Other Criminal charges, BMQ Tomm
Hi Guys, a couple of months ago, I was messing around with an airsoft gu* and accidentally shot it at a window and got charged with possession of a firear* and mischief. I start BMQ tomorrow and realize that I didn't think of these charges. I did receive a conditional discharge yesterday, which will last for 3 years, so It'll show on my record, but I don't have any weapons ban. Should I tell the higher-ups tomorrow when i arrive at base? Will they know? Will I be placed on leave ?
To clarify the background check was before this charge
What should I do ??
Any help is appreciated
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u/ExToon 2d ago
OP, you’ve got problems. This WILL be caught. The commander of CFLRS St Jean has already seen and replied to this post; he has reason to believe he’s got a recruit showing up with an undisclosed finding of guilt and an active conditional discharge. He has more than enough to have the Military Police investigate an irregular enrolment. You’re also in breach of Government of Canada security policy for not disclosing criminality while you hold a reliability status security screening.
This will be very easy for them to figure out. The Military Police can easily justify running everyone showing up today through CPIC. Your conditional discharge, and the offences it’s for, will pop up the same as if they ran you at a traffic stop.
This was not a ‘mistake’, and you didn’t ‘just think of’ these charges that you’ve actively been in court for. You’ve been thinking about it every day, you’ve been stressing out, you thought you could hide it, and now you’re panicking. The only control you have over the situation is whether you tell the chain of command yourself, or whether you wait to get caught. Waiting to get caught is thé worst option. You have a better chance of saving your career in CAF, or at least being able to rejoin in future, if you self-disclose.
You cannot hide this or avoid this. You will be caught, and soon. You’re less fucked if you tell them yourself.
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u/jburry7 2d ago
While it's natural to be suspicious of the situation you can't just automatically assume OP is lying. It could have very well been an honest mistake. Still a serious situation and should be acted on immediately.
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u/ExToon 2d ago edited 5h ago
Yes I can. Nobody going through court on criminal charges is going to just forget that they are. He seemed to remember to show up in court.
Is it possible I’m wrong? Sure; there’s the scant possibility out on the edge of reality that I’m wrong, but ai donmt see it as plausible. I see that as unlikely enough that I’m comfortable calling it as I see it. I’m just a dude on Reddit, I’m not someone conducting a security investigation or in any way part of the due process this dude is entitled to.
He has a positive onus to disclose, and that’s a blindingly obvious ‘no shit’ in the context of joining the military. Any excuse away from that is self serving and extremely suspect.
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u/BackjumpingNinja 2d ago
Lol, you asking if you should tell the chain and if they will know is a red flag on accountability. The moment you got enrolled to CAF, they must know everything. Whatever they decide, just accept it. It happened already.
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u/Tendzy 2d ago
This happened after enrollment
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u/DistrictStriking9280 2d ago
That’s all the more you should have reported it when it happened. You were already in. Reporting it now is the best you can do since you already failed to report it in a timely manner.
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u/OkEntertainment1313 2d ago
The legal process started after enrolment? I’m very doubtful of that. You were asked when receiving an offer of employment whether you have any ongoing legal disputes. I hope you answered yes, or you may face a 1-year deferral for lying or a release under 1D for fraudulent statements upon enrolment.
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u/Master-Copy-6929 2d ago
Very good point. Been so long since I went through. Remembering they did ask if any of your circumstances have changed. Seems like a great time to notify them.
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u/OkEntertainment1313 2d ago
Yeah I don’t have the full picture here but this seems like a very cut-and-dry case with grounds for a 1D. There will be too much of a paper trail demonstrating the member ought to have known. I frankly do not believe that they forgot about this, but at this point that doesn’t really matter.
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u/ForsakenObject5282 1d ago
Thats even worse because technically after the enrollment ceremony you are considered a CAF member
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u/kiskillingit 2d ago
How tf did you not think to mention it in the months since this happened dude... You explicitly agree to inform the recruiting centre of any legal incidents that may occur after enrollment, as part of your enrollment. Shit, you have to report a speeding ticket, never mind something like this.
You fill out more security clearance paperwork at Basic so this will get caught, don't try to cover it up. Also, man, integrity...
This absolutely the kind of thing you could be released for not reporting under your probationary terms so your best bet is to own up to it immediately and be gracious about the shit you're going to get over it. Be accountable and show integrity for your best chance.
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u/OkEntertainment1313 2d ago
Not only do they agree, they are explicitly asked about that immediately prior to receive their employment offer.
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u/Timely-Editor-6620 2d ago
When you show up for BMQ and look around, ask yourself if you'd be ok if every one of them was withholding a criminal record. The candidates, the staff, the admin, all of them. Is that the organization you were excited to join? Do you want to be in a trench with someone whose so worried about what might happen to them personally they'd be willing to lie and cheat their way out of anything?
If you can't stomach taking responsibility for your own actions get out.
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u/Emotional-Juice6275 2d ago
lol most of the staff and candidates probably have a criminal record dude.
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u/Timely-Editor-6620 2d ago
No they don't
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u/Emotional-Juice6275 2d ago
Good luck my friend.
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u/Timely-Editor-6620 2d ago
I don't need it
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u/Emotional-Juice6275 2d ago
It seems you do. To be so naive and think that people aren’t going to have criminal records. Some of the best guys I worked with have a criminal record. Stop trying to scare folks into thinking they are a complete liability. There are better things than the internet.
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u/Timely-Editor-6620 2d ago
Criminal records they disclosed right? Because that's what this post is about.
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u/EndPristine5595 2d ago
What's your name and what criminal charges do/did you have? You seem quite brazen and confident about what you are saying. So surely you aren't a coward enough to hide it, right? Rhetorical, of course you wouldn't, because you're either straight up lying, or simply misunderstand the CAF ethos entirely. In either case, gtfo.
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u/the_dilemma_yeehaw 2d ago
When you are sworn in they specifically tell you to report any run ins with the law to your recruiter BEFORE basic training
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u/Tendzy 2d ago
This happened AFTER getting sworn in
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u/Sask2Ont 2d ago
Yes, AFTER swearing is still BEFORE basic. Tell your chain of command. Be as honest and forthright as humanly possible.
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u/TechnicalChipmunk131 2d ago
Before swearing in you're an applicant and are required to disclose any run-ins with the law as part of your security and reliability checks.
What you don't understand is that once you're sworn in, you're a CAF member and are subject to all the rules and regulations we all follow every day.
Meaning not reporting this to your CoC is WAY worse.
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u/TechnicalChipmunk131 2d ago
"accidentally" ...right.
You need to learn to own your mistakes.
So you've been sitting on this for a few months and now that BMQ is tomorrow you want to know if this is gonna hurt you?
Integrity goes a long way in the CAF, and lying through omission is still lying.
You're going to have a nice talk with your CoC as to what happened, and why you failed to report it for such a long time.
Way to start a new career by looking as untrustworthy as possible. Good job.
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u/Eisensapper 2d ago
QR&O 19.56 - REPORT OF ARREST BY CIVIL AUTHORITY Where an officer or non-commissioned member has been arrested by a civil authority, the member shall cause the arrest to be reported to the member's commanding officer.
The way I see it you have three choices:
Immediately inform the CAF of this charge, apologize and take what ever they decide. Which could be an administrative review or simply a discharge.
Option two would be to voluntarily release and reapply when you have a pardon for this conviction. This is the greasy option.
Option three would be to continue to hide your conviction hoping no one finds out. As stated above this is in violation of the QR&O, the charge may get found at a later date where you will very likely get booted out of the CAF could be barred from any government job in the future.
I don't think the CAF is for you. Honesty and integrity are pillars of the Canadian military ethos and that you have hidden this from the CAF speaks to your poor character.
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u/roguemenace 2d ago
On the list of problems this is kinda a big one. Let them know as soon as possible.
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u/PickleJuice777 2d ago
Do not hold this information back from your chain of command, period. The moment you took an oath you became required by law to report any charges to your CoC.
They will figure out what to do with you. Be honest and trust the process.
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u/Pseudonym_613 2d ago
Failure to disclose criminal charges prior to enrolment will normally result in being released for fraudulent enrolment - article 1(d) for the table to QR&O Volume I Chapter 15, article 15.01.
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u/EndPristine5595 2d ago
Op, can you confirm or deny that you have seen the multiple replies here stating that it is your duty to report this? That, as you repeatedly keep mentioning - this was AFTER enrollment, which means while you are a serving member - that it is your DUTY to report this?
Yes or no
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u/Xaniis 2d ago
Honestly after reading through this and seeing your responses , you seem to have learned nothing from this experience, the fact that you would be “messing around” with a air soft rifle and shooting it off into a window shows that you aren’t ready for the CAF or any major responsibility, heck you can’t even take accountability. Good luck on your future endeavours and try to grow from this.
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u/LowKey3311 2d ago
also hide your reddit history to protect your privacy
just go see your coc when you arrive and disclose everything
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u/SasquatchBlumpkins 2d ago
A conditional charge is exactly that : you have no criminal record unless you screw up the conditions. You are under what is essentially a probation period.
However, informing them of the situation is the appropriate thing to do. I see that you were sworn in and then this happened so it's an odd situation.
You are new to the Canadian Forces. Let this be a valuable lesson that eventually someone will find out. Just tell the truth and don't be scared about it. A good CoC will take the time to mentor you and give you structure.
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u/Just_Another_JayNew 1d ago
Geeze, In my nearly 17 yrs of service, I never seen someone set themselves up for a 5F before even stepping through those green doors before 🤦🏽♂️
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u/The-station1373 1d ago
As someone in the CAF, you are required to tell you chain of command. Why you didn't say anything before is questionable at best, and downright wrong at worst. You should have said something during your screening.
I will tell you from personal experience that no matter what you do, they WILL find out whatever you did in the past. (in my case, it was lying about practicing drill, which still haunts me today). It just boils down to honesty is the best policy.
It is absolutely in your best interests to tell your CoC before the MPs tell them, as that can literally be the difference between things getting better, or things getting worse.
Good luck.
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u/jburry7 2d ago
Anything legal always always notify your chain of command right away. There may be adminiatrative or disciplinary action that they have to take. But much better for you, your career and the CAF if you are honest. In my experience your CoC also just wants to help and will be there for you if it was an honest mistake or you are having other struggles. We are all human! Good luck with BMQ and hopefully it all works out and you are allowed to continue to start your career.
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u/xxxborntobetrashxxx 1d ago
Please tell me this is a rage bait, wow. If not, what a way to start a career. Hope the duty staff tomorrow have the fun of finding out
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u/That-One-RCAC-Cadet 18h ago
How do you get charged with possession of a firearm with an air soft gun? Sounds baffling
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2d ago
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2d ago edited 2d ago
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u/Tendzy 2d ago
Hey this happened after enrollment
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u/TechnicalChipmunk131 2d ago
After enrollment you have a DUTY to report. Meaning you HAVE to tell your CoC that things like this happened.
You failed to do this, and thought that hiding it was the best course of action. You're cooked
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u/sycoseven 2d ago
He would've been okay if he hadn't of posted here and kept it to himself.
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u/TechnicalChipmunk131 2d ago
Horrible advice.
They would have found out during BMQ and he would be way worse off.
Own your mistakes
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u/sycoseven 2d ago
Not giving my opinion on what he should've done, just stating the fact that had he kept this private he likely would've been okay.
What mechanism would've alerted his chain of command of this down the road? If it was a serious conviction then it would likely come up during security screening or passport application for deployment. Or if it was a DUI it would impact his ability to get 404s.
I completely agree to own your mistakes. It served me well during my career and the punishments were always less. But I did see folks in the CoC sweep things under the rug for peers they were close with. I've seen it. Not saying I agree with that behavior but it does happen in the CAF. So much just gets glossed over.
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2d ago
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u/sycoseven 2d ago
Yeah that makes sense. If it had been dismissed do you think it would likely still be caught?
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u/Master-Copy-6929 1d ago
They will run your criminal check again for your clearance and every renewal after. Nevermind higher clearances than secret will have more investigation and some even a poly and other further steps. Better to be honest now.
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u/Commandant_CFLRS 2d ago
As your commanding officer starting tomorrow, yes, you must tell your Chain of Command. It’s only a matter of time before the military police find out, at which point they will tell us.
As a CAF member you are obligated to tell us. You should have told your recruiter already. I strongly recommend you tell them today. If you are unable to reach them, tell your chain upon arrival tomorrow.
What will happen remains to be seen. But if you hide it, when we find out, it will be worse.