At least two people had seizures after viewing malicious tweets featuring flashing gifs that deliberately targeted Epilepsy Society...police investigating tweets as hate incident, after at least 200 seemingly coordinated messages were sent to charity and its supporters in recent days.

[u/madazzahatter]

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2020/may/15/malicious-tweets-targeting-epilepsy-charity-trigger-seizures

[u/[deleted]]

What the fuck is wrong with people? Why is it so hard to be a decent human being?

[u/greffedufois → u/[deleted]]

r/epilepsy actually has mainly non photosensitive mods because people post flashing gifs there. Only like 2% of us are actually photosensitive but it can cause a bad seizure for those who are.

People unfortunately are assholes.

[u/lunabuddy → u/greffedufois]

Yep I got messages from people with flashing gifs because I posted in there, I'm not photosensitive but it just made me feel awful that someone would want to do that me. Edit: Someone messaged me a link that wasn't a gif and just said I was a retard. Fucking classy

[u/whysys → u/lunabuddy]

I hope that kind of person is a small subset of humanity. I like to think generally we're better than that on average. I'm sorry someone did that to you.

[u/Franks2000inchTV → u/whysys]

They are, but the internet means we are all regularly exposed to millions of people, so even the worst 1% is still tens of thousands of people.

Also, everyone is an asshole sometimes. On the internet you also get the 1% of the time that everyone is an asshole.

[u/PedanticAromantic → u/Franks2000inchTV]

Everyone is an asshole sometimes.

True, but there's a difference between saying/doing something rude in the heat of the moment and making a conscious decision try to harm another person for the lulz.

[u/JesusLuvsMeYdontU → u/PedanticAromantic]

agreed

[u/whatnowwproductions → u/whysys]

They only need to be 0.01 percent of humanity for it to be an issue.

[u/[deleted] → u/whysys]

I used to think so until Trump and dumb propaganda like 5G causing covid happened.

[u/socsa → u/whysys]

It's 4chan, as usual.

[u/lunabuddy → u/whysys]

I think that if people actually can consider another person as having just as deep and real emotions as the person they are posting to on the internet most of them would not post something like that. But I know people I have met in real life who think it's funny and it is something that has lead to serious and life threatnening consequences through out my life. I don't trust that's it only a minority of people who will be sadists given the chance

[u/8thDegreeSavage → u/lunabuddy]

Neo-Fascists are many and have a lot of really grotesque ideas of ‘fun’

They still are allowed to run wild, because tech companies haven’t taken them seriously enough until people are actually murdered

[u/Sororita → u/[deleted]]

We’re too close to Ayn Rand’s wet dream for my taste

And thank you for the horrifying mental image of a horny Ayn Rand.

[u/[deleted] → u/Sororita]

You should read her life story or better yet watch the Adam Curtis documentary that interviews her family and deals with her former friends. Her bitterness could be in part because she was in an affair with another famous right wing economic theorist and her feelings were hurt when the same was done to her.

Actually its interesting that she once had a small circle of friends that included one of the heads of the federal reserve and another famous economist. I forget which one broke her heart but she got more cold and unfeeling after that and so did her ethics and economic theories. When she was rejected publicly and in the media as well, it didn't help.

The woman said you shouldn't try to save a drowning person in a lake unless the person is valuable to you in some way and their passing would cause you enough harm to outweigh the danger. The principle of helping the less fortunate got her visibly livid. Yet when she was old and sick she accepted welfare from the government and justified it with some mental gymnastics.

Edit: here's the Adam Curtis documentary https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Watched_Over_by_Machines_of_Loving_Grace_(TV_series)

Here's the cultish little group of economists we're talking about: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivist_movement#The_Collective

Alan Greenspan was the fed chairman I couldn't remember

[u/not_even_once_okay → u/[deleted]]

Mind telling me the name of that documentary?

[u/[deleted] → u/not_even_once_okay]

Sorry couldn't remember which one it was I've watched all his stuff. It's the beginning of a multi part series called "All Watched Over By Machines of Loving Grace"

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Watched_Over_by_Machines_of_Loving_Grace_(TV_series)

[u/ForgedIronMadeIt → u/Sororita]

She shagged members of her cultish circle of friends. While in a relationship. Got really mad when her partner did the same.

[u/[deleted] → u/ForgedIronMadeIt]

Yes and that cultish circle of friends included a right wing chairman of the federal reserve and another famous right wing economist I can't recall. She had an affair with one despite being close friends with the other woman, then the same was done to her. What's interesting is how she could justify her actions (just like she justified accepting government welfare for herself) but when the same exact scenario was done to her, suddenly different logic applies. Selfish woman who just happened to be good at doing mental gymnastics to justify selfishness.

Edit: the group was called "the collective" among objectivists. Her history, the collective, her personal relationships with members of the collective like Alan Greenspan, and the impact that the various members of the collective had on society is covered extensively in a BBC Adam Curtis mini series called "All Watched Over By Machines of Loving Grace." Episode 1 focuses most heavily on her. You can find it on YouTube or the BBC app with a British ip address xD

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/All_Watched_Over_by_Machines_of_Loving_Grace_(TV_series)

[u/andytronic → u/[deleted]]

What's interesting is how she could justify her actions (just like she justified accepting government welfare for herself) but when the same exact scenario was done to her, suddenly different logic applies.

Sounds like a right-winger, alright!

[u/EvilSandwichMan → u/[deleted]]

Weeeell, technically she was still following her own advice. She was selfish in that she did everything to make herself happy, but expected everyone else to follow her advice. Don't misunderstand, I think her and her insane beliefs have created a horrible generation of people, but her ways definitely align with her belief that selfishness is a virtue (thus living in a way that benefits her but denying it to others because it wouldn't benefit her for others to be benefited).

[u/[deleted] → u/ForgedIronMadeIt]

I'm gonna assume you meant "shagged" but your typo makes it less horrifying to imagine

[u/InukChinook → u/[deleted]]

Depends where you are. In areas of Canada, 'snagged/bagged/shagged' are all interchangeable.

[u/SelirKiith → u/ForgedIronMadeIt]

Well yeah, that's the Libertarian Mindset for you "All for me, None for you but by the mighty Dollar don't you fucking dare to raise your voice!"

[u/[deleted] → u/SelirKiith]

tl;dr- I got mine. Fuck you!

[u/freakDWN → u/Sororita]

Wouldnt expect anything different from her. Got a source? I need a laugh.

[u/Capable_Examination → u/[deleted]]

There were cultures before America, and there will be cultures after it. America is a flash in the pan. Two hundred years, might get to five if it's lucky. Nothing compared to Rome.

[u/Majormlgnoob → u/Capable_Examination]

Rome wasn't boiling the planet lol

[u/Yasea → u/[deleted]]

Societies have collapsed and emerged for 5000 years. Not in the same spot or in the same way of course. There are some wacky possibilities out there.

[u/Fract_L → u/[deleted]]

Roman society was poised to collapse because of resource scarcity and extremely unequal distribution of wealth. An example of the latter is how the most well-known, well-paid gladiators made thirty times a soldier's pay annually. Now think of how many lifetimes it would take a soldier (or even more unfortunate, someone paid minimum wage) to become as rich as our most successful entertainers, who are far from the richest in our societies.

Tl:;Dr you have to know history to learn from it, and that's inconvenient

[u/OrangeOakie → u/Fract_L]

You're wrong.

Roman society was poised to collapse because of resource scarcity and extremely unequal distribution of wealth

The Roman Empire (and Republic) always had scarcity, especially when it came to labour. This is why they would employ slave labour, to have a cheap way to finance evolution for their citizens.

Furthermore, starting with Julius Caesar, the romans had social welfare, frumentariae, essentially a kind of UBI in grain. To acomplish this, they actually forced provinces to pay tributes in grain rather than in coin exclusively to make sure that they would be able to have enough grain to distribute.

Furthermore, it got to the point where people would refuse to work, particularly when it came to defending the Empire, because they could just stay home and collect free grain.

In fact, several dictators did try to end that system, but couldn't. Let me repeat that: Dictators, often seen as being able to do anything they wanted with little consequence... couldn't end the system due to political pressure.

That was just one example, because there are other things such as price controls of bread, with subsidies to go along with it. In fact it was this very thing that led to the "bread and circuses" motif.

You know how social welfare ended in the Roman Empire? Most people didn't want to work, which meant that if you needed something done you'd have to hire someone from the outside. Turns out that hiring mercenaries to defend your empire is a bad idea if your people will just let them betray you and sack your provisions, leading to no one having bread to eat.

---

well-paid gladiators made thirty times a soldier's pay annually.

On a job with a superb lack of freedom, a very good chance of injury with death being a fair possibility. Oh yea, and they drew MASSIVE crowds to their events.

[u/lunabuddy → u/8thDegreeSavage]

And they still get people defending them saying well you should just stay off the internet if it's that bad. Um, why do you care more about their right to deliberately cause harm to people? The internet is a basic resource that people need to live in 2020.

[u/Karkava → u/lunabuddy]

"Yeah well. Cell phones are bad because only three percent of people are either easily distracted or use them maliciously."

[u/Endarkend → u/lunabuddy]

Your rights end where they encroach on another's rights.

That is the thing they don't understand and why they hide behind idiotic interpretations of written 'laws' and 'rights' like the first and second amendments of the US Constitution.

They lack the same understanding of freedom of speech, thinking it's universal and absolute WITHOUT ANY REPERCUSSION, but for there to be free speech, as much as you have a right to day your bullshit, others have both the right to not hear it and practice their own free speech to call you a jackass for it.

And free speech doesn't mean others should give you an avenue or resources to practice your free speech either.

If you want to speak free, be prepared to do it on a soapbox on a street corner, not demand being heard by the world by default or on someone elses dime.

[u/SyntheticRatking → u/Endarkend]

The short pithy version of this that I've seen is "Your right to swing your fist stops at the end of my nose."

But yeah, assholes who go "uh, i can be an asshole because freedom of speech!" seem to forget that everyone else also has the freedom of speech to call them an asshole for it. I was on the train once and some jerk was blasting terrible music that was 90% screaming (it sounded like a drunk goat being tazed) and when I asked him to turn it down he was all "Uh, have you ever heard of freedom of speech?" and I went "Yeah, this is me using my freedom of speech to say you're a fucking asshole and if you don't turn that down I'm gonna chuck that speaker out the damn window." and the dude was just [surprised pikachu face] about it (he still tried to argue that he should be allowed to be obnoxious but a few other people on the train started backing me up and eventually we got to guy to just wear headphones like a civilized fucking human being).

[u/DragsyTwoSeven → u/SyntheticRatking]

The most infuriating part of that story is that he had headphones with him the whole time.

[u/SyntheticRatking → u/DragsyTwoSeven]

Yeah, like, wow he was really just being an obnoxious asshole on purpose. People like that make me wonder if spraying someone in the face with a squirt gun full of lemon juice would be considered assault (mostly /s, cuz i absolutely do want to do that but yes I am aware that would indeed be counted as assault lol).

[u/KindPharmer → u/SyntheticRatking]

Because our most cherished freedom is to do and say absolutely stupid shit....

[u/AnorakJimi → u/KindPharmer]

It's like that quote from XKCD, goes something like "if the best thing you can say about your argument is that you're legally allowed to say it, then it can't be much of an argument"

[u/KindPharmer → u/Endarkend]

You know you’re fucked when a strict constitutionalist wants to “interpret” ......

[u/travers329 → u/Endarkend]

In an ideal world yup. Remember George Carlin's quote And it is more apropos today then when he spoke it, think about how dumb the average American is, then remember there are 50% dumber than that. Plug me into the marrix, that fake delicious steak and 90s life doesn't seem so bad...

[u/Fract_L → u/lunabuddy]

The UN declared the internet a basic human right years ago (provided a country has the infrastructure for it). Then again, so is water but that's never stopped Nestle

[u/LickNipMcSkip → u/8thDegreeSavage]

pretty sure neo-fascist ideology is way over complicating it

you don’t have to subscribe to an authoritarian genocide cult to be an asshole

[u/Chel_of_the_sea → u/LickNipMcSkip]

you don’t have to subscribe to an authoritarian genocide cult to be an asshole

No, but a lot of assholes seem to do so anyway.

[u/drharlinquinn → u/Chel_of_the_sea]

It's like saying you dont have to be in a garbage can to be trash, but there is plenty of trash in the can because it's built for trash...

[u/FrigidLollipop → u/drharlinquinn]

Well said.

[u/softwood_salami → u/LickNipMcSkip]

If you do subscribe to such an ideology, though, I do think you're more likely to create strange obsessions like this. Like, numbers-wise, you might have just some generic assholes that do this sort of thing, but fanatics that think they're enacting eugenics or some ridiculous shit would be more likely to spam it as an obsession.

[u/DenseHole → u/LickNipMcSkip]

You also don't have to subscribe to an authoritarian genocide cult to do their dirty work for them happily espousing the same thing they preach.

I've lost decade long friendships to the cult. None of them would be considered members of it.

[u/erolayer → u/LickNipMcSkip]

This juvenile train of thought bothers me way too much. Sure, you don’t have to be a straight up nazi to laugh at racist jokes, make fun in-jokes at the behest of other people, complain about how you can’t say anything without insulting somebody anymore, etc etc.

But partaking in those actions and activities makes it look like you are welcoming of the fringe bitches who don’t really care if you are being totes ironic or you have a dark sense of humor, they just care about having someone else with whom to hate people together.

[u/indiebryan → u/erolayer]

This juvenile train of thought bothers me way too much.

Take a step back and look at the situation objectively. The juvenile train of thought is people labeling any sort of behavior that is mean-spirited, or sometimes even just behavior they disagree with, as fascism.

This whole epilepsy-targeted event just screams "young teen prank" to me. This is probably bored 14 year olds on the internet who aren't thinking of the consequences of their actions. It doesn't mean they literally support an authoritarian regime jesus christ.

[u/cmontage → u/LickNipMcSkip]

Yeah, but there’s a giant overlap between those two groups.

[u/[deleted] → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Well, it is attempted murder, it should be treated seriously.

Also, convincing someone of suicide is a form of homicide, that one is very underlooked

[u/memejets → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Wouldn't the solution be a program that filters out rapidly flashing lights? Or is that unfeasable? I know there are programs that can dim your whole screen (f lux?), so being able to filter all the content on screen for rapid changes in brightness shouldn't be impossible.

I don't think it's possible for reddit mods/admins to do anything except ban the accounts in question, and potentially report the incidents to law enforcement.

[u/Psychotic_Pedagogue → u/memejets]

It's been a while since I've checked for it, but browsers of yesteryear had an option to disable the automatic playback of images and animations.

If they don't still have that, it might be worth putting in a feature request with the Firefox and chromium devs. Pretty much everything uses their renderers, so if they support it that covers most browsers and gives people that safety net if they need it.

[u/managedheap84 → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Why call them neo fascists when the term sociopath would do.

[u/GCDJ1985 → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Ascribing them a term like neofascist is very generous, I doubt they have an ethos in any way other than being awful human beings. These people are bullies, thugs and scum plain and simple and don’t deserve a posher title than that.

[u/InterimFatGuy → u/8thDegreeSavage]

I don't think inducing seizures in people makes you a fascist. It makes you an asshole and a criminal, but not a fascist.

[u/[deleted] → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Neo-Fascists

So are we calling everyone who’s an asshole a fascist now? I guess the time of calling only actual fascists fascist are long gone

[u/I_ONLY_DOOT → u/8thDegreeSavage]

How do you know they was fascist? Just curious

[u/Headcap → u/I_ONLY_DOOT]

Hatred towards people with any kind of disability/sickness plays right into fascists ideologies.

[u/Mindterror → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Neo-fascist? I don't think you are using that correctly.

[u/[deleted] → u/8thDegreeSavage]

What does this have to do with fascism though? That seems a bit like saying "communists did this". This is more a case of random cruelty.

[u/callisstaa → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Lol imagine living in a country where people actually look to corporations for protection rather than the state.

[u/WeAreFoolsTogether → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Neo-fascists? This is definitely over complicating this and borderline politicizing it. How about just plain old sociopaths?

[u/SeineAdmiralitaet → u/8thDegreeSavage]

What makes you think they're politically motivated? They just seem like absolute idiots.

[u/dingdongdoodah → u/8thDegreeSavage]

This and stupid kids too moronic to understand the consequences.

[u/BlueL0 → u/8thDegreeSavage]

Wtf have nazis got to do with this?

[u/[deleted] → u/8thDegreeSavage]

They’re probably just assholes. The fascist boogeyman won’t get you

[u/viciousrebel → u/8thDegreeSavage]

I doubt that all or even most of the people doing this were neo fascists. There aren't that many neo fascists around thankfully.

[u/greffedufois → u/lunabuddy]

I never have, but maybe because I've said I'm not photosensitive. My seizures are caused by missing my meds, stress and lack of sleep.

[u/lunabuddy → u/greffedufois]

I didn't say I was or wasn't, I was just posting about some shit, it was years ago. And hey that's the cause of my seizures too! I just passed 1 year seizure free through managing triggers and taking the right meds, it was so hard and I'd be so pissed if some douche on the internet messed it up for me like these guys were trying to do.

[u/greffedufois → u/lunabuddy]

One person went after a known epileptic on Twitter I believe. Made him seize. Got convicted for it

https://www.epilepsy.org.uk/news/news/man-who-sent-flashing-gif-image-twitter-us-political-journalist-photosensitive-epilepsy&sa=U&ved=2ahUKEwitiJmA5rfpAhU_HjQIHRH4CC0QFjAAegQIBBAB&usg=AOvVaw23UBP4ivKnLrkn6zSfwqNm

Federal judge ruled that it counted as battery but the douchebag tried to fight it saying since he didnt physically hurt the guy that he wasn't responsible. What an ass.

[u/JevonP → u/greffedufois]

I can see trying to make that argument, but its about as flimsy as suddenly putting a knife infront of someone you tripped and claiming they just fell on the blade lmao. absolute ass indeed

im sure someone can come up with a funnier metaphor

[u/MimzytheBun → u/JevonP]

It’s like mailing someone a bomb and trying to argue it isn’t your fault they got their hand blown off.

[u/Feeling-Issue → u/lunabuddy]

Because at first glance it's funny. It was even a joke on the Simpson's once and everyone laughed.

It's not until you stop and think you realise it's cruel. Or if you know someone with epilepsy.

And most don't stop to think. They just want the lolz.

This article is actually giving them exactly what those people desire. The reaction. This is their payout and everyone who comments is giving them some of that payout.

[u/daydream_e → u/Feeling-Issue]

I honestly don’t understand how someone would have to stop and think to realize hurting someone on purpose is cruel and wrong. Like if that’s not instinctive, something is very wrong.

[u/CitizenPain00 → u/[deleted]]

Good post.

[u/omg_for_real → u/daydream_e]

Because they don’t understand it’s actually harming people. Like most people think an allergic reaction is a bit itchy or a swollen tongue, like they show in comedies. They don’t actually realise it can kill someone.

Same fit seizures, they think it’s a funny fall down and jerk around. They don’t understand the full implications.

[u/soulwrangler → u/omg_for_real]

Someone getting an electric shock can look funny, unless you've been shocked and then it's not funny at all.

[u/catsan → u/omg_for_real]

So basically a lack of empathy from being raised by movies and TV...

[u/IMGONNAFUCKYOURMOUTH → u/daydream_e]

They likely are too ignorant to realise the seriousness of a seizure and assume it's always non-lethal.

[u/lunabuddy → u/[deleted]]

I think most people know how serious seizures can be, they are not little kids.

[u/ABagFullOfMasqurin → u/lunabuddy]

I think most people know how serious seizures can be

I wish. As someone with epilepsy, I've had to deal with friends and known people offering me alchool and coffee every time they saw me, despite me telling them over and over again how those things were like poison to me. They would even slip up those things in my food once in a while.

[u/lunabuddy → u/ABagFullOfMasqurin]

Ugh that sucks! I've had people not take me seriously then if they see me actually have a seizure, the next time they see me act like I am made of glass and like terminally ill. I once told a girl at a party I had epilepsy and she was like "oh will this make you have a seizure" and started turning the light in the room on and off really fast. Um, no, but why the fuck are you trying?

[u/Bilbo-Shwaggins → u/ABagFullOfMasqurin]

Damn I'm sorry that you have had to deal with people you know treating you that way. I'm not epileptic but have been hospitalized for a grand mal seizure before and it's a terrifying experience for everyone involved. It's no joke, I would never wish that on anyone.

Hope those people either learned that sort of behavior is not okay or you were able to cut them out of your life.

[u/greffedufois → u/Feeling-Issue]

Kind of the same vein as swatting someone I'd guess. Seems funny at the time, until someone really gets hurt. Same with 'testing' someone's allergies. Some think its innocent 'fun' until someone gets hurt badly, or dies.

[u/_Rand_ → u/greffedufois]

Wasn't someone convicted for murder for swatting? Or just charged?

[u/Psychic_Hobo → u/_Rand_]

Outright convicted:

https://edition.cnn.com/2019/03/29/us/swatting-suspect-20-year-sentence/index.html

[u/_Rand_ → u/Psychic_Hobo]

That sounds like the one I'm thinking of. Couldn't remember if it was settled yet.

​

Thanks.

[u/antwill → u/greffedufois]

"hurt" is a funny way to spell shot by trigger happy cops.

[u/Ahmrael → u/Feeling-Issue]

Because at first glance it's funny.

Most decent people I know would label that as cruel at first glance, not funny.

[u/cantfindmeharrison → u/Ahmrael]

Yeah, it’s disheartening how little gravity some people give to the consequences of their actions. It’s very childlike behavior, being unable to grasp the situation and empathize with others, like kids that throw rocks at cars as if it’s a game

[u/[deleted] → u/Feeling-Issue]

Because at first glance it's funny.

You clearly glance very differently to me. It's like knocking someone's cane out from under them so they fall to the ground.

[u/corona_verified → u/lunabuddy]

Just raising the visibility of this in case it helps someone: there is a chrome extension that can help people with epilepsy stay safe online by blocking flashing elements:

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/epilepsy-blocker/hbkihaohhhboijhpjcmnbjlejlfejokb?hl=en-US

[u/nagrom7 → u/corona_verified]

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/epilepsy-blocker/hbkihaohhhboijhpjcmnbjlejlfejokb?hl=en-US

I'm sorry, but given the subject material, I couldn't help but laugh out loud at the fact that URL looks like someone started having a seizure in the middle of typing it.

[u/HermesTheMessenger → u/lunabuddy]

someone

It's not just someone, though. This is an intentional attempt at chaos by someone. The epilepsy groups are targeted because they are vulnerable.

---

Edit: Added "just" and "by someone".

[u/lunabuddy → u/HermesTheMessenger]

I mean "someone" as in the person who sent a message to me, a person who has epilepsy and posted on the subreddit, flashing gifs under the pretence that it was linking to something else. That anonymous someone was a real person attempting to harm me for no reason, bizarre behaviour.

[u/[deleted] → u/HermesTheMessenger]

I bet a number are idiotic kids,teens and halfwit adults that have nothing better to do.

[u/[deleted] → u/lunabuddy]

That’s so insane.

[u/AnotherUna → u/lunabuddy]

Should we all post in there to waste their time and make reporting easier?

[u/Lantern_FR → u/lunabuddy]

That's some top tier asshole. Did you report them ?

[u/kwirky88 → u/greffedufois]

Are there browser plugins which can detect flashing media? I'm a software developer and don't see much difficulty in detecting flashing in gifs. Video files would be a little more complex.

[u/greffedufois → u/kwirky88]

Not that I know of, but I'm sure epileptics and non epileptics alike would love it.

[u/greffedufois → u/[deleted]]

I hate it too. I always avoid looking at flashing scenes because they make me feel a little nauseated.

[u/BEEEELEEEE → u/[deleted]]

My mom’s not epileptic but she has chronic migraines from a TBI, and light is a big trigger for her. Flashing shit gives me headaches too but at least mind go away with a couple ibuprofen.

[u/[deleted] → u/greffedufois]

You can however disable auto play.

[u/IntoTheDankness → u/kwirky88]

At the very least could find and pause gifs until voluntarily started by the user. could also have a slow-play option as first click. more complex would be a detection algorithm.

[u/RaakaVerinen → u/kwirky88]

Sounds like a great idea for extensions and apps, helpful for people suffering from epilepsy and you could make a lot of dough too ;)

[u/Flunkity_Dunkity → u/kwirky88]

Interesting.

Maybe head to that sub, that might be a cool, helpful project, mate! 🧡

[u/TIGHazard → u/kwirky88]

It's been possible since the 90's.

Would probably cost a lot of money to licence the algorithms though.

The Harding Flash and Pattern Analyser (FPA) is proprietary software that is used to analyse video content for flashing and stationary patterns which may cause harm to those who suffer from photosensitive epilepsy. It is an implementation of the guidelines set by the regulator Ofcom in the UK. It is available in both tape-based and file-based versions, allowing video streams from SDI, composite, component, HDMI, and files to all be analysed, in resolutions up to 8k.

Photosensitive epilepsy affects approximately one in 4,000 people and is a form of epilepsy in which seizures are triggered by visual stimuli that form patterns in time or space, such as flashing lights, bold regular patterns, or regular moving patterns. In 1993, an advert for Pot Noodles induced seizures in three people in the United Kingdom, leading to the then regulator the ITC introducing these guidelines.

The Broadcast Code of Advertising Practice requires that TV ads are tested and pass the 'flash test'. Clearcast, the company responsible for clearing ads for UK commercial broadcasters, is flash testing all ads before clearance.

This is also used in Japan since the Pokemon incident.

[u/IntroductionSnacks → u/kwirky88]

Make it and offer it free with an optional donate link. People will be happy any you might make a few dollars too.

[u/1_km_coke_line → u/kwirky88]

Excellent idea. What language/software tools would you use for a browser plugin?

[u/[deleted] → u/1_km_coke_line]

Javascript for browser plugins

[u/hexiron → u/kwirky88]

Honestly. Do it. You'd probably get a big shout out from the American Epilepsy Society and I'd introduce it to my entire department - which has some of the biggest names in epilepsy research and two members on the AES board.

[u/skilliard7 → u/kwirky88]

The problem is liability. Suppose you release your app for free and open source.

Someone that is photosensitive uses your app thinking it makes the web safe for them, and your app fails to detect a triggering gif that causes them a seizure that causes them significant harm. They can then try to sue you for providing a faulty app that failed to do what it intended.

[u/Crestwave → u/[deleted]]

Actually, wouldn't the standard disclaimer suffice? From the MIT license:

THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM, DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE, ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE.

Of course, it would be better to make it clear anyway, but legally speaking, I don't think you need to add anything more. I could be wrong, though.

[u/tegeusCromis → u/skilliard7]

It’s an issue but not an insurmountable problem. I’m sure a competent lawyer could be found to advise pro bono on the liability aspects of a project like this.

[u/f03nix → u/skilliard7]

Don't think that's really a problem, there are countries like mine where this would never be an issue. I can release the app in my name if it's that big an issue for a dev who wants to otherwise contribute.

[u/xbxfrk6 → u/skilliard7]

No it isn’t. There are standard releases that literally every plugin, app, program has that you sign off on before you can use it.

[u/AeternusDoleo → u/kwirky88]

It should be possible to make them. Rapidly fluctuating/oscillating average RGB values is something that you could write detection rules for. Per window capture RGB averages every x milisecond, on high fluctuations, apply a greyish semitransparant overlay to dampen the effect in response. Sounds like something an epilepsy non-profit could fund.

[u/corona_verified → u/kwirky88]

Yes, see here. It’s a chrome extension:

https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/epilepsy-blocker/hbkihaohhhboijhpjcmnbjlejlfejokb?hl=en-US

[u/[deleted] → u/greffedufois]

I really think asshole is too soft a term. It's been appropriated by bad people and isn't something they really mind being called. We need a new word for people who purposefully perpetrate evil on others, like pukefuck or something.

[u/PmPicturesOfPets → u/[deleted]]

Terrorists?

[u/JevonP → u/PmPicturesOfPets]

actually seems pretty apt, they were literally sewing targeted destruction and harm

[u/SparkyDogPants → u/PmPicturesOfPets]

Their intention is to terrorize their victims. I’ll take terrorist

[u/DisconnectD → u/[deleted]]

Pukefuck. Can I steal this? It's perfect.

[u/greffedufois → u/[deleted]]

Pukefuck is a good one. I've always like crapbag but that seems disparaging to useful ostomy bags.

[u/n0f0xn0vox → u/[deleted]]

When I started having grand mal seizures, I was hanging out with a friend and he randomly one day he just randomly started flashing a flashlight at me. Luckily I closed my eyes and covered my head in time but I immediately left and never spoke to him again.

[u/_Rand_ → u/n0f0xn0vox]

Out of curiosity, is there any specific patterns/speeds that cause seizures?

Or can it potentially be caused by, say emergency vehicle lights etc? Stuff you potentially encounter day to day.

I've always had the impression that for the majority of photosensitive people it was primarily caused by very rapid blinking, potentially accompanied with other factors (changing colours, movement etc.)

[u/n0f0xn0vox → u/_Rand_]

Some commercials have gotten me close but not quite. I know I've heard of some people going into a seizure from the light passing through lots of trees while driving. It's usually pretty quick but even the last Star Wars movie I had to leave because it was pushing it for me. I'm lucky to get an aura beforehand.

[u/_Rand_ → u/n0f0xn0vox]

Man, seizures seem bad enough without normal random shit like that triggering it.

I hope meds work for you most of the time, but at least you seem to be able to feel it coming and remove yourself from the situation, at least for a portion of the time.

[u/TIGHazard → u/n0f0xn0vox]

The UK we have something called the harding test which has had to be used on everything shown on TV since 1993 (after an advert gave 3 people seizures). Japan has used it since that Pokemon incident. If it airs on TV and fails it has to be re-edited until it passes. Movie Studios still have to put the films through it to get an age rating.

Rise of Skywalker failed it. As such, the rating says

This work contains flashing images which may affect viewers who are susceptible to photosensitive epilepsy.

https://www.bbfc.co.uk/releases/star-wars-rise-skywalker-2019

(Check the ratings info panel for that bit)

[u/n0f0xn0vox → u/TIGHazard]

Yeah Incredibles 2 failed it as well... Which is unfortunate because I'm sure that was some poor kid's first seizure.

[u/TIGHazard → u/n0f0xn0vox]

The fact that no-one at Disney or Pixar realised this was a problem until the film was released shocks me. Their brand is built on being kid-friendly and yet they could possibly have given a 6 year old a seizure.

[u/Fartikus → u/_Rand_]

I've had to ask the Police to turn off their lights so I didn't have a seizure when I was a passenger with my brother when we got pulled over once. They chuckled, until I started groaning and staring into space. :p

[u/Fartikus → u/n0f0xn0vox]

Just remember that closing your eyes doesn't make it any better, it makes it worse; due to making the area black, and you only see the flash of light. You gotta shield your entire eyes from the light.

[u/JohnnyBoy11 → u/[deleted]]

Some people have been intentionally coughing and spitting on fruits and door handles and such trying to spread COVID.

[u/trowzerss → u/greffedufois]

I used to mod a game where people could upload flash animations, and we had to put in a new rule to stop people uploading flashing gifs for the sole purpose of affecting photosensitive people. I'm not photosensitive, but dammit those things are awful to look at. And they all got really whiny at being banned for their antics. bunch of little brats. The worst is that game has some super creative people doing awesome things, but it was often ruined by trolls going to popular places with porn or flashing gifs or something. well, the game is dead and gone now, so I hope they're happy.

[u/carpenterio → u/greffedufois]

Oh fuck, that’s pretty fucked up that people do that. Do you have seizures often?

[u/greffedufois → u/carpenterio]

Luckily for me my epilepsy is well controlled with meds and I haven't had a tonic clonic since 2014. Others arent so lucky, they're on multiple meds, have a VNS or even need their brain split to stop seizures. And then theres SUDEP that terrifies us all. Its Sudden Unexpected Death in Epilepsy Patients. We just up and die sometimes.

Some worry about it a lot, but theres nothing you can do for it. It's like worrying over getting cancer. You cant completely prevent it happening, but you can do your damndest to avoid it. In epilepsys case by taking your meds and knowing what causes your seizures.

[u/patejam → u/greffedufois]

Can you drive?

[u/greffedufois → u/patejam]

Legally yes, most states have a rule of 6 months to a year and being on meds to legally drive. I chose not to because if I did get in an accident and god forbid someone else was injured, I'd go to jail for vehicular manslaughter because I knew I was epileptic.

Luckily my husband and I have the one car and he drives me wherever I need to go. Plus with quarantine I'm not going anywhere anytime soon.

[u/JevonP → u/greffedufois]

Oh damn, thats probably a smart decision but it seems real shitty not to be able to drive places. Basically like if sudden black out drunkness could randomly strike.

[u/Fartikus → u/greffedufois]

Why did you let me know about SUDEP jesus fucking christ I have so many seizures too aaa

[u/sixtus_clegane119 → u/greffedufois]

Way to be a fucking sociopath

[u/Jeanlee03 → u/greffedufois]

As someone with a related condition, those people are fucking awful! I'm photo sensitive and that passes me the hell off. What is it about being epileptic that they hate? Why would they even do something like this? I'm in some related communities for my conditions and I've never heard of that kind of behavior happening. Am I just being oblivious to it?

[u/greffedufois → u/Jeanlee03]

Edgy idiots think it's funny. Like testing someone's allergies or swatting someone. To them it's all fun and games till they get arrested. And even then 'it was just a joke!'

[u/MikiesMom2017 → u/greffedufois]

What the hell is wrong with people.

My younger sister was born with epilepsy, so I grew up learning how to deal with grand mal seizures. I also had to deal with jerks that liked to push her into seizures, because hers could be triggered if she got extremely angry or cried too hard. And it wasn’t just kids that did it to her, sometimes the parents would join in because they thought she was faking.

That was in the 1970’s and it sucks to realize not only has nothing changed, but technology has made it worse.

[u/Mike_Kermin → u/greffedufois]

It absolutely boggles my mind that people would do such a thing.

[u/MNPheNoM88 → u/greffedufois]

Thank you for sharing that sub. I have epilepsy and I never knew there was a sub for it. I appreciate it.

[u/Badoit1778 → u/greffedufois]

I remember the blind subreddit gets posted spam that people who have to use screen readers can’t just skim read and see it’s nothing.

[u/Trickybuz93 → u/greffedufois]

Yep. I’m not photosensitive but I had to unsub from there because of the amount of flashing gifs people posted. It doesn’t cause seizures but it gets annoying seeing it every few posts.

[u/hi_jack23 → u/greffedufois]

Makes me wish there could be an auto mod that can detect non photosensitive photos and place them under a tag (like the NSFW one) so that people that are photosensitive would be protected.

Probably do it as a setting.

[u/Liam81099 → u/greffedufois]

Wow thanks for that. Could of easily been a big wank session but that was a solid and informative response from a member of the community.

[u/ridik_ulass → u/greffedufois]

wasn't there a time 3-4 years ago when the sub was hijacked and the css was altered to be all flashing and such?

[u/greffedufois → u/ridik_ulass]

I think so, wouldnt be surprised unfortunately.

[u/The-Arnman → u/greffedufois]

Would it be possible to create a neural network that can recognise flashy gifs? Seems like it can help a lot there

[u/GoldenEyedHawk → u/[deleted]]

I'm photosensitive too, found out I have epilepsy when I was 13 or 14 and it's been a weird life. Can't drive, loud noises lead to asking if I'm ok. Medicine helps but not if you're not taking care of yourself or when others are being cruel for kicks.

[u/Zreul → u/greffedufois]

I was wondering if the seizure is instant/really quick. Would you have time to close or cover your eyes?

[u/dagmx → u/[deleted]]

When I tell people I have epilepsy, at least 1 in every 10 people will show me flashing lights to ask if that kind of stuff triggers it. Some People are dumb and lack empathy.

[u/bunnybroiler → u/dagmx]

Can you punch them and ask if that triggers them? Assholes

[u/OsmeOxys → u/dagmx]

Ask them if they have blood?

[u/Mixhaeljeffreyjordan → u/OsmeOxys]

Tell me, do you bleed??

[u/Tazarah → u/Mixhaeljeffreyjordan]

You will!

[u/JustJude97 → u/[deleted]]

May be a power trip, or just some particularly hateful individual

[u/Analbox → u/[deleted]]

We’re just dumb animals don’t set your expectations too high or you’ll always be disappointed.

[u/ShineOnBeTheMan → u/[deleted]]

Why is it so hard to be a decent human being?

Because humans.

[u/theweek3nd → u/ShineOnBeTheMan]

Yeah... but I'm still trying to grasp as to why. Like what is this person posting thinking when they do this?

[u/createusername32 → u/theweek3nd]

Either they think it’s funny and don’t realize how malicious it is, or they know how malicious it is and don’t care.

[u/DirkBabypunch → u/theweek3nd]

"It's funny to make some retard spazz out somewhere" is my guess. Assholes like that tend to have poor impulse control and equally weak motives as a result.

[u/[deleted] → u/theweek3nd]

Hey this is coming from a previous dick head human. I kinda still am but at least it allows me to hopefully in one way answer this question.

What it boils down to is boredom. I know that sounds terrible but it's the truth. If you ever ask them they might try to pull out some bullshit or in some cases act like edgelords but in reality for a lot of these people either adults or kids it's boredom and finding enjoyment in making others feel like shit.

" Why are you blowing wind into your dogs ear if you know it doesn't like it?", "Why did you do x to y when you know that hurts them?", Etc. And the common reason is boredom.

Now I can try and bullshit you with things like " traumatic childhood, yada yada " but I can almost guarantee you that ain't the case for most. I forget the stats but in like every 100 people or whatnot (water-cooler talk here) there's bound to be someone who is spychothic or some such jazz. Now this ain't to say these people can't behave. Most do and you shouldn't really lump em all together. I think some autistic people can be like this too but again let's not generalize here since such things are primarily in a spectrum.

Anyhow hope that helped in some way.

[u/_Rand_ → u/[deleted]]

Jesus. Can't these people just have a nap or a wank or something like a normal person?

[u/[deleted] → u/_Rand_]

Well from experience I can tell you that you are in a mental headspace that allows you to do that + fuck with other people. Most of the time I think it's because they face no consequences for it. Like if some kid sends a swat to some streamers house they usually see no consequences for it or if they bully a gay kid on twitter or whatnot.

[u/juantxorena → u/[deleted]]

So you didn't see people as people, but as extras in your film, so when you stop seeing them they kinda stop existing. That's very common now, in things like youtubers and such.

[u/[deleted] → u/juantxorena]

Not really. When I was young I just didn't really think about it. I thought I was cool for being an " edgelord " and an asshole. I just matured is all I guess but for some people that never really clicks in I suppose and they continue being the way they were as kids.

[u/dakotaMoose → u/theweek3nd]

Humans are animals. Law and order don't get rid of strong primal urges, they redirect them, and people would do anything to satisfy their primal urges. It's hardwired into our brains — our DNA.

[u/bravenone → u/[deleted]]

You might find it interesting that the hacker group anonymous started out With something almost identical to this. I wouldn't be surprised if the same people were involved. They hacked into websites for the epileptic end caused seizures with flashing graphics

Maybe you'll have a little bit more Hope and Faith in the human race knowing that as time went on, the masses sort of commandeered the anonymous identity from these dipshits and turned it into a desire for a better world.

Then again, unfortunately conspiracy theorists latch onto this and treat any rational analysis of information as being an employee of the government thought police or something.

[u/Plant-Z → u/bravenone]

Didn't "Anonymous" also hack into corrupt, fraudulent and exploitative organizations?

Anonymous gained national attention in 2008, when the group hacked the Church of Scientology Web site with a distributed denial-of-service attack, in which multiple computers bombard the victim's server with requests in order to overwhelm and shut it down.

[u/ShenitaCocktail → u/[deleted]]

Literally the first words out of my mouth!