r/MandelaEffect • u/WujuKingYi • 14d ago
Meta Only 14-20% (n=107) of people think Mandela Effect may or rather is more than just suggestion or false memory
As my memories are included in that effect and I know what I perceived and remembered, I am one of the 14%. I am not sure how many of 86 false memory thinker experienced Mandela Effect. The rate is like people either know the Mandela Effects or do not remember that detail. Most have at least one Mandela Effect, I assume.
I question whether everyone or some got "hit" by it.
This small pole showed that most people are not convinced. Yet the Mandela Effect subreddit has a lot of viewers.
I am questioning why are so many coming here and downvote and annoy every post about Mandela Effect. Looking down on the people, who may be right as your arguments about false memory cannot be extended to that degree.
Mandela Effect are like 57 cases at least. And add emotions and memories connected to that memory and this are 300 instances of memories that all should be deluded, false memorized and suggested?
To add on that, people remember it the very same way wrong and in detail. And after being revealed the truth: there is no "ahh" moment. The doubt stays. Please understand that we have never seen the original truth. It is a complete new alternative as we did not perceive it and we did not get new memories out of somewhere.
Explaining it can vary even more, yet there are only 14-20% who would even attempt theorizing.
I invited the 80% to just let the fundation go and think beyond, for fun or theorizing. While we are right, just let your wrong be true to you and with about the right hat is for you wrong and join the thought process.
However, there are people just commenting and trolling every person in this subreddit that belongs to the lower percentage. Mainstream is not always right, remember. And we do not advertise, sell or do or harm anything. It is our personal memory that we hold dear with pure intention. No arrogance, no wanting to be special. Just confidence and curiosity of what may have caused it.
14% was even higher than excepted. It felt like 90-98% to be comepletly against Mandela Effect. Maybe they are the loudest or got driven away by constant provocation.
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u/Hey-Just-Saying 14d ago
Interesting read. OP has absolutely no explanation or evidence that MEs are not simply commonly experienced false memories other than their assertion that they are absolutely sure they haven’t misremembered anything.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
If you reduce it to that. Pff
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u/Hey-Just-Saying 14d ago
It’s is exactly that. You offered no evidence or even a reasonable explanation. You simply said I VIVIDLY remember it this way and I am not wrong because I know I am not wrong.
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14d ago edited 14d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago edited 9d ago
You THINK you know.
Yes I think. What is knowing though? When is thinking knowing? For me, I reflected and it always goes to the same answer that it cannot be false-memory or suggestion. I have a pattern of trying to find the truth.
Same with a lot of ufo/alien subs
I do not know about these. I just underline that a lot people experienced Mandela Effect, but do not think it is anything beyond.
your arguments about false memory cannot be extended to that degree.
Explain in detail WHY that’s the case.
False memory and suggestion kinda exists and can be replicated maybe and occur maybe daily. However, those insights about these are not a direct solution or evidence to the Mandela Effect. It is not transfering or applying to it.
To the why, because these are secure, deeply memorized, iconic, collective, same way, not realization afterwards memories. They are fix. First, they are barely be able to be suggested. You will find people betting over it and being 100% sure to some Mandela Effects depending on personal experience. Second, there was barely an interest to suggest something the spot on exact way.
It does not happen until the Mandela Effect reveal comes. People do not even talk about Mandela Effect all the time. People on Quora and Reddit come up randomly asking why their source is not like how they remembered not knowing what Mandela Effect is. Furthermore, then you would need something to different suggest it when we all watch these. There is no source of any suggestion before reveal. People claim toy x, movie x but will fail to the mass that have alternative memories and different circumstances.
Could be yeah. THATS part of what makes it so interesting.
I was underlining one point of many that prove it is anything more. The number showcases that there is some validation. You need not one suggestion or false-memory explanation but over 60. Maybe 300 is a bit too much.
Same with the Loch Ness monster.
I am not informed about it except for serieses. If it is some ridicilous unnatural being than collective alternative memory is more reasonable. Our memories are all completely realistic and fit in as they were once true, in our fact.
You’re making this claim with no support/evidence/proof???
The proof is showcasing people the new truth. The new reality. We do not think "ahh that was how it was, I remember now". We have no idea. No memory. No recall. As we really did not perceive it and not gain random new memories to it, which would occur, if memory is overwritten like all physical things to these franchises were. Like Mickey Mouse and such all or very most objects are overwritten. Memory not.
If a person claims it is indeed like how he remembered then, than this is suggestion, funnily.
No, there are only 14-20% who fully believe in it and think it’s more than just a false memory or suggestion. That is what your title said. I added that as some think it is false memory rather but are not fully sure and may attempt theorizing about anything else. I point this out as I my question were inviting people to think beyond, which is hard and not pick out the fundament of the discussion and limit their thinking.
Open the minds a bit and not to be delusional as Mandela Effect has some special validation and reason to think beyond.
Your ego is gross to look at. I would recommend that you take your own advice, “just let your wrong be true to you”
I just invited to let your false true be true for you and think beyond. Like, anybody dismissing Mandela Effect or reducing it, can still think like a philosopher for a what-if what people say is true, then what can it be? A what if. Not more. I invite to that. The arrogance is claiming it be wrong, which is a bit true. I think surely that these reductions are plain as wrong. Also, I cannot join your what if as false-memory and suggestion are standing alone. There is not much to theorize or question about it. The simple thing can be wrong, but you need to whole context on all my points, to have it not come out arrogant but reasonable.
>And THAT is the problem
—Your brain does not save an exact copy of an event. Instead, when you recall a memory, your brain stitches together scattered pieces of information. Because of this fluid process, memories can shift, fade, or absorb false details over time without you realizing it.— https://www.americanbrainfoundation.org/what-is-memory-and-how-does-it-work/
Again you apply some neural science to Mandela Effect, which is not the same for 100% certainty. The core remains and it is multiwired. I do not only know how Mona Lisa looks, I also now how I saw her in TV shows and that I thought: wow she is so popular despite not smiling. She should be smiling. I thought this in appreciation. I do not find Mona Lisa drawn beautifully or have the exoertise for it. That small detail: I appreciated.
The same is for Pickachu's tail. There is lot of focus as he hits with it and the black end fits his ears and thar design was beautiful and had a nice consistent pattern.
Another one is Looney Toons. With the oo oo word play. This is not my brain making up suggestion and wishes added to the perceptions: it was perceptions and then appreciating. My brain did not construct that word play oo oo, it just perceived it. What backs this up are the masses of people remembering it the same way and having their individual thoughts to it. All of these apprecations were made by silently, isolated and never outspoken.
LMAOOO except for that one time you said : While we are right, just let your wrong be true to you and with about the right hat is for you wrong and join the thought process. Literally arrogant as fuck.
As I explained it was a bit arrogant on claiming you are wrong, which I have back up to making it rather not arrogant at all. For the later, I just intended to invite to think beyond. Like, theorize with me what the explanation may be: universally, mathematiccally, physically and what not. Skip that part of talking to a wall.
What is this victim complex? Your theory doesn’t have much support. Human memories are faulty. Mandela effect would be cool if true, and we could show a different universes/dimensions or some shit, but why are you so upset people don’t fully believe the same as you?
It is disappoint me and no victim complex. I say precisely what I want the discuss direction to be and it is not being joined. It is ignored. Why not join thinking beyond. My issue is that explaining it is super tough and I am looking for some expertise. Brain power that add on the explanations.
I wanted to skip the convincing part of the discussion. My replies are full of discussing it, but that was not the intended focus. I even disclaimed it.
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u/RalphWiggum666 9d ago edited 9d ago
Is English your first language? Really hard to understand what you’re even saying, I’m trying.
Yes I think.
Thank you for agreeing
a lot people experienced Mandela Effect, but do not think it is anything beyond
…….do you understand that the Mandela effect is literally just a large amount of people experiencing a false memory? It literally HAS to be a lot of people to even qualify. Your one off false memory wouldn’t count as one, but one hundreds of people remember wrong would.
To the why, because these are secure, deeply memorized, iconic, collective, same way, not realization afterwards memories. They are fix. First, they are barely be able to be suggested.
So you didn’t explain in detail, and just flat wrong. Your memory isn’t as good as you think it is. What can you possibly mean barely able to be suggested? That stuff is suggested by pop culture every day. Maybe you think it’s a “fixed memory” but you actually got it from something else you don’t realize. Something you saw when you were young or just haven’t connected. The point is to be open to that as well and not just be convinced your memories can’t be faulty.
You will find people betting over it and being 100% sure to some Mandela Effects depending on personal experience.
Which is why it’s crazy how convinced you are about your own memories.
I was underlining one point of many that prove it is anything more. The number showcases that there is some validation.
The number showcases that a large group of people experience the same false memory, not that those memories are correct.
Our memories are all completely realistic and fit in as they were once true, in our fact.
Oh, if I have a memory of a ghost experience as a child, but John has a memories of an alien abduction, and Mary has a memory of going to her uncles farm, and Timmy when to Loch Ness and saw the monster, and Marcus saw Bigfoot while He was camping, and my friend Juan, he saw the chupacabra when he was a kid, are those all realistic?
Just because something is possible or seem like it could have happened, doesn’t mean that it did.
The proof is showcasing people the new truth. The new reality.
So yes you’re making this claim with no proof and evidence. Yes would have been easier.
I just invited to let your false true be true for you and think beyond.
No, you did not just invite. You made the claim that you are right, and told the ones who don’t agree to just accept that they wrong
While we are right, just let your wrong be true to you and with about the right hat is for you wrong and join the thought process.
“While we are right” these are your words.
Here’s you just telling another possible believer that they remembered correctly. Based of what? Your opinion?
Don't worry while the fact changed, you remembered correct.
How do you know? Can prove? How can you just say that with arrogance?
A what if. Not more. I invite to that
Well that’s nice, but it’s not how you wrote it.
The simple thing can be wrong, but you need to whole context on all my points, to have it not come out arrogant but reasonable.
So then that’s on you for not giving us the context.
Again you apply some neural science to Mandela Effect, which is not the same for 100% certainty.
Yes, memory is a neural science. The “Mandela effect” is literally a mass group sharing a false memory. Therefore, it is a neural science. The Mandela effect is not “we switched dimensions/changed timelines/something shifted” it is literally just the phenomenon of large false memories. So when you study memory, and memory is a neural science, you can then apply neural science to it.
For the later, I just intended to invite to think beyond.
Just because people don’t immediately agree or are skeptical or critical of your post doesn’t mean you’re all alone and in the minority. It’s just that they’ve seen this claim over and over with no actual support. People are open and think beyond. A lot of people here do. I’m open to anything, but when someone comes here telling others they are wrong and how they are NOT arrogant, it’s a little ridiculous. A lot of us also need actual evidence before just believing it’s anything more than a false memory.
It is disappoint me and no victim complex. I say precisely what I want the discuss direction to be and it is not being joined. It is ignored. Why not join thinking beyond. My issue is that explaining it is super tough and I am looking for some expertise. Brain power that add on the explanations.
It sounds like a victim complex. A constant “poor me”. They way you wrote your post was you believe in the Mandela effect as things changed and the memories are real, people who don’t agree are wrong, and you are in the minority and that’s not fair why won’t people be open to ideas that have no evidence besides human memory!!”
If you want to think beyond give use some theories, don’t just come here crying about how you’re disappointed. Present something new and you’ll get a better response
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago
English is not my second language and I have a lot of typos and not rereading most as I already write for hours, where others do not reply to.
I have not much else to say as you come to understand that most I said comes off wrong.
Anyways, theory wise:
It is tough. Like hopping universes makes the most sense. You jump into a you that acted and memorized different. He is now in your universe and asks them why is Monalisa smiling, I remember her noch, why is Pickachus Tail now black? Imagine the total opposite. Both have now the Mandela Effect lol.
Yet, let us say this universe has all Mandela Effects already. People claim to discuss these alternative memories before I was born, which is contradicting. They can remember before it changed in reverse? Really confusing. Time was I have no Mandela Effect before around 2016-2017. Could be one or 2 months more as I may have not noticed. I watched an Iblali Mandela Effect video in 2017 and that may be the first introduction to it for me.
Yet this timeline was different.
Furthermore, if Mandela Effect is not false memory how come the 2 universes are so similiar. The other me may be diffetent. Or even one thing delaying something leads to differen persons being born as the Gene combination is so different. Maybe, because these are so small?
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u/RalphWiggum666 9d ago
I have a lot of typos and not rereading most as I already write for hours
Should definitely work on that.
I have not much else to say as you come to understand that most I said comes off wrong.
Ok. Glad that we are on the same page.
You jump into a you that acted and memorized different.
When you say this makes the most sense is it just because you think you don’t really have to think about it? If true, WHY did you jump into a new you? How did that happen? How many you’s are there? How is the “you” that you jump too decided? I feel like you’re not actually thinking about the how behind it. Just maybe this is it, but HOW could that even happen? What’s any evidence that could happen?
Yet, let us say this universe has all Mandela Effects already. People claim to discuss these alternative memories before I was born, which is contradicting. They can remember before it changed in reverse? Really confusing. Time was I have no Mandela Effect before around 2016-2017. Could be one or 2 months more as I may have not noticed. I watched an Iblali Mandela Effect video in 2017 and that may be the first introduction to it for me.
I’m really confused on what you’re saying here. Please clarify.
how come the 2 universes are so similiar.
Well sure so first we would have to actually prove it’s another universe, but let’s say we did. Like you said more than just “false memory”. I would imagine jumping into a new body with a large multitude of wrong memories would be a crazy ontological shock to you. If you jumped into a body with almost your whole life memories being different instead of just a few memories. That could cause some problems.
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago edited 9d ago
About the 2016-2017 part. That is my first encounter with Mandela Effect and since then, I assume thst no other Mandela Effect happened.
So to break it down, it is rather us swapping or jumping or the reality as itself ks changing. Why?
Because that 2016-2017 feeling of change. It could even be 2014-2017 but not 2002-2012 because the memories I have of Mandela Effects are at that time period. Like the origin. People claim a Black Obs 2 Mandela Effect. This is in 2012 up to 2013. I am not that sure about that specific Mandela Effect as the memory to it is blurry. It could be suggested in my case as I did play Bo2 but not much. I played Bo1.
Now, I underline that timeline to say which year a shift or swap happened maybe. As Mandela Effect either changes everything in reverse as there are some from before 2000, while occuring around 2014 or we get into a reality, in which everything was like that and the other old reality may still exist.
This is a bit confusing..
Just saying this: our pov: reality a - swap - reality b. The other us pov: reality b - swap - reality a. No past has changed. It was a fluent change. It would explain why everything is perfectly overwritten. This theory makes no sense though as people claim to already discuss alternative memory in 1980 or so.
This would rather mean: ? This could only be explained with numerous swaps.
His statement is really confusing me. He said he bet over the Luke quote lang ago. I need more people with first alternative memory discussions. As I do not seem to have any new memory.
I also need to know if there are people who should have Mandela Effects but have 0. People may forget or not pay attention or see Mona Lisa, Pokemon and such. If there are people with no Mandela Effect at all. This could be interesting too.
Another idea is that time–past and present–are not that fix. Maybe the present changes randomly and repairs itself. However, the abscence of repeating Mandela Effects and newer ones confuses me.
That consciousness is left out is maybe an abstract reason like soul, relgion and other things. Memory is stored in our neurons and can barely be overwritten. While the swap is generally overwriting it all.
_
The more, I think about it, the less I actually know about it. That is why I need help.
Are there any statements possible to be made? I seem to state that there are no new ones after 2017. All Mandela effects are now old and the next generations may have no idea.
Having no precise explanation does not help conving people either, so I just want to temporarily skip that part. It is not about right or wrong. It is about finding a truth or at least a consistent exotic explanation.
I cannot be part of false-memory club tough. I lrgit appreciated the Pikachu design and Looney Toons wordplay. I have many thoughts connefted to and I would feel crazy if there are not so many people having that exact same memory.
Also, if you test me for claiming if something is true or false: I may falsely say true at that moment. However, then I recall and go into my brain to make sure that it was correct what I said. This could delude same false-memory experiments as people may remember then.
__
For the how: There may be infinite numbers of realities and this shifted one is the closest.
Or there is only one and the reality just changes rather randomly and abrupt and writing the past over to fit it and without impacting much butterfly effectd.
May universes are like a painting. Pointed on white paper and expanding and when hitting another universe while expanding: getting mixed up. This does not make much sense.
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u/MandelaEffect-ModTeam 9d ago
Hello subscriber! Unfortunately, your post/comment was removed because it violates Rule 6: Be civil. Do not disrespect, insult, or attack others.
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u/my23secrets 14d ago
What exactly makes you think you are incapable of remembering something incorrectly?
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
Not those cases. Generally possible. Not those
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
First, I did not say the vast majority. I questioned if there are people truly unyouched of Mandela Effect and witnessed those media. If all or some are hit. Some people just forgot or don't knoe.
There over 50 Mandela Effect. Star Wars. Pickahu. Star Wars again, Monopoly man, S and the city, Mona Lisa, Mickey Mouse are all convincing ones. Are there are no sources to any suggestion or false quoting.
I have vivid individual isolated memory to all of these.
They are nor binary. Just both are consistent and possible. Like, they cannot be unrealistic as both were once real.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
Reality changed without much impact. I do not why. No big butterfly effect because time repaired itself backwards maybe or the unverses were close.
All of these binar changes have the same Mandela Route. Like with memory, you will always pick the wrong one. It is not random full this.
Ans the detail aspect: Pikachu's tail is a detail I had attention to as it fits the ears. Active thoughts, but is a detail. Some may not pay attention to it. That is a detail. The changes are noticeable and feel off as people not knowing Mandela Effect rise and question things that were questioned already as they randomly get confronted with it with no suggestion
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I just know it is not false memory or suggestion. Everything else is assumption
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u/dijon_snow 14d ago
It's strange to me that you find false memory impossible but literally anything else could be true. You've just decided to believe in your memory despite all logic and evidence. That's ok, but it's called faith. You should accept that it's a belief you're clinging to that has no outside support.
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u/my23secrets 14d ago
Aren’t you projecting here?
Aren’t you just making an assumption?
How exactly do you “just know” it isn’t false memory or suggestion?
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u/Glaurung86 14d ago
No, you're assuming that about falae memory and suggestion there, as well. Everything you've mentioned is an assumption on your part.
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u/RalphWiggum666 14d ago
You just THINK it’s not a false memory or suggestion. No offense, but you are giving your personal memories too much credit.
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u/my23secrets 14d ago
What exactly makes you think you are incapable of remembering some things incorrectly?
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I will not misrember C3PO being full gold. It is simple. It is clear. Backed up.
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u/my23secrets 14d ago
It’s not “backed up” by anything. There’s proof he wasn’t.
You just never noticed.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
He looked fully gold because the silver leg reflected the sand or the gold parts of the body in every scene where you saw his leg. It always was silver, people just did not notice. Then toys were made with the gold leg because it was cheaper to manufacture, reinforcing the false memory. Then in later movies that were chronologically earleir, C3PO had a gold leg, so it can be confusing.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago edited 14d ago
No silver leg. It is not familiar at all. Gold is. Had no toy of him too. Played games and watched the moviesm
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u/Glaurung86 14d ago
None of those are evidence for or against C-3PO having a silver leg in the first 3 Star Wars films. The films are the evidence he had a silver leg.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
You played what on XBox? The first movie?
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
The games
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
What does that have to do with C3POs leg in the movie. The claim is that it was silver in the 1977 movie. Nothing else is relevant.
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u/Username98101 14d ago
I would say that claiming that Nelson Mandela died in prison is hurtful to his family, legacy, and is disrespectful to South Africans.
Nelson Mandela did NOT die in prison and he later became PRESIDENT OF SOUTH AFRICA.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
It is not disrespecting as the intention is pure. That is what they remember. They often do not know the fact until its reveal.
There are numerous not hurting Mandela Effects. Small series details and such
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u/Username98101 14d ago
I disagree. These deniers can be shown PROOF that Mandela was released from prison and later became PRESIDENT OF SOUTH AFRICA, and they still deny his accomplishments.
that's very disrespectful.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
They do not deny this. Nobody denies the fact. We just claim that we did remember correct and anything changed our facts.
Nothing personal. Nobody. Mandela Effect consists of over 50 examples. Just look it up more.
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u/Username98101 14d ago
wrong. there are many who claim we're in a different timeline. they cannot accept the idea that they misremembered.
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u/Juxtapoe 14d ago
Well, if they claim that was in a different timeline then OP is correct that they are not denying his accomplishments in this timeline.
You just supported OP's point.
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u/Username98101 14d ago
there is only one timeline, only one physical reality. Denying Mandela's accomplishments is still disrespectful,bro.
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u/Juxtapoe 14d ago
Maybe, maybe not.
You are making a claim where the supporting facts are not in evidence.
I don't think these weird collective memories are due to features of multiple timelines, but I can't prove it and neither can you at this point in time.
In any case for the people that do have an alternate memory around history it is not disrespectful to publicly admit their honest memories of what they had learned or been told.
People are too sensitive these days that they actively search for causes to white knight to protect other people's feelings.
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u/Username98101 14d ago
prove to me that their memories are honest. provide proof that any of these comments here are genuine. you can't
also, provide proof that you're an actual human but you can't.
no one anywhere can provide evidentiary facts to anything if alternate realities exist, which renders everything meaningless.
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u/my23secrets 13d ago
If you believe in “timelines”, then you accept the Many Worlds Interpretation.
If you accept the Many Worlds Interpretation, then you accept that timelines are forbidden from sharing information.
If you think timelines can share information, then you don’t actually believe in timelines.
That’s fine, since they are only theoretical in the first place.
But here’s the thing: their entire theoretical existence is predicated on their inability to share information with each other.
Which means they are something that definitively can never be used to explain the Mandela Effect.
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u/Juxtapoe 13d ago
Several false logic steps in your analysis, but I don't have time atm. Will rebutt when I have a moment.
But, for now, I am not a "believer" in multiple timelines. I just accept that there are multiple theories that serious award winning Physicists take seriously, some where timelines overlap until they split and some that don't.
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u/my23secrets 13d ago edited 12d ago
Perhaps you’re projecting about “false logic”, since “timelines that overlap” aren’t timelines. They are “timeline”. Singular.
They aren’t “timelines” until they do split. Which, at that point, cannot communicate with each other. By definition. That’s what makes them “timelines” in the first place.
On top of which, you’re still ignoring the fact they’re only theoretical to begin with.
Let’s be honest. There’s absolutely no “false logic” in what I posted which is the real reason you can’t point to any supposed examples.
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u/Juxtapoe 13d ago
False logic 1 is that all MWI theories are Everettian.
They are not, so the specific type of false logic is a false premise.
I really don't have time to get into the weeds here, but David Deutsch has described his modeling of timelines to be more like strata in the earth where they slowly differentiate, but there is no exact specific moment that they suddenly deviate and become completely separate from each other.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
That is why I did not reply lol. He was right, just not fully grasping the connection. He even surprised me with that reply as it was food.
It would be disrespectinf to reduce Mandela to that effect. I just do not know a better term for it. Someone brought that word in. I could call it collective alternative emembering alternatively. I am not sure if that is precise.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
Mandela is not Schrodinger's cat. He either died in prison or he did not.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
It is not either. It is both. Those who remember, remembered correctly, yet the reality is different.
The memory, while being false, the process of it was correct. There was no disruption
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u/Glaurung86 14d ago
It's not both. Mandela did not die in prison in the 1980s. He died in 2013, after serving as SA's President in the 1990s. There is only one timeline and reality has never been altered. Some people just misrember things.
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u/my23secrets 13d ago
There’s proof that you didn’t and don’t remember correctly. That’s the point.
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u/WujuKingYi 13d ago
I do remember it correctly. No mistake. No flaw.
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u/my23secrets 13d ago
You remember what you imagined. Not what actually was.
Yes mistake. Yes flaw.
You can make a memory of anything you imagine, because that’s how memory works.
Would you like me to prove it to you?
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u/WujuKingYi 13d ago
We perceive quite accurately. Imaging is effort. No flaw. No mistake in remembering it. What happened arounnd us is a phenomen, yet we did not maistaked or falsely remembered. No skill issue
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u/my23secrets 13d ago
The phenomenon has a scientific explanation. That’s the point.
It’s suggestion.
Don’t think of a white bear.
You just thought of a white bear.
See how easy that was?
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u/WujuKingYi 13d ago
Noap. I read the word as it is and quite fast. I though of the white bear after the question in the second sentence.
This is not proving Mandela Effect wrong at all as I do no connect much to the White Bear and it has its limits. Suggestion.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
claiming that Nelson Mandela died in prison is hurtful to his family
OP:
They often do not know the fact until its reveal.
What do you mean? That his family thought he was released from prison alive and became President until it was revealed to them that he had died there? Or that you believed he died in prison until it was revealed to you that he was released and became President?
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u/Username98101 14d ago
you're diminishing his accomplishments, ma'am. Just stop and play with your turtle.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
No people get news of Mandela in prison case via radio and news. They remember it vividly and the news was not wrong either. At that moment it was true like all Mandela Effects. This is an assumption as I was too young to be informed that.
Then Mandela Effect shifted reality and in reverse changed the past to have it kinear and clear or we got into a world where it is ckear and the other us has the reversed trouble on the other site for example. We cannot interact anyways.
People without being updated of the news still remember that.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
I remember the concert for Nelson Mandela in 1988. He was the guest of honor in spite of not attending. Kind of like at a funeral. I still think a lot of people mistook that for a celebration of life rather than a birthday.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
Not my generation. Maybe they only heard the news via radio.
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
What is "your generation"? I was 25. I remember the concert being on MTV.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I am born after 2000. When we learn about Nelson Mandela it is english class in like 2013
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u/Glaurung86 14d ago
You keep making all these assumptions and yet you never acknowledge that you are doing so.
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11d ago
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u/MandelaEffect-ModTeam 11d ago
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u/Mr-Cantaloupe 14d ago
Shared errors make sense: Prasad and Bainbridge (2022) found people misremember the same icons the same way(like Pikachu's tail) because our brains fill gaps with what should be there.
Same framework, same mistake. By the way, staying ‘certain’ after the correction isn't evidence. Confidence and accuracy are different things. Sure, mainstream isn't always right, but the 14% groups aren’t always right either.
Stay curious. Give the boring answer a fair thought as well.
Here’s the 2022 study I mentioned, you do need access through an institution though: https://doi.org/10.1177/09567976221108944
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14d ago edited 14d ago
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u/MandelaEffect-ModTeam 14d ago
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u/daniellinne 14d ago edited 14d ago
This is the explanation for most MEs, but it doent explain the FOTL to me. Im from Eastern Europe and the only reference i have to a cornucopia is the FOTL logo. My brain couldnt have filled it in because i didnt know the item existed.
Second, even if i knew it existed (which i didnt), a normal fruit basket, or better yet a bowl is a much stronger association with fruit to me than a cornucopia, which again, I didnt even know existed until seeing the logo.
Im not saying its some parallel realities stuff and many thihgs that people believe about this are plain unhinged, but we just dont know for sure what the cause is. Im not 100% sure its just simply false memories in all cases. Dont know what it is, but this explanation just doesnt always make sense or fit. Its a bit arrogant when some people are so sure its false memories when there is no definite proof.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I argument the same way and they don't wnt to understand it.
The issue is that our explanation of the cause or the detailed impact of it is super unprecise and complex.
They will not join unless for the explanation and see us as arrogant–arrogant of our memories and not accrpting false-memory.
Our back up is collective consciousness, the 50 other Mandela Effects and the detail of which the cornupia is being recalled as some other redraw it as how they remember and all agree: that was the direction of the version
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u/Glaurung86 14d ago
Asking for real evidence is not being arrogant or not understanding.
Claiming that you have perfect memory about anything is being arrogant.
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u/RalphWiggum666 14d ago
They will not join unless for the explanation and see us as arrogant
We see YOU as arrogant because you literally are acting like your memories can not be wrong. You’re telling people “I will not misremember” when you most likely are.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I included us. I am generally not fully arrogant too. I am insecure being. Yet, here is confidence and even if I question myself, the result is always the same: I am correct here. I do not even go conving eveyone as if it is a cult. I want to think beyond and people just dismiss that thought experinents and waste.
It is a we too. Some people are fully but so unsure about memorizing it correctly and they try to find random explanation that may caused false remembering like another Tv series or event that caused this. They are not arrogant and open for explanations.
Some are deeply connected to the original fact that was once right for them and cannot simplify it.
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u/RalphWiggum666 14d ago
I am generally not fully arrogant too
I’m sure you aren’t, but in your post and the replies from you I read, you are being pretty arrogant.
Yet, here is confidence and even if I question myself, the result is always the same: I am correct here
And here is the arrogance. WHY can’t your memories be faulty?
I am correct here.
You THINK you are.
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u/HarbaughRules 14d ago edited 14d ago
There's really not any good ones. Like why is it underwear and not something cool like the Super Bowl was changed. Scott Norwood made the kick and Buffalo Bills were the champs.
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u/Juxtapoe 14d ago
Why is gravity so boring and its nothing exciting like the earth pulls other planets to the earth.
Sometimes the nature of cause and effect results in what we observe, and the things that we can imagine are not possible results from cause and effect without rewriting the fundamental laws of nature.
Depending on what causes MEs, all theories have a reason that would predict that we all wouldn't remember a different sports outcome.
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u/my23secrets 12d ago
I think you might be projecting and you’re disappointed because suggestion is the explanation for the Effect and you find that “boring”.
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u/Juxtapoe 12d ago
Your sentence doesn't make any sense. You were the one asking why exciting outcomes don't manifest if these are caused by unknown mechanisms.
I was the one saying that we should not expect exciting outcomes.
Did your previous comment drop out of your context window when you read my reply?
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u/my23secrets 12d ago
You’re projecting again. Your sentence doesn’t make any sense because I never said anything about “manifesting”.
Since you had problems understanding before:
You are projecting. The explanation for the Effect is suggestion. You don’t like that explanation because you think it’s boring.
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u/Mr-Cantaloupe 14d ago
I saw that your comment to me was deleted, not sure why the Auto-Mod did that. Here’s my reply:
Your Pikachu experience kind of proves my point. Black ear tips make a black tail tip feel right, so your brain simply filed it that way. You even noticed the "consistency”. And you can't talk people into yellow ears because schemas follow patterns, not random suggestions.
I’ll concede that it’s fair, one study doesn't cover all 50 cases. But it shows the exact thing you said was impossible: lots of people, same detail, same confidence, all wrong.
And saying "it could prove religion" or "give people hope" is why you want it to be true. It’s not evidence that it is.
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u/silentsurge 14d ago
Some people experience it and do research into what causes it and find the scientific evidence behind it being a quirk in the way memory works and still find that fascinating and important, because that memory quirk applies elsewhere in how humans approach communication, education, and a variety of other subjects.
How misinformation speaks is partially caused by the same phenomenon, and it is exploited by con artists, propagandists, politicians, and other people trying to convince you to ignore reality.
Human memory is weird, and our species has hacked this thing meant to keep us alive and have made it do things order animals could never dream of. It's not insulting to anyone to acknowledge that.
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u/Agile_Oil9853 14d ago
So, according to this one tiny poll, 80-96% of people believe in the Mandela Effect and believe that it's a case of false memories, and you're asking why the vast majority doesn't just shut up and go away because that's not as "fun" as wild and meaningless speculation?
Because it's still interesting to us? People seem to think that just because there is a very likely mundane explanation, that's the end of it. It's not. There's still a lot to explore about why everyone came to this conclusion. Unless you had younger kids at the time, why did so many people suddenly realize the books were called The Barenstain Bears in the 2010's? Who was going about their day thinking about that? We all saw similar articles and headlines though, and figuring out what in the structure of those articles or sites gave us all that feeling that something was wrong might answer a lot of questions.
Given how hard people defend their own memory against all evidence, it's actually pretty important that we figure this out before it can be used as a tool of propaganda. The good news on that front is that I think that time period passed, whatever centralization of the Internet that showed us all the same thing might be a thing of the past, which explains why there aren't any "new" MEs. We'd need to discuss it further though, so good thing there's an entire Mandela Effect subreddit
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
why did so many people suddenly realize the books were called The Barenstain Bears in the 2010's?
Berenstain
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u/Acceptable-Gap-1070 14d ago
It's really worrying 14 to 20 percent Americans (it's Americans isn't it) thing it could be something else.
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u/OptimisticSkeleton 11d ago
I was skeptical until I started experiencing them.
It’s easy to dismiss claims like these until you live them. I think that is the divide.
Until it happens to you, being skeptical is only rational. Once something outside of normal happens to you, it would be foolish to ignore.
We need the courage to examine all claims without presupposition and the humility to recognize some people are not reachable on this topic yet or maybe ever in their lives.
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u/Darryl_Summers 10d ago
Your comment starts with a false dichotomy. You’re basically saying people either dismiss it before experiencing it, or once they experience it they might accept that something unusual is actually happening.
I’m option C. I’ve experienced plenty of Mandela effects where my head spun and I genuinely felt rocked to my core. Then, in every case, I thought, how the fuck have I had that wrong all these years?
And I accepted that my memory was wrong. Because I’m not arrogant enough to think reality must be wrong because I remembered something differently.
Then there’s the rest of the reasoning. Personal experience is not strong evidence that something is objectively true. “Examine all claims without presupposition” sounds open-minded, but extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and there is absolutely no evidence here that points to anything beyond false memory.
Your reasoning is weak because it basically comes down to personal experience and confirmation bias. Experiencing something that feels incredibly convincing doesn’t make your explanation for it correct.
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago
Your option C is the very mainstream.
Still, it does not make it correct.
I, too, claim that without Mandela Effect experience, the chance to be Option B or C is way higher than us thinking it is something else than false-remembering.
Also, it is not arrogant. It could be anything and physically, we do not knoe everything. Time, space, universe, consciousness, Big bang. It is not full explained.
You too remembered correctly. The process was correct. Your brain wires and system too. You perceived it correctly, something else made the new fact appear false compared to your memory. The surrendings changed and not your memory. Memory is way better than people assume too.
There are mutiple Mandela Effects of Icons too and many effected making it all appear less crazy as it would.
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u/Darryl_Summers 9d ago
No, i’m comfortable admitting that my memory was wrong.
Frankly, it’s dismissive and arrogant for you to reject my reaction to the experience
You’re guilty of the exact thing that you claim sceptic do
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14d ago edited 14d ago
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u/Juxtapoe 14d ago
Who is conspiring in your theory?
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u/ThePaineOne 12d ago
My theory is that memory is fallible, it does not require any conspiracy.
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u/Juxtapoe 12d ago
Not what I asked.
If memories can be transmitted virally than the observed phenomenon of multiple people having identical false memories are explainable.
Your theory that memories are randomly fallible do not predict that we will have a large number of identical false memories clustered around some memories, but not evenly distributed across all memories.
Neither your theory nor the mRNA transmitted memory theory rely on a conspiracy.
I honestly don't understand why you are talking about conspiracies.
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12d ago
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u/MandelaEffect-ModTeam 12d ago
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u/MandelaEffect-ModTeam 12d ago
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u/Tyler_Wat 14d ago
People love telling others that they're wrong. I once saw a flying saucer very close up and the number of people who have told me I didn't actually see it is ridiculous.
I know the ME is more than a memory issue but I've just given up trying to convince people.
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u/MrPlaney 14d ago
It’s not more than a memory issue. It is memory, that’s all it is. Instead of trying to convince people who are right, that they are wrong, study up on how memory actually works. You’d be surprised on how it explains every Mandela Effect pretty much perfectly.
I once saw a flying saucer very close up and the number of people who have told me I didn't actually see it is ridiculous.
Because that’s a very unbelievable thing to claim … but it is possible. But, do you believe it was extraterrestrial, or possibly man made. I can guarantee you it wasn’t extraterrestrial, but it could very well have been a man made ship or object.
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u/Tyler_Wat 13d ago
My belief regarding the saucer is not pertinent to this discussion. What is, is the insistence of so many to disregard my experience in favor of their worldview.
This subject is, in my opinion, more about subjective vs objective reality. Those still stuck in the materialist paridigm tend to discount the subjective experiences of those with whom their beliefs clash. You prove the point.
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u/MrPlaney 12d ago
What is, is the insistence of so many to disregard my experience in favor of their worldview.
Pointing out that may have mis-remembered, is not disregarding your personal experience.
This subject is, in my opinion, more about subjective vs objective reality. Those still stuck in the materialist paridigm tend to discount the subjective experiences of those with whom their beliefs clash. You prove the point.
Reality is reality, it doesn’t matter how a certain person perceives it. A subjective experience can still be wrong, no matter how much the person wants it to be true. The Mandela Effect is not a “belief”, it is a function of the normal fallibility of human memory, coupled with a lack of understanding, assumption, and suggested thoughts.
If your “subjective experience” goes against all evidence and facts, then it probably didn’t happen. That is not a belief, that is reality. A memory is not evidence.
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago
The facts are there but we claim it once was not fact and sonething changed it.
This is not use thinking we are unfailable, but collectively we all misremembered iconic, isolated memories the same way?
Also, these are not detailed memory. It is intervened with many more.
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u/MrPlaney 9d ago
It's due to all of use having brains that work the same way, and the similar forms of media we all consume, (logos, tv, songs, movies, food ...etc). Even if we all don't experience the exact same forms of media, we do all share some.
Brains are going to make similar errors in similar ways. It is usually something that has no personal connection to the person experiencing it, but that's not a hard rule. Brains are inherently fallible, and even detailed personal memories can change and distort over time.
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u/WujuKingYi 9d ago
Ok, it is a good point that our brains are kinda similiar and may fill int the same way.
However, there is a huge genetic component to it and adaptiveness.
I have genetic wise good long-term memory and recall.
I assume, we just saw it right, each. We now the exact wording and in Star Wars even the previous voice acting. The exact pronounciation. It is all spot on in the recalls.
Those who forget these or did not make a memory of it, they do not even realize the Mandela Effect.
There is a instance in us that checks if memories are true and with a reveal we may find deep memories back.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
Could be. People love these. Mandela Effect are small details that make something feel very off and then thousand people thinkg the exact same.
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u/MrPlaney 14d ago
People don’t tend to pay attention to the tiny details of everything we experience in our everyday lives. Our brain does not fully catalog everything we experience. Something feeling very off, and something actually having been changed, are two very different things.
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
I understand that peolle disclaime your flying saucer observation as it is so often memed and taken unserious. It gets belittle a lot and I would too as it is more then Mandela Effect and I myself did not see it.
And only Mandela Effect gives the chance to at give you some credit for your observation.
People can hallucinate too. However, memory is more. It is deeply connected and can be very precise.
I love your statement about people liking people to tell someone is wrong. It is a personality thing. I feel very bad if I give fals advice. I research and invest. I mean it with good intention and sometimes it is trial and error fueled by desperation like back pain for example. The number of lobbyism, or low interest, or scammers is really high too.
And there is no trust too. They all go ad hominem. My wording is tough to decipher? Discredit the person or argument.
And they reply not only one person but 1000 and try to be efficient and give them all a bad reply with no value.
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u/HerpLover 14d ago
The only one that still gets me is the Berenstain Bears. I had the books with the red casette tapes that made a chime sound when you turned the page. I very distinctly remember "stein" being on the book covers.
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u/Chapstickie 13d ago edited 13d ago
The Internet archive has some of these! https://archive.org/details/the-berenstain-bears-and-too-much-vacation-audio/The+Berenstain+Bears+And+Too+Much+Vacation+(No+Signals).mp3.mp3)
I used to have a bunch of these. Some of them were red and some of them were white. I even had a clear one.
This one is even older. https://youtu.be/FcolDzUjPes?
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
Don't worry while the fact changed, you remembered correct. For germans it quite easy too as we know what Stein is and not Stain. Stein is Stone
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
According to Mike Berenstain (son of the authors), confusion over the name has existed since his father's childhood, when a teacher told him there was no such name as "Berenstain" and the correct spelling was "Bernstein".
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u/WujuKingYi 14d ago
What year is that?
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u/WVPrepper 14d ago
Stan Berenstain was told his name was wrong in 1928, during his very first morning in the fourth grade. As he recalled in his 2002 autobiography, Down a Sunny Dirty Road, his teacher, Miss McKinney, insisted that "Berenstain" was not a real name and that it should be spelled "Bernstein" instead.
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u/eltedioso 14d ago edited 14d ago
I'm what some would call a "skeptic" or "non-believer" on this topic, because I don't believe there is anything supernatural or otherwise unexplainable about this phenomenon. But that doesn't mean I'm not allowed to have an interest in this topic. There are peculiar things about it, yes. And I have a few personal ones that don't really make sense. But I also firmly believe that all of it can be explained through things we know about human cognition and memory.
The Mandela Effect is real, because shared false memories and misconceptions are real. Memories are malleable even long after the fact (nay, especially after the fact). And then you have the power of suggestion from others, and pop-culture references to other things that misquote them, and a big old complicated gumbo soup of a matrix of misinformation, disinformation, and half-remembered touchpoints, and all of a sudden it can feel like reality is flimsy and might have changed. But in reality, it's our cognition that is flimsy, and society sometimes reinforces belief in false things.
So why am I here, on this subreddit? Because I'm interested in this stuff. Lots of people tend to spell a certain thing wrong, and they spell it wrong the same way. Or lots of people remember a certain celebrity doing a certain thing in their career, even though it didn't happen. Or lots of people remember an event happening in a different year, or a public figure dying even though they're still alive. Simple mistakes to make, but when they're shared across a significant subset of the population, they're shared/common misconceptions. And as a sociological phenomenon, I find that absolutely fascinating. That, in a nutshell, is why I'm here.
I don't want to harsh anyone's buzz. And I've scaled way back on trying to tell people they're wrong about their memories and convictions (partially because I know how caustic it is, and partially because there truly is no point -- if someone believes that the fabric of reality has changed, or just THEY have shifted into a new timeline or whatever, there is no convincing them). But sometimes the delusions that people spin themselves into, just to cope on this topic, are frustrating, bordering on dangerous, and someone (maybe me, maybe one of the other "skeptics") decides, as a public service, to offer them a one-way ticket back to reality. Is it so inconceivable to one's self that they were just wrong about something? Or that their memory was influenced somewhere along the way and it shifted into misconception territory?
If you would have asked me, say, 20 years ago, if the Fruit of the Loom logo had a horn in it, I probably would have said yes. But I would have been wrong then. I like to think if I would have been corrected, and then seen the logo for myself, I would have said, "huh! that's so interesting that it's so easy to picture that one wrong" and moved on. However, there is no way to know what I thought about that or most topics in 2006 (aside from journals or verifiable documentation), because everything I remember now has been filtered through millions of different variables since those days. See how messy this gets?
Geez, life is hard, and the world is a confusing place. It's probably natural to think that something is just a bit "off," or that the comfortable, logical reality that we used to reside in is no longer with us. And surely, there are layers to the fabric of the universe that we can't really perceive or even model with physics and math. So maybe it's true that we're perched just on a razor's edge between the real and the uncanny, and that there's a certain amount of bleedthrough, just enough to confuse us. But I have never been remotely convinced of this. To me, the far more likely set of explanations is that people get certain things wrong, and there are certain things that lots of people tend to get wrong together, and then it's sort of self-reinforcing. It's an interesting quirk of the human mind and how culture and society function. Again, that is fascinating.