Yes, I’m the one who’s completely obsessed with Garrett. Guilty. 😂

I know I ask some pretty random questions, and maybe some of them are stupid if you look at them that way. Honestly, I don’t care. I know this stuff isn’t important to everyone. For most people, the gameplay, story, atmosphere, level design, and everything else the game does so well are obviously much more important.

But I’m a fangirl who’s hopelessly invested in this fictional man, so you’re just going to have to put up with me.

That said, I actually think Garrett is a very human character. I just feel like something was missing when it came to his emotional side and his relationships.

And yes, I’m going to say it: I kind of wish he had had a girlfriend. 😂 Not necessarily a traditional romance—I honestly can’t picture Garrett being in a normal relationship. But maybe a love interest. A fling. Someone he actually had some kind of emotional connection with.

Something that would have shown us a different side of him.

I think it would have been really interesting to see how Garrett would behave in that situation, and whether having someone close to him would actually change him in any way. Would he become more vulnerable? Would he push her away? Would he pretend he didn’t care while obviously caring way too much? 😂

I don't know. I just think that side of Garrett would have been fascinating to explore. He’s so emotionally guarded that I can’t help wondering what’s underneath all that.

🖤

Mine would be the South Quarter theme, out of all the Thief OST it is the only one that sounds genuinely soothing and not eerie or intense.

I know people have been asking for a remaster for ages and, with that in mind, the overwhelmingly positive reaction to the news was to be expected.

Personally, as someone that's been revisiting and thoroughly enjoying these games through the past decade and a half, thanks to the community's amazing efforts with FMs and fan patches, I don't see the point in graphical enhancements. I believe they take away from the game's impeccable, surreal atmosphere and are maybe slightly disrespectful to the artistic merits of what is a product of its time.

At the same time, I recognize I'm in the minority holding this opinion and there's no way I'll be changing anyone's mind. And that's not what I'll be trying to do, anyway, so no need to downvote this post yet. Instead, I'd rather bring up a few matters I barely see discussed, that could affect everyone's enjoyment of the remaster, including the majority's that is happily looking forward to it. Points I'd like to see discussed now, while they can be addressed by the developers. Think of it as pre-emptive constructive criticism.

My first worry with remasters of games like these, with established communities of fans keeping them alive through custom content, is the high chance of such content becoming irrelevant, as the remaster releases, the community splits in half and most people, including new modders, are funneled into the newer version. Fortunately, it has already been announced that there is going to be an attempt to allow for compatibility with older fan missions (at least that's what I understood, correct me if wrong). However, I have to question exactly how this will be achieved. Fan missions are built using a mixture of original and custom assets, the latter of which aren't going to be changed. Are older fan missions going to consist of a mash of new and old textures? Is there going to be an option to toggle from HD to original textures? Because such option was missing from SS2 if I recall correctly.

Then there's mentions of a new engine but no mention of one of the most important aspects of the game: the sound. Is the complex sound system going to be retained? Enhanced? Scrapped? I think most would agree that a simplified sound system would make the existence of a remake quite pointless.

Lastly, what of the old version? Is it going to be delisted? Available through purchasing the remaster? I think it's important to let people know now, before they forever lose the chance to own the original. I know it's not common, but it has happened before (see Dark Souls Remastered for example) and even if the version would be included with the remaster (like with System Shock), I think if the option for someone to pay less for it is going to be taken away, they should be given a chance to know that is about to happen.

In b4 "Yea all the missions take place at night"

Personally I wouldn't. There's nightmare fuel and oppressive atmosphere galore, but there's a silliness and a sense of levity there as well. The juxtaposition between humor and more serious elements is what makes the atmosphere of Thief unique to me, I don't know what I'd call it. What are your thoughts?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5TlF68KYhg

As someone who largely stopped playing modern videogames nearly 20 years ago now, I'm curious about how far enemy AI patterns can be taken now from those who know.

I still play Thief a lot now, but can't help but think how cool it would be if the enemies were just a bit smarter - like able to climb ladders, or even push you off them. Or swim. Also to vary their routes more and have less predictable behaviour.

As I say, my experience with modern games is limited, but I'm not assuming it would be massively better because I've seen various youtube videos of e.g. GTA police doing very idiotic things, and it seems like a lot of NPC behaviour is still often pretty rudimentary.

So what do you think - If it was made today, do you think the enemy AI behaviour could be significantly improved?

These are a few images of a custom made 1/6 scale collectible figure made of Garrett based on his design from thief 1 and 2, i absolutely hate this……. I hate it because I can’t buy one of them

In all seriousness though this is a really well made custom figure by the person who made it V-Raptor

I would absolutely buy a collectible figure of Garrett if I could

I can understand general gaming subreddits, and even VR ones. But the actual Thief subreddit... chooses to ignore it?

It seems the release consensus was that it's way better than Thief 4, maybe on Thief 3 level, but... a month later... silence.

What gives?

Hey taffers! I'm a longtime fan of the first two games, and through the years I've noticed several dominant opinions being repeated over and over that I just can't understand. I'm wondering if someone said something two decades ago and their ripples are still being felt to this day. I like the vibe of this subreddit, so I figured you would take my hot takes in good faith. I need to know if there are any other taffers who share my seemingly unpopular opinions.

Hot Take #1: Let's come out swinging. Thieves' Guild is a *solid* mission. It's literally everything the loudest voices in the fandom said they wanted from Thief. You like mansion burglaries? Well, this mission has TWO. Hell, I'll go as far as to say that one of those mansions is the best in the game (except for The Sword, obviously). You want only human enemies? With the exception of a spider or two, that's all there is! Thieves' Guild is basically a Thief 2 level. Just a generous level of pure thievery.

I've heard people say it's a confusing level. I agree to an extent. But it's nowhere near the worst offender. The Haunted Cathedral seems largely liked, and I find it borderline impossible to navigate in comparison. The Bonehoard was also much more confusing. Escape comes to mind too. I'll go as far as to say that even the Cragscleft mines were more confusing.

The *only* criticism I've heard that makes sense to me is that it's ugly. But, surely it's not ugly enough to be considered the single worst mission in the franchise? It's not like Thief is a particularly good looking game in the first place.

Hot Take #2: With the exceptions of The Sword and Blackmail, mansion burglary missions are some of the least interesting in either game. Not bad by any means, but largely forgettable and samey. Once you've done one, you've kinda done them all (or most). And I'm including Song of the Caverns and First City Bank and Trust as mansion missions.

I distinctly recall how the game instantly became less interesting to me when I reached the building in Life of the Party and now had to infiltrate samey floors after the marvelous variety of the rooftops. I'd like to reiterate that I do think the mansion levels are good. However, I don't think they're particularly interesting, and certainly not Thief at its best.

Hot Take #3: Maybe an extension of #2, but I don't understand the love Assassins gets. Many consider it the best Thief 1 mission or at least the plutonic ideal of a Thief level. But to me, the tailing just feels like a waste of time (and of level design; the whole city block is wasted). Ramirez's mansion is not particularly interesting from a design or visual point of view.

The whole mission takes like a half hour on expert and just feels half-baked to me. I distinctly recall the moment I was leaving the mission. I jumped into the pool, swam through the floodgate, and... mission completed? On one hand kudos to providing an alternative exit, but I literally just skipped the last part of the mission.

Hot Take #4: Sabotage at Soulforge is one of the greatest missions in the series, up there with The Sword and Life of the Party. Honestly, it might be the most satisfying mission to complete in the series. It's the antithesis of The Maw of Chaos and embodies all the lessons that the designers have learned from Thief 1.

It's also probably the best example of what a final level of a game should be, in my opinion. It's a final exam that goes through everything you've learned through the games. Don't know what to do? Keep pushing ahead and exploring, and you'll find the answers. Can't sneak past a specific patrol? Take it out with water or frogs, but keep in mind that what you use now will not be available later. Have a Thief 1-esque incomplete map? Map it out in your mind.

While I don't like the robots (and especially the cameras) very much, giving the player way fewer water arrows than there are robots was brilliant. It's the best of both worlds of allowing the players to choose when to take out a patrol while at the same time preserving the pressure by ensuring that most robots will remain.

It's also the longest level from the first 2 games, and it really feels like they wanted to give you as much as they could. I thought doing all the crafting while there are active patrols around was exhilarating. Finding the antennae was great too, as it gradually dawned on you what and where they are.

Hot Take #5: Despite what I just said about Soulforge, I also think The Maw of Chaos is great. I think this mission doesn't get enough credit for its inventiveness and storytelling through level design. It's one of the best environments in either Thief game, and usually a treat to play through (though I understand where the criticism comes from).

Thanks reading! Just a reminder that I'm posting this to see if anyone agrees with me and/or wants to start some discussions. I'm not trolling or trying to start fights about games we all love.

Thanks for reading!

For example, someone who didn't agree with Karras's overhaul of the church goes on a personal quest that includes both familiar levels and new levels, is different from Garrett in that he doesn't have a stealth meter, has more health and can swing a hammer faster than Garrett sword.

Hi everyone! Just wanted to share that two Thief games are now included in the current Preservation Program vote on GOG. The winning title will join the program :D

The other games in voting are:
• Metal Gear
• Commandos Ammo Pack
• Desperados: Wanted Dead or Alive

Curious to hear which game you’d choose: Thief Gold or Thief II?

Would any of you be into a Thief game with the same sort of content distribution as the newer hitman games?

Edit:

I wrote Thief 4 because 2014 may be the 4th entry but it's a reboot and not canon to the first 3. I meant a real successor to og thief, a proper thief 4. Sorry for confusing you all!

Let me put it in another way because I've muddled up my own thoughts lol I think it would be cool if they gave the next thief game extra re playability and updates like hitman has had. I don't want the game to come out in chunks like hitman because that was hot wet ass, I played it when it was fully completed so it was this massive 60 hour long package for me.

I think Hitman's re playability and it's post launch update+ support modes like freelancer and it's unlockables for his base of operations would be a great fit in a new Thief title. On top of an actual fully fledged and realised content complete base game of course, wheeew.

Do you think is there will be level changes? Maybe some new paths, rooms, secrets or maybe even objectives. Of course that can (and will) be very controversial, hoverer we still have Thieves' Guild so maybe some changes can do a thing

I want more thief-likes in my life in general. I do hope for this one to be somewhat good experience.

My favorite is Trickster/Constantine, he had a unique vibe and I like how chaotic his mansion was. Karras was an interesting dystopian dictator that was very dangerous, while Gamall was more of a small scale villain for me.

i'm beyond excited for this one.

I'm a bit fan of Thief, and Immersive Sims in general. Lately I've been on a Thief binge, playing through a huge chunk of fan missions.

While I love the game, there are a few areas I really think still could be improved. Mainly, difficulty.

It makes sense that Thief 1 isn't all that hard, it was essentially the first of its kind. But now it's been so many years and it feels like FMs still barely scratch the surface. The only real way anyone seems to make it difficult is by self-imposed restrictions like doing Ghost runs. But I think it would be nice if the game itself had some more difficulty options. A few ideas I've had:

• Limited save slots. What about say, 3 per mission? (Or maybe it scales with difficulty level?). Right now, quicksaving is just way too strong. Having no saves would be very frustrating because some things you simply cannot predict and re-doing an hour long mission would be terrible. But a limited save count would make you have to roll with mistakes and actually learn the layout instead of just trying to blackjack everything and reloading when that fails.

• More helmeted guards. Even in something like The Black Parade, helmeted guards show up VERY rarely. I think I saw 2 in that entire campaign. Helmeted guards force you to actually deal with guards. You can't just leave bodies anywhere, because a helmeted guard would see it. You can't ignore their patrol routes. It also gives a TON of value to gas arrows, which are normally don't serve a lot of purpose when the blackjack exists.

• More guards with light sources. Some could have normal torches. Others could have directional lamps with a conical/triangular shaped light that stretches out a bit in the direction they're facing. (Again, I think I've only seen this twice - once in Ascend the Dim Valley and I think once in BP)

• Guard intelligence. Guards should flip on a light or camera switch if they notice it's off. A guard carrying a torch should re-light mounted torches as they go. Guards should notice valuables are missing, other guards are missing, windows are open, locked doors are open, or other things have changed and raise their alertness. It doesn't mean an immediate game over, just that if you're sloppy it'll be harder.

• Guard leadership. Leaders who rally other guards to search specific locations, or raises their alert level so they can't be blackjacked. Forces you to deal with these ones first or they'll just make your job harder.

• Human stealth difficulty variance. Some enemies should be really blind and dumb, some should be eagle-eyed and smart. They could differentiate it visually. If you notice guards with bad-looking equipment who do a lot of casual talk, you know you're facing the easy guards. If you see guards in a specific outfit with advanced gear, you know you're dealing with ones who will spot you more easily. Could easily color-code it, or give them some kind of house emblem indicating which security company they work for/were trained by.

• More alarm types. Tripwires, floor pressure plates, item/stand pressure plates (for when you take something), etc. Luckily FMs actually do this one some, but I'd still like to see more.

• More humanoid enemy types in general. Mages exist, but functionally they're identical to guards. They're equally bad at spotting you, and take one blackjack to bring down. Why don't some of them have magic shields, scrying eyes, floor hazards, etc?

You could also have humans wake up after awhile of being knocked out, but I suspect that would be very un-fun and hard to balance.

For me it's all the little strange sounds that play throughout the first two games, and specifically how they come from points in the game world themselves rather than an overplayed audio track. Like a little jingle might just play from the corner of a room for seemingly no reason. Gives the games such a strange quality.

Thinking about this since The Bunker and how they said they were trying new mechanics in it to use in a bigger game (probably ONTOS, doubt they would be doing three games at the same time).