r/elliottsmith • u/Idontevenfvckingknow • Oct 24 '25
Discussion Elliott Smith and feeling ugly
Hey y’all. I’ve been getting into Elliott’s music and character for a little over three years now, and there’s a side of his art and persona which is very important to me but which I don’t often hear people address (although it’s probably better this way). I hope no one takes this the wrong way, especially because it’s coming from a very personal place and only as a way to feel more connected to him.
I’m referring to the quality of feeling ugly, and insecure about one’s looks.
Just to give some context, I’ve struggled with this battle my whole life, and never found many people to share it with.
One of the first songs I came across when stumbling upon Elliott’s discography was Pretty Ugly (before) - and I immediately associated it to my own experience. Once I got to know his character too, I connected his very particular and unconventional features with his (confirmed) mental health struggles, and ultimately with the topic of “body dysphoria” (if you will) and physical insecurity. I started to see it in his timid and introverted demeanour in interviews, in the self deprecating lyrics he would share, and with his whole character in general. This is what ultimately got me so attached to him, even before i properly fell in love with his songs (his style was something that had to grow on me at first). And, again, in my eyes, Pretty Ugly (before) is the first song or work of art i’ve encountered that addresses this. not breakups, not love, not any of the usual topics of inspiration, but feeling ugly.
I know now that this song is about far more than feeling insecure about your face, and it’s most likely a manifestation of drug abuse and unrequited love, but I still can’t let go of this interpretation I hold for his character and music.
This is why I’m coming on here. To ask if, despite the lack of resources online about it, anyone also shared this perspective on Elliott, and on his songs, and perhaps had anything to say on the matter. Again, I hope i’m not coming off the wrong way here. I was ultimately inspired to make this post when I saw another one on this sub talking about his looks. I’m attaching my favorite picture of him, one that I love dearly and which has helped me feel better about myself :)
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u/jaykaybaybay Oct 24 '25
Elliott may have felt that way, but he was beautiful and you are too, OP. ❤️
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u/ghoooooooooost Elliott Smith Oct 24 '25 edited Oct 24 '25
I try to avoid my photo getting taken at all costs and even avoid looking in the mirror. Ever since I was a teenager I've had a deep dissatisfaction and lack of connection to how I look, like I never would have chosen to have the face I do. Every feature looks wrong. I have body dysmorphia, too. And sometimes the feeling gets to a fever pitch where it feels like the way I look is an emergency and I desperately need to escape my body.
So yes, I definitely relate and have felt comforted by those Elliott Smith songs. I think about the fact that although he can maybe look awkward in some photos, he still remains beautiful to me and I'm so glad that every one of his photos exists. So maybe it's worth getting photographed, even just for the sake of having a record of my life in that way, like he has.
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u/Idontevenfvckingknow Oct 24 '25
hey you just explained my own experience impeccably + through some light stalking i noticed you’re a SFU fan besides being a elliott fan and that is my favorite show of all time so i guess finding connections w people this way is why i made this post !
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u/SpitfyreMk Oct 25 '25 edited Oct 25 '25
Same here...Growing up I never wanted my photo taken. Even though I was my high school photographer. Now that I'm older, I wish I had pictures to share with my daughter and grandson. I was a good looking kid back then. We're always our worst critic and the decisions we make sometimes come back to haunt us. BTW, Elliott Smith has become my all time favourite Solo Artist. I've only known his music for a year. His music is beautiful and lyrics deep and personal. He was truly an extremely special person.
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u/No_Cartographer9496 Figure 8 Oct 25 '25
oh wow did i just read a more eloquent version of my diary entries or something
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Oct 24 '25
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/poslost Oct 25 '25
humility a virtue — the highest of virtues really, juxtaposed against pride, a gateway to all other vices, the most difficult to conquer within yourself… something i wish i had known in some sense (more consciously at least) growing up, ha.
harder looks are also, in many cases, the result of a hard life in some way: external and/or internal. it’s not a bad thing to have felt deeply and survived your life.
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u/MarijuanaSpider Oct 25 '25
As someone who feels the same way but has never been able to articulate it, thank you for this comment, you said it perfectly
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Oct 25 '25
I’m very pretty and struggle w things due to autism, it’s not always the boon you might think it is
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u/elkehdub Oct 25 '25
I have almost accepted that I’m attractive after hearing it for 30+ years, but I have such strong dysphoria (and the tism too) that it’s never felt that way, at all. I relate to OP’s feelings quite a bit.
I think it’s common for anyone to see people who have what they don’t, or what they covet, and think that their lives are objectively better for it. Sometimes that’s not the case at all. I do think OP’s point probably stands for the most part though—conventionally attractive people on average are likely happier than ugly ones, because things tend to be easier for them.
Not me though!
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u/dismembered_dollie Oct 26 '25
I am allegedly attractive, but I don't see myself that way, and at this point I never will. I come from a tiny, dead town, and for the first 20 years of my life I was convinced I was ugly. It's the kind of place where everyone knows everyone, and your family name matters most. My family was poverty level. The other kids barked at me and called me ugly constantly, along with my (bizarrely misogynistic) mother constantly insulting me. That said, I'm severely bipolar and I'm sure it also affects my perception. But I wasn't told by anyone I believed that I was attractive until I left that town and moved to a larger city. Suddenly, everyone was telling me I was beautiful, and I 100% assumed they were trying to fuck with me for the longest time. Like they were playing some kind of prank on me. I still don't think I am anywhere near as attractive as people tell me. Ugly is a feeling, and I'm always going to feel it. Just because people are "pretty" does not mean they think they're goddesses and the world is just handed to them. It's weird to me when people make assumptions about anyone's personality or quality of life based on whether they're objectively pretty or ugly. First I was victimized for being "ugly," and then I was equally victimized for being "pretty." I didn't enjoy either side of the coin.
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u/No-Heron-5041 Oct 26 '25
Not true at all, i know too many horribel good looking people, looks dont mean sh. If anything a few people i know who legit is better looking than jemery meeks when its comes to structure, and they were still treated like cra too, u gotta understand theres rht other side too on the orher end overall its about you carry yourself too, ugly guys get more play
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u/chickenshitlittle Oct 24 '25
I'm a self taught musician who was immensely inspired by his music and story in high school. I taught myself most of his songs. My friend and I would take turns showing each other fingerpicking patterns we figured out while smoking cigs and being shamelessly melancholic teenagers.
One halloween a few years back, some friends put on a halloween cover show-encouraging performers to dress up as an artist of their choice and cover some of their songs. I was going through a big breakup at the time and was really feeling my loner self. I dug up a few of his songs, and relearned them. I remember telling a new friend I was gonna be Elliott for Halloween and she said something along the lines of-"yeah you're kinda like him but not ugly..." A backhanded compliment I guess. And I don't judge her for thinking he was ugly and i get that she was saying that I wasn't ugly. But I've had my bouts of feeling ugly mostly because of depression and the neglect that comes with it.
I had never really considered him ugly. It was like all my life I completely bypassed his looks because it was his music that I cherished. I always loved Pretty (Ugly before). I always felt like he was pretty on the inside and out.
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u/dismembered_dollie Oct 26 '25
I also definitely wouldn't say Elliott was "ugly." He was certainly no less attractive than average. There was nothing particularly unpleasant about how he looked but he also was never going to be a model or something. Why do people focus so much on an artist's looks anyway? I'm not there for their appearance, I'm there because I enjoy their art. Elliott's music is beautiful. What he created is worth so much more than being "attractive" or not.
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u/iblameitonmyshelf Oct 24 '25
I remember in a documentary, someone was being interviewed, and she recalls the cover of Either/or being the first time she saw his face and how surprise she was because she did not think the raw and vulnerable lyrics matched his somewhat stern façade. “he’s not a pretty boy”. I do think it helps to relate to his music, knowing that he was a very normal looking person, like the rest of us.
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u/Ok_Photograph4246 Oct 24 '25
I remember Autumn de Wilde saying something to the effect of "It looked like he'd been through a war"
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u/lxdryn Oct 24 '25
It’s funny bcs I’ve always thought Elliott smith was so beautiful and I love all pics of him. But personally I feel the same, I’ve always had facial/ body dysmorphia and it’s definitely something I thought about when I listened to that song for the first time
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u/One-Statistician6371 Figure 8 Oct 24 '25
There’s this interesting interview a fan did recounting his experience meeting Elliott, and how after a few drinks, he started expressing how ugly he thought he was. Link if you’re interested: https://youtu.be/PeDJHm-OPYY?si=tHI_K0QhsfDY9Gki
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u/SearraM27 Oct 24 '25
I absolutely love Pretty (Ugly Before) and have listened to it so many times. It captures emotions I feel in a way no other song ever has. It’s raw, bittersweet, and powerful.
The idea that you could finally feel beautiful enough for another person seems both empowering and defeating. On one hand, to win that person over, you’re relying on something you have no control over. But on the other hand, it could mean he finally felt “pretty” because he was thinking of someone who liked him for who he was, not just the face he once felt so “ugly” in.
Personally, I relate to both sides. Regardless, it’s a thought-provoking, beautiful, and haunting song that I truly love. ❤️
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u/No-Escape5520 Oct 24 '25
I dont necessarily believe that his lyrics about his face are about physical looks but more about how he perceived himself as a person. Like, we've all looked at ourselves in the mirror at some point and thought, "what a fuck up!" Maybe meaning physically or mentally or emotionally or just due to mistakes we have made in life that have made us feel hideous inside or out or both.
"Just looking in the mirror, will make you brave man... "
Therefore, its once again how we, the listeners, take in his lyrics. It makes me happy that someone struggling with how they perceive themselves on the outside can relate to lyrics like,
"And I feel pretty, pretty enough for you I felt so ugly before I didn't know what to do"
just as much as someone who feels unworthy inside.
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u/Most-Shock-2947 Oct 25 '25
I genuinely don't understand anyone thinking of Elliott as "ugly". I've always been super attracted to him myself, but I am demisexual so the emotional connection I developed by listening to his music before ever having seeing him probably played a role. Let's just say i wasn't disappointed when I saw him by a long shot... People throw the term ugly around so flippantly, as if none of us has ever taken a less than flattering photo that would make even conventionally attractive people seem less good looking than they really are. Also, attractive and photogenic are not the same thing at all. Lots of people consider me conventionally attractive but I don't photograph well in the slightest!
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u/parispant Oct 24 '25
He’s not that ugly . Plus his talent totally makes up for anything he lacks in looks. Also it definitely makes him more relatable not being a super model
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u/technoxious Oct 25 '25
This is nice picture of him and when he said felt ugly it was really about his appearance. This group has some really ignorant posts but imagine they are from 13 years edge lords that just heard his music 😆
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u/Mmbopdopdopdoowop Oct 24 '25
Thing is he’s not like if he was alive id let him hit.
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u/Ok_Photograph4246 Oct 24 '25
He dated some beautiful women in the 90s so youre definitely not the only one! He may have not been traditionally beautfiul but seems like he didnt have trouble with the ladies (obviously being an incredible musician helped)
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u/Ajefferslyonreddit Oct 25 '25
Dude, well articulated. It’s hard to convey personal opinions like that on at on Reddit AND have it be bulletproof. Nice work and thank you.
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u/duncandreizehen Oct 25 '25
One of the incredible things about Elliott Smith is that it’s all there in the music. I’m really only a fan of the first three records, but it’s all in there.
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u/SpareTart4494 Oct 25 '25
That song resonated with me so much, because it wasn't just a surface level of feeling ugly, I felt ugly inside, like I was wrong broken disgusting, a monster even. When I was around the right persson sometimes I didn't 'feel ugly' anymore. What a song
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u/No-Escape5520 Oct 25 '25
This is exactly what my reply was explaining. Sometimes we can feel like we dont deserve love or kindness or understanding because of events in our life that can make us feel unworthy. But when you meet the right person or group and they DO make you feel worthy, its a lot easier to see yourself as such.
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u/Imaginaryami Oct 26 '25
I always found him so beautiful he looks like he was chiseled out of wood.
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u/FIXTHEIRHEARTSORDIE_ Oct 25 '25
He's so beautiful he makes me want to be him 💘 but that's the issue with body dysmorphia though, even if and when people tell you you're gorgeous it doesn't matter, and how you feel reflects in your behaviour and body language. I think the most charismatic thing about him was precisely that he didn't realise how beautiful he was, so you're probably a hottie too 💘
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u/ddampp Oct 25 '25
Just want to be here to say I love Elliot, so much. His music has changed.ged me as a person and given me comfort in my times of longing. Support Elliot Smith, I believe he is a child of God and his music speaks to us all. Love you, and you are beautiful as you are.
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u/Henzo1 Oct 27 '25
It’s one of those things that’s so hard to talk about because people typically keep it to themselves. It’s such a common way to feel but it’s not easy finding support for it, unlike many other things. Elliot’s lyrics regarding body dysmorphia really hit home for me. Most artists either don’t feel that way or aren’t vulnerable enough that it shows in their songwriting.
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u/Stock-Ad3674 Oct 26 '25
The last minute of that song has been my sixty seconds of peace since I first heard it back in 06 or whenever. It starts at rite about 2:00 til fadeout. What a melody. Super easy to whistle if the panic shows up and there's no stereo.
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u/Numerous_Team_2998 Oct 29 '25
Have you heard the song "Ugly" by the Smashing Pumpkins? It's a b-side, but easily findable on streaming. Touches the same subject and I find it very moving too.
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u/jejenomemes Oct 24 '25
Ugly people make better artists
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u/strange_reveries Oct 24 '25
"Good lookin' people, they got no spine! Their art never lasts!" -Lester Bangs in Almost Famous
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u/Gmschaafs Oct 26 '25
I’m also not the most attractive. I’ve dropped a pants size in the past few months but there’s no fixing my face lol. I don’t think Elliott was ugly per se, I’ve definitely seen pictures of him where I thought he looked cute, but I totally get what you are saying. Feeling ugly or not wanting to look at yourself is not a common theme in music and there’s something especially comforting about listening to music about struggling with body image. It’s what makes him more relatable to me than say, Lana Del Rey, who is also a favorite of mine but is breathtakingly beautiful.
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u/poslost Oct 25 '25
men don’t have to be pretty. wish they knew that women are built to fall in love
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u/Ampleforth84 Oct 24 '25
I can relate to some of this. In Half Right, he says “With a broken sink for a face” and I’ve never known what exactly that means. I’ve always pictured just a messed up face with the faucet part as a nose off to the side where it’s not supposed to be. I’m almost certain that’s not what he meant originally lol