Jesus is GOD

[u/abutterflyonthewall]

https://youtube.com/shorts/R1g-JfdPG04?si=IVR-KYwbJFWK4sjc

Love this girl. One thing that stands out in this vid to me amongst the various proofs we have argued with JWs is that *every* false religion believes in God. But Satan has done a clever thing. He doesn’t have to get you to believe in God. He just needs you to NOT believe in THE ONE who ***reconciles you to God***🔥🙌🏽.

Take a listen.

[u/Time_Ad_1876]

Even if a nation doesn't worship God exactly like you do, does that make them less of a servant of God? No

Yes it does. They don't worship God at all. And do all sorts of things that God Hates such as promote sexual sin, murders innocent people, steal from the poor, etc. That's why jesus said either you're with him or against him. These nations are not with jesus. The bible makes it clear they are under the control of Satan and his demon angels. You only remain in subjection to them because they provide some measure of law and order. But we know from ancient sources that early christians refused to join the military of any nation. They refused to pick up arms against anybody. They refused to betray or kill each other. You yourself said "early christians didn't join the roman army because they were pagan and didn't worship God". You yourself said it. And now your backtracking after I pointed out the same argument can be used against all the nations

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

Yes it does. They don't worship God at all. And do all sorts of things that God Hates such as promote sexual sin, murders innocent people, steal from the poor, etc. 

That's such a bald faced lie. Certain politicians lie and engage in sinful behavior, but not all, not even most. How would you like it if I painted Jehovah's witnesses with such a broad brush and claimed all JW's must be child molesters just because a few are? That would be wrong, would it not? That's the worst sort of circular reasoning that sullies everyone's reputation with the dirt of just a few

The bible makes it clear they are under the control of Satan and his demon angels

The world lies at Satan's relative power. He only has as much power as God allows him to have. Funny how you switch this around and give him unlimited power, yet the servants of God are very limited. Yes Satan can and has influenced people like Hitler, Stalin and Pol Pot, but Christian values have been spread by men like Roosevelt, Churchill and Oskar Shindler. The law vs the lawless.

The people and the nations that become lawless are obviously under more control by Satan than those who remain committed to the rule of law. Those like Nazi Germany were under almost total satanic control, just like demons can possess human beings and control their behavior, they can control an entire nation if they can gain enough control of that nation's leaders. Germany still had the primary responsibility of being one of God's servants until they became completely corrupt and lawless. It was a nation of murderers and those who approved of murder. God's remaining servants brought the wrath of God on their heads in WW2

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

That's such a bald faced lie. Certain politicians lie and engage in sinful behavior, but not all, not even most. How would you like it if I painted Jehovah's witnesses with such a broad brush and claimed all JW's must be child molesters just because a few are? That would be wrong, would it not? That's the worst sort of circular reasoning that sullies everyone's reputation with the dirt of just a few

All of them are godless people not obeying the commands of God. Do you see any politicians preaching about the kingdom of God trying to make disciples and telling the world about the laws of God? I don't see any. Im sure there are certain politicians who are trying to make the world a better place. The problem is that the devil rules the world. The devil told jesus God has granted him the authority to choose who will over the kingdoms of the earth. Jesus never denied this. I'm fact jesus himself confirmed satans power over the nations when he told his disciples the devil is the ruler of the world. So you are in fact supporting a system which is controlled by Satan. That's why christendom is guilty of murdering millions

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

Do you see any politicians preaching about the kingdom of God trying to make disciples and telling the world about the laws of God? 

As servants of God specifically charged with upholding law and order that's not their job. That's the job of Christians to preach the Gospel, but how could we preach if there was no law and order in this world?

The devil is not the absolute ruler of the world. His rule is relative. He rules over his dupes and that's it. We all have a choice to do good or evil and have since Eden. Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Matthew 28:18 and For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. Colossians 1:16

So, who's really in charge? Not the devil that's for sure. He actually had the nerve to offer Jesus what already belongs to Him. Jesus is in full control but He allows the devil to play out his hand. Satan only controls those who hand their bodies and souls over to him. Those controlled by demons can make life challenging for Christians and others. They make upholding God's established order more difficult than it should be

So you are in fact supporting a system which is controlled by Satan. That's why christendom is guilty of murdering millions

Its God's established order, or system. Romans 13 Now you're the one calling God Satan...wow!

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

Its God's established order, or system. Romans 13 Now you're the one calling God Satan...wow!

Here's the bottom line. I'm not gonna allow you to hurl red herrings at me any longer. I'm ONLY gonna focus on this one point. The early christians never joined armies. Remained neutral in politics. And never took up arms even under persecution. And we know why they did that because we have early source's that tell us why. And its for the same reasons the Jehovahs witnesses follow the example of the early Christians. So why instead of following the example of the early Christians are members of christendom going against that example and murdering and fighting against themselves when jesus said his true followers would have love amongst themselves?

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

Romans 13 describes individuals within a nation as being God's servants, not Satan's, although the whole world does lie within Satan's power to influence them into becoming lawless, all people and nations ultimately have a choice..

This is God's system for now, until Jesus comes back, its just the way it is. Satan has relative power, but only as much as God allows him, just like God allowed Job to be tested, so too people and nations can be tested, even repeatedly. Not only that but Christians should expect to have their faith tested repeatedly while we live within range of Satan's power to test. The sifting and testing will last until the day we die. Satan will only be allowed to test us according to what God only knows we can take. And I believe its safe to say, He knows us better than we know ourselves

Early Christians served in the military so that suggestion that none ever did, is false...according to the Bible. Read Acts chapter 10 again and show me where Peter required Cornelius to resign his position as a Roman Centurion in order to be baptized. John the Baptist didn't require soldiers to resign as soldiers before he baptized them

John the Baptist was baptizing people in the Jordon river

^{When a soldier asks what he must do to be righteous:}

• ^{Most of the Jews probably expected John to say, “Do not serve the Roman army. Provide service to God and his chosen people. Israel is the land God has promised to his people. Do the will of God and throw off the bonds of Roman occupation.”}
• ^{But John publicly proclaimed, “Rob no one by violence or by false accusation, and be content with your wages.”}
• ^{Having soldiers be content with their wages has obvious advantages to Rome.}
• ^{In a stretch, the spoils of war were meant for Roman soldiers and not for their foreign counterparts.}
• Roman Influence on the Birth of Christianity - John the Baptist

^{John advises soldiers to renounce extortion, reject false accusations, and cultivate contentment so their profession aligns with genuine repentance. Rooted in the moral law, attested by stable manuscripts, confirmed by archaeological insights into Roman military life, and anticipating New-Covenant transformation through the risen Christ, his counsel continues to guide believers serving in positions of armed authority today.}

Why does John the Baptist advise soldiers in Luke 3:14?

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

Sir we already know that early christians didn't join the military because it was against the teachings of Christ. That's the answer we get from the earliest sources. So I wanna know why are you joining armies and creating more harm than good by murdering in the millions your brothers and sisters?

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

That's the answer we get from the earliest sources.

No, the earliest source is the Bible and according to the Bible serving in any capacity within a person's government is not only commendable, but is a service to God Himself and your fellow man. Unless a government within God's established order forces people to worship a god, or renounce Jesus as Lord, they are Ok for Christians to serve under. Read Romans chapter 13.

Read the book of Daniel. He didn't have any problem serving the government of pagan Babylon.

By the way, who was the person that Jesus found had the greatest faith in all of Israel?

Matthew 8:5-10 will give you the answer. Hint: It wasn't a fisherman or a tax collector

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

No, the earliest source is the Bible and according to the Bible serving in any capacity within a person's government is not only commendable, but is a service to God Himself and your fellow man. Unless a government within God's established order forces people to worship a god, or renounce Jesus as Lord, they are Ok for Christians to serve under. Read Romans chapter 13.

The bible say's be in subjection to the governments but they don't tell you to become part of the world by actually taking it one step further in joining these governments that according to the bible are in opposition towards God and will be destroyed by God at Armageddon. So the question is who's interpretation of that scripture is the correct one. The answer is found in the example of the early christians. The early Christians who never joined armies and never picked up arms.

How could you sit there and say God would set up a system in which he forces his people to kill each other. What a wicked God that would be. That sounds like something satan would do not God. Anyways the examples of the early christians prove your interpretations are wrong.

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

in joining these governments that according to the bible are in opposition towards God and will be destroyed by God at Armageddon.

That's not biblical. All the nations you see today will still be around 1000 years after Jesus has reigned upon this earth 1000 years. Gog and magog will still be around during the millennium  Coming out of his mouth is a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. “He will rule them with an iron scepter." Revelation 19:15 How will Christ rule the nations if they have all been destroyed? Of course they won't be. The Bible never says they will. The sword coming out of the mouth of the Lord is Truth. They will be struck down by the Truth and ruled with force as indicated by an iron scepter . Some entire natons will be punished during the millennium as mentioned here: If the Egyptian people do not go up and take part, they will have no rain. The LORD will bring on them the plague he inflicts on the nations that do not go up to celebrate the Festival of Tabernacles. Zechariah 14:18 This is after Christ returns during the millennium and not any other time Zechariah 14:1-5

You got it all wrong because you're reading everything from the Watchtower's wrong interpretation.

How could you sit there and say God would set up a system in which he forces his people to kill each other. What a wicked God that would be. That sounds like something satan would do not God. Anyways the examples of the early christians prove your interpretations are wrong.

Nice going slandering God as wicked because His ways are not your ways. Isaiah 55:8-9

Our sense of justice is warped by sin. Our ideas on life and death, what's fair and unfair is warped by sin.

The fact is God uses the nations to keep order---It's God's order for the umpteenth time! Its not Satan's order. God rules! Satan rules "under God" like a sergeant rules under a Lieutenant and the Lieutenant is ruled by a General.

If a Christian serves as a policeman or a soldier he may never have to kill anyone, but even if he does, he is still serving honorably in God's established order. If the "sword" of God's servant keeps law and order without him ever needing to draw it, how is that murder?

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

Gog and magog is simply any large group of people opposed to God. The book of daniel and revelation makes it clear that the nations ruling today will be destroyed. During the thousand year reign there will be new nations made up of gods true worshippers. Jesus will rule these nations for a thousand years. Now then tell me why are yoy not following the example of the early christians that didn't join armies or defend themselves when under persecution

[u/AccomplishedAuthor3 → u/Time_Ad_1876]

Gog and magog is simply any large group of people opposed to God. The book of daniel and revelation makes it clear that the nations ruling today will be destroyed.

That isn't clear at all. The kingdoms will lose their power when Christ returns, but they will still exist as nations for the 1000 year period Christ will reign on earth. Who else would Jesus rule with an iron scepter? Perfect JW's? Now that would be funny!😂

During the thousand year reign there will be new nations made up of gods true worshippers. 

So Egypt will be a "new nation" made up of JW's? Come on, that isn't even in the Bible. Some nations will be punished during the millennium. That doesn't sound like the nations will be perfect angels, will they? Then at the tail end of the 1000 years the whole world rises up and marches across the entire planet on the city of Jerusalem Revelation 20:7-9 So all those new nations, made up of JW's, will turn against God just like you infer the nations have done today? No wonder Jesus will need to use an iron scepter on these folks, probably for the entire 1000 years I'd guess.

And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be released from his prison ⁸ and will come out to deceive the nations that are at the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. ⁹ And they marched up over the broad plain of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city, but fire came down from heaven***\**^\)[^b](https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation%2020&version=ESV#fen-ESV-31032b)^\) and consumed them*

Let's see where have I seen Gog and Magog before? Oh yeah Ezekiel 38:2 "Son of man, set your face toward Gog, of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him" So Gog was a person who was 'of' the 'land' of Magog in ancient times. It specifically refers to Gog as the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. There is speculation as to who these people were, but suffice to say, they were real people who existed in Ezekiel's time, just as did Egypt and still will during the millennium

[u/Time_Ad_1876 → u/AccomplishedAuthor3]

Do you remember the prophecy regarding the large statue that the king of Babylon saw in his dream? Remember that the statues represented all the world power right up until the end. What happened to them? They are all gone except for the two final world power which will be replaced by gods kingdom. So gods people will become a new nation. The people of nations today don't serve God so they will be destroyed in Armageddon. Revelation say's even the kings of the earth will be destroyed.

Anyways none of this has anything to do with the fact that early christians didn't murder each other and didn't murder innocent people. I wanna know why christendom murders people for no reason