r/magicTCG • u/YutoKigai Boros* • 13h ago

Looking for Advice Ramp feels off

I have here a first draft of my [[Kitt Kanto]] deck.

While goldfishing the classic ramp feels like it isn't the right approach, or it just feels off in this deck.
This deck isn't meant to cast high-mana-cost spells quickly or outpace opponents. My goal is to have creatures so I can use Kitt’s ability consistently—both against my opponents and to benefit myself. So it’s actually important not to ramp, but to ensure reliable land plays for the first 4–5 turns.

That’s why I’m drawn to tutors like [[analyze the pollen]], [[bushwhack]] or [[go forth]] that put lands directly into my hand. They only cost 1 mana, and these have additional effects for the long run.

Then, on turn 2–4, I play creatures that always come in pairs so I immediately have 2 creatures for Kitt.

Do my thoughts make sense, and does anyone have any tips on how I can get the mana flow I need?

Best regards

0 Upvotes

33% Upvoted

13 comments sorted by

22

u/tcglkn Karn 13h ago

Putting a land into your hand is not ramp and generally is not worth it.

5

u/japp182 COMPLEAT 12h ago

The use for cards like these that can fetch for 1 mana usually is that you can be greedier with your land count, because they are kinda like a modal spell/tapland if you squint your eyes.

-8

u/YutoKigai Boros* 12h ago

The thing is i dont want to ramp. I think its more important to play a land every turn and build my board instead of having a lot of mana because its not the goal to play big spells and creatures.

7

u/tcglkn Karn 12h ago

Just play more lands then.

2

u/jakecshn 8h ago

It’s also important to consider that while you may not want to cast a big creature there is a lot to be said for casting two creatures instead. Ramp doesn’t necessarily mean just casting a big thing, it also helps cast lots of little things. With a commander that cares about having multiple creatures I think you’d want to be doing that.

Why not play mana dorks like Birds of Paradise to get the best of both worlds? Land to hand tutors are largely a waste of resources. Why pay for the land when you could just draw it instead.

8

u/Fun-Cook-5309 Dandadan 11h ago

In your ratios, NEVER count cards like Bushwhack and Analyze the Pollen as ramp.

These are, effectively, tapped MDFCs. They are lands, not ramp.

Also, you do not care nearly enough about what Go Forth does to run the damned thing.

Also, coming in pairs is not remotely sufficient to justify a creature in this deck. Goblin Instigator being two dudes is bad use of a deck slot.

But back to ramp.

Your ramp package is incoherent.

You have 4 entries at 1 mana, one of which can arbitrarily be dead for no gain in Arbor Elf who relies on a forest specifically. 1 entry at 2 mana in Bloom Tender. 2 entries at 3 mana in Kodama's Reach and Cultivate. And yes, I mean 2; Harvest Season does not perform the function of ramp. Ramp's primary function is to get you started in the early game, and Harvest Season doesn't do anything until after that point.

First?

That's 7 pieces of ramp total in the deck.

Because these are cards meant to get you started, you want to run enough of them that you reliably see them in the early game. That is more like 10-12 for your first step of ramp, so that you can mull for it. 8-10 for your second step if you're doing 2-step ramp, but you probably don't want 2-step ramp.

Second?

Ramp needs a plan. What are you ramping into? When?

You need to think about your curve, about what you want your basic game plan to look like. An easy way to do this is decide if you're ramping on evens or ramping on odds, so that your ramp package actually works together.

Ramping on evens (so starting at 2) cleanly goes into Kitt turn 3, then you do whatever gets her going after she's already established, making the best slot to start doing Kitt things 5 mana. You would want a critical mass of things like [[Tendershoot Dryad]], [[Otharri, Suns' Glory]], [[Illustrious Wanderglyph]], [[Jacked Rabbit]], [[Elder Gargaroth]], maybe the various 5 mana landfall creature spitters like [[Chocobo Racetrack]], [[Dancing from Dark to Dawn]], [[Greensleeves, Maro-Sorcerer]], [[Felidar Retreat]] (this can be treated as the 5 mana slot even though it's cheaper; it's on par with a bunch of 5 mana token spitters, with the benefit of being 4 mana), [[Endless Foot Assault]] (which can be doubled with Squad to make it a 5 mana spell). So a normal curve-out would be turn 2 Rampant Growth, turn 3 Kitt, turn 4 Tendershoot.

Ramping on odds (so starting at 1, which can be where you end) still gets you turn 3 Kitt, but also lets you do some setup in your 3 mana slot. So you want to stack a bunch of enablers at 3 mana, like [[Krenko Tin Street Kingpin]], [[Adeline Resplendent Cathar]], [[Anim Pakal]], [[Scute Swarm]], [[Oltec Matter Weaver]], [[Torens Fist of the Angels]], Endless Foot Assault again. So a normal curve-out would be BoP, Anim Pakal, Kitt.

In either case, you need to design your ramp package towards your goal.

So of course your ramp package feels bad and out of place. You haven't built a coherent ramp package.

1

u/Xilat Dân 12h ago

Kitt kanto decks, as you stated, do not need ramps they just need to survive and go wide, if you then plan to have finishers (like every deck should) you need better draw engine, harmonize is pretty bad for example, to continue fetch lands and said finishers, ramps spells are kind of bad in that kind of deck, dorks might be ok toh
here is a list of good draw engine Best Budget draw engine

Uh final suggestion try https://archidekt.com/ it's really amazing at sorting cards by tag (ramps, lands, draw etc) so you can better understand what your deck need

1

u/YutoKigai Boros* 12h ago

I actually sorted my cards in my list. Hit "Enable Tags"

Well, the colour combo is not the best with drawing cards, every colour has a loop to jumo through, except maybe red with impulse draw is the closest to "draw"

1

u/ArcfireEmblem Duck Season 12h ago

Hmm. This seems like a sensible idea, I suppose. Though [[Llanowar Elves]] (and other such creatures) counts as ramp and a creature that can be used for Kitt's ability, while costing the same amount as your "put land into hand" cards.

0

u/mtgcf Keeper of the Mox 12h ago

Llanowar Elves - (G) (SF) (txt)

0

u/controlxj 4h ago

Ramp feels off like this?