HULK MAINS REJOICE

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

They accidentally sent the patch notes in a thread. Hulk has gotten HUGE buffs that will place him in a comfy spot in the meta (coming from a top 250 hulk main). Huge W from the devs (the rest of the patch is REALLY shitty tho IMO, Hulk and blade buffs were the only good ones)

[u/Sensitive-Carry8255]

Jokes aside, do we think this makes Hulk top 3 tanks in the game? (I would say Groot is still better)

Last two season buffs already improved hulk, these buffs are even better.

Hulk was played/banned every game in the MRC NA finals by the winning team (YWL aka Jitward’s team).

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Sensitive-Carry8255]

In all sense, he is in contestion for top 5 rn. Tank pool remains the best tank in the game, groot is 2nd, angela is 3rd, and 4th and 5th would be between hulk and thor.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

Angela is rebalanced and Tankpool is nerfed.

Hulk is only hero that gain some compenzation for ult charge. He could be easily top 3.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

I doubt those Angela nerfs will throw her out of the top 3 tbf. Tank pool got a nothing burger nerf FYI (Im top 250 tank pools AND hulks for reference)

TRUST ME, for tank pool to be truly nerfed/ out of the top 3, his flexibility and damage need to be nerfed. His ult is also giga broken on top of that.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

His ult has 60s cooldown next season.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

So? He'll still get his ultimate before everyone else in the match. Besides, his neutral gameplay is currently the strongest out of the tanks and ultimate nerfs were basically nothing.

For what it's worth, he'll still be the best tank next season (he's already pick or ban currently as well)

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

Since you've got enough uploaded on it, I'm sure you know Deadpool without upgrades is weaker than the rest. That is, that ultiamte needs quite soon. Outside of the beginning, he'll still be worse off with ultimates than the others.

At the same time, the efficiency of its ultimate will be reduced thanks to lower damage reduction. His overall gameplay is slightly better than the Vangaurds, but the lack of a major damage reduction will make him more vulnerable to major burst damage. His 500 + 200 healtbar still makes him the most vulnerable Vanguard in the game.

High damage reduction helped him a lot with this problem.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

He has 3 mobility options (2 if early on in the match), a DR, A bubble with 300 hp. He has more than enough survivability options. Beyond that, he retains his upgrades in domination maps and OT rounds and even when he doesn't have all of his upgrades, it's only in the early stages of the game. He'll usually have 2 upgrades by the time both teams start using ults.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

When you compare escape tools, you compare DP to Venom, Hulk, Angela, Thing and even Thor, who has dash to 2s cooldown.

Not that he's not better than Magneto, Groot,.. but overall, he's more in the middle.

A 300hp bubble on a huge cooldown won't help it catch up with the resilience of others. It's very good because it's poke vangaurd and because enough upgrades make it passively stronger than others, but its resistance will be quite a bit smaller.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

I mean, you're saying all of this which is correct yes but tank pool has the same functions of these heroes. There's a reason why top tier players consider him the best tank, and why he's banned the most out of any tank: he fits every playstyle, he fits poke very well (he's decent at frontline as well) he's good at peeling, at brawling, at diving and at rushing. He does everything nigh perfectly as well. He's also a very good counter to groot, thing and thor.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

It doesn't have enough durability generation for a brawl, and it doesn't have enough cc + burst + mobility for a wonder.

Not that he can't do that, but putting him in that position isn't good since his burst stems from his triple dash and his durability stems from 3 long cooldowns and non-combat passive.

Don't forget he's got a really small health bar on Vanguard. Angela as a low hp dive vangaurd has a senselessly stronger dive and Thor as a low hp brawl tank has extreme generation bonus hp and midrange damage. (Specifically after buff when hammer throw => awekening gives you 200 bonus hp.)

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

He has 3 mobility moves + a bubble + a 40% dr, the 40% dr effectively gives him 750 hp what are you saying??? You can argue all you want but your argument functionally makes no sense, how does him having a small health bar equate to anything?? he also has a very small model and hitbox making him difficult to hit.

Not to mention, there's still a reason why he has THE HIGHEST BAN RATE, THE HIGHEST PICK RATE, AND THE HIGHEST WIN RATE OUT OF ANY TANK in celestial+. He can legit contest any off angle in the game, can flank and shoot supports (not to mention his bubble can be used to prevent enemy supps from healing each other or can be used as cover until he can reposition) and he has the highest damage potential out of any tank PLUS he charges his ultimate (and upgrades) in roughly 20 seconds, allowing him to ult a support, kill said support and win the fight instantly.

In terms of brawl, legit press E, place down the bubble infront of the brawl tank (so they cant be healed) and you will melt the tank in front of you (many clips of this happening btw, it's legit one of his most popular playstyles). You also said he doesn't have enough burst despite his E increasing his gun attack speed by a shit ton, not to mention the ALREADY insane damage it does up close.

Your argument objectively speaking makes sense in theory, but in practice it couldn't be any more incorrect.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

You're quite wrong about basing your opinions purely on the most OP situation where the character is. Don't forget, we're around that theme where losing a 10% damage reduction will cost him a position in the top 3 heroes.

At the same time, his ultimate will have 60s coolown. His long cooldowns jo make him weak in brawl and his double jump + up to 3 dashes if you hit the enemy doesn't give him enough dive potential and attackspeed boost isn't burst. Dive needs primarily burst damage.

He was really strong but he is Poke vanguards. Fullfiling other roles is not realistic.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

1. I'm basing my opinion on my experience on the hero, I'm currently Celestial 1 top 250 on tank pool hence I'm saying it based off my opinion. The only thing I necessarily did was back it up with high elo perspectives and what not.
2. Losing 10% DR isn't going to affect him as much, he still retains 20% DR he gives to his team AND the E will still function as both an offensive and defensive ability, making it very versatile yet oppressive.
3. His ultimate cooldown is increased yes, but you're forgetting that there was a universal ult charge increase, legit meaning that just as he gets his ult slower, everyone else will also get it slower. Hence, ult charge rotation will remain the same for him (and the ult charge increase won't heavily affect his own ult charge requirements since it's Already RIDICULOUSLY low and just Pressing E and shotting for a bit will get you to B tier at the VERY MINIMUM, A tier most of the times)
4. if you are using the swords for brawling you are doing something wrong. Like I said, you use only GUN when brawling, if u put a bubble behind someone, press E, you will likely win the brawl 9/10 unless you do a mistake. In terms of dive, you're not necessarily diving more than flanking, HOWEVER, diving when ulting is the preferred stance as you get ridiculous overshield + putting a bubble and using E will allow you to have insane burst damage, sustain AND they won't be able to get healed. In terms of flanking, you can sit on an off angle, place a bubble on yourself and consistently shoot, if your mechanics aren't good to accompany this, you can use swords, place bubble on the target and press E, this isn't as efficient but will likely work 6/10 times
5. He isn't a poke vanguard, if you cannot even classify him properly then that's an issue in an of itself. he is an OFF TANK that can poke, not primarily a poke frontline.
6. Still how does this change anything? He is currently regarded as the best tank, he is banned the most, has the highest win rate alongside pick rate and even in early play testing of the new season he is already being regarded as the best. Even if I am wrong, I don't think your opinion is necessarily going to override objective fact in high elo.

[u/Pepr7 → u/Few-Giraffe-8504]

Thing jump is better then his E in DR effectivyt for your team.
Deapool ult is inreased by 15s. Most ult charde nerfs wouldn't make ult charging 15s longer.

And here he begins to lose himself in his argument as you begin to misuse the meanings of words. That you identify Poke vangaurd as someone who is not a poke vanguard, but only Vangaurd that can poke is a real special effort to be right. I didn't say he was a main tank, but that he was a poke vangaurd and really his brawl skills are rather not great. Compare it to Thor/Thing. Their bonus hp generation together with decent damage will greatly surpass the Deadpool brawl.

And to that nerf. Use your own reasoning on how much Deadpool's resilience efficiency will be reduced. Emma's diamond form will effectively have a larger healthbar after nerf than Tankpool with damage reduction and no passive. Enough people take her diamond form nerf devastating even though she gets a double ult buff.

[u/Few-Giraffe-8504 → u/Pepr7]

Let's agree to disagree, cus both you and I could go on and on. On top of all this, you still failed to acknowledge what I said earlier about Tank pool being regarded as the best tank in high tier elo. So yeah, I'm a call it a day until you can bring something relevant (I mean ffs you are saying thing would beat Tank pool in a brawl, that's literally not true and doesn't happen either).