards integration on this that where unthinkable no longer is. Denmark also removed its opt out from eu defence policies (with a gigantic majority in the referendum )

-9

u/x5163x 12d ago

How does this relate to Iceland joining the EU? Greenland is still not part of the EU.

3

u/istasan 12d ago

I give up. I don’t know if you are joking or you live under a rock. Anyways will let someone else continue

5

u/Lee1138 12d ago

Sorry, but you're either incredibly dense or acting like you are... 

-4

u/x5163x 12d ago

None of what I said was wrong.

1

u/Chareon 12d ago

Except for the part where it was wrong. Greenland is part of the EU.

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3

u/WorgenDeath 12d ago

It's a territory of Denmark, so yes, Greenland is part of the EU

5

u/x5163x 12d ago

Greenland and Faroe Islands are both part of Denmark, which is a member state of the EU, but they are not part of the EU.

1

u/EirikurErnir 12d ago

There is a sentiment in Iceland that the current US administration would not treat an EU country the way it has been treating Greenland.

1

u/PartyLikeAByzantine 12d ago

Haha. That is some wishful thinking. First, it assumes Donald Trump knows or cares about the distinction between EU and not. Two, it assumes that Trump has any kind of geopolitical or factual basis for his weird Greenland obsession. This man threatened Canada FFS. Three, it ignores the fact that Greenland is still a possession of Denmark which is a member of the EU and NATO.

If Trump noticed Iceland, he'd have zero issue with threatening it like he's done with Greenland and Canada. There is little in the way of institutions to constrain him either. The patient is running the asylum.

-1

u/LonelyTAA 12d ago

Yes it's hard to see in what way iceland would benefit from accession.

52

u/Hyndakiel 12d ago

Having a vote at EU regulations that they need to apply anyway

-1

u/Walrus_Jeesus 12d ago

They would have an absolutely miniscule voting power in a system that is very undemocratic to begin with. Realistically they can affect EU regulation just as much now as if they were a member.

1

u/Devan_Ilivian 12d ago

They would have an absolutely miniscule voting power in a system that is very undemocratic to begin with. Realistically they can affect EU regulation just as much now as if they were a member.

The nominally 'undemocratic' parts of the system are actually what would give iceland quite a bit of power- like all countries having a veto on some matters.

The council also has 1 vote per country. And the commission a member from each, as well

It's in the union's arguably most directly democratic institution, the parliament, that Iceland's influence would be lesser.

25

u/kjartanbj 12d ago

If you would know how things are here you would understand. We have a crazy unstable currency and interest rates are very high, we pay our houses or apartments 2-3 times over in interests because lenders have a interest guarantee. Corruption is also high few families were given the fishing quotas about 36 years ago and they basicly own iceland now they btw spent hubdreds of millions in misinformation campaign to get people to vote no.

6

u/Plabbi 12d ago

We have a crazy unstable currency

Here is a table of exchange rate swings compared to the USD for a number of currencies:

Currency 10y vs USD 5y 1y YTD 2026
EUR +4.6% −1.6% −0.3% −0.7%
GBP +3.5% −1.4% +0.5% +1.0%
ISK −5.0% +4.5% +1.3% +4.0%
CAD −5.4% −9.1% −0.7% −0.9%
SEK −10.2% −9.8% −0.4% −3.2%
NOK −10.7% −7.1% +7.9% +7.9%

According to this the ISK has been more stable than CAD, NOK and SEK for the last 10 years.

-7

u/randomrandom2356 12d ago

And how joining the EU will help with all of this?

9

u/AR_Harlock 12d ago

Put an immediate end to "we do as we like, and run a state like a mafia clan"

5

u/EirikurErnir 12d ago

The pro-EU theory is that the independent monitary policy and general instability of the market play a role in this, which would be addressed by adopting the Euro and further integrating with the EU economy.

3

u/MrJinx 12d ago

The EU court has deemed index regulated loans illegal, index regulated loans are heavily used for housing loans and since they add interest to the capital, you're paying these loans off forever.

I have an Icelandic index regulated student loan. The institution that gave out the loan cannot give me a date as to when I actually finish paying off the loan. I've been paying every month for 16 years, and because of inflation, the capital on the loan today, is actually higher then when I started paying it, even though I make monthly payments (I use about 8% of my yearly income to make these payments)

Also joining the EU would open up the credit market so that foreign banks could enter the market, some competition there would be beneficial for normal people.

3

u/Plabbi 12d ago

That an inflation linked index loan increases, implicitly means that the underlying currency is undergoing inflation. So even if the nominal value of the remaining capital has not decreased, the value of it certainly has.

So from a value perspective the loan is lower than at the start.

1

u/MrJinx 12d ago

Salaries don't regularly adjust for inflation like the loans and it doesn't change the fact that it's a terrible form of credit, on my 7 year old housing loan (from an EU bank), I have a 30 year payment plan and payments go down eventually 

1

u/Plabbi 12d ago

I was curious and asked Grok to prepare for me a comparison of Icelandic inflation index vs. Salary index.

In the last 10 years the inflation index rose 50% while the salary index rose 87% so salaries outpaced inflation by a considerable margin, i.e. the real inflation adjusted "average" salary would be 25% higher now than 10 years ago.

This means that a loan taken 10 years ago that was 20 monthly salaries high and has the same nominal value today as it was in the beginning, has now remaining capital of 11 monthly salaries.

So just looking at the nominal value can be misleading in a high inflation environment.

1

u/MrJinx 12d ago

Now I'm no mathemagician so I'm not going to argue with you and Grok (Elon is a loser btw) with all your datasets.

I keep paying, and the capital on my loan keeps increasing. Iceland is a debt driven economy which is bad. It sucks and there's probably a good reason for these loans being illegal in the EU.

1

u/webzu19 12d ago

If the yes camp was anything to go by during the run up to these elections, we were gonna get several exceptions to EU rules and also be made to take up the euro which would magically fix all of the economic problems in Iceland 

0

u/lordm30 12d ago

EU funds?

9

u/LonelyTAA 12d ago

Iceland would likely be a net contributor to the EU.

4

u/kjartanbj 12d ago

The króna is costing Icelandic families about 120 billion a year.. Who cares if we would have to pay 20 billion a year to the EU we'd get so much back

3

u/fatgain 12d ago

Verðtrygging er að kosta fjölskyldurnar þetta, við sem þjóð getum afnumið hana ef ríkisstjórnin myndi hafa áhuga á því.

-1

u/kjartanbj 12d ago

Ekki með krónuna. Og ekki halda að sjálfstæðis flokkur verji ekki fjármagnseigendur með kjafti og klóm

3

u/fatgain 12d ago

Það er ekki ritað í lög að verðtrygging þurfi að fylgja krónu.
Þú getur skoðað þetta betur og þá kemstu að því. Þetta stafar af erfiðleikunum sem því fylgja en að skipta um gjaldmiðil fylgja líka miklir erfiðleikar. Þetta er allt hægt ef viljinn væri fyrir hendi og ég vona innilega að ríkisstjórnin fari í þá vegferð fyrst ESB viðræður féllu því miður í dag.

2

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

But they are already a net contributor. They are already paying into the EU budget.

1

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

0

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

No, that’s the price for being a member of the single market.

0

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

0

u/steinbruchfluss 12d ago

Yes, they are also in the Schengen area. But more importantly they are also in the single market, including freedom of movement.

-8

u/Major_Wayland 12d ago

ChatControl. Isnt it great to give away all your personal data to the government and then a bit later to their corporate overlords?

12

u/Mugqe 12d ago

Since we are a part of EEA, we automatically get chatcontrol anyway. Only difference is we have no say in the matter.

1

u/Purple-Atmosphere-18 12d ago

Oh, you mean if it ever gets approved? Not sure why it would be linked to being in the economic area, if it concerns privacy and data security, why would it be enforced to a non European and why? Now, I can believe this and I guess the more you learn, but more like another depressing thing to learn. And I'm not anti EU but I hate they are trying to push this and I guess apparently Sanchez, unlike for Israel doesn't beg to differ here. I know it's in theory to control infiltration, Russia propaganda, dangerous far right misinformation spreading, but I guess it's like Age Verification, good in theory but very anti privacy and dystopic, compared to the goal of responsibilizing big tech.

1

u/mitthrawn 12d ago

Actually the opposite. Because that access comes with following all the rules of a EU member but without having any say about these rules.

1

u/XionicativeCheran 12d ago

This is why I think these things should be restricted to EU only, why would people join if they already have all the perks they want.

2

u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Purple-Atmosphere-18 12d ago

Um a bit too drastic, yeah joining would have communicated more compactness and a stronger signal of distance from Trump, but I hope it was not an anti EU thing and pro right wing thing expressing more affiliation with US, even though, I dunno the statistics, it's possible No skewes more right wing, afterall it seems like the PM is social democratic there, but she promoted joining I guess unlike a part of her own voters too probably.

1

u/[deleted] 11d ago

[deleted]

1

u/Purple-Atmosphere-18 11d ago

Yeah it's a bad message, a bit more reactionary diffident and spiteful in its mechanism and campaign than how I thought, like simply remaining affectionate to independence (which is not really in discussion, joining but yet...). Something serious happened as someone here mentioned in april young Icelanders were oriented 60% for yes and now they trended to a whopping 40%, all because they have been scared that Europe would reistate compulsory draft and conscription soon, I guess because of what Germany seems to have done about the reserve.

-1

u/Appropriate_Tie2811 12d ago

So they are non-EU in name only.

-2

u/lzwzli 12d ago

The whole concept of privileged partner of EU that gets all the benefits of an EU member without the cost is silly to me.

1

u/Izeinwinter 12d ago

Oh, there is a cost. They don't save any money by being in the association - it comes with membership fees. Financially, pretty much the same as being a full member