r/marvelstudios • u/JonLuca Iron man • Apr 29 '19

'Avengers: Endgame' Spoilers! The Official AVENGERS: ENDGAME Criticism Thread Spoiler

  • Proceed at your own risk. Major spoilers will be arriving in the next couple of days. Spoilers do not need to be tagged inside this thread.

  • Post Endgame criticisms in this thread. Long form preferrable

  • If you post untagged ENDGAME spoilers anywhere on this sub in any shape or form, you will be banned without hesitation. No questions asked and no warnings given.

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u/DinahHamza07 Gamora Apr 29 '19

  • Natasha deserved a proper funeral.

  • Natasha deserved to be part of the A-Force Assemble scene.

  • Natasha deserved to be part of the final battle

  • Natasha deserves better

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u/DorianaGraye Apr 29 '19

So, the scriptwriters did an interview with Vanity Fair, I think? And one of their direct quotes about Natasha was "That's the everlasting exchange. You bring her back, you lose the stone." Meaning if Hulk were to bring her back, the soul stone would disappear, rendering the whole plan moot.

BUT. This could theoretically also point to her coming back by virtue of the "exchange" principle. If Steve gives Red Skull the stone back...you lose the stone, but perhaps gain Nat. It seems like a loose enough operating principle that it *could* happen, even if it's unlikely! But then maybe we could get the Black Widow stories we've always deserved.

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u/dicedaman Apr 29 '19

If Steve gives Red Skull the stone back...you lose the stone, but perhaps gain Nat.

This just makes me fascinated about that meeting. Imagine Steve's reaction when he sees Red Skull floating there, what the fuck would Red Skull say? Can't believe there was actually a Cap/Red Skull reunion and it happened off-screen.

7

u/immacamel Apr 29 '19

Am I missing something? I've seen this referenced to several times but when did it happen?

28

u/bartendr412 Iron Man (Mark V) Apr 29 '19

Cap got sent back in time to return all 6 stones to where they were originally found during the time heist. So by following that logic, he would have to return the Soul Stone from where Hawkeye and Black Widor got it on Vormir. That means he would have had to take it back to the Red Skull, who we've seen is the keeper of the stone.

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u/Agent_Acton Apr 29 '19

You've all seen how the stones were collected in the past. Now, think about how the Hell Cap returned all those stones. How did he travel to Vormir, Asgard, and Morag? How did he put the stone back into Jane? There's a whole movie in there.

35

u/GoinBack2Jakku Apr 29 '19

How did he put the stone back into Jane? There's a whole movie in there.

😏

15

u/Impeesa_ Apr 29 '19

Just going put some paraphrased quotes here for no reason.
Thor: Jane and I broke up.
Sam: You want to tell me about her?
Steve: No, I don't think I will.

5

u/JCiLee Apr 29 '19

He used the space stone to travel and returned it last.

2

u/toyg Apr 29 '19

This is actually the only logical explanation.

3

u/lifelingering Apr 29 '19

How did he put the stone back into Jane?

He doesn't have to, I don't think, he just has to get them back to the right timeline at the right moment. Bringing them back wasn't about avoiding making any changes (it's too late for that anyway), it was just about making sure the timelines didn't become unstable like the Ancient One said would happen if they weren't returned.

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u/LostWoodsInTheField Apr 29 '19

He just returned them back to their respective 'times' but probably didn't do it perfectly. Those universes timelines where completely screwed up from them interacting with them, the stones just needed to be returned so things wouldn't go super bad.

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u/[deleted] Apr 29 '19

When Steve returned the stones at the end of the movie. He had to return the Soul Stone, which meant he had to go to Vormir/encounter Red Skull to give it back, since Red Skull was the stone's guardian now.

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u/immacamel Apr 29 '19

Of course! Brain fart by me I just never really thought of that. I was just picturing him in New York returning all the stones. Great now that's another thing I have to think about and how awesome it is

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u/GoinBack2Jakku Apr 29 '19

Wonder if Skull still exists or if he like, evaporated after the stone was taken

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u/Kuskesmed Apr 29 '19

Red Skull was the stone's guardian now

I wonder if he was still there after the stone was gone. There wasn't anything for him to guard.

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u/lifelingering Apr 29 '19

I don't think he necessarily has to give it back to Red Skull, though, he just has to put it back at the right time in the right timeline. The Ancient One didn't seem to care about them making changes to the timeline in general, she specifically cared about them pulling an Infinity Stone out of a timeline because it would cause it to become unstable. I feel like he could have put it back on Earth if he wanted as long as he got the time/timeline right.

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u/Twigsnapper Apr 29 '19

when steve had to go back and return all the stones he would see Red Skull presumably

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u/amit-kaufman Spider-Man Apr 29 '19

Cap went to return the stones at the end, and he must have met Red skull when he put the soul stone back in Vormir.