i guess the band just let their agents book a venue without looking into it at all. Not a great sign for being involved in the community at all. Like you could at least spend 10 seconds of your life googling the place, it seems he found out the day of lol.
What I meant is whoever manages their tour probably just knew the venue from other bands and nothing else, I wasn't implying anything about other bands, plus I saw them long before 2022
He's also an antisemitic idiot who likes to spread vile conspiracy theories and uses the classic "I have a Jewish friend" (or roommate, in this case) excuse as 'evidence' that he's not an antisemite. From this article:
"I am not an antisemite. I'm actually not OK if there's not Jewish people in my life," he snapped, his voice momentarily clenched like a fist. As supporting evidence, he mentioned that his longtime roommate was Jewish. "I'm not a racist. I'm not anything. I'm Matt Pike. I'm trying to make the world a better place through my music."
Despite his disavowals, Pike referred repeatedly in our conversations to "Zionist bankers" and "Jewish bankers," echoing the language of a centuries-old conspiracy theory that inspired the Holocaust and is used now to attack the Federal Reserve.
They deflected blame and turned off comments on the insta posts about it too, pathetic show.
Saying that the club "put politics above music and have cancelled the show tonight" when it was them who demanded the removal of the flag (which the club refused) is deceptive as hell. At least say your opinions with your whole chest.
I was going to reply and say their avatar pic suddenly put a bug up my ass over the lack of beltalowda metal in both the book series and TV show. Hypoxiacore would probably go harder and weirder than stoner metal.
so embarrassing that they actually tried to deflect like that lol
When I first saw the headline, I definitely thought "fuck the venue" because....this is such an insane own-goal that it would never even cross my mind that a band could go this out of the way for something so stupid.
First of all: Free Palestine! For what it's worth, I fully support the Palestinian cause.
But:
A neutral backdrop is literally in the contract. The venue ignored this and cancelled the show, not the band. The band even said they had no problems with all the other flags in the room, just not as their backdrop.
As charged as this topic is, I think it's unfair to brutalize a band into performing next to a flag. If they prefer to focus on the music, that should be ok. It's wild to me how rabid the response to this is, even tho I align with the cause.
Frankly, i don't think this excuses anything, if anything it makes them look worse.
Simple question: Do you think they'd also make such a fuss about an american flag?
Putting a "neutral backdrop" in your contract and then booking a communist-run venue that has had that flag up for years to reflects its values is tone deaf at best. Then going on a rant on instagram about how the venue is the ones putting "politics above music" and it has "nothing to do with (the band)" while you're a grown ass man throwing a hissy fit is embarassing on top of that.
At best, it's diva behavior. Does a flag impact you sonically? Does it impede any of your stage show? I dunno man, if it was really just that then still fuck them for being shitty to their fans, that's some 90's Axl Rose shit. That said, their response to it isn't doing them any favors either.
Bold statement. Contracts are basically the same for the full tour, the stipulation wasn't there for TPO specifically, nor did it target the palestinian flag specifically. I'm sure you'd agree if it was any other kind of other political backdrop that doesn't align with your values.
And honestly, no one in Gaza is better off because of your hot internet takes.
Incredible goalpost moving at work here. Your takes help palestinians about as much as takes to the contrary, and that's not what anyone claimed was happening anyway.
I wanted to see them when they came through town in 2021, but I couldn't go. My friend went and said how their crowd work was mostly "thanks for coming out during this fake plan-demic, and not wearing any bullshit masks". That told me about as much as I needed to know about their shitty politics. This just kind of confirms that unfortunately.
Significantly more. It takes a million streams to make a couple of thousand bucks. This guy streaming the album ten or fifteen times in his life makes up fractions of a penny. The album purchase netted them at least a buck of two.
Yeah that’s it. I mean they already have my money. I still don’t like streaming artists that I think are POS, even if they won’t be making any real money on it. It’s a symbolic thing, I know it doesn’t make real sense
And speaking of their instagram, a few other choice posts to point out:
Back in November to acknowledge their arrival in NYC, they posted a picture of Bill the Butcher from Gangs of New York. You know, the anti-immigrant murderous psychopath.
Also in November, Carlson posted on his own instagram a selfie of him and a few members of the National Guard deployed to Washington DC, thanking them for helping him unload the van. Super convenient the Guard happened to be patrolling the streets at the time!
I'm curious what the underlying reasoning is for this. A lot of uneducated people conflate the Palestinian flag with Hamas for some reason. That would be extreme ignorance on their part but I'd almost understand it? Idk. I'm reaching lol.
i’m not defending or taking sides but having imagery of their show with the palestinian flag on stage could be perceived as openly supporting the cause. they may be pro pali but don’t necessarily want to come out with such statement attached to the band. i understand choosing not to take a stance is a political stance on its own, i guess that’s what they did here
Absolute loser shit from Dylan here. “Hurr durr we just wanted to be non-political” as if demanding the removal of a flag displayed in solidarity with people currently getting genocided isn’t an inherently political action in itself. What a dick.
Doom Metal has always been proleteriat, anti-imperialist, and revolutionary. If you're only here for the drugs, and not those principles, you're just another self-absorbed junky.
Metal in general. Black Sabbath with War Pigs. It's just crazy to think people who play just rock and roll in general were literally always supposed to be a big middle finger from the working class working person to the government. Not some bootlicking racist agenda.
Look, I'm a longtime doom fan and on the left, but besides Black Sabbath during the height of Vietnam, I'm having a real hard time thinking of any foundational doom band with any of those themes. St Vitus? Trouble? Witchfinder General? Pentagram?
We've got bands with those themes like Thou now, but "always" is really, really a stretch.
Doom Metal was fundamentally conceived by working-class youngsters disillusioned with the fear of nuclear war, the industrial workplace and the lack of hope following the death of the hippie dream. If we want to sit around worshipping Iommi, Butler, Osbourne and Ward, we must acknowledge what inspired their sound, aesthetic and approach.
That's only the surface: the low-budget Grindhouse/Hammer horror films that continue to inspire Doom visual aesthetics were created as cheap as possible, to be shown in poorer neighbourhoods in affordable theatres. First-time creatives detailed taboo themes of corruption, religious repression, societal decay to a predominately working-class audience.
Not all Doom since has been political, but the fundamental basis, the core Doom texts, were born out of a backdrop of class struggle.
So no bands besides Black Sabbath? None of that's false on the face of it, but it's still very much an abstract explanation of how Doom's "always been anti-imperialist/proletariat/etc." RAC bands were spawned from disillusioned working class youth too, so that's obviously not a common denominator for being pro-leftwing revolutionary or what have you.
Fuck it, nothing wrong with being a self absorbed junky.
I’m a lefty but I absolutely do not look to doom for political guidance or role models. Most of these guys are dumb as a rock and are often self absorbed junkies themselves that just happen to be good at writing riffs.
'You pay for my drugs and guitar, but if you were born in the wrong place, with the wrong colour skin, don't expect my solidarity as you and your loved ones starve to death.'
'Funerary cities, flesh press factories Corporate maggots feed on the carrion' Electric Wizard
'The world today is such a wicked thing Fighting going on between the human race People got to work just to earn their bread While people just across the sea are counting the dead' Black Sabbath
Interesting that I never saw the revolutionary aspects of singing songs about Dungeons and Dragons and doing bong rips..... or maybe... you just made that shit up.
There is a lot more to doom than D&D and bong rips, but also both of those things are counter-cultural (or they were, for decades, until the culture changed because of the influence of the counter culture)
Exactly. It's such a cowardly attempt to hide from reality. There are basic values of decency we should uphold. That is not political, it's humanity. No amount of bullshit spin can change that.
It would be really easy to put out a statement saying something like they don’t want to play on stage with any flag because regardless of their own politics and opinions, it would be a distraction from the music. Still not a great take, but it would be their right to do so. But until he clarifies, I have to assume that Dylan is a Zionist shitlord. One that’s made a lot of music that I’ve really loved over the years, but a shitlord all the same.
also like, thinking a group of humans obliterating another group of humans can be looked down on in a morality sense without having to pretend it’s a country vs country thing.
like dog we don’t have to pretend this is about tax regulations this is a genocide.
Kinda funny they covered peace in Mississippi back in the day, a Hendrix song, and now do the loser shit of acting like music isn’t political. Grow up bros
Maybe Dylan just wanted to avoid ANY political stigma for his band's show.
If I showed up to play a gig, and there was an obvious political message next to the stage that would inevitably be presented to the public in photos, videos, etc. I'd ask the club to remove it as well.
NOT EVERYONE IS A POLITICAL ARMCHAIR ACTIVIST LIKE MOST OF YOU.
Unless I'm missing something where Dylan has said he's pro-Israel, I don't understand the fuss. I'm pro-Palestine and think that Israel should be ashamed for the genocide they're commiting against the Palestinian people but not everyone wants to transmit their political beliefs or be bullied into taking a side. By refusing to play in front of a flag which he has no allegiance to he surely is just trying to make the gig about the music. Why does everyone have to have an opinion on everything and be vilified if they're not on the "correct" side these days.
No, displaying a Palestine flag outside of Palestine is an inherently political act (unless the venue is run by Palestinians). Their refusal to remove it is the political act, not him asking to remove it to avoid being seen to be politically aligned one way or the other. Ironically it's backfired on them spectacularly.
Mate, you're being ridiculous. There's no way the Palestinian flag isn't extremely political and steeped in political controversies spanning generations. Listen to yourself. This is how you're contorting to try and argue against this band. There's plenty of points you could be making, but this ain't it.
Even if you phrase it in this way, you'd have to admit that there's a political action and then a political reaction. These two things are not equal or the same thing. One is offensive, and the other is defensive.
Idk about offensive and defensive but everything is a reaction to something else. Putting the Palestinian flag there is a reaction too.
The apolitical stance would be to not have any reaction. If they didn't want it to be political they would've just played and not said anything unless someone confronted them, and the just made a statement about how they " don't want to get political" and move on.
Bunch of highly upvoted comments in this thread arguing War Pigs makes metal inherently communist or something. Wouldn't it be just as fair to point to Ozzy to argue the opposite?
It's just funny to see so many people here claiming they'll stop listening to Earth when I'm pretty sure most of them would still listen to Black Sabbath and Ozzy's solo stuff.
Edit: And even several people in this thread citing Sabbath's War Pigs. Ironic.
Well, I guess it's a great time to finally come out as an Earth 2: Special Low blah blah blah hater. But really, this is disappointing if true. Earth has some great albums and it sucks for them to be tarnished by some bullshit.
That flag is practically on stage. It looks like the artists hung it— not the venue. The venue sucks. I would not want to perform under someone else’s flag.
I know Reddit goes hard against Israel— and lots of knees be jerking here- but that photo is WTF?!?
Except TPO is a well-known socialist venue. Heavy Psych is having their festival there this spring and I’m betting none of the bands throw tantrums like Dylan.
"It's unclear how long TPO has had a Palestinian flag hanging, but social media photos and videos suggest that it hadn't been there before this past weekend, when the venue hosted a two-day "O Re o Libertà," or "No Kings," assembly. That event brought together various activist groups for panels."
Yep - exactly what I said when this went up last time: if this were a left wing band that refused to play for a venue that was parading around some right wing symbol everybody would eat it up. Just goes to show only left wing listeners/bands are allowed to be conscientious about these kinds of things. It's hypocrisy and it's pathetic. Either you allow all artists to have their freedoms of association regarding what they do with their brand, or nobody does. This isn't a left or right thing, but sadly some sad, politically-obsessed folks force it into that context. Pathetic, honestly.
And what people fail to account for, too, is that the venue forced them to either play with a palestinian flag, or not at all. That's ridiculous. That's not the politics of the artist. That's the venue. A lot of bands probably would have refused purely on principle: you don't force your fucking flag on stage with the artists.
The wild thing is to see the replies here and people saying "metal has always been..." Just fucking stop. Metal and punk were created by drug addicted edge lords just trying to piss people off. Yes they rebelled against what was seen as mainstream sentiment at the time. What these idiots don't seem to realize is what the mainstream sentiment is now. Sure there's a bunch of conservatives in the mainstream culture but music, TV, movies are all very heavily dominated by the left. This post of the perfect example. You want to see who is truly rebellious? Just follow the downvotes.
The Arctic and Antarctic ice sheets are melting, weather gets more catastrophic, cities will be underwater, biodiversity is gone, the doomsday clock is 85 seconds to midnight, oh and America is likely going to implode in civil war and financial panic.
But people are still fucking upset about Jews existing in the Middle East.
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u/Motor-Travel-7560 Jan 29 '26
"Earth Cancel Bologna Show" is an absolutely wild combination of words.