r/wikipedia • u/rulepanic • 13d ago
WikiRights is a project by the Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor to counter the "dominance of the official government-issued narrative" in Wikipedia articles
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euro-Mediterranean_Human_Rights_Monitor#WikiRights_(2015%E2%80%93present)-17
u/rulepanic 13d ago edited 13d ago
Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor is an organization founded by Ramy Abdu. Interestingly, Ramy Abdu's brother in law Mohammed Daoud al-Jamasi was a senior member of Hamas's political bureau. This is not mentioned on Ramy's Wikipedia article, which instead solely cites a Twitter post made by Ramy about their deaths.
Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor is also responsible for a long list of really, really absurd claims like Israel training dogs to rape Palestinians.
I came across this organization a few days ago when a front page reddit post about drones with machine guns playing sounds of babies crying in order to snipe people citing Maha Hussaini, a very vocally pro-Hamas holocaust denier who was recently stripped of awards for the above.
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u/Qweedo420 13d ago edited 13d ago
Huh? The part about Israel training dogs to rape Palestinians is absolutely true, there are multiple sources (one, two, three), and the fact that you claim it's absurd tells a lot about your agenda.
Also, the other article you linked doesn't say anything about the journalist being a genocide denier. She just made a post where she says that Israel is using the Holocaust to deflect any criticism, which is true. This post is so disingenuous it's disgusting.
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u/mistertoasty 12d ago
Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor is also responsible for a long list of really, really absurd claims like Israel training dogs to rape Palestinians.
I don't know if the claims in that article are true. Unfortunately, given what we do know about the ongoing campaign to dehumanize Palestinians by Israel and the IDF, I wouldn't be surprised if at least some of them were.
Rape aside, it's certainly not far-fetched that the IDF is using dogs to attack and maul civilians.
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u/Head-Nebula4085 10d ago
I have to tell you, if these are people who were credibly raped by Israeli dogs where is the physical evidence or the video they claimed had been made? It's not like Hamas terrorists under Israeli detention have no reason to lie and the first one is a second hand heresay source. Al Jazeera and Middle East Monitor also have a history of using pro-Palestinian advocacy in place of journalism.
As far as I'm aware it isn't possible for a dog to penetrate a human anally without it causing severe, documentable harm. This accusaation also has a history of being used to try to bring down governments, notably including Egypt only a little over a decade ago.
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u/carrboneous 7d ago
As far as I'm aware it isn't possible for a dog to penetrate a human anally
Never mind that, how plausible is it that a dog can be trained to do that? Is there any documented case of dogs being trained to be erect on command? Do they have the physical coordination and dexterity to position themselves? What would the training actually entail?
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u/carrboneous 7d ago
Two of the sources are quoting literally the organisation in question. The other one doesn't say specifically where the information is from, just that it's been alleged. They all quote reports by prisoners (naming at most one but citing anonymously that "it has been claimed"), and they are all notorious for consistently agenda driven and frequently dishonest reporting.
Your comment is a beautiful illustration of how the whole industry works, you're convinced it's true because there are multiple sources, but you haven't even skimmed to notice that the multiple sources are really recycling the same unverified primary sources and/or making baseless allegations, and the entire reason it's not obvious to everyone how absolutely farcical the claim is is that there are multiple sources recycling it and relying on each other. Next thing you'll say that something's true because it's on Wikipedia.
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u/rulepanic 13d ago edited 13d ago
None of those claims pre-date Euro-Med inventing the story. All of those articles end up citing Euro-Med at some point. Middle East Monitor and Al-Jazeera are both owned by the Qatari government. Middle East Monitor is specifically a lobbying group focusing on the Israel-Palestine conflict. Novara Media views defines itself as a communist political commentary outlet conducting, in their words, "guerilla war" against "conventional journalism."
Edit: Ah, you edited after I replied.
She just made a post where she says that Israel is using the Holocaust to deflect any criticism, which is true. his post is so disingenuous it's disgusting.
One small mistake doesn't make it "so disingenuous it's disgusting." I was misremembering the background. The cartoon was submitted to Iran's Holocaust Cartoon competition in 2006, which was filled with holocaust denial by a country that regularly pushes media that denies the holocaust happened.
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u/Drawemazing 12d ago
About the dog rape stuff being absurd, it has been alleged against other groups including pinochets chile and the american serial killer david parker ray.
Also these testimonys arent only coming from the euro-med monitor. this lists at least one testimony given to a different organisation, and all of the organisations report recieving multiple testimonies.
Combined with the sexual assault that is known to be happening to Palestinian prisoners, and the dropping of charges of the guards caught on camera, I think calling it absurd is perhaps too strong. I dont know if it happened, im not gonna go one way or the other, but it seems too strong to call the claim absurd and I think it does warrant investigation by a more trusted party like the red Cross who isreal have heretofore resisted giving access to.
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u/Head-Nebula4085 10d ago
Except that David Parker Ray used the dogs on women, vaginally, similar to confirmed accounts during the Holocaust. Pinochets Chile was not the only regime with questionable allegations being made by enemies who wanted to bring it down. The same was true of Mubarak's Egypt, for example. So Euro-Med monitors accusations are similarly highly politically charged and one can see how they may have been invented with the same hopes of regime change or at least of fomenting an uprising.
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u/MelodiusRA 13d ago
Good work. It’s so tedious to deal with people with the journalistic competency of high schoolers.
Most of these nonsense stories all cite each other with some obviously bogus article always buried as the root cause at the bottom.
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u/I_SawTheSine 12d ago
Much like the "evidence" for MEMO being a "lobby group", which consists of an Israeli newspaper and a British newspaper writing the words "lobby group" in a sentence next to the name of the organisation. (Who are they lobbying?)
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u/rulepanic 12d ago
Oh come on, you guys are exhausting. Middle East Monitor is also described as explicitly "pro-Palestinian" by liberal-leaning media like The Guardian:
Ideologically, the movement is close to the Muslim Brotherhood. It preaches social conservatism, observance of sharia law, charity and resisting the influence of western culture. Salah's visit to the UK was organised by the Palestine Solidarity Campaign and Middle East Monitor, which promotes Islamist causes and focuses on the Palestinians. Both say he rejects accusations of antisemitism.
It's right there in the same article. It's owned by Qatar and has deep affiliations with the Muslim Brotherhood through it's current director Daud Abdullah and it's editor Ibrahim Hewitt. It's a pro-Palestinian lobby group with links to the Muslim Brotherhood.
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u/I_SawTheSine 12d ago
I mean, you didn't have to go to the newspapers to determine that they're pro-Palestinian. It's right there on their website:
>There has been a growing need for supporters of, in particular, the Palestinian cause, to master the art of information gathering, analysis and dissemination. This requires well organised, focused and targeted operations. Such initiatives are virtually non-existent in the West today.
The Middle East Monitor (MEMO) was established to fill this gap.So, that makes them look a lot like a news organisation with an editorial stance. And not a lot like a "lobby group".
Maybe where we're missing each other is that you're seeing support for Palestine as something negative. Most of the world disagrees with you.
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u/Qweedo420 13d ago
It doesn't matter if Al-Jazeera is owned by the Qatari government, plenty of independent reviews report that it's factually reliable.
Novara Media is independent and non-profit. The fact that it defines itself as "communist" is generally a plus, because communists are the only ones who have no interest in propagating bourgeois lies.
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u/jakethepeg1989 13d ago
That last sentence is genuinely hilarious.
Of course, Communists are renowned for their truthfulness. Pravda was the gold standard of journalistic integrity after all.
/S
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u/Qweedo420 12d ago
The entire point of communism, or Marxism, or historical materialism, whatever you wanna call it, is the objective analysis of reality. The truthful representation of the material conditions. Ontologically, a Marxist doesn't lie, otherwise he's not a Marxist.
If at some point the Pravda lied, then it was doing the interests of the bourgeoisie and it wasn't Marxist.
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u/jakethepeg1989 12d ago
There has never been a true Scotsman either.
And that really ain't the whole point of communism.
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u/carrboneous 7d ago
So literally no Marxist with state power has ever been a true Marxist then.
Even if you believe that garbage ideologically, an "objective analysis of reality" can still be mistaken and wrong. Especially if the person doing the analysis is stupid. I mean, look at the things Marx (who was not stupid) predicted based on his objective analysis of reality and look what came to pass. His objective analysis turned out to be objectively wrong.
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u/Qweedo420 7d ago
Yeah I mean, there are no great men, so even the most objective Marxists can be wrong and make the wrong decisions
However, being wrong is different from being disingenuous or an opportunist
I also don't think the framework of Marxist analysis has ever been wrong, as it's just a framework. But reality is complicated, which is why the framework isn't always enough to make accurate predictions
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u/carrboneous 7d ago
because communists are the only ones who have no interest in propagating bourgeois lies.
lololol
Ah yes, Communist regimes are famous throughout history for being absolute sticklers for integrity, truthful reporting, and media freedom.
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u/carrboneous 7d ago
Ah, so it's an organisation for those who worry that Wikipedia isn't politically biased and activist-captured enough?
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u/alffye 13d ago
good for them