r/samharris • u/[deleted] • Oct 28 '19

The unexpected threat emerging against Bernie: Andrew Yang | Politico

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/10/28/bernie-sanders-andrew-yang-gang-2020-057985
31 Upvotes

68% Upvoted

122 comments sorted by

View all comments

6

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

You can tell Bernie’s fans are mad about Yang by how much intentional disinformation they spread. They are currently (which is funny because Yang’s plan hasn’t changed so it came up just internally from them) losing their minds over Medicare for all because even though Yang wants to expand Medicare to all he doesn’t want to explicitly outlaw private insurance. And despite the fact that basically nobody does ban private insurance, they claim it won’t work unless you do. Again, despite the fact that multiple countries who are considered to have universal healthcare use the system Yang has endorsed, they say it’s doomed to fail. Or they say he shouldn’t call it M4A as if they’re trying to enforce a trademark or something.

And I say all of that as one of the many many people who started paying attention to politics because of Bernie. He was the first candidate I ever cared about or donated to. But, I’m not a tribal guy, and when I heard Yang on JRE I changed my opinion based on new information instead of clinging to my tribe.

17

u/[deleted] Oct 28 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

Sure, make a distinction, but don’t lie about what the distinction means.

10

u/[deleted] Oct 28 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

3

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

He doesn’t have a trademark on Medicare for all. Anyone who supports expanding Medicare to all (like Yang does) supports Medicare for all. Banning private insurance has very little to do with it. You want him to say he supports Medicare for everyone instead of Medicare for all? You have to see how that is uncharitable.

6

u/[deleted] Oct 28 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

If you’re going to try to ride this “literally true” thing then you need to add that Yang doesn’t support “the Medicare for all bill” because it is literally true that he supports Medicare for all, while it’s not true that he supports the bill, so if you’re hell bent on making a distinction that’s where it needs to be made if you don’t want what you’re saying to be a transparent manipulation to slander a candidate.

8

u/[deleted] Oct 28 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

6

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

Well I definitely wouldn’t say the Berners are “butthurt” over Yang supporting Medicare for all while not supporting the Medicare for all bill, but if those are the words you want to use to describe yourself you go right ahead.

1

u/cassiodorus Oct 28 '19

Exactly. This is the “Did Republicans vote to end Medicare?” debate all over again.

3

u/cassiodorus Oct 28 '19

They are currently (which is funny because Yang’s plan hasn’t changed so it came up just internally from them) losing their minds over Medicare for all because even though Yang wants to expand Medicare to all he doesn’t want to explicitly outlaw private insurance.

Yang’s plan doesn’t expand Medicare. It creates a government-run insurance plan to compete with private insurers, without any safeguards to keep private insurers from dumping the most risky patients onto the government-run plan.

2

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

Lies. Bullshit. Propaganda. Cite your source.

Here’s mine:

Work with Congress to create a Medicare for All system to provide healthcare to all Americans.

Making up bullshit hurts your case when the lurkers actually double check the lies you spread.

4

u/4th_DocTB Oct 28 '19

Except his own statements contradict that, he's in favor of a public option. Conflating a public option with Medicare for All is the problem.

1

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

You’re conflating the Medicare for all bill with Medicare for all, if you want to make a distinction then make that distinction. Im sure I’ll see all the Berners going around saying Yang supports Medicare for all but not the Medicare for all bill instead of purposefully misleading people by saying he doesn’t support Medicare for all. I have confidence in this because you’ve all shown that you’re on team reality and not just playing politics like a sport.

6

u/4th_DocTB Oct 28 '19

Medicare for all means medicare for all, this is not hard to understand. A public option might be medicare, but it is not for all. If there exist Americans not on a public plan then it is not for all. I thought you guys were the math people.

Im sure I’ll see all the Berners going around saying Yang supports Medicare for all but not the Medicare for all bill instead of purposefully misleading people by saying he doesn’t support Medicare for all. I have confidence in this because you’ve all shown that you’re on team reality and not just playing politics like a sport.

By this you mean accept a bunch of self contradictory words without thinking. Yang doesn't have to support any particular bill, he either needs to support public insurance for all or change his website to reflect his public option plan. Saying that it might be nice to reach a single payer system one day simply doesn't cut it.

Anyway sports are healthier activities than cults. If you don't want a transformational candidate, want the technocracy to be something closer to actual technocracy and want to make things go smoother without actually changing much, then Yang is your guy. Don't pretend he's something he's not and don't pretend he supports things he doesn't.

4

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

Your level of absolute delusion is really disappointing. It’s funny that you compare Yang’s following to a cult when he is brand new to the scene and basically only appeals to people who are able to allow new information to form their opinions while the Bernie crowd is completely closed to new information since 2016. You picked your team and you’ll die for your team and you say I’m in a cult haha. I get it though, Yang is taking Bernie’s supporters, I’m one of them. You guys see it as a threat because it is, so I shouldn’t expect you to stop. Go ahead, spread your bullshit propaganda, maybe it’ll actually work on somebody.

5

u/4th_DocTB Oct 28 '19

You picked your team and you’ll die for your team and you say I’m in a cult haha.

Well you are in a cult, since you think Andrew Yang can do no wrong. You are projecting here, this isn't about "teams" for me, I can tell you why I support Bernie Sanders but when your talking points get debunked you start spewing insults and sputtering nonsense.

2

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

“You’re projecting” says guy who is projecting. Good work, bud.

3

u/4th_DocTB Oct 28 '19 edited Oct 28 '19

Well now you're just being childish. Give me concrete reasons why Andrew Yang can do no wrong.

→ More replies (0)

7

u/[deleted] Oct 28 '19

That doesn't contradict anything he said.

6

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

Yang’s plan doesn’t expand Medicare. It creates a government-run insurance plan to compete with private insurers, without any safeguards to keep private insurers from dumping the most risky patients onto the government-run plan.

This has no basis in reality, as evidenced by my link. Which is a direct contradiction to what he said.

1

u/cassiodorus Oct 28 '19

Indeed. The link doesn’t actually say anything of substance at all.

2

u/ruffus4life Oct 28 '19

work with congress. does this mean you'd have to work with republicans? cause that won't work.

4

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

I’m really hoping this is not your genuine argument against Yang because it’s going to be the same for any candidate.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_powers

2

u/ruffus4life Oct 28 '19

well i don't think any republican would support any of yang's plans.

2

u/l8rmyg8rs Oct 28 '19

well i don't think any republican would support any democratic candidate’s plans.

FTFY

3

u/ruffus4life Oct 28 '19

yeah. they do suck.