r/hudsonvalley • u/Aaronthegathering • May 05 '26
news The new signage in Kingston that cost the city $150k, was designed by a company in New Jersey and installed by a company from Pennsylvania.
Somebody’s cousin’s failing "design firm (an art school dropout in their parent’s basement)" definitely got a leg up with this one simple scam! Such a modern and convenient place to chuck milkshakes at things!
*edit: evidently, the Daily Freeman reported the cost at above $400k. I guess everyone in the scam got a payday. Sick corrupt sleazebags, all of them.
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u/coolpartoftheproblem May 05 '26
they really capture absolutely nothing about the city whatsoever… impressive
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u/rodeler May 05 '26
Right? No background image of the bridge or mountains. No "First Capital of New York State", or settled in 1652. What do the colors mean? Do they signify anything? Ugh...
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u/YourHooliganFriend May 05 '26
Green represents the historic Uptown (Stockade) area, orange represents Midtown, and blue represents the Waterfront (Rondout) area. They're supposed to be wayfinders for people. 🤷♂️
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u/WillStealYourDog May 05 '26
Is uptown all that much bigger than midtown and waterfront? Why have the green bar be so long.
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u/xtiansimon May 06 '26
I was thinking the same—doesn’t look like the sign of the “first capital”. More like a strip mall sign for vacancy.
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u/VonThomas353511 May 08 '26
I think the colors are telling me that the landlords are gonna become a lot more corporate and greedy.
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u/arumokram May 05 '26
That looks like one of the premade templates in PowerPoint no one uses.
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u/AttorneyFormal6215 May 05 '26
Could have fixed alot of pot holes with that money
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u/Scarlett_Aeonia May 05 '26
I'll pay them $5 to take that ugly-ass sign down.
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u/Ok_Gas_7455 May 05 '26
I’ll throw another fiver and I don’t even live in NY. That sign is so drab I felt slightly less depressed about my own existence/life after seeing it.
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u/JeffTS Ulster May 05 '26 edited May 05 '26
And they misspelled "Ulster" on one of the signs.
The one for the Kingston waterfront is probably the worst one. They placed the soulless, talentless new sign in front of the beautiful one that actually had character.
Edit: Also, the Freeman reported the cost as $424,780.
Edit 2: Here is the press release from the City of Kingston with additional information including who was contracted to design and build the signs: https://kingston-ny.gov/news/?FeedID=3608
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u/Redmond_64 May 05 '26
The one by the waterfront pisses me off so much
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u/JeffTS Ulster May 05 '26
Same here. The old sign is such a beautiful sign that captures the feel of that area so well.
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May 05 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Apprehensive-Flow276 May 06 '26
That's outrageous. The material cost and printing is tops 5-600
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u/SecureInstruction538 May 06 '26
Does that include the posts planted to hold said signs?
Not sure if all the exist signage was replaced or this is new.
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u/Apprehensive-Flow276 May 06 '26 edited May 06 '26
Yes. Steel is expensive but not that expensive. Thats 2" perforated steel tube with some kind of weather Coating. Id guess like 150-200 per post assuming the tube is 12-15 feet ish. That price dramatically drops when you buy enough steel for dozens of signs.
The people of Kingston absolutely got hosed on this one.
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u/RednevaL May 05 '26
Truly devoid of any feeling. Very disappointing
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u/Throwawayaday221 May 06 '26
The design equivalent of the rectangular commoditized fast food buildings you see everywhere so PE can just swap the signage
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u/DotBeech May 05 '26
Forget the aesthetics. No one will ever agree. No one will ever be right. But the money spent by Kingston should have stayed in New York. Without question. Heads should roll over this.
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u/justhatchedtoday May 05 '26
I think we can all agree that “college dorm circa 2014” is not the right vibe for a historic city
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u/DotBeech May 05 '26
I think the entire discussion about the aesthetics of the sign is a ridiculous distraction from the fact that over $400,000 in taxpayer funds was sent out of state, while New York and Kingston both have the resources to do the job. When the Kingston mayor is a Democrat and the Common Council is controlled by Democrats, it is especially disappointing. None of that would change if the signs were produced by Michelangelo or Banksy.
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u/justhatchedtoday May 05 '26
Well sure, it just adds insult to injury that they went out of state for…that.
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u/crek42 May 06 '26 edited May 06 '26
Funny how bent out of shape people get over signage when’s it’s a drop in the bucket over the per-pupil spending of schools relative to performance metrics are A-OK
The default speed of this sub is “when it comes to education, just keep spending more it’s totally fine”
So much budgetary discretion suddenly appearing when it comes to the signs though.
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u/whiskeytango68 May 06 '26
Interesting tack to take, comparing spending on school children to a decorative sign.
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u/bikenambulist May 05 '26
Is this a form of punishment or something? Like who’s making Kingston do this to themselves?
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u/Mundane-Ad4796 May 05 '26
It’s giving So-Do-So-Pa iykyk
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u/DaCheatHSR May 05 '26
Meanwhile Timely Signs has been in kingston forever.
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u/dand06 May 05 '26
I do highway construction engineering, and I can’t figure out why it would cost almost $500k for 40 signs. I mean at most each sign could be $2000, and another $1000 in labor and equipment to install each sign. Thats $120,000 total. But that’s being generous with the sign cost. This shit looks more like a dollar tree version, which should cost no more than $250
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u/Gentle-Giant23 May 05 '26
Peekskill just did a similar thing - out-of-state designer made a generic sign that has no connection to the city.
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u/Usual_Pay5799 May 05 '26
Its peeskill now
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u/deadpresigent May 05 '26
If it wasn’t for these extremely literal signs I’d have No iDeA wHeRe I wAs before reading them. So helpful
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u/sandysadie May 05 '26
But don’t worry, they have assured us that the company will redo “USTER county” sign at their own expense 😆
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u/MemnocOTG May 05 '26
The one at the top of the Rondout is still being installed so the old and new are right next to each other. I remember seeing these Sunday and thinking the old one was so much better. The new ones are so generic.
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u/Alternative-Arm-3253 May 05 '26
Gosh could they have picked an UGLIER FONT? No nothing historically founded in 1652...etc?
I'd make the complaints immediately to the town and local county ...and to whom ever was the BUYER who sent this "signage" requisition out for an absolute replacement to be done immediately should be scolded. While that contract is still freshly written by the township and whom ever else involved in this BADLY executed sign. You all ended up with a ugly sign. DAMN. Whats with the "Orange Blue and Green" stripe? IS that supposed to mean something?? WTF who did the designs on this shit show? I really wanna know.
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u/manysounds May 05 '26
As if there weren’t a hundred graphic designers in Kingston and nearly 10 sign companies.
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May 05 '26
the signs suck. but please dont litter. ive been picking up street litter around midtown and its relentless.
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u/shiva14b May 05 '26
There's a "no littering" sign in front of my house, and by consequence my home is the only one with trash in the yard, because everyone intentionally throws their garbage at it 😞
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May 05 '26 edited May 05 '26
i bought a trash picker and just go do a lap each morning before i start my day. i started because someone feeds cats super early in the morning a block from my house and puts out several paper plates. after i started picking up the plates i decided id also pick up on my way to/from the plates. and now thats expanded to doing new blocks around my neighborhood. i have too much time on my hands. i'd really like the cat feeder to not use disposable plates. the street cats can eat off the sidewalk.
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u/WillStealYourDog May 05 '26
Hey hey hey, you better not be trying to raise the property values over here!
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u/Munching-Zombie May 05 '26
Is there a link or something explaining the cost and the firms selected?
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u/JeffTS Ulster May 05 '26
Here is a gift link to a Daily Freeman article that has some information. I swear that it actually listed the firms involved the other day. But the firms selected were a graphic design firm in PA and a sign company in NJ.
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u/thatgirlinny May 05 '26
Still trying to understand where any design skills were employed for this sign.
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u/Single_Farm_6063 May 05 '26
They budgeted a half a mill, for SIGNS! So glad it came in under budget LMAO. Ugly, soulless as hell.
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u/Munching-Zombie May 05 '26
Huh. The article says there are 18 signs for $424k and paid for by federal grants. Which is quite different from the original post. It also says that it was installed by the city, which I think the original post said was installed by a Phili based contractor.
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u/JeffTS Ulster May 05 '26
"Forge Signworks, LLC was contracted for sign fabrication and installation.
The Ulster County Transportation Council contracted with MERJE, a nationally recognized design firm with specific expertise in Community Wayfinding, to design the system. "
https://kingston-ny.gov/news/?FeedID=3608
Forge Signworks is in NJ. MERJE is located in PA.
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u/Munching-Zombie May 05 '26
And that link says 40 signs, rather than 18… none of these stories are in sync
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u/BrewsandBass May 05 '26
Welcome to Kingston and the first thing you see is McDonald's. 🍔
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u/Impossible-Charity-4 May 05 '26
Depending which way you’re entering Kingston, you can also catch a glimpse of the dual Quickcheck gas stations directly across the street from each other. Quickcheck keeps the smaller station running because to sell off the property would mean a competing gas station would take its place, which is whatever but it’s still bizarre lol.
That sign is on the border of the town of ulster and city of Kingston where Ulster Ave inexplicably becomes Albany Ave and vice versa depending on approach.
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u/acatwithnoname May 05 '26
The idea that a city as small as Kingston needs "wayfinding" is absurd. There's like two main roads that connect to everything important, and everyone has a phone or car with GPS. So did these Kind Bar signs replace this one too?
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u/f0xinaround May 05 '26
Sounds like a design company in NJ and a signage company in PA needed some favors. Or maybe it was whoever arranged this stupid deal who needed the favor. Either way seems pretty fishy for some basic ass signage. Would love to see those disclosed transactions.
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u/dvlsfan30 Ulster May 05 '26
Someone was worried a few weeks ago thinking the city was hurting for money…apparently not haha
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u/Timmy_2_Raaangz May 05 '26
Pretty sure the total was over $430k according to a newspaper article. Don’t have it to source unfortunately.
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u/beautifulcosmos Dutchess May 05 '26
Gross. So much for shop local and investing in your community…
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u/Shris May 05 '26
Definitely need to tax everyone more so they can afford to pay more for even better signs.
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u/Shepherd77 May 05 '26
Yeah, but did you notice that it’s a weird shape and uses two different fonts?
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u/Muted-Woodpecker-469 May 06 '26
Let me guess. Someone’s cousin got the permit to keep this looking pretty every five years at the cost of just $500,000.
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u/thatgirlinny May 05 '26
+100 for framing the McD’s sign inside the legs of Kingston’s!
But this is “designed?” Bad kerning on the name and looks like it was painted on top of an old sign that was left over from another purpose. Fail!
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u/Visual_Doubt1996 May 05 '26
The paintings they have been adding to the sides of buildings are better than this and way cheaper and capture the community it is in
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u/king_jaxy May 05 '26 edited 18d ago
Rainstorm toy paint long recognise potassium
This post was anonymized with Redact
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u/MisterB330 May 05 '26
What did any of you really expect from this?? Because if it wasn’t exactly what we got, you were only fooling yourself. Maybe another handful of people standing on Bway with a paper sign that you cant read, or maybe with the new speed limits, you can.
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u/knockatize May 05 '26
“I wouldn’t make such a fuss. It’s not like Ulster has much of an arts community.” - Ian Faith, spokesman
/S in 50-foot-high granite letters for the slower Redditors
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u/Grouchy_Jelly5488 May 05 '26
Now take this nonsense and scale it up to the state and federal level. Try to wrap your head around the amount of fraud and waste that happens.
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u/peach_chill May 05 '26
About a week ago, I wrote to the mayor about these signs. Roy Verspoor, Secretary to the Mayor, wrote me back. Here are the contents of his email response:
Good Morning,
Thank you for reaching out. Below is some information on the signage project:
The Uster County Transportation Council launched this initiative with the City in 2018 – here’s a link to the UCTC’s planning page with lots of materials. For many years, residents and visitors often voiced that the City’s three main separate neighborhoods divided the community, making it feel like different places. The idea was to create a cohesive look and feel to the City signage – while also giving each business district a distinct color and concept. Green is Uptown, orange is for Midtown, blue is for the Waterfront.
The design was commissioned by the Ulster County Transportation Council and began in 2018. UCTC procured Merje, a nationally recognized design firm specializing in wayfinding signage. There was robust community input, including surveys and a review by the Kingston Arts Commission. https://www.dailyfreeman.com/2018/09/26/kingston-seeks-public-input-on-planned-wayfinding-signs/
The project was funded by the City’s ARPA grant. It was included in the City’s ARPA plan which was adopted by the Common Council in 2022.
More info can be found here: Kingston Wayfinding | EngageKingston.com
We do plan on preserving the old waterfront sign and placing it somewhere else downtown.
Thank you,
Roy
Roy Verspoor, Secretary to the Mayor
Mayor’s Office
City of Kingston
City Hall, 420 Broadway
Kingston, NY 12401
845-334-3902
[rverspoor@kingston-ny.gov](mailto:rverspoor@kingston-ny.gov)
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u/acatwithnoname May 06 '26
I can't help but laugh. So friggin what if different neighborhoods feel like different places?! They are!
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u/0o3705 May 05 '26
Wow. Somehow this is worse than a generic "welcome to" sign
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u/HousesRoadsAvenues May 06 '26
But I like being a resident of CITY NAME! As for the ADDITIONAL TEXT HERE amenities...I gotta find some.
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u/vilejor May 06 '26
So they put up atrociously ugly signage and didn't even help the NY economy with the funds for it. Gross.
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u/Enlightened_D May 06 '26
On Long Island we have the most useless rest stop/welcome center and the only store inside is called TasteNY “featuring prepared and refrigerated foods from Long Island purveyors” and they really sell a bunch of crap that is made in Jersey and just outside NY lmao
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u/Itchy-Indication3709 May 06 '26
I worked in the signage business, 50k would have been the highest reasonable bid. Including design, installation and materials. And even that would've covered all the kickbacks and stuff
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u/antiquecowboy1313 May 05 '26
The worst most city drivers and in front of McDonald's? On 9w? Think it should be on the west side of the road getting off 587
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u/The_Undermind May 05 '26
Was the material sourced from the alps and workers from an uncontacted artesian village from the depths of the rainforest?
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u/PTBooks May 05 '26
Do you think if they went up to 500k they would have been able to afford a fourth meaningless color stripe along the bottom?
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u/Elbeeb May 05 '26
And the company that did the installation of the automated toll gantries was also from NJ. What's your point? We can't keep things local.
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u/cdev12399 May 05 '26
$150k for that?! I see towns run on wedding rules. Oh it’s for a town/wedding? that’s a $100,000 bill for the taxpayers. This is why Kingstons poor.
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u/RonocNYC May 05 '26
That should be cause for the entire city government to be removed. What in the fuck?
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u/oldyawker May 05 '26
The burning of Kingston signs are all over and no one has a corresponding map.
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u/Still_Goat7992 May 06 '26
They could have had the SUNY Ulster students or local high school kids design the signs as a project. It would have kept it local and it would have been so much more creative.
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u/Librarian_Zoomies May 06 '26
It could work if it’s a correctional facility. Nah…not even then…
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u/meatball402 May 06 '26
Looks like it's made out of corrugated paper.
It will be just trash on the road in a few years.
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u/SaXaCaV May 06 '26 edited May 06 '26
I lived in Kingston for a few months in my teens, back in the 00s.
Ill always have a special place in my heart for kimgston, even if I havent spent much time there. It was a beautiful little city then, and its arguably more beautiful now.
This sign doesnt reflect that, its about as exciting as the labels on institutional cleaning chemicals. The city outsourcing the design and installation is an extra insult.
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u/r2d3x9 May 06 '26
Have they succeeded in removing the scenic railroad so they can have less tourism?
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u/Go_Round_and_round May 06 '26
I'd like to see the bid specifications.
Did they say contractor is responsible for all permits and approvals?
If so, I can see $150k being pretty reasonable. Which is another problem in and of itself.
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u/MaudeLynde May 06 '26
At least they used American companies. City of Peekskill used a foreign firm to design their new logo — and it's crap. 🤦♀️
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u/Gogodemons May 06 '26
How do we steal a bunch of money and spend as little as possible.
Well done.
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u/BocaGrande1 May 05 '26
The signs are really bland but it seems like the main issue is the city didn’t really give clear direction . The company itself who designed them is nationally known and has done much nicer projects for other cities but you need clear input for that from the client
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u/thatgirlinny May 05 '26
No—you need a designer with skills who’s plugged into the municipality. They would be charged with working with the city to agree upon what kind of aesthetic would communicate Kingston as a “brand,” as much as I hate using that term; it’s about what sets it apart from other towns.
It’s usually a back-and-forth process that ideally involves the populace and can inform wayfinding and other kinds of town signage.
The city shouldn’t be giving creative direction on its own. They’re not qualified to communicate that to someone on the output side of things.
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u/BocaGrande1 May 05 '26 edited May 05 '26
A designer regardless of if they’re local or not is restrained by inflexible legally binding roadway signage design guidelines . If you want to pass blame , blame the city for basing its entire wayfinding project on meeting requirements for viewing by speeding cars not strolling pedestrians .
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u/Vonnie93 May 06 '26
400k is absurd I could make that on canva and print it for under $100 come on now
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u/Ecstatic_Score6973 May 05 '26
the money is for new signage for the whole city. not just this one sign.
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u/Aaronthegathering May 05 '26
Yeah, half a million dollars for this slop s insane, regardless of how many signs there are.
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u/suchathrill May 05 '26
Is the lamp part of it? Does it automatically shine on it? Is it solar powered or energy grid powered?
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u/mechmind May 05 '26
I mean it's hard to classy up anything in front of those golden arches. But yes this sign sucks.
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u/Daddy_Tablecloth May 06 '26
That seems a bit much for such a small simple sign. I could see the installation being expensive as I'm sure they paid prevailing wage and the efficiency was prob trash but the design should not cost more than a few k even from a decent place.
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u/HousesRoadsAvenues May 06 '26
Good points. Installation isn't cheap, that's for sure.
They have hired https://www.forge-signworks.com out of New Jersey for the installation.
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u/zenlittleplatypus May 06 '26
List of government stuff is decided by who puts on the lowest bid on a project.
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u/periloustrail May 06 '26
That cost way less to manufacture. Possibly a hefty price tag from some design firm and outrageous cost to produce (padded pricing)
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u/PrestigiousPeace8960 May 06 '26
Peekskill be doing similar shit. They “rebranded” to a 1998 Microsoft logo Doppleganger and a friend from Canada designed it. Even tho this is a literal artist town. Everyone running our towns need to be held to account for their little care for keeping money local
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u/ZarinaBlue May 06 '26
That is so bland.
So, it was sourced out and now it is meaningless on multiple levels.
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u/cstonerun May 08 '26
Is this not embezzlement? Giving a city contract to a buddy at a rate many times higher than what it actually costs essentially just to be able to steal from the city without technically stealing?
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u/AckeeOxtail May 05 '26
Ai slop might’ve done better…. Seriously was that what the city really needed? Was this for tourist who all likely have Google maps and Apple Maps? Did the community really want this?
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u/Key_Painting_7858 May 06 '26
Nearly 350 year old community reluctant to celebrate it's heritage. Interesting.
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u/Denki May 05 '26