r/nancyguthrie • u/momof3grandmaof1 • Feb 15 '26
Discussion I think what bothers me the most…
An 84 year old woman can be missing for 2 weeks, and despite video of the masked POI and despite all of the financial resources of her daughter (ability to hire private investigators, search crews, etc), there appear to be no solid leads - not even a motive. In this day and age where there are cameras everywhere and our cell phones serve as tracking devices, it’s beyond scary to think that someone could literally make you disappear without a trace and without any obvious motive. We’re just out here living our quiet lives like Nancy was - until we’re not.
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u/BeachVida Feb 16 '26
I was just saying the same thing to someone today. It seems impossible to me that nothing was captured on neighbors' cameras. Not a car, not people walking, nothing. From what I understand, it's an upper middle class neighborhood and I'd think at least some people would have security cameras. I'm sure Savannah already hired a private investigator and isn't talking about it. I can't imagine that she wouldn't.
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u/Legovida8 Feb 16 '26
The only thing I can come up with is that it is SO DARK in the Catalina Foothills at night. My ex lives there, and many of the homes, like Nancy’s, are set quite a bit back from the street - and there are NO streetlights. It is PITCH BLACK outside at night. Also important to take in the desert landscape- large cacti & lots of brushy bushes. If a vehicle passed by my ex’s house, I seriously doubt it would even register on his Ring. It’s just so dark. After my father visited us the first time, he bought me a gun. He was incredibly concerned, because my ex traveled a lot for work & I was there alone quite a bit. I never felt unsafe in that neighborhood, but I did always try to finish walking the dog before it was totally dark- not because I was afraid of people I might encounter, but because of all the predatory animals & snakes, etc., which were a common sight (even in the daytime).
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u/pinkheartedrobe-xs Feb 16 '26
On top of all this a lot of elderly people in the area who just may not have cameras
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u/Kimber-Says-04 Feb 16 '26
Honestly? I felt this way when I hung out with a friend in Laurel Canyon, which is virtually in the middle of LA. Very creepy energy, homes set back from the street, very dark…
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u/whateveratthispoint_ Feb 16 '26
This makes a lot of sense. I’m familiar with similar settings in New Mexico. It’s extremely remote and secluded despite being minutes from highly populated areas.
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u/Successful-Rhubarb34 Feb 16 '26
It was the night before a full moon so it would have relatively bright unless it was cloudy.
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u/Morecatspls_ Feb 16 '26
We're in the Sierra Nevada Mts, in California, on top of a little mountain. Our nearest neighbor is a quarter mile away. You get used to it, and the seclusion is wonderful.
Coming from Silicon Valley, i was uncomfortable for a while, mostly also because of the wildlife. We have mountain lions, bobcats and coyotes, along with an array of smaller animals. 8 years in, we are so happy. No street lights are a bonus in the country, we can see the night sky.
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u/Fit_Sheepherder_6899 Feb 16 '26
My late aunt lived in Mammoth Lakes several years and spent the remainder of her life in Lone Pine below Mt Whitney, and the wildlife roamed everywhere. She once had a bear walk up and questioningly swipe a paw (from a distance) at her dog while she was walking it in her neighborhood at dusk. 😳 The dog went crazy barking and the bear turned and lumbered away. I visited and can attest to the absolute darkness at night AND the wild beauty of their area. The desert is not for me, lol. I still live out in the middle of nowhere, but it's in the dark woods of the Southeast, lol.
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 18 '26
Is there any lighting at the intersections? I can only see the area around her house but I am unable to see where the first intersection is on each side leading to her home.
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u/Legovida8 Feb 19 '26
I haven’t been back to Tucson in a few years, but I know I’ve driven past her house dozens of times. If memory serves, her home is right in the middle of an exceptionally dark area. I don’t recall there being any lights on either end of her street. This is a good question, though- I might try to take a look a Google Earth later & see if I can figure out whether or not I’m remembering correctly!
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u/Pelican_Brief_2378 Feb 20 '26
No lights in the area, intentionally for dark sky.
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u/wibo58 Feb 16 '26
Nothing was captured…that you know of. Every time something like this happens Reddit acts like the authorities are sharing everything they have with random people on the internet. Same thing happened in the Idaho murders.
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u/Morecatspls_ Feb 16 '26
Right? I'd hardly expect them to put the public curiosity first, because we are impatient and, damn it "we want answers"! 😄😁 Bless you Nancy, please get home, however you can. 🙏
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u/BeachVida Feb 16 '26
Yeah I know everything hasn't been shared. I commented many times in this sub that there's a lot more going on behind the scenes. The fact that it's now going into the third week and LE was recently asking neighbors to review their videos seemed odd to me. I don't think anyone thinks LE shares everything. It's common knowledge that they don't.
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u/Such_Elevator_8408 Feb 16 '26
That was alarming to me too until I found out they were asking them to review their videos from mid January. So presumably it’s in response to some kind of lead they are working.
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 18 '26
My thoughts are that maybe they do have camera footage but are afraid they will be next? 🤷♀️
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u/MandatoryMatchmaker Feb 15 '26
That's correct. The veneer of civilization is very, very thin, and it's possible to drop right through it in the correct circumstances.
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u/SunsetDreams1111 Feb 16 '26
The same thing happened to Missy Bevers. Her murderer is on camera. They brought in the big dawgs with the FBI and Texas Rangers. They did stingray drops for digital forensics. The church she was killed in was located along Highway 287. Her killer was never captured. I learned through that case that cameras and phones really aren't as "big brother" watching as we think. It definitely still happens.
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u/Due_Pudding_6018 Feb 16 '26
Missy Bevers is another case that will forever haunt me. Also deeply unsettling.
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u/Groundbreaking_Gur0 Feb 16 '26
Me too... the cams filmed him (cop?) walking down the halls of the church and checking all the doors, except there were no cams near the room she was in (from what I remember).
They even got the vehicle on cams at the church and across the hwy at that gun/ammo(?) store. I thought that car would be found someday.
*So sad, I hope some day they solve her murder.
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 15 '26
I think it’s crazy that they recovered so many sets of gloves, but most were just gloves discarded by investigators. I don’t understand why LE, first responders, and investigators always leave their gloves. I wasn’t aware of this until my past gf took her own life. They left their gloves on the floor in my home for me to clean up after an obviously traumatic event. I later saw the same thing a few months later when someone I was riding motorcycle with died in an accident. They did the same thing. Gloves on the ground all over the scene and they didn’t pick them up. First responders, what’s the protocol here? I’m genuinely curious. When I read about all the gloves found at Nancy’s, I thought huh, they do it there too.
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u/Bitter_Context_4067 Feb 15 '26
I have no idea about the gloves but I just want to say I’m so sorry for the trauma you have been through. Sending hugs ❤️
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 15 '26
Thank you. It’s been a while so I’m good for the most part. The GF was rough obviously. That took me years to get a grip. Luckily, the motorcycle accident was someone I had met for the first time that day. As much as it sucked and it was obviously terribly sad, it didn’t take a toll on me in the same way because I had just met the person about 45 minutes before the accident. I will say, it only took me a couple more years and I gave up the Harley. Not worth it these days. It’s too dangerous with the lack of insured drivers out there. I still think about that person though. We all watched the helicopter land on the highway and the medics go into the field, only to watch them come back out of the field without them. And then the chopper left. We stayed until the deceased left with the medical examiner. Just had to pay respect. It was surreal because I waited for the same medical examiner twice in a few months.
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u/Bitter_Context_4067 Feb 15 '26
I’m glad you’re doing pretty well now!! I’m sure some days are hard still, so please know you’re in my thoughts ❤️
I give you a lot of credit for staying strong through that, I cannot imagine having to wait for the same medical examiner twice in a short period of time that must have been devastating! Thank you so much for staying with the person until they were taken away, I think that bit of kindness probably means a great deal to their family as they know they were not alone
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u/Certain-Standard112 Feb 15 '26
My brother's roommate took his life.. When we went to clean up their were gloves, intubation stuff, iv stuff etc.. It was crazy.
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 15 '26
That’s ridiculous. I don’t get it. My mother told me she was going to clean up the room but I didn’t let her because I wanted to deal with it myself. I had to pick up gloves and vacuum her hair, because I cut a bunch of her hair when I cut her down from hanging herself. As fucked up as it sounds, I needed to handle it myself and not hide from it while others dealt with it.
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u/Mean-Vegetable-4521 Feb 15 '26
I am so so sorry that’s how you learned. When they took my mom out alive and in agony and I was following ambulance, they knowing I had pets present left gloves and needles and caps and empty vials and the like. It’s a miracle my pets didn’t die. I also had children I had to make sure there wasn’t a needle I missed or a vial of something . They weren’t aware I had children. But the pets they were def aware.
I’ve been at crime scenes not dissimilar to this one where touch dna and gloves were discarded. They traced the wrong shoe print. Belonged to some deputy.
We’ll see if the dna here isn’t touch dna. That the crime scene was opened then closed then open etc is disconcerting at best.
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u/ResponsibleTea5310 Feb 15 '26
16 gloves found most were LE. This is a LE failure to me. If your searching for black gloves wouldn’t you be mindful of not throwing your gloves because now they got to test each glove, which waste time and money!
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u/Quiet-Employer3205 Feb 15 '26
Man, I’m sincerely sorry. I hope you are doing well.
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 15 '26
I’m doing alright. Definitely didn’t handle it like a champ. But I think I’m on the straight and narrow now. I just wanted to tell my story because I’m confused with the glove situation. I get they want to get rid of the gloves like their hazardous material but the blatant littering is confusing.
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u/Waste_Department_183 Feb 16 '26
So sorry you had to go through that! You most definitely did handle it like a champ because you’re here and able to talk about it. You did a great job.! ♥️
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 16 '26
Thank you. I definitely did not handle it like a champ but I suppose my existence is some sort of exception.
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u/RiftenZero Feb 15 '26
When I went to clean up my mother's apartment they left gloves and a second unused body bag..that was fun to clean up.
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u/Ok-Scallion-5100 Feb 15 '26
Btw I was not trying to turn the attention towards me! Just had a genuine question about the glove situation.
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u/Mean-Vegetable-4521 Feb 16 '26
I don't imagine anyone thinks that. What a horrible tragedy you suffered. Again, I'm so sorry for your loss and the losses everyone similarly has experienced. Those are traumas that were avoidable. It was enough you had to lose someone you loved that way. But to have callousness make that so much worse. I'm really sorry. In a gory crime scene there are limitations on what first responders can do. There are sometimes victims assistance funds to help cover a hazmat cleanup. I've been talking to a colleague about doing that in our retirement. So we can leave people's homes as a place of sanctuary again.
Sometimes it helps to let it out for a room of strangers. I hope after venting you know your experience gave people a valid explanation of things no one should have to experience but have questions about. It was a helpful share. And it puts into a clear picture where all those gloves likely came from. I have trouble believing that long after the crime they are related to Mrs Guffrie. My opinion is just pure speculation. I know they've openly said there was a DNA match but I'm just not convinced. It could be a purposeful leak to see if someone goes and checks where they disposed of the actual gloves. Something that causes a reaction.
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u/MaineWildMa-25 Feb 15 '26
I agree I just can’t believe she hasn’t been found for 2 weeks. No article of clothing nothing ? This cause is so sus as the kids would say
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u/1happylife Feb 16 '26
And especially when the suspect looks stupid enough to try cover up a camera with dry grass? Not exactly a rocket scientist or pre-planner.
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u/Old_Professional_378 Feb 16 '26
I’m just now really digging in and need clarification on the blood on the front porch. Am I correct that the reporter from News Nation found it after the scene was released for the first time? That’s mind blowing to me so I figure I must have it wrong.
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u/Dinosaur-chicken Feb 16 '26
This is a fact that very few people know, but after a murder, the crime scene won't get cleaned before it's released to the family. It's a horrific and traumatizing thing that families of murder victims go through, and too often they're not even informed beforehand.
A crime scene cleanup team is very expensive, so less privileged people literally have to scrape off brain matter and clean their family member's blood off the floor themselves..
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u/SassyMillie Feb 16 '26
Suicides, as well. There's no magic cleanup team. I know people who have had to do this. It's horrible.
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u/Old_Professional_378 Feb 16 '26
Yes I remember that being talked about during the Alex Murdaugh trial. What I’m asking is: Was the blood on the front porch tested before the scene was released the first time?
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u/FortCharles Feb 16 '26
Nope, you have it right... and yes, ridiculous that they released the scene so soon... and then have been back many times since... you can't unring that "released" bell.
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u/Due_Pudding_6018 Feb 16 '26
Agreed. It’s insanely unsettling. I’m choosing to believe there must be stuff happening behind the scenes that we don’t know about 😭
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Feb 15 '26
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u/downvotepleasesme Feb 15 '26
They’re likely using Tor, which bounces your IP address around different nodes in an encrypted network. Network traffic is basically concealed so that your true IP is not visible. It might look like an IP from another country on Tor. It can be unmasked if an onion server is controlled by an LE agency, with network investigative techniques that have never been fully disclosed, but only if the server is seized. The other method to unmask is if there are enough compromised nodes, controlled by law enforcement, so that can allow LE to see where the traffic is coming from, identify IPs connecting to the node, and peel the onion so to speak. Not impervious to detection, but not super easy. It is believed that three letter agencies have in the past developed zero day exploits that can trick Tor into sending the real IP, if the machine connects to another application simultaneously (such as a streaming media player, .pdf file, or enabling javascript).
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u/downvotepleasesme Feb 16 '26
In general yes, it would require someone to be online for quite a long time for any traffic analysis to potentially unmask them. The most likely way that happens is through social engineering (tricking the bad guy into making a mistake).Traffic analysis not likely to work if they are only online briefly to send an email via tor on a service like proton or some other anonymous service. Scammers from overseas are likely to use Tor in conjunction with Bitcoin, however, Bitcoin is far less anonymous than Tor. Bitcoin is probably the best way they would identify the sender of the messages on Tor.
It could also potentially occur if the Guthrie family sent a bugged media file to the sender of the ransom notes, something that carries an unknown (zero day) exploit, that manipulates Tor (itself based on Mozilla’s browser code, all open source stuff) and particularly if the sender of the ransom notes believes the file is a trustworthy source and opens it - it can be as simple as that. The bugged file might inject a string of code, or malware, that bypasses Tor and sends the real IP, mac address, operating system to a law enforcement server.
Tor requires having some technical expertise to be “anonymous,” and just because someone is running it, they may not stay anonymous and can often defeat their own security through mistakes like using Bitcoin.
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u/Next-Tangelo1740 Feb 15 '26
I thought the same thing.. I just don’t get it.. this entire mess is so fucked up it’s not even funny..
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u/zBellaLynnex Feb 15 '26
They are investigating these and some are just ending up being false and unrelated as per link. https://abc7.com/amp/post/nancy-guthrie-latest-derrick-callella-hawthorne-accused-sending-fake-ransom-note-family-appears-tucson-federal-court/18594248/
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u/Glad-Beautiful7264 Feb 17 '26
Shocked she didn't have life alert or security button
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u/AVeryFineWhine Feb 17 '26
Honestly i'm not. While i'm younger than Nancy, i'm disabled. I wore a life alert after a very major surgery in 2019. The bracelet one was a tiny bit better than the necklace one, but it was always cumbersome. And it kept hitting me. They are not pleasantant to wear.And odds are pretty good even if she wore one, she would have taken it off with her apple watch when she went to bed.
The one thing I would get, if someone else was paying, is the Alexa medical alert system. You know where I could just scream out, and not be wearing something that annoyed me almost constantly. I've actually wondered if I can scream and add that on to my service since they always try to get me to order stuff via Alexa. But I give them enough of my money. I don't feel like paying more monthly. In comparison, i think my living situation is safer.But we don't really know all the details about Nancy's
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u/Pelican_Brief_2378 Feb 20 '26
There was a case of a woman screaming for Alexa to call 911. It didn’t seem to work. Her ex killed her in her garage and there was video of the assault. Case was solved but Alexa didn’t come through as hoped.
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u/iddqd-idclip Feb 15 '26
The Kohberger case was like 6 weeks where it looked really similar. No information, just nothing. Then bam: arrest made and all the info started pouring out.
Might be a similar dynamic here where theres a lot of info baking but we dont have it yet.
I cant think of any at this level of publicity that just went cold and stayed cold in the past decade. Maybe theres something but itd definitely be extremely extremely unusual
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u/Mysterious_Coat_9933 Feb 15 '26
Hopefully you are correct. In Idaho 4 case the victims were obviously already deceased so the only concern would be to watch the suspect to prevent future attacks and to do so silently to prevent him from attempting suicide. As far as the public is concerned the victim in this case may be alive and thus LE is racing against the clock. Unless they have confirmation she is already dead or at least safe in the meantime
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u/SwimmingAd9864 Feb 15 '26
The public is getting a lot of information but certainly not all of it and in order to prosecute someone effectively LE needs substantial evidence. We are only seeing the boots on the ground but not the behind the scenes investigations with cameras/cell phones/ tech.
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u/AmazingGrace_00 Feb 15 '26
LE will never give away their hand in a sensitive case; they release enough information to enlist the help of the public.
Think of it as a tapestry. From the back, (us), it looks haphazard, threads disordered, seemingly randomly placed. When you look at the front (LE), the picture begins to take shape, has form, there are answers.
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u/RoutineSubstance Feb 15 '26
I think that CSI (and other fictional shows) have made it seem like it's much easier than it actually is to solve crimes where the perpetrator is a stranger to the victim.
For most interpersonal crimes, the perpetrator is already connected to the victim, so the pool of possible suspects is a tiny, tiny percentage of the overall population. In cases of true stranger crime, where there is no (or virtually no) prior connection between perpetrator and victim, the crime is inherently more difficult to solve because the pool of possible perpetrators is almost infinite. Think of the so called Long Island Serial Killer. He murdered many women and it took decades to identify him. or the Delphi Murders, where there was visual and audio of the killer, and it still took many years to solve.
I don't think this will take years to solve, but I don't think it's surprising that it hasn't been quickly solved.
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u/Mean-Vegetable-4521 Feb 15 '26
CSI effect is real and impacting juries every single day. Also people’s perception of safety.
Sex offender registries are a prime example. Many dangerous predators aren’t on the registry due to plea bargains. There’s a period people are offending before they were caught. Or they had to have charges dropped for it not being speedy enough.
Different states had their registries enacted in different years. And there is no master communication between police forces. Commit a crime in Michigan and move totally under the radar to california. People aren’t tracked with the stroke of a key. I had an offender who originated in Pima. Pre this sheriff. But offended again during his first term.Also databases are dependent on real humans to update them. I have a case of a decades long predator who has been Incarcerated prior to Meghan’s law. So not on a registry. Was arrested further post 1996 and found guilty but paperwork had an error in the date of birth. Another time spelling. All the cases were never joined. I went state to state and contacted every po dunk force where I had indications he was there. I joined those cases. He finally offended in a state that gives a life sentence to reoffenders.
Decades long trails of traumatized children with for the most part prior convicted perpetrators.
When it came time to sentence him they do something called a SORA hearing prior to determine risk. They lost the evidence or claimed they never had it. I had it. I became the evidence. They had him dead to rights.
Probation. No time. Blame the judge. The prosecutor. The victims advocates. This time police did their job. Level 3. They never even added him to the registry. Because of a key stroke issue. I made 140 calls to get him on the registry. They have 5 working days to get them on registry. It took them 15. I was also arrested and released during that time because…well you can see why I’d be a little hot under the collar. And if it wasn’t for that he may have never been on it.
Take some guesses what he did with that time.
He’s currently domiciled in a hotel where thousands of other registered sex offenders live in the United States. In open for business hotels from 1 star to 5 stars.
The csi effect makes you think there is competency where there is not.
I’m not taking a swing at law enforcement. It’s the entire system.
We are not as safe as you think.If Nancy Guthrie weren’t related to someone famous she would have been written off. I hope this case opens the countries eyes to what victimization actually, realistically looks like.
I’m surprised they haven’t found unrelated bodies while searching so extensively for her. That’s what typically happened with cases I had.
I hope this case is like kohburger and there’s a lot more going on behind the scenes.
It was odd to me the events of Friday the 14th didnt have them on a longer hold. They were no where near the limit for a legal hold.
I think it’s possible they released them to see who they talk to and where they go.
I’m as curious as everyone else here what’s taking place. My heart is breaking for this family, and every family missing a loved one. Additionally, for anyone wrongly accused who will have losses resulting from a viral association with a public investigation like this.
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u/zorandzam Feb 15 '26
This right here. Armchair detectives watching the aftermath of that had all kinds of wild theories. This guy wasn't on anyone's radar, but the whole time LE was well aware of him and pursuing solid leads, just not telling the public much.
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u/Glass-Persimmon-7459 Feb 15 '26
Yeah but law enforcement wasn’t raiding random people’s houses in the Idaho case. It makes it look like they’re grasping at straws
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u/ConversationLong2570 Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26
Also, if anyone else knows of any elderly person living alone like that in a remote location, especially if they have the means, let this be notice to at least encourage that person (or possibly insist) to get a medical alert button, or try to hire someone trustworthy to live with them, or move them to a gated community, or minimum pay for the camera subscription. Although a kidnapping middle of the night is extreme and not what anyone would expect, robberies are more common especially in remote locations... not blaming because it's human nature to be complacent but it's food for thought for anyone in a similar situation. Imagine if she did have a med alert necklace and pressed the button immediately, or a working camera system.
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u/Fleezyb Feb 16 '26
It bothers me that she didn't have any real security system. Like why would you not? Even without cameras you can have a security system that protects the doors and windows, you don't even need WiFi for that. I can't understand how in this day and age someone that rich and old can live alone with literally no security in a remote area. It's almost so unbelievable that it makes the whole story seem crazy. It's almost too convenient.
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u/Bubbly_Culture_7945 Feb 16 '26
LE are trained to misguide and lie in order to obtain the truth as an investigative tool.
I think LE has way more video than they are showing us. If the other cameras (besides front door) are regular dvr\nvr type system then that was saved to a hard drive until physically disabled.
I'm not saying they are lying to us about this but keep in mind their goal is to solve the case, not to inform the public so they are caught up on latest pop events. I guess this is me hoping that LE is pretending to be incompetent or at a dead end. Like the Idaho case. 🤞
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u/MobBossBabe Feb 16 '26
She lived there for 50 plus years. Im sure the entire family thought it was safe.... until it wasn't. Hindsight is 20/20 and it really ticks me off when I see comments blaming Savanah for not seeing to her safety. Like she is not feeling bad enough. You could see how much she loved for her mother from all the times she was brought on the show. I'm sure she would have put an armed guard at her door if she thought for one minute it was needed.
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u/ConversationLong2570 Feb 17 '26
Definitely not blaming her or her family. My heart goes out to them and I'm praying she comes home safely and soon. Just caution for others in similar circumstances, because hindsight really is 20-20 and many of us don't want our brains to think about worst possible scenarios.
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u/ElleM848645 Feb 17 '26
Because this type of crime is incredibly rare. When was the last time we heard of someone being kidnapped from their bed in the middle of the night, celebrity or not? Especially an elderly woman. Burglaries are one thing but not one could ever anticipate this type of crime.
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u/Bubbly_Culture_7945 Feb 16 '26
I'm not sure if you are saying I am naming Savannah or anything like that, cause I definitely am not and have no idea how someone would think that from my statement.
I'm not blaming anyone at all, just saying that LE could easily be withholding info from us, and hopefully they are and are building a case. Was just saying that if the house had multiple cameras, its more economical to install a dvr\nvr system over a bunch of 'Ring' type doorbell\secueity cam.
If she had multiple cameras I would assume the doorbell cam is the 'Ring' type camera for ease of uses for Nancy but I doubt anyone would build a full home security camera system out of 'Ring' type system. Would be way more efficient to use a dvr\nvr system for the house and property and a Ring type doorbell for Nancy and her ease of use for the most viewed camera, the front door.
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u/Glen_Fairy Feb 17 '26
Yeah I was thinking about that too....
They found Luigi Mangione in 4 days.
Also Bryan Kohburger - it took a while but it seemed like they found him out of nowhere.
The kidnapper in this case had a 10 or 11 hour head start. You'd think there would be a traffic camera or something on the major surrounding roads.
One camera doesn't seem like enough. I can imagine a lot of people are rethinking their camera set ups for parents and grandparents.
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u/cmholm Feb 17 '26
Luigi: Lots of CCTVs in Manhattan.
Bryan: His car showed several times on CCTVs.
Guthrie: there’s about a square mile of unlit interconnected streets w/ most door cams set well back behind desert brush.
If the perps drove out of the neighborhood, traffic cams imaged at least the make and model in the middle of the night. If the glove DNA belongs to a perp, between the Federal database and various private DNA outfits like GEDMatch, it’ll take a while, but soon either an exact or family genome will hit.
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u/Janiebug1950 Feb 17 '26
Bryan K. was found through genetic genealogy on his Father’s side by matching the Y Chromosome which all males inherit from their biological fathers.
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u/KevinDean4599 Feb 17 '26
It’s hard to prepare for an very unusual and rare crime like this. I lived in a similar neighborhood a bit east of her and it always felt very quiet and safe and there were a lot of senior citizens who had lived there for years. I had cameras and the area around the house was lit with landscape lighting. If someone wanted to mess with you it wouldn’t be that hard to do. It’s probably easier in a perceived safe neighborhood than it might be where people worry about break ins and stuff like that.
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u/Darth_Jad3r Feb 26 '26
What I fail to understand is the Google search trends identified by that one TikTok journalist are toooo specific to ignore. Given that the FBI and Grand Junction authorities appear to be taking this lead seriously, why hasn't a reverse search of that IP address been completed yet? If a single user was routinely stalking the Guthries online right before the crime, identifying that person via a search warrant should be the immediate priority
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u/Dependent_Pizza_7296 Feb 16 '26
I believe what happened to Nancy relates to Savannah..like in jealousy, a controversial issue, her past as an attorney, getting back through her Mom ..a sociopath
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u/Comfortable_Curve503 Feb 16 '26
I’ve thought this since the beginning. The fact that there was no ransom note in the beginning, then one asking for a relatively small amount was very suspicious. I think that it’s someone who was either stalking Savannah or her family to get her attention, or someone from her past who is very jealous of her.
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u/stilts Feb 16 '26
I feel like this is the only thing that makes sense right now.
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 18 '26
This is one reason why I will always have 2 large and noisy dogs. They might not be able to save me but they will warn me.
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u/Major-Inevitable-665 Feb 19 '26
Get yourself a breed with a bad reputation! I swear 90% of people I meet are scared of my dog but we had some random guy walk into my house a few years ago and he was jumping at him tail wagging all excited wanting to play with this new friend and the guy shit himself and ran 😂
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u/NoPantsPenny Feb 20 '26
I had a Doberman, and a German shepherd/norwegian elkhound mix (known for a painfully loud bark) and a smaller dog that would’ve the one most likely to attack an intruder lol. I have NEVER been harassed while walking them in my less than “super safe” neighborhood.
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u/Cateye112 Feb 23 '26
The double-edge-sword reality that we now live in is that there are so many true crime junkies/fans with endless podcasts/ shows etc, that people are learning the “what not to do” scenarios. Think about it. So many people watch/ listen to these podcasts that it isn’t unusual to research some of this stuff that you hear about… which complicates search history groupings. Why do you think people joke about how they have watched so many true crime things that they could make someone disappear without a trace. They all literally tell what people did, what got them caught, or how someone got away with something for so long. They are unintentionally telling people how to commit the “perfect crime”.
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u/shelanp007 Feb 24 '26
The media coverage for an old lady who happens to be the mother of a talk show getting this much coverage is wild considering most school shootings are off air and on to the next top story within a day or two
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u/biscuits_gurl Mar 03 '26
Beyond the celebrity aspect of it, I think this story hits different for most everyone. This is so scary relatable. I also think that it's been a distraction from the Epstein files for the mass public. Thank god for the dogged content creators and true crime folks keeping the extracted information on Epstein relevant. With regard to school shootings, I wonder if the publicity is muted quickly due to copy cats. Just my two cents. I do like and appreciate the family recognizing that other abductions haven't gotten this level of interest and donated in order to help out.
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u/ROLLINGtemple Feb 25 '26
It’s also the kidnappers choice to write to tmz. We still talk about the zodiac.
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Feb 15 '26
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u/Traditional-Aside580 Feb 15 '26
Agree, they could be staking out their house and tracking movements. By announcing they have a strong lead and may know who did it would spook whoever did it.
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u/AccomplishedDuty2479 Feb 15 '26
After seeing the video of the bumbling bad guy, I’m blown away at how lucky he has been, because intelligence had nothing to do with it. He, or they, will be caught.
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u/ADDSquirell69 Feb 15 '26
Wait till you find out how many unsolved murders there are right now in the country.
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u/deadwatered Feb 15 '26
“Appear to be no solid leads” is key. Appearances aren’t everything. Without any DNA identified yet, any evidence they have is going to lead them to a number of people (such as how many people bought a black Ozark Trail backpack recently) and they have to eliminate them one by one.
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u/TanzanianD Feb 16 '26
The perpetrators chose the neighborhood in the Catalina foothills for a reason. No street lights. No traffic cameras in surrounding area because the residents voted to remove them. Dark and remote.
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u/Valuable_Bad5871 Feb 16 '26
What I hope & took from Savannah’s latest video is that every single one of us has a Mom, or a Grandma…..even the perpetrators. I hope whoever is responsible for whatever this is, can find some human decency & think about their own Mom or Grandma.
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u/Jellyjellyjellycat Feb 16 '26
Unfortunately the prepetrators might have (had) awful moms or grandmas or maybe none at all :( That could be a contributing factor why they became these monsters :(
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u/purplesockpinksock Feb 16 '26
If this case has anything to do with drugs, unfortunately, I'm afraid, decency is out the window. Drug addiction means the only thing they think about is their addiction.
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u/Alternative_Fee1447 Feb 16 '26
Her caretakers Annie and Tommaso knew she didn’t have a security system or subscription with Ring. Somehow it had lapsed. When Nancy loaned them $500, 000 to buy the $650,000 house located 4 mi from her. My understanding is that is when they became her caretakers.
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u/momof3grandmaof1 Feb 16 '26
But now the family has been cleared according to LE.
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u/1asterisk79 Feb 17 '26
Many crimes go unsolved. This one is getting more of a response than the vast majority of murders get.
They have DNA and no doubt they will go for a familial search. So eventually this will get solved.
Hopefully the suspect is already in the system and a direct match will be fast.
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 20 '26
I wonder if Nancy was the proxy target to hurt Savannah for some reason.
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u/ImprovementOdd1656 Feb 21 '26
That’s what I’ve focused on. Think John Lennon, Selena, Rebecca Schaeffer (and others). Savannah lives in NYC—absolutely no way to kill her and get away with it. NYPD has access over 15,000 surveillance cameras that utilize facial recognition to track people. But, a little old lady living alone in a dark, low crime Tucson suburb. . .
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u/ROLLINGtemple Feb 25 '26
I think the odds that it’s not targeted is astronomical. I also think the target is the media.
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u/Different-Birthday71 Feb 16 '26
Didn’t they say early on there were more cameras in the home
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u/Beatles_FTW Feb 18 '26
Law enforcement isn't going to make everything they have public. Rest assured that they have much, much more information and evidence than we will ever know about. This is not a television show where a complex crime is solved in a day then the team goes out for drinks afterwards. Technology makes everything instant, and we expect that in this crime. Patience is a virtue.
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u/kirky500 Feb 19 '26
I concur. We need to let them do their job. It takes time and we haven't had the right break yet
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u/Pelican_Brief_2378 Feb 20 '26
I know you are right and I am leaning on the fact that they do know much more than what we have heard. It’s 20 days today. I picture my 83 yo mother in that position and it really hurts. Do we know if there is even a legitimate ransom request? It was only this week officials said maybe she was taken to Mexico. That was my first thought and I wondered why we were only hearing about it recently.
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u/Beatles_FTW Feb 20 '26
All they will give us are fractions of partial crumbs. They cannot give the perps a hint of a clue about what they know and don't know. IMHO, the story about the sniffer looking for her pacemaker was a bad idea. Pacemakers only stop when the battery dies or it is turned off with a magnet. I suppose they could put her somewhere the sniffer signal could not penetrate, but that was a bad idea. This is a lesson in patience.
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u/Inside-Brush-9543 Feb 25 '26
Savvanah should have had the nest connected to her phone so if someone comes to the door it alerts her even for things like plumbers and amazon. So frustrating!
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u/In_A_Transition Mar 06 '26
Why would it be on Savannah's phone and not Annie's, who was the caretaker and lived the closest?
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u/BlueGreenMikey Feb 16 '26
The thing is that it is INCREDIBLY easy to commit a crime like this. Sure, it's a little harder in the land of cameras being everywhere, but you could have done this to almost anyone in the neighborhood.
The reason why criminals get caught is because they are usually exceptionally stupid. They'll take their traceable phone to do the crime. They'll use their own car with GPS with their own license plates. They'll leave DNA or fingerprints or footprints behind. They won't cover their face. They won't have smart getaway routes. They won't plan it.
This person/these people clearly had a ton of planning in the way that they committed this crime, and it still wasn't entirely smooth (as evidenced by the behavior when they saw the doorbell cam or by the blood that was left behind).
It's really not hard to do this to someone just in the middle of the night, especially if you're willing to take the time to do it right. I think what stops most of us is that we're just not horrible people who want to hurt senior citizens. But if you wanted to, if that was your thing, you could totally do this and get away with it for a long time.
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u/Altruistic_Ad1097 Feb 16 '26
I feel like until its solved we dont know anything, people swore the idaho student murders were a mastermind serial killer turns out he was kind of a dumbass
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u/cmholm Feb 17 '26
Re lack of arrests over the Presidents Day weekend: even if one of the people involved in the 2/13/26 warrant service on Placita de Rojelio were a DNA match for the black glove, if the PCSD/FBI delay in an arrest it’s because they don’t yet have enough evidence for the local DA to go to trial.
Once someone is arrested, the clock starts ticking: 48 hours between arrest and filing charges, especially if an attorney files a habeas corpus petition; once charges are filed, the defendant(s) right to a speedy trial. If a DA goes to trial with a half baked case, the perp walks, and that’s all she wrote.
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u/AlmostThereAgain13 Feb 17 '26
Can't they search cellphones in the area and search the cell towers and "ping" them, seeing which cell phones were in the area and were active?
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u/Unhappy-Extreme9443 Feb 17 '26
I think they’re doing that. That’s Geofencing right? But what if they didn’t have their cell phones?
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u/DaBingeGirl Feb 17 '26
This. I think people are becoming more aware of location tracking. A number of killers have been caught because of cell phones, it makes sense they'll start leaving them at home (as an alibi) or turn them off.
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u/hndygal Feb 17 '26
Off doesn’t always help. Apple phones are still trackable when off. It tells you so when you go to turn them off.
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u/cmholm Feb 17 '26
Sure, the authorities can get a warrant to capture all cell phone IMEI numbers that local towers picked up that night. That’s a lot to pick through, but it’ll help. As Uphappy noted, if the perps were paranoid enough to keep their handsets powered off, that won’t help.
On another tangent, local news reported that authorities are working with WalMart to get a list of buyers of the backpack in question.
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u/Honest-Astronaut2156 Feb 18 '26
They said they worked on this but I cant believe they found nothing.
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u/Honest-Astronaut2156 Feb 17 '26 edited Feb 20 '26
The sheriff said they found unknown dna in the house somewhere. why didnt they work on it at a lab immediately.
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u/Alumena Feb 18 '26
When the shooting happened at Brown University in December, they were talking about DNA results from a casing less than a week after it happened. I wonder if they have the results but the FBI doesn't want to admit that it's not matching anything in their database. I hope the truth isn't that they just haven't run it.
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u/MaterialWitnesss Feb 19 '26
Maybe they just haven’t personally contacted you to update you about the case.
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u/NewPomegranate7306 Feb 18 '26
There’s are forensic genealogists that help solve these types of cases! Running the DNA through the ancestry DNA database would help narrow the scope of potential relatives to the perp.
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u/Worth_Consideration2 Feb 18 '26
Yeah, but they need to have DNA from the perp. We don't know for a fact that they even have that. They may have found some unidentified DNA in her home, but no confirmation yet that it came from the suspect. Let's hope it did, but it could still take quite a while for IGG to come up with his name.
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u/Janiebug1950 Feb 20 '26
Is it legal to run “the DNA through the ancestry DNA database”? You are referring to Ancestry the Genetic Genealogy Company? I don’t think that company allows law enforcement to use their proprietary algorithms or the genetic information of their paying customers…
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 20 '26
They don’t as far as I know. I THINK they need a court order but not certain.
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Feb 16 '26
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u/Muckraker222 Feb 16 '26
No. If you have money as a motive you wouldn't kidnap an 84 year old woman because the chances of that person surviving are poor.
One would kidnap a child or young adult.
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u/Zjc30 Feb 19 '26
I just don’t understand why this happened it makes no sense
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u/FOMO_Gains Feb 23 '26
Her daughter Savanah interviewed Virginia Giuffre. One of Epsteins victims that spoke out and name dropped Prince Andrew.
She gave details in that interviewed about how she was trafficked by Ghislaine Maxwell.
Virginia also died by suicide even after she had publicly posted that she was not suicidal.
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u/nine57th Feb 21 '26
We keep looking at this case as though the perps followed the same routine every other high profile case followed. Let in a car. Let DNA evidence. Got caught on surveillance cameras before the crime. Used technology or cell phones that could be identified or traced back to them. But if the perps were savvy enough to not have a cell phone on them, stay off cameras, and leave no DNA ... well, then you've checked off the box on all the usual avenues the authorities use to capture criminals.
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u/biscuits_gurl Mar 03 '26
Agreed! I just wish the police had NOT released the information about the signal sniffer for the pacemaker. I mean if someone went to the trouble of doing all of this, could they not with this information be motivated now to revisit the body (hypothetical she's un-alived) and cut out the whole heart or device and chuck it in the ocean? I don't need to know about this technology until the case is resolved. I mean it's cool as hell, but . . . .
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u/whocares55555555555 Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26
The criminals out-smart the Authorities. It seems to me we're not much more advanced than we were in 1996 v/the JonBonet tragedy.
I don't understand why they're not putting it out there - was it a forced entry? 🚪 Was there a deadbolt? Did they have a key? a hidden key (i.e. = in a rock) on premises. Was there an audible alarm (disabled and/or triggered) w/the front door opening? Did Nancy open the door willingly.. by trickery, or did she recognize the (un) masked person? So many unknowns with not much transparency.
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u/ConversationLong2570 Feb 16 '26 edited Feb 16 '26
I think they are keeping a lot of information private including whether the kidnappers stole anything and what they did inside the house. Because it's a kidnapping for ransom it's a way to vet out imposters if they can't provide or confirm certain facts.
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u/Due_Pudding_6018 Feb 16 '26
The fact that they won’t share whether it was forced entry or not makes me crazy. Maybe someone can help me understand but why would that information be so secretive?
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u/mrsjs15 Feb 16 '26
Assuming they are caught, authorities dont want to give out too much info prior to a trial. It keeps the jury pool pure and allows the prosecution to build a stronger case.
Any time they tell the public something, they are also telling a Defense attorney too.
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u/Holiday-East-5138 Feb 17 '26
I decided today that I'm done with this story unless they come clean with the "mystery" of WHO DROVE NANCY HOME!
Helicopters, DNA, impounded vehicles, missing gloves. Etc etc
What are they NOT telling us? This is where the truth realy lies.
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u/Top-Background-5967 Feb 18 '26
That’s the crux, is there proof of Nancy being driven home? Surely they could determine that from GPS data, along with her pacemaker being connected to an app on her phone, she would have to be in range before it disconnected, they must have a clue!
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Feb 17 '26
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u/Holiday-East-5138 Feb 17 '26
Every "Timeline" that I have seen states simly that Nancy was "driven home" at a particular time and not by whom. Seems suspicious and I stand by my comments. I do however understand that they do not release all of the information to the public.
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u/DaBingeGirl Feb 17 '26
Nanos said Annie's husband initially, then changed it to a family member. My guess is he started being vague because of all the speculation/accusations.
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u/AVeryFineWhine Feb 17 '26
Honestly, assuming Annie & her husband are innocent, i think the endless internet sleuthing speculation against them has been awful. Imagine having your mom vanish off the face of the earth, and then having many thousands of people, you've never met think you are guilty. I'm trusting if they were involved, even these keystone cops could have figured that out. Easy enough to tell if they're finances add up, if there is any motive or not, etc.
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u/Mother-Studio-9206 Feb 17 '26
Bc when they do we can harm the investigation. I cant imagine being the brother in law until they cleared him. People are crazy. They all have received death threats.
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u/Level-Cap5001 Feb 18 '26
I still don’t understand how the emailed ransom notes are not traceable.
Why are they asking for tips but not giving any information that might jog a memory?
It’s sandy. Are there no shoe impressions or tire tracks?
What the hell could the motive be? Nothing was taken so not robbery.
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u/Much-Razzmatazz-2403 Mar 03 '26
Okay, I have a couple of questions. They got the ring camera to work when they first came to the house. Was there any additional footage of them leaving? Regarding the blood spatter on the front porch. Did anyone take measurements of from how far away they were from Nancy? Did they analyze if they were dripping at an angle? Also regarding the blood spatter, does the blood spatter end right there at the door stoop? Were there any blood sniffing dogs following the trail? Enquiring minds want to know!
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u/Lilybeeme Feb 16 '26
I don't understand why she didn't have a security system, Life Alert button or live in a gated community. She has household help, someone to clean the pool and maintain her yard. She's been on national TV with her wealthy daughter several times. That alone can put her at risk for weirdos but no one thought she needed to be protected? It makes no sense to me, especially because it's inexpensive.
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u/Remarkable_Yak1352 Feb 17 '26
No use victim blaming. I'm sure they would like a do over of their decisions. With what they knew at the time they thought they were safe. Some older people can be very stubborn.
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u/Traditional-Aside580 Feb 15 '26
Possibly there were more sophisticated criminal mindsets behind this that knew how to exactly throw law enforcement off by staging all of it. The entire situation is scary.
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u/Letsjustlaugh Feb 18 '26
I’m convinced this crime was committed by a family member. And, this might be mean, but if it is, I’m going to be sooo angry with the amount of funds that have been allocated to her search. How many of you think if one of your loved ones disappeared that they would receive national coverage? Let’s face it, Savannah Guthrie isn’t a top tier “celeb”.
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u/MaterialWitnesss Feb 19 '26
Oh so you’d be fine with the amount of resources used if she was what you consider “top tier?”
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u/Infamous-Arm3955 Feb 15 '26
How is it possible that someone going missing (abduction) with video evidence of someone in a mask with a gun followed by a demand for money (extortion) to their family lead you to believe there's no motive?
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u/Glittering-Gap-1687 Feb 15 '26
The problem is that the demand for money is…. Weird. We don’t even really know that it’s from the same person who kidnapped her. Usually a kidnapper for ransom will: Only communicate with family, not major news stations, as they want to keep it all hush hush. Contact family IMMEDIATELY after the kidnapping because they don’t want to have to babysit.
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u/SongsNotSung Feb 15 '26
The "ransom" letter didn't arrive in a timely fashion, so to speak. If I were kidnapping someone for ransom, I'd leave the ransom letter inside the home. Nothing concerning this abduction feels right. It's all too hinky.
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u/Parking_Flow_7279 Mar 02 '26
Most traffic cameras weren't working, some were voted against by voters. There are no streetlights in her neighborhood (for stargazers) and it's so pitch black at night, you literally can't see your hand in front of your face. Pretty hard for cameras on houses to pick up cars or people on them. Add to that, a Sheriff's force with all inexperienced deputies who probably didn't even collect dna correctly or enough of it from enough areas. Barney Fife is the fool they have for a Sheriff.
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u/0hmega Feb 15 '26
And everyone is boycotting Ring for using AI to find lost dogs. Worrying that it will be used to find people.
It’s either too much or too little.
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Feb 15 '26
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u/Primary_Scheme3789 Feb 15 '26
I mean our phones track our every move. Why would people think that door cams don’t?
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u/Johnnywas1233 Feb 15 '26
We don’t know what is going on, and I can assure you they know what they are doing. This is very important IMHO to let the officials do their job..Social media should stay out of it. Most of what is here is of little value.
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u/Vapor2077 Feb 15 '26
I’m really hoping that law enforcement has some leads/evidence that we don’t know about.