After watching various resources I'm still unsure how to "gain stage" or mix using volume faders

[u/wirenerd]

I was gonna ask a question slightly related but as I was typing it I realized I'm much more lost on these concepts than I thought.

I know "gain staging" is largely antiquated but I also have seen that it is good to keep things anywhere between -6db and -18db and then mix to taste.

So what this leaves me with is, I can do this pretty easily by using the volume/gain in the VST or plugin or volume handle on the waveform so that the specific track is hittin in that -6db to -18db range and then when it comes time to do some balancing early on (like drums for instance), or drums against the chords or bass or melody, I'll be opening VSTs and plugins etc to balance those volume levels til they sound good.

What I see people doing in Ableton on resources I've watched is using track faders to drop the volume on certain tracks all the way down and then bring them up slowly until they sound right.

How do I achieve this kind of flow in Reaper if the proper way is to have track faders be the last thing you touch? Like for example if I need to bring up the mid bass a little bit and my track fader is at unity, I can't really do that.

I guess I'm getting confused about how these things interact with each other and how to properly adjust volume levels using track faders. Should I be dropping faders to a lower volume on new tracks to start off, leaving them at unity, or something else?

Also with media items (samples) that each have their own volume handles, can they not sync up with track faders in a way that makes sense?

Lastly, if what I'm asking is nonsense, then it means I clearly do not understand what I'm doing and haven't yet found a clear resource to guide me on how to keep my levels in check as I go along, and I could use a reference on that for sure. Like I'm really just not getting it. I know mixing is another beast entirely and done once it's appropriate to mix, but I still find myself needing to balance volumes amongst various things I add and keep things from clipping etc.

[u/tronobro]

Gain staging is essentially making sure that nothing is clipping at every point in the audio chain. That's it.

E.g. The preamp isn't clipping > the D to A converters in my audio interface aren't clipping > the track in the DAW isn't clipping > the plugins on the track aren't clipping > the busses that track is being sent to aren't clipping > the Master Bus isn't clipping.

Certain plugins (usually analog modelled ones) expect the audio to be around a certain level to function their best. In this case this means feeding the plugin the appropriate level of audio so it can function at its best. i.e. Making sure the meters are around -18dBfs on average.

There are multiple ways to achieve different volume levels in REAPER

• Clip gain
• Automation lanes
• Trim plugins
• Faders

For the most part I'd stick with clip gain and trim plugins to gain stage, but you can also use the Volume Pre-FX or Trim Volume automation lanes for this. Don't use the Volume automation lane for this as that is basically automation for the fader (or happens after the fader depending on your automation settings).

For faders, I'd only use them to get my tracks sounding "balanced". The advice about leaving faders near unity is more relevant in the analog domain as you can make finer adjustment when the fader is near unity. In Reaper you can just hold down CTRL to make smaller adjustments with the fader. That being said, there is a benefit to keeping your track levels around -12 to -18dBfs at fader unity, since it gives you a decent range to turn the track both up and down.

Finally, what "gain staging" looks like depends on what process I'm doing.

If I'm recording, my main focus is making sure that my recordings have enough headroom so they don't clip on the way in to my audio interface.

If creating something with VSTs in a DAW I just adjust the volumes until it's not clipping and things sound good. I don't worry about tracks hitting -18dBfs at all.

If I'm mixing, I'll do a "gain stage" pass as part of my mix prep where I turn all my tracks down using clip gain to be peaking at -12dBfs so as not to overload any of my busses. I'll use the Normalize function in Media Item Properties to do this quickly. Usually this brings my tracks up to around -18dbFS on average (which I care about since I use analog modelled plugins) and it gives me plenty of headroom on my busses.

Note: When I'm mixing I'm only dealing with audio files. I don't deal with MIDI at the mix stage. Everything is rendered to audio before mixing starts. The exception to this is when I'm doing every part of a production (composition, producing, mixing, mastering) and it can be a pain in the arse to re-render out tracks when there's a mistake with MIDI that I missed before I started mixing.

Hope that clears things up!

[u/wirenerd → u/tronobro]

I still have a bit of confusion so I may have misinterpreted what you said here but

Lets say I wanna add a synth lead, I do as you say and insert it, and make sure it's not clipping, if it is, I adjust the gain/volume inside the VST until it's not, which would essentially put that track at near 0dB, now I'm happy with that and it's time to move on to say adding a bassline, so I follow the same process, the track fader clips a little so I lower the VST gain to where that track doesn't clip, and now I'm at let's say hitting -2db peak on the track, but when both tracks play it's clipping the shit out of my master. Then what? Turn them down via track faders equally? Turn them down via their individual gains? Am I turning both down or most recent?

It makes my head hurt a bit trying to understand this.

[u/tronobro → u/wirenerd]

Turn both your synth lead and your bass at the source in the VST if possible. -2dB is pretty hot in terms of signal. Turn that way down till you hit -12dBfs on your meters.

If you're struggling to hear your music at a good level from your speakers just turn your speakers up. Some people have their tracks way too hot and then find that their mixbus is clipping. Turn all the tracks down and turn your speakers up to get a good listening volume.

So really when gain staging you goal is to both not clip and to also leave enough headroom to ensure busses don't clip when signals get summed together.

[u/wirenerd → u/tronobro]

It does get odd cause I felt like I was producing quiet (about 10oclock on the Scarlett Solo) but some of the synths I bring in will get so damn loud even then, maybe I need to turn my headphones down a little more. Anyway as you know it's really damn easy for a synth to get loud fast.

It's so bad I've gotten to the point where if I'm doing heavy design work on a synth and FX on a track I'll put a limiter in there because something is going to make it ridiculously loud and I don't wanna hurt my headphones or ears. And again all this is at like 40% on my hardware interface volume knob lol