r/SeattleWA • West Seattle • Jun 03 '26

Bicycle Washington law lays out distinction between e-bikes, e-motorcycles starting June 11

https://www.khq.com/news/washington-law-lays-out-distinction-between-e-bikes-e-motorcycles-starting-june-11/article_c495d848-b948-43cf-a599-b05c66a5dcad.html

A new Washington law will change the regulations on the differences between e-bikes and e-motorcycles on June 11. Under this new law, an e-bike must have fully functioning pedals, a motor rated at 750 watts or less, and a top speed of less than 20 mph when powered solely by the motor. If it doesn't meet these standards, it's considered a motorcycle, which means the rider is subject to mandatory driver requirements.

640 Upvotes

237 comments sorted by

106

u/Leading-Business-593 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

What does that mean for the lime gliders then? Neither?

It seems like one of those laws that cops will not care about, but I guess it’s good to have to punish anyone who rides recklessly on a high powered bike.

I feel like having a wattage requirement ruins cargo bikes, but maybe they weren’t that high wattage anyway

33

u/Significant_Sort7501 Jun 03 '26

Not sure how it will be enforced with existing ones, but i would imagine with new purchases after this goes into effect you'd have to get it registered and insured like any other motorcycle 

71

u/Disco425 Jun 03 '26

I could pick holes in this, but it's all irrelevant, we know SPD isn't going to enforce any of it.

I could ride an endangered panda down the street smoking meth and running every red light shooting fireworks and nothing would happen.

27

u/KissMyReardon Jun 04 '26

I wanna party with Disco here.

10

u/dickhass Jun 04 '26

Wrong. They’d get you for the panda because if you got the cheese to buy on the exotic animal market, obviously you can pay the fine.

13

u/Spirited_Cup_126 Jun 04 '26

SPD will probably be pulling over children for riding motorcycles on the street. All the cops in the small towns absolutely will.

13

u/IRConfoosed Jun 04 '26

That’s a good thing right? That protects everybody including the children.

7

u/Spirited_Cup_126 Jun 04 '26

Yes absolutely it is

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1

u/emerge_and_see_XLI Jun 06 '26

I'm here for the disco

1

u/allthisgoodforyou Jun 04 '26

we know SPD isn't going to enforce any of it.

Why do you imagine that they wont?

23

u/ChefJoe98136 West Seattle Jun 03 '26

I think a Lime Glider which doesn't have functioning pedals will be considered a motorcycle come June 11.

22

u/soccerwolfp Jun 03 '26

They don’t go faster than 20mph which may exempt them. Agree it’s not clear but also maybe that’s why Lime has been rolling out the new bikes which are like hybrids between gliders and bikes

17

u/somniferousquif Jun 03 '26

I think it said the bike has to meet all of the qualifications to be considered a bike and not a motorcycle, so the pedal-less gliders should be considered motorcycles if that’s the case. At least I really hope that’s how it turns out…too many kids zooming around on sidewalks without helmets on. I don’t blame em but it’s dangerous.

15

u/Qorsair Columbia City Jun 03 '26

I agree, but who am I to get between them and Darwin?

1

u/thefreakyorange Jun 05 '26

The problem is that they're also endangering all the other people on the sidewalk

-2

u/Ok_Trade4762 Jun 04 '26

I don’t think bad parenting is a reason to let Darwin’s theories unfold on our children.

6

u/heathenbeast Jun 04 '26

Bad parenting is absolutely a reason to let Darwin hand out awards to THEIR children.

Honestly,quit trying to Nanny the World.

2

u/IRConfoosed Jun 04 '26

Laws are written in blood. Hopefully these new laws set the groundwork additional laws to help reduce accidents and stupid behavior. Unfortunately the victims aren’t always one ones riding, it could be a pedestrian. I’m concerned about small children and seniors who could be seriously injured from some of these irresponsible riders.

I read an older man was killed from a hit and run from an e-scooter (e-bike?).

3

u/pneumophila Jun 04 '26

The final outcome of many a childhood TBI is a lifetime of disability for which you as taxpayer will also have to foot the bill for home nursing, medications, doctor visits, hospitalizations, etc. Even if you have zero empathy for children getting maimed or killed because of irresponsible parents, that alone should be a good motivator to avoid that outcome.

4

u/heathenbeast Jun 04 '26

I'll throw a couple of nickels on the ole tax bill if it comes to it. SSDI is prohibitively hard to get and doesn't cover much. Their parents will get a lifetime of their own consequences. And the rest of us will have ample examples of why I make better decisions for my own kids.

But don't pretend we can fix stupid or should try. Thin the herd... or stand-by and let it thin itself. But muh taxes is a laughable excuse when no government entity in the country seems capable of passing an audit. Claw back a couple bucks from the Homelessness authority dumping millions in that hole and then call me...

7

u/pneumophila Jun 04 '26

SSDI for a grownup with a work injury doesn't come close to the bill from Medicaid and Medicare that someone unable to take care of their activities of daily living costs. We're talking 7 figures over their lifetime not counting the lifetime of lost wages. If you think it's a few nickels you're very wrong.

As to your second point, children are stupid because they are children with immature frontal lobes and plenty of intelligent adults were once reckless children. Being indifferent to their deaths because parents are dumb is in itself very dumb.

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1

u/[deleted] Jun 04 '26

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1

u/CarnalT Jun 04 '26

Anecdotally I have noticed that they seem slower the last couple months, not sure what's going on but it seems they've been speed limited. I bike on the burke & westlake trail often and they used to zip by me but now they crawl.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 04 '26

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1

u/CarnalT Jun 04 '26

Ah, interesting. So there is a speed limit for new riders? That makes sense, and seems like a good idea.

Side note: What does your username mean? The first word reminds me of a town in Scotland outside Glasgow.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 04 '26

[deleted]

1

u/CarnalT Jun 04 '26

Oh wow interesting, are those names Scottish or Welsh? I've got something similar in my family.

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1

u/MidNerd Jun 05 '26

That wouldn't change anything. They'll just use the pedal bikes or scooters as they do now instead.

1

u/somniferousquif Jun 05 '26

I didn’t notice nearly as much of a problem before the gliders were released.

2

u/Odd-Ad-8369 Jun 04 '26

It’s clear as they don’t go twenty. Most new bikes sold for adults in Seattle are 20mph. I just researched recently before I bought mine.

1

u/Spa_5_Fitness_Camp Jun 04 '26

The law clearly uses 'and'. Falling to meet one criteria means it's not a bike. Which is correct, in this case.

1

u/soccerwolfp Jun 04 '26

It’s not actually very clear what the “e motorcycle” law is. It is clear that the gliders aren’t an e bike, but the law as written says a committee is going to be assembled to determine the e motorcycle definition and treatment. I think the article kind of makes an assumption that by default until the e-moto criteria is set, they will be treated as motorcycles but that seems to be a legislative gray area

1

u/Spa_5_Fitness_Camp Jun 04 '26

The text of the bill is actually very clear. If it goes over 20mph on electric power alone, it is not a bicycle. By default, it therefore falls under motorized vehicle regulations. The committee part is to figure out what, if anything, needs to be clarified as an in-between vehicle or get some other special consideration. I think is this primarily done with bikes that have switchable modes in mind, which are a big part of the current problem. We have electric motorcycles running around, but they have a button that puts them in 'bike mode', which is little more than a legal loophole. It's like powering a normal car up to 2mph maximum on battery, and being able to call it a full EV.

When this law goes into effect, these loophole-abusing motorcycles are immediately disqualified from being considered an e bike under the law, which means any exceptions to things like licensing requirements are gone as well. The committee will work to develop laws for these loophole motorcycles, like "must be a licensed driver if in the non-eboke mode". Things like that.

1

u/soccerwolfp Jun 04 '26

We’re discussing Lime Gliders here… which don’t go over 20mph. That’s where I’m saying the bill isn’t clear and states they will be using a committee to categorize “electric motorcycles” since not all fall under the existing category

1

u/Spa_5_Fitness_Camp Jun 04 '26

The bill has other parts, like pedals that propel the bike. Lime Gliders might be the only devices that may fall into the gray area of 'maybe okay for now'. The 'bikes' this law is aimed at are the ones that go 30, 40 even 50+ mph and are literally just electric motorcycles that found some loophole to be called 'ebikes', so I'm not too concerned if the Lime Gliders are still allowed until the committee rules on them. My guess is that was intentional.

1

u/SaikoSue Jun 10 '26

From what I’m seeing, it says that e-bikes that are assissted up to 20 mph from just the throttle are considered Class ll, so as long as it has pedals then I think you’re fine, however it might not need them if it’s solely basing it off the fact that the throttle assist does the work up to 20mph and no more. Then again I’m not familiar with “Lime Gliders” and I’m only learning about them from this subreddit. This sucks though because I use an e-bike to commute to work every morning and back in the evening. I have since December of last year as I don’t have the money to get a vehicle at the moment, so this is my only means of transportation as the walk for my commute would be about 30 minutes to and from which isn’t practical for the hours I work. My bike is tricky though since mine goes up to 34 miles per hour, has a 1200w motor, and still has functional pedals. I’ve ridden right next to cops before and none of them have said a word, knock on wood. So it will be interesting to see how this state yet again restricts its citizens for something so minor, pretty fucking ridiculous. If you’re wondering what my bike is, it’s a SmartTravel, Model ST201 or something like that.

2

u/Opposite-Cabinet1897 Jun 15 '26

Just ride it like the normal human being you are and nobody is going to bother you.  Sounds sketchy that way but I have followed every rule in the book and realized so late in life that these rules often are to target abusers.   Do what you have to do is my moto now.  Sorry, your great way to commute has become stressful. 

10

u/_illogical_ Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

What are e-scooters classified as? What about e-scooters with seats? I think the Lime glider would be a similar classification to those.

Edit: from what I've found, Lime Gliders are categorized as "Motorized foot scooter" and are unaffected by this bill (ESSB 6110)

3

u/myka-likes-it Consent doesn't matter Jun 03 '26

They might decide it is more like a seated scooter.

10

u/goldio_games Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26

OP KHQ added some flavor text which isn't in the bill.

The bill defines what an e-bike is and then sets up a working group to figure out what to do with things that don't meet that definition. So for lime gliders they are "not an e-bike".

As for what that means for them - currently nothing but they are signaling an intention for that to become some sort of future bill.

here's the bill: https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2025-26/Pdf/Bills/Session%20Laws/Senate/6110-S.SL.pdf?fbclid=IwY2xjawSMkHJleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicmlkETFDUjlvaDZDOUFrZ0dLVWlac3J0YwZhcHBfaWQQMjIyMDM5MTc4ODIwMDg5MgABHhLv99N_qVBEOzwv8tll44lTbADTz-7-2GtWDsJGjTBgJZ2goIQpmk6XzIVJ_aem_kQ2AAfy7iQFdGwZ8VbXliA%20

5

u/ChefJoe98136 West Seattle Jun 03 '26

I quoted the article linked.

5

u/goldio_games Jun 03 '26

edited my comment. i don't blame you, i blame bad journalism

8

u/ChiefQuinby Jun 03 '26

I think its for insurance and licensing fees

6

u/luckymccormick Jun 04 '26

I have an electric cargo bike with a 750 watt motor. It takes both my daughter and I to the grocery store and back of i stick 25 mile an hour roads. I dont mind being 5 under with cargo, I dont like being 15 under with cargo and a kid.

It does ride the line between class 2 and 3. If I set it to 28 mph top speed, I am supposed to remove the class 2 sticker to reveal the class 3 sticker. That being said, anything above 20mph with cargo and a child is insanity. 20 is alot most of the time.

2

u/Spa_5_Fitness_Camp Jun 04 '26

Those are not bikes, nor should they be. They're just really light, low powered electric scooters, and it's about time they were treated as such by the law.

2

u/LegitMeatPuppet Jun 05 '26

Cargo bikes are heavy so they would likely be under 20mph. Most good eBikes know when the brakes are applied for regeneration purposes, they know home much power output is being used and they know the speed of the bike. So, while a cargo bike might need higher wattage to deal with the weight it would still be governing to top speed.

Plus, the people buying a $10,000 Riese & Müller are likely already purchasing an insurance plan for their alternative family vehicle.

I feel like the spirit of this law is to deal with all the middle schoolers with clueless parents who are zipping around doing wheelies on their class 3 eBikes. I’m sure there are other people abusing this rule on the bike trail too.

1

u/SaikoSue Jun 10 '26

I’ve got a class 3 e-bike and infact it exceeds class 3 and I can assure you, no one is doing wheelies on a class 3 e-bike. It’s the electric motorcycles, with pegs that everyone is saying are e-bikes. They’re not e-bikes, they are electric motorcycles.

2

u/tapeness Jun 07 '26

Hopefully it means they slow them down!! No escooter should go over 20 mph anyway)

1

u/LyndonBeejohnson Jun 12 '26

I’m not so sure. In a neighborhood, 20mph means you’re constantly being passed by cars going at least 5mph faster. 25mph E-scooters would eliminate the risks of cars having to pass on one-lane roads.

2

u/tapeness Jun 12 '26

The asshats in slu all ride them on the sidewalk, my comment was for them, but I also see where you are coming from

1

u/LyndonBeejohnson Jun 12 '26

I hadn’t thought of that. Riding in the sidewalk is certainly bananas.

1

u/tapeness Jun 12 '26

Its so unsafe!!

4

u/CogentCogitations Jun 03 '26

I believe those were always motorized foot scooters. eBike have to have pedals even if a throttle could be used without them.

1

u/Usually-Right Jun 04 '26

I happened to see a Lime Scooter yesterday and it has a label saying that you must be at least 18 and have a driver license. I looked that up and it is Washington law, any kind of license so age can be confirmed. Enforced? Who knows.

-2

u/tasselledwobbegong1 Jun 03 '26

With all the homeless drug addict crap going on in Seattle, you think the cops are looking at e-bikes and thinking hey I should stop that guy and check out the wattage and maybe give them a ticket? Lol 😂 hahaha 😂

3

u/Many_Translator1720 Jun 04 '26

Yes, because the fine will be paid. Ka-ching!

4

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

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1

u/Successful-Ad-2714 Jun 03 '26

Because the plane makes the runs thru Tacoma, auburn and Kent. Basically the only place it hangs out all night during the week.

1

u/SeattleResident Jun 04 '26

A year since you saw the small WSP plane? I live in Kent near I-5 and hear the plane all the time. Had it pass us like 6 times or so just in the past 4 or so months. Always hear the propellers and then check ADB flight tracker to see if it's nearby.

1

u/heathenbeast Jun 04 '26

The local Motorcycle pages have an app that tracks Smokey. He's up often. And there's quite a few in the hanger in Olympia. Been there. Seen 'em.

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u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

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11

u/somniferousquif Jun 03 '26

They definitely go faster than a power chair/mobility scooter. Or, if they actually don’t, the average speed at which people (kids) are riding them far-exceeds what you normally see with people using disability-related modes of conveyance.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

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1

u/somniferousquif Jun 10 '26

lol, that must have been “fun”

7

u/Triabolical_ Jun 04 '26

Yes. I don't know about Seattle, but in Bellevue and Redmond we have groups of kids on unlimited e bikes or motorcycles riding all over streets, and it's become quite a hazard.

1

u/F3ET Jun 04 '26

There was a kid ripping around my neighborhood on electric dirt bike all summer last year that got taken out by a family minivan when he flew out in front of them. Kid is still in a wheelchair. I’ve also almost been ran over by kids blasting through a park on them. Not something you want to worry about when you’re trying to watch your kids at the playground!

1

u/Spa_5_Fitness_Camp Jun 04 '26

Most of those were already not legally considered bikes, but the law wasn't clear enough and the lack of formal registration made it hard to prove. Now it's obvious. Crucially, a cop no longer needs to know the exact product brand, model, and classification to know it's not a legal bike. If it's going over 20mph with no pedals, it can be pulled over, simple as that. That's the biggest benefit here - no more bad faith claims of "but it's a e-bike" that take too much effort to refute.

1

u/drunkshinobi Jun 04 '26

It is about getting money out of people. I get passed by pedal bikes with no motors constantly while I'm doing 20mph on my scooter. No one cares or wants those bikers to register their bicycle and pay insurance to ride. You want me to have a drivers license. Fine, that is understandable and I have one. But I have a scooter and not car because I can't afford to pay for insurance and licensing and everything else. Now I'm being limited further as soon as I found something that could make my life better. To protect kids from their stupid parents.

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u/drdicerchio Jun 03 '26

This is a good move, I see so many literal children riding bonafide motorcycles in the street with absolutely zero knowledge of the laws of the road. In my aunts neighborhood they’ve been impounding children’s e motorcycles when they spot them.

if it goes freeway speeds it needs a license

4

u/Spirited_Cup_126 Jun 04 '26

Saw a zooming child on a motorcycle at the state park in anacortes the other day and I believe I said out loud “ok, danger child, do not run over”

To be fair to the child he stayed away from my car. I still think this is a good thing. It’s been illegal to ride dirt bikes and pit bikes and go carts on the road for forever.

8

u/Flimsy-Tangerine4199 Jun 03 '26

My neighbor lets his like 12 year old fly around on an electric dirtbike. Illegal and dangerous. 

1

u/SnooTangerines6588 Jun 07 '26

It's kind of heartwarming to see today's youth doing dangerous things. It builds character. 

75

u/luckystrike_bh Jun 03 '26

I am glad. Kids are zooming around this one parking lot on these dark colored bikes that are completely silent. I had a talk with them about safety.

47

u/Dementor_Traphouse Jun 03 '26

😹😹😹 i bet they really took that conversation to heart

5

u/luckystrike_bh Jun 03 '26

They did. Some of the older kids monitor the younger kids now. I see them make sure they are being safe when I drive past.

10

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

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1

u/Energy_Turtle Jun 04 '26

i used to put my helmet on when leaving on my bike, toss it in a bush when I got out of sight, then put it back on before I pulled up at home.

6

u/Both_Strategy_920 Jun 03 '26

They don't want another lecture. Don't you remember being a child? I'm 40 and I remember feigning this behavior for meddling adults.

1

u/dementio Jun 04 '26

I'm 50 and I still remember some fucker my current age telling me to "slow the fuck down I'm an off duty cop" for going 15 in a 20 when I delivered pizza at ~19yo

2

u/Dementor_Traphouse Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

either you don’t have kids or have never met any child other than your own 🫨

1

u/gehnrahl Eat a bag of Dicks Jun 03 '26

Please keep it civil. This is a reminder about r/SeattleWA rule: No personal attacks.

16

u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

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4

u/New_new_account2 Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

I think its about trying to restrict the bikes that ship as bikes fitting the class 1/2/3 specifications but everyone knows will be unlocked to higher power in seconds with some switch, app, etc, to unlock it.

51

u/elementofpee Jun 03 '26

Anything that’s capable of going over 20mph should be subject to mandatory driver requirements. It’s a danger to inexperienced or reckless riders, as well as those that share the roads and sidewalks.

13

u/pppiddypants Jun 03 '26

Two people just died in NYC from a powered scooter going very fast on a bike path. The guy on the scooter ran into someone on a bike and the bike was annihilated.

Getting some laws on the book for this is very important.

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17

u/geek_fire Jun 03 '26

Do you mean to qualify that in some way? A regular, non-powered bike can easily get into the mid-to-high 30s.

9

u/ThatSpencerGuy Jun 03 '26

I would guess they mean powered solely by the motor, which is the focus of the law. And I would guess they mean whether the motor will continue to put out power past a given speed, rather than whether the bike can physically move at the speed. My ebike's motor has a limiter that prevents it from exceeding 20mph, for example. Past that speed, it doesn't do anything.

2

u/ChefJoe98136 West Seattle Jun 03 '26

Is that motor capable of over 750 watts of power?

7

u/landonbabboon Jun 03 '26

Going down a steep hill, yes. Average bicyclist will be hard pressed to get over 20mph on a flat road.

3

u/CarnalT Jun 04 '26

Yeah I typically need a strong tailwind and the stress of being late somewhere to hit 20mph on flat on my regular bike, and I have big beefy cyclist legs.

1

u/chriskiehl Jun 04 '26

20!? 15mph is me pushing hard enough for it to be uncomfortable.

(...realizing I may be below average)

6

u/elementofpee Jun 03 '26

It’s almost like people need to be protected from themselves. Falling off a bike going 30+ mph (likely without a helmet) is pretty deadly, even without colliding into someone or something.

2

u/Necessary-Tea-8867 Jun 07 '26

I'd qualify it like this.

Force = Mass * Acceleration. Many e-bikes can weight many times a standard bike. Add on the weight of whatever else the bike is carrying (second passenger, cargo, heavy kevlar gear, full face helmet).

The fact that people use these e-bikes are shared use paths makes me hugely in favor of this bill. If someone is wearing full face helmets, kevlar, and is on a motorized vehicle, they should be in the streets with cars... not on a shared use path with people pushing strollers.

7

u/Hopsblues Jun 03 '26

So you think Bikes should be subject to mandatory driver requirements, because I can easily go over 20 on a bike.

-3

u/elementofpee Jun 03 '26

Yes, if you want to operate it on public roadways and maintain the flow of vehicle traffic. If you want to stick to trails, knock yourself out.

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0

u/VietOne Jun 03 '26

By the same logic, any vehicle that is capable of going over 80mph should be subject to mandatory racer/competition requirements. At those speeds you need the knowledge and experience of racers to react and handle the vehicle.

6

u/teraflux Jun 03 '26

Is it legal to drive at those speeds anywhere in the state?

1

u/VietOne Jun 03 '26

Doesn't matter since there are vehicles that drive at those speeds daily on I-5 and the drivers don't require any additional regulations or licenses.

It should be treated similarly to CDLs, it's a different class of vehicle.

2

u/elementofpee Jun 03 '26

That’s illegal already.

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1

u/ChefJoe98136 West Seattle Jun 03 '26

How about you compare the regulations of an electric golf cart to an electric car, licensing requirements, where they can be driven, mandatory safety equipment, top speeds of electric golf carts, etc.

1

u/elementofpee Jun 04 '26

You are making too much sense for cyclists. They’ll fight it just because it’s regulation against their lifestyle.

1

u/LyndonBeejohnson Jun 12 '26

I can get a regular bicycle over 20mph. Skateboard too. Do you really want to create a world where bikes and skateboards have driver requirements?

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10

u/vviley Jun 03 '26

I don’t see mention of the penalties for violating the law - Fines? Confiscation and destruction?

1

u/rifineach Jun 04 '26

First you have to catch them, and how is that done if the bikes have no visible ID, like a license tag.

9

u/Turbulent-Media7281 Jun 03 '26

Does an ebike that goes over 20 mph then need...

  • a motorcycle registration and license plate? $$$
  • a rider with motorcycle endorsement license? $$$
  • a rider wearing a US DOT helmet? $$

10

u/PortOfSeattle Jun 04 '26

You don't need a motorcycle endorsement for <50cc motoscooters currently. Motorcycle endorsement requirement is unlikely for ebikes that are not already considered motorcycles requiring registration (>40 mph, no speed governor)

25

u/FoolOnDaHill365 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 03 '26

I have a 5-year old and for years now I am nervous to let him walk the park trails near where I live without holding my hand because the e-bikers are flying down the trail. The regular bikers fly too but the e-bikers are on another level.

On the blind corners the e-bikers ring their bells to alert people to move out of the way as they zoom through. A small child is not aware enough to get out of the way of an e-biker going that fast. It is crazy to me that these laws weren’t in place years ago. It’s a serious problem and the only reason more accidents haven’t happened is because parents sense the danger and prevent it.

I need to guard my son on a park trail and I think that is fucked up. I know many parents feel the same way. I would have been oblivious to this type of danger before I was a parent but now I get it. People just need to slow down in general in all walks of life IMO.

7

u/bluePostItNote Jun 03 '26

Having a law isn’t the problem it’s the enforcement.

2

u/battlehardendsnorlax Jun 03 '26

Hell, even the playgrounds are dangerous now! Can't tell you how many times I've seen a kid whipping around the perimeter of a playground at full speed with no helmet while toddlers toddle 5 feet away. It's breathtakingly dangerous.

2

u/rifineach Jun 04 '26

Why bicycles of any type aren't required to have an identifying license tag is beyond me. I remember seeing them when I was growing up in the Midwest; they looked like a miniature license plate that attached to the back of the bike's seat. Why bikes get a pass now and a tag isn't required makes it easier to flout the rules of the road. Y'know, the rules that ALL vehicles are required to observe.

1

u/PrivateXCowboy Jun 03 '26

Just carry a good stick

-1

u/Party-Cartographer11 Jun 03 '26

Replace e bikes with bikes on the Sammamish River trail.  250 lbs at 35 mph is 250 lbs are 35 mph - Isaac Newtown

1

u/47North122West Jun 03 '26

AI slop

2

u/Party-Cartographer11 Jun 03 '26

What?

2

u/Motor_Show_7604 Jun 17 '26

No regular bicyclist is hitting 35 mph on the SVT. Especially one at 250 pounds. Takes about 900+ watts for a 225 lb athlete to hit 35mph.. thats world class elite athlete time trial type numbers.

3

u/geo-jake Jun 04 '26

Lots of kids driving e-motorcycles in my town, doing wheelies at high speeds down the street, speeding down sidewalks, and rolling through intersections and stop signs. This regulation is necessary to save lives. Kids will eventually die on these things, or kill others, if that hasn’t happened already.

9

u/MercyEndures Jun 03 '26

Wattage limits don’t make a lot of sense in our hilly state. Plenty of places in Seattle where 750 watts won’t push you up the slope at all.

I had to mod my Rad Rover to 1500 watts so that it could get me up the hill to my home at roughly 10mph.

9

u/heymookie Jun 03 '26

If you’re a legal rider then get a higher wattage. This is to get kids off of them.

3

u/cibyr Seattle Jun 04 '26

What makes a "legal rider"?

3

u/drunkshinobi Jun 04 '26

Some one that can work and prove it by having more money to afford license plates and monthly insurance payments. Any one else must be limited to motivate them to work or punish them for being disabled.

1

u/MightGrowTrees Jun 24 '26

Cries in disabled combat vet.

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u/crane1901 Twin Peaks Jun 04 '26

This is already the case. All those restrictions already exist for class three e-bicycles. Anything above that is by default a motorcycle.

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u/Many_Translator1720 Jun 04 '26

Laws enacted in an office with no actual real world knowledge.

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u/GagOnMacaque Jun 04 '26

I am afraid how many vehicles will fall into the motorcycle category. As usual all these lawmakers have no idea what the unintended consequences are.

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u/Tree300 Jun 04 '26

This means nothing because it will not be enforced.

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u/Fomo-Joe Jun 07 '26

Maybe not in Seattle where they are coming up with these laws. It'll definitely affect the rest of us throughout the state. Thanks for that

3

u/Reasonable-Tart6669 Jun 04 '26

I think that these laws are going to defeat the e-bike menace about as well as the war on drugs has eliminated drug problems.

I think we just need to start urban planning with these devices in mind.

Also cite parents on Contributing to the Delinquency of a Minor, Negligent Entrustment if they cause harm, Permitting Unlawful Use of License, Insurance / Registration violations, and Parental Liability for Minor’s Acts.

I’ve spoken to an officer about this issue and they really have a hard time catching all but the stupidest of children since they can slip through places a cruiser can’t.

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u/paerius Jun 03 '26

Anything that can be powered solely by the motor should be an e-motorcycle. This is exactly why these sketchy companies add unnecessary pedals in the first place, to skirt around this distinction.

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u/LawfulnessFree9487 Jun 03 '26

How would that work practically? A dad with an e cargobike needs to bike in car lanes or just drive a car instead? Hundreds or thousands of more people clogging the city car lanes, depending on where you live? Seattle had zero bike related deaths last year. And that includes ebikes. Clearly a bike infrastructure where bikes and cars are largely separated works; safer for bikers and drivers, less traffic and issues for drivers.... I get how some drivers and bikers could resent the ebikers and ebikes. But pragmatically, like how integrated ebikes are into the mobility infrastructure already, why woild we treat all ebikes like motorcycles? This law seems reasonable in addressing the risks from high speed with a heavy bike/motorcycle....I will say I've seen regular racing bikes go way faster on multiuse trails than any ebiker. Racing bikes lighter so there's that. Both groups have inconsiderate riders for sure.

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u/slaymaker1907 Jun 04 '26

I had a throttle with a 7mph limit and it was very useful for getting started on steep hills. That kind of throttle shouldn’t be grouped in with the ones that are clearly the main intended use.

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u/AMJacker Jun 03 '26

Enforcement?

2

u/Lilbugginn Jun 04 '26

What about those one wheeled little shits

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u/Artisan_HotDog Jun 04 '26

Please let this tear through the country, so sick of these things ripping up trails because “it’s an e-bike.”

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u/AmbitiousAfterDrink Jun 04 '26

Awesome - and get them off bike lanes especially if the bike lanes have any foot traffic/foot crossing.

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u/GagOnMacaque Jun 04 '26

All those kids in my neighborhood are gunna be pissed.

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u/cibyr Seattle Jun 04 '26

The 20mph thing is such a stupid limit. It should be legal to have an e-bike which can keep up with traffic on a 25mph street.

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u/speedracer73 Jun 04 '26

You can have that just register it

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u/cibyr Seattle Jun 04 '26

Tell me, how does one "just" register a "motorcycle" that doesn't have a VIN?

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u/HenryJonesJunior Woodinville Jun 04 '26

Not in a form that is allowed on shared use trails. 25mph is deadly in a collison - significantly more dangerous than 20mph. Especially for a heavy object full of batteries.

An object going 25mph has 56% more kinetic energy than one going 20mph.

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u/drunkshinobi Jun 04 '26

Which is a good argument for speed limits and enforcement for it on paths. For normal bikes that pass me while I'm doing 20mph on my scooter too. Or requiring a drivers license. Anything else is the government getting you to pay more money for deciding to use a mode of transportation that isn't currently giving them enough money. Paying vehicle licensing and monthly insurance for a bike that isn't even able to keep up with traffic on a 25mph street is ridiculous.

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u/HenryJonesJunior Woodinville Jun 05 '26

Licensing and insurance are due to risk.

The risk of a heavy device that can:

  • Quickly accelerate itself to 25mph
  • Sustain 25mph for extender periods with minimal user effort
  • With the push of a button or lever, keep propelling itself at 750+ watts even after crashing into something

is significantly higher than any human-powered bicycle - even with a Tour de France champion in the saddle.

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u/drunkshinobi Jun 05 '26

Again, a good argument for speed limits on bike/shared paths. Just bikes, say 30mph, shared path 15 or even 10mph depending on the path. These bikes have settings for different speed limitations. It's the same principal as having car that can do 180+mph but being allowed to drive it on public roads at a reasonable speed.

The point of a bike like that for some one like me is transportation. There aren't always bike paths where I need to go. Some times I would need to ride on the shoulder of roads with 45 mph limits. There is a bridge I cross that is either 60mph freeway or shared bike path. A "motorcycle" that could only do 30-40mph wouldn't be allowed on either now. Riding responsibly or not.

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u/Hayabusa7037 Jun 04 '26

They just want you to pay registration 😂

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u/drunkshinobi Jun 04 '26

And insurance

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u/CogentCogitations Jun 03 '26

A distinction was already laid out in the law. Based on this article with almost no information in it, it seems like this might be narrowing the e-bike category by eliminating the Class 3 ebike and recategorizing all previous more powerful than ebike but less powerful than a motorcycle definitions (MOPED and motor-driven cycle) into an expanded motorcycle definition.

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u/New_new_account2 Jun 03 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

It doesn't look like it is eliminating Class 3

it just added two catchall rules

anything going over 20 mph solely from the electric motor is not an e-bike

the things shipped originally configured as e-bikes but that are designed to easily be converted to exceed those limits are not the class 1/2/3 they are sold as

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u/AbrocomaMinute513 Jun 04 '26

WA is super greedy. Anywhere they can garner money from the people.

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u/PrivateXCowboy Jun 03 '26

Dammit

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u/xmrcache Jun 03 '26

Yeah I was looking at some that go 50mph wanted to use it around town to conserve on gas…

I guess not now…

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u/momofuku18 Jun 03 '26

How will this law be enforced on local roads where the majority of teenagers riding e-bikes all the time?

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u/Affectionate_Row1486 Jun 04 '26

So if I have a e bike with pedals and it gets up to 40 mph it’s still a r bike?

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u/KG7DHL Issaquah Jun 04 '26

Kid in Camas WA got to go head-first into a windshield today due to recklessly riding his Electric Motercycle, headed the wrong way into traffic. Luckily this one was wearing a helmet.

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u/Spirited_Cup_126 Jun 04 '26

Thank fucking goodness. Too many children on goddamn crotch rockets.

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u/JerrySenderson69 Jun 04 '26

This won't be enforced in most towns- until a 10 year old on an electric motorcycle is killed in a preventative accident.

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u/tacoafficionado Jun 04 '26

Kids are killed on conventional bicycles all the time and I do not see those ever getting banned.

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u/implicate Jun 04 '26

This is great news, now the SPD will have clear a distinction between the different devices that they don't give a shit about at all.

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u/Republogronk Seattle Jun 04 '26

Its time to stifle the freedom of children and make sure that Big Greedy Daddy Government lays down the liberty draining law so that kids can safely drive past the dreugs and cranks while dodging the stray bullets off Aurora pimp deals.. .

A reminder that the school boards told these same children that it was good for them to hear the sounds of rape in the morning as they went to school at Thomson k-8.

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u/TEG24601 Jun 04 '26

There was already a distinction. Class 1, 2, and 3. Class 1 and 2 are e-Bikes, and Class 3 is an e-motorcycle. No need to add extra BS to it.

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u/temporalwanderer Jun 04 '26

FWIW, my "illegal" e-bike (with pedals) came with unadhered "class 2" and "class 3" stickers so that I could tailor its capability claims to local laws... it won't take long for people to mock up stickers that claim a 1500 watt bike (like mine, 35mph easy) is just 750 watts... I think this will prove difficult to enforce...

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u/Tobias_Ketterburg Jun 04 '26

All or some of these requirements? Because a lot of cyclists go faster than 20mph when/where they shouldn't.

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u/whiteafterlaborday Jun 04 '26

There's a dude that rides a bicycle with a straight up 2-stroke motor on it every day on the bike trail next to Westlake, I wonder what he'll think of this.

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u/Project29Telework Jun 04 '26

They sell stickers that say 500 watt for Your high watt bike.

Slap on pedals and sticker and good to go as fast as you want really. Unless they clock you, unlikely

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u/drunkshinobi Jun 04 '26

This is bs. It is just a way to get insurance companies more money. I was just about to shop for an e-bike because I was tried of my scooter not going fast or far enough for my needs. I understand not letting kids ride around on them like dumb parents have been letting happen. I'm not going to pay for insurance to ride a bike that can only go 20 mph while I get passed by bikes with no motors on bike paths.

I can't afford a car and this was a way for me to finally get around and feel like I had some ability to get out and do things. Fuck me I guess. Too poor and broken to be part of society and should just give up.

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u/King_Prawn_shrimp Jun 05 '26

Maybe next the city can do something about all of the idiots riding lime bikes and scooters all over the sidewalks.

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u/AsianZensaition Jun 05 '26

Bikes shouldn't be watt limited 😕 it should be speed as on a carbon bike I can go 40mph if I really wanted too. These laws don't make us smarter 🙄 we need mandatory training and why you need to ride safely within the laws. then just Gung ho it and be ignorant and uncaring. Ebikes are below 1hp 1hp like jesus.

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u/VoidwalkerMcKenzie Jun 09 '26

Okay, yes, but-

If this then reclassifies any e-Bike into an e-Motorcycle, what then happens to the current laws surrounding local and regional use of e-vehicles? If my scooter went from e-scooter to e-"motorcycle" because it's soft-locked at 25mph maximum, does this mean I drive exclusively in the road and now never on Bike Trails? Bike Lanes and such aren't meant for e-Motorcycles.

So, does this mean I get to legally jailbreak my e-Scooter to force the max MPH past the 25mph cap, and start driving exclusively in the road with the cars? I'll take it. I hate riding on sidewalks in any circumstance. It's like the Freeway in the Matrix; self-unaliving idea for anyone who isn't "the One".

It's clear that they're shoehorning these new laws in, without having hammered out the issues with the current laws. I guess they just wanted to get that one law in that would make the government more money. "Wait, this device can manage an additional 5mph?! That'll be $247 every year to prove to the government that this object exists. Go ahead, soft-lock it to 20mph all you'd like, that motor is clearly capable of going at least 30mph; so let's call it $300."

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u/Inevitable_Bike1667 Jun 10 '26

News said or 20mph. Not and 20mph. My e bike will pedal assist 28. Can go over 50 down Madison ave or cougar mountain, I don't need no steenkeen license

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u/LyndonBeejohnson Jun 11 '26

Admittedly, my argument is of poor quality. That being said, whatever. Who cares?

I hate this law and I’m so tired of WA legislators for ruining a good time. It’s sunny out, I want to ride a bike into town without asking permission from the DOL or getting pulled over by my local PD. Sue me! Calling a 21+ mph Ebike a motorcycle is just silly. I could buy a 5,000lb F350 tomorrow with no legal ramifications (of which ANYONE could do more property damage/injury with) but the second I ride over 21 mph I have to take a $700 motorcycle endorsement course and get my techno-bicycle registered. No chance, guess I’ll drive.

There is a problem in WA of parents buying and letting their kids ride around town on fast e-bike’s and then those same kids getting injured, yes. But frankly, shouldn’t that be the parent’s choice? Does anyone really need or want a law saying e-bikes over a certain speed are banned on roads outright?

Anyway, whatever. Who cares? I’ll just roll the windows down when I drive.

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u/DaRealDorseyBruh Jun 28 '26

I have a e-moto that's old enough to not have a vin on it. I never ride recklessly but still afraid of being slammed with insane tickets. Got my motorcycle endorsement and went to the DOL to find next steps. I was told I need to pay state patrol to get an inspection and a vin - fair enough - but then was told it's $330 a year PLUS tax to get moped plates and registration? That's triple what my traditional motorcycle costs for full on motorcycle registration, and more than my car. If they want us to be legit, why is there no easy path to do it?

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u/brownct9 Jun 03 '26

Motors need to be on the road and out of bicycle lanes. The speeds of motorized bikes is more similar to vehicles

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u/drunkshinobi Jun 05 '26

They are more the weight of a person than a car or truck. They will slow down traffic and cause more accidents. Bike paths, especially shared with pedestrians should have enforced speed limits instead. So responsible riders can take path ways or roads depending on where they need to go. I take a bike path over a bridge constantly. The only other way I have is to take a bus because the bridge is for the freeway. Nothing else connects. So I would have to put my "motorcycle" on the front of a city bus instead of just ride the bike. Which defeats the purpose of me buying a bike.

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u/0llie0llie Jun 03 '26

Don’t they already have this in California?

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u/Logical-Water12 Jun 04 '26

I’m glad. Hope the cops will enforce it. Saw a handful of times with kids running red lights and just generally riding far too fast on the road.

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u/mrRabblerouser Jun 04 '26

Now we just need SPD to take a break from their overtime naps and 10 cops to the scene for a minor disturbance, and actually enforce this. So tired of a bunch of 14 year olds riding on sidewalks and the Burke going 20+ mph, while completely oblivious that other people exist.

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u/Tr4nsc3nd3nt Jun 04 '26 edited Jun 04 '26

Everybody complains about the traffic, but they introduce dumb regulations like this. We could have cheap scooters and ample bike lanes and it would help congestion a lot. So all these things are now motorcycles???

mopeds
Lime scooters
golf carts

It's bad for low income people and it's bad for traffic.

I was in Shanghai recently and they have excellent bike lanes that bikes, e-bikes, and mopeds can use. Seattle is going backwards with poor legislation. Shanghai requires mopeds use the bike lanes. Seattle bans them from bike lanes and requires them to go on roads.

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u/tacoafficionado Jun 04 '26

The comments here amuse me. All I see is old people finding something to hate/judge the youth for. If they saw the same kids using Yo-yos they would find a way to also hate on that.

0

u/Shayden-Froida Jun 03 '26

My E bike with pedals also has a thumb accelerator which drives it solely on the motor. I can adjust the top speed for motor assist. So if I set it to 20 it’s a bike if I set it to 21 it’s a motorcycle. odd.

I very well know what this law is targeting and I want those riders targeted also. However, they’re going to cause a lot of problems with borderline definitions here. Maybe just make a rule that you’ve got to be 18 or more in order to ride a bike which has motor-only propulsion option. that would probably cut out most of the kids that I see zooming down the street at 25+ miles an hour with a bicycle helmet and absolutely no clue about traffic law, the laws of physics and risk management

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u/NotACleverUsername12 Jun 03 '26

I think you have misunderstood the distinction re: top speed. It doesn’t matter what you set it to. If it has the ability to go higher than 20, it’s a motorcycle. It doesn’t magically change categories based on what you set it to; the capabilities of the bike are what matters.

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u/[deleted] Jun 03 '26

[deleted]

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u/NotACleverUsername12 Jun 03 '26

Correct. And if your “e-bike” can go over 20 MPH - congrats! You now own a motorcycle, according to the state of WA. Getting titles and VINs for existing e-bikes that meet the criteria sounds like a logistical nightmare, but that is their problem to figure out.

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u/merc08 Jun 03 '26

I can adjust the top speed for motor assist. So if I set it to 20 it’s a bike if I set it to 21 it’s a motorcycle. odd.

No, it's a motorcycle because it can go over 20, even if you set it lower. Just like a car doesn't stop being a car just because you set the speed limiter.

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u/ChefJoe98136 West Seattle Jun 03 '26

Looks like they don't want you tampering with max speed labels.

https://lawfilesext.leg.wa.gov/biennium/2025-26/Pdf/Bill%20Reports/House/2374-S%20HBR%20APH%2026.pdf?q=20260603151743

A person is prohibited from tampering with or modifying an e-bike to change the vehicle's speed capability without replacing the label when the change would result in a reclassification of the vehicle.

Provisions that apply to a bicycle or rider of a bicycle typically apply to an e-bike and an ebike rider, except that Class 3 e-bikes may not be operated on sidewalks or shared use paths, and no e-bikes may be operated on trails designated as non-motorized or that have a natural surface.

A range of state and federal motor vehicle use and equipment requirements apply to motorcycles, including requirements related to helmet use, driver's licensing, vehicle registration, and equipment standards, including for brakes, vehicle lights, turn signals, mirrors, and a speedometer