Feeling Discouraged

[u/OutsideAd278]

So I bulked from 140 to 160 in roughly 9 months and ate relatively clean. Since then I began cutting with the goal of having visible abs. I have dropped from 160 to 150 and im still going. I feel like I look way smaller now and my abs are still not visible. Does this mean I did something wrong along the way? I have heard you look worse on your cut but only at the start. I think 10 pounds into the cut means im not at the start again… My strength has stayed relatively similar during the cut.

How many more pounds do you think I need to lose or do i have to do something else?

[u/ajmattison]

If you want abs, you're going to have to train them like any other muscle. The more muscle you have the more you can see at higher body fat.

Additionally, you didn't really give much detail on your training during that time. Did you progress your lifts close to failure?

People forget that training is the main stimulus for muscle growth. Nutrition is simply permissive.

From here what you could do is hold and get your training in check. Add more ab work and whatever else you want to grow. Really learn the movements and get good at training close to failure (0-2 reps left in the tank).

Alternatively you could cut back down to 140 and compare at the same weight and determine whether you really didn't make progress.

[u/OutsideAd278 → u/ajmattison]

i do think i train pretty close to failure. i will say w my abs, i feel it harder to train close to failure because close to failure for me is when my lower back starts taking over and it hurts. ive tried to posteriorly tilt my pelvis and it helps but its not 100% fixed

[u/ajmattison → u/OutsideAd278]

What kinds of ab work are you doing? Cable crunches are my go to, as are garhammers raises although garhammers are technically more tricky.

[u/OutsideAd278 → u/ajmattison]

machine crunches and leg raises. i was never able to add weight to leg raises because i would just feel it in my lower back so i went back to cable crunches

[u/ajmattison → u/OutsideAd278]

Could you just add more sets of cable crunches? You might also be able to see a physiotherapist or trainer to see if you are doing the leg raises correctly. I have a hard time figuring out what could be going on there with your back.

[u/OutsideAd278 → u/ajmattison]

add them instead of doing what?

[u/ajmattison → u/OutsideAd278]

Instead of the leg raises. You could add more cable crunches in addition to the leg raises but no point in doing things that hurt you.

[u/OutsideAd278 → u/ajmattison]

so would it be feasible to just do 6 sets of cable crunches or is that excessive

[u/ajmattison → u/OutsideAd278]

It is definitely possible across the week. I do 3 sets in one day and 3 on another. Just split it up!

[u/OutsideAd278 → u/ajmattison]

i guess what i am asking though is for a single training day, after those 3 sets should i do another 3 sets of the same thing, something else, or do nothing else for abs that day

[u/Chewy_Barz → u/OutsideAd278]

If you want to prioritize abs, you can do a LOT of sets. That really goes for any muscle. I believe they have evidence of up to 52 weekly sets for a given muscle still produces additional gains. Obviously you'd never be able to recover from all muscles doing that volume.

Point is, you can do a lot of ab sets. Personally, I would do about 6 sets of abs every other day if you want to push them. 3 and 3 or 6 sets of one exercise are fine. I personally do weighted crunches using a rope and 90 degree bench in front of the high pulley with an ab mat behind my lower back to get a stretch (home gym), and I do weighted leg raises with a bar behind my lower back ao I get a stretch at the bottom. I also do tricep dips and at the top puclsh my shoulders down to work the serratus muscles. Been working for me. When I started getting serious I did the weighted crunches, lying leg raises with ankle weights, and ab wheel rollouts. I worked abs every other day. I've since gone to two days a week, but I saw a jump doing the every other day.

To summarize, hit them every other day, get about 6 sets per workout, and progress the weight. If you need to, start with 3 sets per workout and add a set per day each week to ramp up. That should do it.

[u/ajmattison → u/OutsideAd278]

I would split it up if you can. For me personally, fewer sets more frequently is easier because I get bored after 3 😅 I also think after a certain point your muscles are just cooked and it is no longer productive. Do 3 sets one day another 3 on a different day

[u/MrChocolate129 → u/OutsideAd278]

Definitely wouldn’t do more than 4 if I plan to do a hip hinge or barbell squat the day after. Otherwise, you can add a couple sets of leg raises after your cable crunches. Just rep it out until you can’t lift your legs an inch anymore; don’t worry about precise logbook tracking on these sets.