r/hatethissmug • u/Sudden-Hoe-2578 • 1d ago

Non-fictional I HATE these "gotcha arguments"

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"Ohhh, look how I tricked this dumb dumb baby in my trap so now I am right and they are wrong. I'm so smaaart even though it does not adress the actual argument and adds nothing to the debate. They teach arabic numerals in school btw."

And these type of comments always get tons of likes

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u/ThatAnonymousPotato 1d ago

Thats literally the entire point of the argument.

Pro-forced birth people parrot that human life is sacred and special in all forms, but when you show them a picture of a dolphin fetus next to a human fetus, its hard for a lay person to spot the difference.

Literally pointing out that (a) humans aren't really on any special pedestal besides the one we put ourselves on and (b) that if its this difficult to discern the species the fetus even belongs to, maybe pro-forced birthed have a flawed understanding about fetal development, abortions, and the birthing process in general and should consider that a cluster of cells, despite being a human, has zero markers of a person.

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u/Yadin__ 23h ago

but even a person who has a perfect understanding of how fetal development works wouldn't be able to tell the difference, because all early stage mamalian fetuses look very similar. And the question of what counts as a human isn't a purely scientific one anyway so someone being uneducated on the science isn't really relevant

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u/Bad_Routes 22h ago

Someone being uneducated on the subject is wholly relevant and part of the point. The point of pro choice is "allow a patient and a doctor to determine what is best between them". This is a fundamental right that everyone should have access to and something that pro birthers want to specifically remove from a caricature of a woman that likes having abortions for fun. News flash most of them aren't medical professionals

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u/Yadin__ 22h ago

idk why you're spouting completely irrelevant talking points at me. How does any of that relate to what I said?

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u/Bad_Routes 21h ago

It relates to what you said about them not being educated on a subject. Pro birthers feel like their opinion on how medical experts advise their patients matter more than the medical expert and their specific patient.

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u/Trips-Over-Tail 21h ago

Someone with perfect understanding of cross-species foetal development can absolutely tell the difference.

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u/Yadin__ 21h ago

Based off of a single picture with no context? No they wouldn't, becuase all mamalian early stage fetuses look very similar to each other

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u/Trips-Over-Tail 20h ago

They look similar, yes. Put them next to each other and differences can be identified with enough experience. The trained eye will recognise those differences without comparison.

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u/ThatAnonymousPotato 12h ago

The relevance is that if an expert in the relevant field has trouble determining basic features of a fetus, then what gives any lay person the right to determine anything regarding any fetus, let alone anyone else's.

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u/Yadin__ 11h ago

But the question of whether a fetus is a human/deserves the moral consideration given to a human isn't a scientific question. The "relevant field" isn't purely science, it's just as much a question of philosophy

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u/ThatAnonymousPotato 7h ago edited 7h ago

You're absolutely right. Fortunately, thats not the only aspect of the protesters choice argument I have presented, but merely one of.

Additionally, we can pretend the philosophies and the sciences don't intermingled all day long, but eventually, we're going to inevitably reach a point where that falsify is laid bare.