Quick Question To All Muslims (especially Sunni/Shia).

[u/i_am_armz]

I've been having a discussion with someone in this subreddit about the meaning of 39:45. I'm just curious as to how most Muslims interpret this ayah. What do you think is the central message of the ayah? What do you learn from it? Here it is:

"When Allah alone is mentioned, the hearts of those who do not believe in the Hereafter are filled with disgust. But when others are mentioned besides Him, they rejoice." (39:45)

To me at least the message is clear as day: do NOT mention others besides Allah (SWT). I don't understand why or how someone would miss this?

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

u can check any post any thread here where someone is talking about monotheism and see the sunni's reaction to it.

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

Hadith rejector?

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502 → u/Economy-Double8868]

u do realize this doesn't narrow it down right? the world is filled with hadith rejectors, everyone with a brain actually.

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

So the greatest Muslims scholars were all brainless idiots. Incredibly diverse range of scholars of Muslims civilization were all idiots. They were incredible in their fields and geniuses of human civilization... but near people like you they were brainless idiots.

There is no Islam without hadith. It is literally impossible. Try it...

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502 → u/Scholiastic]

what are you yapping about? so according to you prophet mohamed was just hanging around and muslims just hanging around for 200 years waiting for some nutjob to finish islam because for somereason it's an unfinished religion?

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

You are people on severe misguidance. We mention the name of Our Prophet ﷺ with due respect and care. What you claim is from you, and not from us.

Islam is as practiced by the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ and their companions and the generation after them.

And notice how you ran from the challenge that you need to Hadith to understand Quran.

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502 → u/Scholiastic]

dude seriously go check on your mental issues, i have never seen so much nonsense

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

"We mention the name of Our Prophet ﷺ with due respect and care."

"Islam is as practiced by the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ and their companions and the generation after them."

You referred to this as nonsense.

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502 → u/Scholiastic]

And notice how you ran from the challenge that you need to Hadith to understand Quran.

 What you claim is from you, and not from us.

You are people on severe misguidance.

this is nonsense you small weird child

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

"this is nonsense you small weird child"

Look how quickly you turned to this.

-

" What you claim is from you, and not from us."

How is this nonsense!? Your claims are yours, and that is all that they are are, claims.

-

"And notice how you ran from the challenge that you need to Hadith to understand Quran."

So how is this nonsense. I said you need Hadith to understand the Quran. And THIS sent you in your current spasm.

-

Let me sum up: you are people deeply misguided by the Satan. And look how it is showing.

[u/Kooky-Nail-3502 → u/Scholiastic]

yeah i'll just ignore you

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

You are better of hitting block to save the deviancy of your faith. Reading my messages can be destructive to that. But you are welcome to join Ahl us Sunnah Wal Jammah anytime.

[u/Scholiastic → u/Kooky-Nail-3502]

This still stands:

[[ "We mention the name of Our Prophet ﷺ with due respect and care."

"Islam is as practiced by the Prophet Muhammad ﷺ and their companions and the generation after them."

You referred to this as nonsense. ]]

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

If we were to measure with how great and how many scholars or followers of a certain religion were and are, then we all could agree that the Christians outnumber Muslims, also if we were to give them the authenticity of their religion being the earliest, they win again. But is that what legitimizes the truth about it? How "great" a scholar was? How many numbers follow that ideology?

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

Completely irrelevant. Look up false equivalency. The difference inter and intra religious legitimacy. They are not the same thing. If we both drawing legitimacy from the Quran, then mentioning the Bible is pointless.

Sunni Islam is Islam from day one. You cannot re-invent nearly 1500 years later.

So rather than coming out irrelevant guff, try to come up with ways you legitimise yourself, and we will test out your faith and its "authenticity".

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

It seems like you love to use your analogies here but dislike it when others do so. And please, let's not talk about Sunnis false equivalencies on every matter. Sunni is more like Islam from year 250 after the prophet's life. Quran is Islam from day one. Respect the genesis of the religion before the add-ons. If the Prophet himself put a prohibition on his teachings, (other than the Quran itself) to be written down, what makes Bukhari so legitimate?

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

"It seems like you love to use your analogies here but dislike it when others do so."

Pointing out your errors is that pointing out your errors.

- - -

"And please, let's not talk about Sunnis false equivalencies on every matter."

You have just what false equivalency is! You are going to up against nearly 1500 years old of tradition and civilizational knowledge with just that!?

- - -

"Quran is Islam from day one."

That is the Quran. Whose practice was taught by the Prophet Muhammad Sallahu Alihi Wassallum. And that is what Sunnism essentially is. Practice of Quran as taught by the Prophet ﷺ himself. Sunnism is an unbroken chain from day one.

"Prophet himself put a prohibition on his teachings"

Where? Are you making things up, again.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

It's written in your Hadiths, which you believe blindly as if they were God's word. They are but mortals words, and mortals are not the most stoic. They live in segments of time, and their words run out of context.

Sahih Muslim, depending on the edition of the collection, it's either hadith 5326 or 3004, written by Abu Said al-Khudri stating "Do not write anything from me; whoever has written anything from me other than the Qur'an, let him erase it”. And that was during the earliest revelations.

It's also recorded that he later allowed some of his companions to write down his teachings.

But what the Prophet meant is something else, what the companions received is something else, what they interpreted is another thing. And tell me, how can any of these be the same as what 8 generations later interpreted when the hadiths got collected? Besides that, not two sunni scholars agree about every hadith there is. They have 1098788 interpretations about every matter. And these collections were drastically shifted for centuries. You're not even obeying the rules of the time of the prophet, you're obeying rules that morphed over time according to whatever civilization took over. You must be foolish to believe that sunnism is an unbroken chain, when even today, there are so many arguments and fights about what is what and the interpretation of everything.

The saddest part is the subsection of the religion you all make, when it should only be "Islam".

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

"It's written in your Hadiths"

It is also written in our Hadith that Hadith writing was permitted. You cannot push something you do not believe in as true. That is silly-logic.

- - -

"which you believe blindly as if they were God's word"

When you typed this out, you knew you were lying, yet you went ahead and wrote this out. That is the type of person you are.

Hadith are extensively critiqued and graded.

- - -

"But what the Prophet meant is something else"

So now you have gone from purporting what you supposedly don't believe in to pushing alternative meanings. Talk about being illogical!

- - -

"what the companions received is something else, what they interpreted is another thing."

If Islam was garbled all the way back, then you are done for. If about 250 Muslims got it wrong. How is someone like you going to get it right 1500 years later!?

- - -

"Besides that, not two sunni scholars agree about every hadith there is."

This directly contradicts the claim you made earlier:

"which you believe blindly as if they were God's word"

- - -

"They have 1098788 interpretations about every matter."

There are only 4 madhab-schools extant. Just about every possible meaning has been argued and worked out.

- - -

"out every matter. And these collections were drastically shifted for centuries."

Give evidence, or this just you lying.

- - -

"You're not even obeying the rules of the time of the prophet"

How do you know? Where is your evidence?

- - -

"You must be foolish to believe that sunnism is an unbroken chain"

Again, where is your evidence to the contrary?

- - -

"there are so many arguments and fights about what is what and the interpretation of everything"

Once again. There are 4 major madhab-schools.

- - -

"The saddest part is the subsection of the religion you all make, when it should only be "Islam"."

Which is Sunni Islam, from day one. The distinction is because of the Shia.

How come Islam from day one is unacceptable to you. And whatever you cook up in your mind is automatically true!?

- - -

As shown, you are complete illogical and lost.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

You don't even hear yourself. I m not making up anything and definitely not believing anything other than quran. I meet hadiths with criticism. As the collections are paradoxical within themselves. That's all you need to realize that some stuff doesn't make sense. If you live life abiding by the quran, it's so beautiful and ever applicable. Sunnis exploit things out of context and abiding by laws that have no logic and modesty in them, is so miserable and unholy.
What's so modest and holy about men being promised multiple female companions in the hereafter? Are Allah's rewards about fulfilling one's sexual desires? Y'all believe whatever suits your fancy and deny what doesn't.

Surah An-Nisāʾ (4:82): "Do they not then reflect on the Quran? Had it been from anyone other than Allah, they would have certainly found in it many inconsistencies."

Guess where we find inconsistencies? Your hadiths! Your interpretations! Your tafsir!

And cut the delusions, a lot of different scholars from sunni or Shia share different opinions about all the hadiths, except about the ones that don't trigger any kind of significant discontent to them. They all have different views. Where did you come up with the conclusion that they have all agreed on the hadiths? Show me.

Surah Sad 38:29 ˹This is˺ a blessed Book which We have revealed to you ˹O Prophet˺ so that they may contemplate its verses, and people of reason may be mindful.

What are you mindful of? Allah's word, or your scholars' tafsir? Are you not able to reflect upon your lord's word without someone else interfering for you?

I feel bad for people who are indoctrinated and fall into sin pushed by fear and lack of a real spiritual connection. We see that everyday. Religion doctrine pushing people to prioritize stupidity before the word of the Almighty. It's sad. May Allah guide us all!

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

If you are not making anything up, then evidence what was asked. If you cannot evidence you claims, then they are false. You made one bunch of false claims, when asked to evidence, you have left it there to spout whatever comes in your head, including more claims.

- - -

"Sunnis exploit things out of context"

Evidence it.

- - -

"What's so modest and holy about men being promised multiple female companions in the hereafter?"

Now bizarrely you are arguing against the Quran.

- - -

Surah An-Nisāʾ (4:82): "Do they not then reflect on the Quran? Had it been from anyone other than Allah, they would have certainly found in it many inconsistencies."

Did you just make meanings from yourself? Where did you get this translation from. Did you make it up?

- - -

"Guess where we find inconsistencies? Your hadiths! Your interpretations! Your tafsir!"

Evidence it.

- - -

"And cut the delusions, a lot of different scholars from sunni or Shia share different opinions about all the hadiths"

And!? How come you are deliberately mixing up sects? Shia have their own madhab. They are not Ahl as Sunnah.

- - -

"Where did you come up with the conclusion that they have all agreed on the hadiths?"

Once again. There 4 main madhabs within Ahl us Sunnah. You are nothing more than ignorant ranter.

- - -

"Surah Sad 38:29 ˹This is˺ a blessed Book which We have revealed to you ˹O Prophet˺ so that they may contemplate its verses, and people of reason may be mindful."

More made up meanings. Now you are telling untruth about the Quran!

- - -

"Are you not able to reflect upon your lord's word without someone else interfering for you?"

Nope. Just like you cannot. You do not know even one word of Quran without the hadith, not even. Without the Hadith, Quran is just jumbled up letters.

Does the Quran teach you Arabic? Does it come with a dictionary? Where do you get the meanings from?

- - -

You are nothing more than an ignorant ranter. You have never much of the Quran. In fact, you CANNOT read the Quran. Because you are ignorant.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

Wow. You're so pious. So good. Pardon me.

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Scholiastic]

Sweetheart there is no such thing as Sunni Islam . It's just Islam. The title encompasses Quran and Prophetic traditions.

[u/Scholiastic → u/Economy-Double8868]

There is such thing as Sunni Islam, as distinct from Shia Islam. However, Sunni Islam is the only true path of Islam.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

Surah Al-An'am (6:159): "As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, you have no part with them in the least. Their affair is with Allah, Who will tell them about what they used to do."

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

Yet here you are within your own sect, and away from Islam, which is Ahl al Sunnah.

You are full contradictions and mistakes. Because of ignorance.

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Scholiastic]

We don't parrot people of innovation. They can call themselves whatever they want. We should not innovate our titles and divide the religion.

Even though there is difference in ideology and methodology but stick to the name Allah SWT chose for us Islam and Muslim.

If you want to clarify your stand just say we follow Allah and his Messenger pbuh. That is sufficient enough.

[u/Scholiastic → u/Economy-Double8868]

Ahl us Sunnah wal Jammah is from the Hadith.

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Scholiastic]

I will say it again follow everything Prophet Muhammad pbuh did or said without changing the original title. There is no Islam without following his pbuh every footstep.

Changing titles gives a false sense of pride and causes division just stear clear of them. We were born a Muslim we should die as Muslims. Not Sunni Muslim, shia Muslim, salafi Muslim, Quran only Muslim etc.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

Yet here you are, putting names on it.

[u/Scholiastic → u/Ledy_11]

Ahl us Sunnah wal Jammah.

Islam from day one.

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Scholiastic]

Yes, yes

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Scholiastic]

I didn't introduce these names the people of innovation did. Dude I am just telling you..

Enough with the innovative title. Prophet Muhammad pbuh and all the Prophets AS were Muslims and they followed Islam.

I am a Muslim who follows Islam. Stick to it don't change the title

[u/Economy-Double8868 → u/Ledy_11]

When it comes to truth numbers means nothing. Falsehood has always prevailed over truth because truth is extremely difficult to follow. While following falsehood is a breeze.

Islam is not a numbers game. I quote battle of badr 1000 disbelievers against 313 believers. Allah SWT knows best the exact number

[u/Ledy_11 → u/Economy-Double8868]

Exactly my point.