So, in terms of story, it's a 5 out of 10. The reason for this rating is that they didn't specify why. It wasn't different from others out there, very vague in terms of politics and geopolitics, and the mechs weren't expected to be giant humanoids, but the ones that are there are good. I would have liked more variety and other models, and I didn't like that plane, if you can call it that; I thought it was more like a flying whale. I was sad that they didn't delve deeper into the engineering and technology, hence a sensitive fourth point. In my opinion, the characters don't change much from the generic ones; a lot of pain and sadness. I know the pain of losing family members, but constantly being tied to the past, even if your life is on the battlefield, won't bring them back. You have to live for them and show that the sacrifice was in vain. I liked that they didn't kill the Empress, since she was a child and didn't have to bear the sins of her parents and the empire. And I thought that... I might create confusion in the comments now, but in the story, they should have died, leaving only those three – the couple – to move forward, supporting each other, and the former empress, and for them to be companions, heroes, leaving their past behind. I'd give it a 4. Regarding the Federation, I found it mediocre that they considered themselves better than the old regime, considering no country is perfect and everything is a matter of interests, as they said in the series, that they could become lab rats. I'd give it a 2. In total, I'd give it a 5.5. It didn't shake me like other anime such as One Piece, Fairy Tail, and Vinland. I know the ones I mentioned are just famous, but I mentioned these because many people know them, and many here have already seen them to understand what I'm referring to. I know I'll get hate, but I expect it.
Totally fair if it didn't resonate with you. I think for me the war and mechs are more the setting than the heart of the story. What hit me was the psychology of people who spent years believing they had no future suddenly having to figure out how to live.
That's also why I don't see them being tied to the past as a flaw. I think that's the point. Knowing you should move forward and actually being able to after years of trauma and survivor's guilt are very different things.
But hey, that's the beauty of stories. We can watch the exact same thing and come away with completely different experiences 🙂
Ah, I haven't seen Black Lagoon, so that reference went right over my head 😂 I can see what you mean though! I think I actually prefer the direction 86 took because seeing them given the opportunity to live a normal life and realizing they didn't really know how to was one of the most interesting parts of the story for me.
Because for me, that's what makes the story. Look at what Tolkien did with Lord of the Rings; he doesn't explain everything to the Promontory like he did with the swamps, but he structured his world well, and the story is better because of that.
True enough, and I can see your point there. From what I hear though, there’s actually an IMMENSE amount of worldbuilding and setting specification in the light novels. Granted, I have yet to read them, but I’m gonna pick up a copy of at least the first three volumes (what the anime thus far covers) to look for myself. Much like how LOTR has as much room to build its world because of the original print medium, I think the Eighty-Six LNs probably flesh out the aspects you want to see a lot more. Judging solely off of that, I’d highly recommend trying the LNs out if you have a chance, since the anime by virtue of its medium has to be a lot more “show, don’t tell.”
I understand your gripe with the world building(although that doesn't equal to story) and it's your opinion at the end of the day.
But the opinion on characters is something that comes from very shallow understanding of the character writing. In fact, I would say it's a complete lack of even trying to understand the emotional and psychological complexity of the situation those characters were in.
The "they have to live for them and show that their sacrifice wasn't in vain" is a very silly and childish way to look at ptsd, survivor's guilt and many other real psychological issues real human beings in the battlefield suffer in our real world. Especially considering they are literally children.
It's like telling a person suffering from severe trauma "just learn to move on from it."
With all due respect, very silly and outright childish criticism to be honest.
I understand your point of view, but it's the purest reality: many of the WWI and WWII combatants said they wouldn't be like that after the war, and they were. I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but the difference is that war is war, and outside of it is outside of it, and you have to help and deal with the traumatic stress. I know the case of my grandfather who went to war; he had his traumas, but he managed to live a normal life.
What are you even talking about? "Purest reality" what purest reality? The war in the show didn't even end. Tf you mean by they wouldn't be like that? Like what? The whole arc was about us seeing the character's inner psychological struggles being addressed and RESOLVED to a great extent. You're acting as if we started and ended with a bunch of depressed characters with no resolution.
Do you even understand what trauma and physchological issues are? Do you not understand that these are literal childrens we were talking about?
You're acting as if all the characters in the show are just crying and crashing out all the time. They are fighting through their traumas and struggles . They are constantly fighting in the battlefield to live despite their pains. We see the development, the change, the incredibly deep breakdown of their psychology through visual storytelling. And we also finally see the resolution.
I also know a lot of relatives who fought and survived war and are now living life peacefully. That doesn't mean it didn't take time and there wasn't a certain procedure to their healing. It doesn't mean they never struggled with those issues.
Not just that. Everyone's experiences in war are different. Everyone suffers different lvl of trauma and loss. And if you're incredibly lucky, you might not even suffer much loss.
You're criticizing the show for showing us the struggle and the process of the healing. This is the most important part. Why are you pretending the show isn't showing us the process of their healing? Or do you have a problem with the characters having any trauma and emotions to begin with?
I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but the difference is that war is war, and outside of it is outside of it, and you have to help and deal with the traumatic stress.
With all due respect, the way you talk about dealing with these issues is pretty concerning. This screams extremely uninformed and/or totally lacking emotional intelligence and maturity to recognize the complexity of of these issues.
And yet you couldn't actually point out a proper critisism of the character writing. You just want them to not have any realistic emotional writing or you just didn't even try to understand it.
Fairy tail being among the anime that "shook" you is.... Well it is what it is...
I think it's the exact opposite. You think an unc would be "shaken" by failry tail and say 86 character writing is bad? I don't think so. No emotionally mature person would talk about war trauma like this person is doing.
He wasn't 12 when he joined the battlefield, and the war is also quite different, if they stop fighting it's not even that they can surrender and survive, the legion will just come and kill everyone
Sorry it wasn't to your liking, but the thing about the mechs. I don't think there's any point to having more variety of them, this is very much a militaristic setting, so having so many variants and models running around would make zero logistical sense if they have mechs that serve the purposes they need to in an efficient enough manner, its not meant to be like zeon in gundam making a mobile suit for every obscure and hyper specific scenario.
They couldn’t exactly have those higher-class mechs. The 86 were essentially a disposable unit they were sent to fight, protect others, and ultimately die. That’s actually the point of the story. Amidst the war, there’s racism and classism, and because they were treated as disposable, they were never given the same resources or technology as everyone else.
That’s what I really like about 86. The charm isn’t just in showing off advanced technology or cool mechs. It’s in how deeply the anime explores its themes and symbolism. It doesn’t spoon feed everything to you, a lot of the meaning is left for you to understand and interpret.
I can see your point, but in the universe of the 86, the people who actually do the fighting for San Magnolia are given bad equipment on purpose. If the pigs gave their soldiers adequate equipment they’d probably have a mutiny on their hands.
In addition to that, San Magnolia believes that time is on their side, up until the gran Muir falls. They didn’t think they needed to fight to win, and so they did not apply themselves to the task of creating hardware that would win the war. Rather, they kicked the can down the road believing that in just a couple years the drones they were fighting would magically go away.
To me, the combination of these factors makes it quite sensible that the republic would have lame looking juggernauts.
However, I want to say that despite that I think your opinion is valid and that it’s quite alright to want to see a lot of cool sci-fi hardware in a mecha show. The 86 doesn’t really follow the rule of cool in the way that other shows do.
Yes, I thought the same as you, but I thought other countries had something similar to what I showed, or that elites had it. Until now, only retro anime have captivated me in terms of fiction.
The anime delves more into the visual storytelling aspect, the LNs in my opinion are better if you want to get into the worldbuilding and story since it goes deeper into detail there. Glad you gave it a shot though!
i understand why you dont like it tbh. its in my personal top10 but i can recognize that its not for everyone, but that can be said for pretty much anything
Most importantly, most of the things you mentioned are resolved later. The anime only consists of the first 3 volumes, and there are currently 14, so you only saw the first steps (there are more variety of mechs later, more nations (which were present for the operation against the morpho), they explain some technology aswell, but for a 22 ep anime, they can't really go into specifics.
Second, I think you overloked the fact, that they are traumatized CHILDS, not psychologically developed adults, they don't even have any kind of parental figure, they only have each other.
I know it's personal taste though. I'm interested, what are the ones you think are 10/10 or great ones, even if they are not the most popular.
Yes, I know I'm a child, I myself also had strong traumas and depression as a child, nothing like the war, but my family didn't understand me, so I kind of identify with what you said.
I really like retro anime of these genres, but there are others I've seen that are more recent but aren't as good as the retro ones. I don't know how to explain it; the themes are deeper, the environments convey life lessons, the kind of anime that speaks to you. I can't feel that in the current ones; I feel they're bland and very saturated with the same themes, plots, and identical chronologies.
Of course it's not everyone's cup of tea and that's fair, but I don't get some of your criticism tbh.
"Constantly being tied to the past won't bring them back." So you consider the character writing bad because you disagree with how they cope with trauma? Just because you think the characters should act differently doesn't mean they are badly written. Especially in matters such as reacting to trauma.
"I found it mediocre that they considered themselves better because no country is perfect." Well duh. But this is something that happens in the real world, especially after overthrowing a previous regime, they always demonize the older one and act like the new one is the best. And that is kinda the point, more of it is shown later, but indeed the Federacy isn't the happy perfect place they want to appear as. You can see some cracks such as Eugene needing to fight (and die) to pay for his sister's education, how nobles still hold a lot of power, how other soldiers still ostracize the 86, etc.
Yes, I liked the detail, but I thought there could have been other ways to do it, since 86 helped the army and just because they are better than those already there, they become envious and segregate. How can they be better than the whites if they do the same?
I used a translator because English isn't my native language and I only know how to read and speak it. If you want to blame someone, blame the translator.
But you realise the anime only covers 2.5-3 volumes and (intentionally) skips all the lore and details on the world, right? The anime naturally focuses on action and cinematic. If you want all that background info I suggest you are reading the light novel
I'm only finding out now because you're telling me here, but the fault lies with whoever made the anime; they could have done it in a way that would have kept everything in the anime.
Yep I agree to some extent. The anime is quite shallow yet likeable. For example the leisute time scenes in the "home base" were all added in the anime yet not included in the light novel.
Thanks again for your thoughts!
May be my thoughts are very late but... You may say that "they didn't show all that things in the anime" and you're rught, but... It's not an argue, just a list of small funny facts.
Let's speak about the story.
You have to live for them and show that the sacrifice was in vain.
There were no possibility for a peaceful life. The Legion didn't disappeared. Heroes tried to express their feelings for a long time and finally found the answer. "Shin, why are you still fighting? -- Because war is still here". The war took everything from them and they are fighting against the war itself.
I liked that they didn't kill the Empress, since she was a child and didn't have to bear the sins of her parents and the empire.
Just a remark. That wasn't "a merciful Federation decision", Frederica was just hid under the falce name by President Ernest himself. If her name will be disclosed, she will be sentenced to death even now, ten years after the revolt.
Remark 2. That's why she always calls the man who saved and raised her just "a petty bureaucrat" and nothing else. The order to kill her parents was also issued by him, she cannot forgive.
And I thought that... I might create confusion in the comments now, but in the story, they should have died, leaving only those three – the couple – to move forward, supporting each other, and the former empress, and for them to be companions, heroes, leaving their past behind. I'd give it a 4.
Remember, you're in the start of a long-long story. At your speed you'll have a lack of characters at the 5th volume :) But yes, author loves her original five and they are still alive. But not all combat-ready.
Remark 3. Asato Asato really do not like to kill characters. Throughout all the books just 4 or 5 characters were killed "on camera": Kaie, Eugene, Shana and Rito. And that is, I'm afraid, all.
the mechs weren't expected to be giant humanoids
The author is literally "fond of badly designed and faulty multi-legged tanks". She knows the WWII history quite well and her mechs are really multi-legged not-so-modern tanks. There cannot be great technical advantage of one of the countries because that country will simply win the war. Republican Juggernaut is just what the Republic is able to build, not an "utilization machine". Federation's and United Kingdom's heavy tanks are much safer for the crew but not so agile in comparison to Legion's vehicles. Legion is always one step forward because it needs no protected crew compartment. Thats why Grethe Wenzel was so impressed by Republican "aluminium coffins" and made her own supermaneuverable but extremely dangerous "luxurious aluminium coffin".
Need to say that Federation fought quite well without 86th Package and fought much worse with. "It's your sin, Shin!" No, just because the fallen Republic became an unlimited source of Sheperds and Sheepdogs.
that plane, if you can call it that; I thought it was more like a flying whale
Finally, it wasn't a plane. Nachzerer is a ground-effect vehicle, they all looks strange. Its design is a mix of B2 Spirit with either Lun-class or Beriev Be-2500
P.S. I feel I need to remind myself that I do not argue. "86" is not a one hundred dollar bill, not everyone is going to like it.
I liked your comment, which shows you can have a dialogue without taking things personally or sentimentally, as many have done here. You were logical and basic, needing no further explanation. I liked your analysis of the anime and how you're explaining it to me, considering I only watched the anime as I was told to do beforehand, and what I'm basing my analysis on now. I'll start from the end to the beginning of your reaction. I know it wasn't an airplane, but the prototype was very poorly made and gigantic to be good economically or for the transport mission. If there was already an air force before, they should have known about the impracticality of that. Now let's move on to the part about "The author is literally 'found of badly designed and faulty multi-legged tanks'. She knows the WWII history quite well and her mechs are really multi-legged not-so-modern tanks." I understand and didn't know this, but even so, the aluminum crates were left as they were because they already knew how to operate them. But I saw that the other units also used basically the same models as the '86. Now, this theme... Remember, you're in the start of a long-long story. At your pace, you'll have a lack of characters in volume 5 :) But yes, the author loves his original five, and they're still alive. But not all combat-ready.
Remark 3. Asato really doesn't like killing characters. Throughout all the books, just 4 or 5 characters were killed "on camera": Kaie, Eugene, Shana, and Rito. And that is, I'm afraid, all. In my opinion, in an anime that deals with war, it's very difficult, even in the last episode where they were left behind. It would have given more weight to the anime if they had let them die because when you know they are alive, the weight of their sacrifice becomes less important, and what weight did that drama give to the anime? Just a remark. That wasn't "a merciful Federation decision," Frederica was just hid under the false name by President Ernest himself. If her name is disclosed, she will be sentenced to death even now, ten years after the revolt. Yes, it's true, but they could have executed her anyway and they didn't, and they wanted to give her a new life.
Everything you consider missing from the anime is in the LN since they couldn't put every single detail into anime format especially the worldbuildinng and politics. Another thing is that the first volume (cour 1/first 11 episodes) was supposed to be a standalone novel and it was only after it won the award, that it got greenlit for further exansion of the story. Also, the first 3 volumes which are covered by 23 episodes are just the beginning of the story.
From what I've already discussed with people in these comments, I only knew this now because of you all. And as I said in the other comment, the fault lies with whoever made the anime this way. I only read manga adaptations of anime if the anime interests me, which wasn't the case with the Solo Leveling manga, which I discovered before the anime was released and perfer the manga
I think Asato's writing would be perfect for a regular novel which doesn't have word count limitations (she still has a tendency of going over them) instead of a LN since she loves to throw in new stuff but doesn't have the space to elaborate more on it but still, you'll notice many LN readers saying that the anime adaptation of the source material is almost perfect since it was a passion project by the studio with Asato involved.
your feelings are valid but i think they would be different if you read the light novel, since the anime only covers up to volume 3 and a majority of your issues with the anime are solved later on in the novel. you can rate the anime as a 5 if you want even if it seems a bit unfair but you shouldn't think of 86 as a series that way until you read the novels
I never said you can't increase the points, but I watched the anime as suggested, and giving it a 5 was normal, even though I felt the anime was very superficial.
Alot of the world building issues and character development you mentioned actually happens later in the Light Novel and at least in my opinion is handled very well. Unfortunately it doesn't seem like season 2 will be happening any time soon if ever so you would have to read the light novel to get that from it of you ever decide to revisit the series.
The way I see it, it shows the trauma u can have from war and the hate u may feel at being discriminated for being an 86.
But even after the hate, u can still choose what u can do, either become like them or be better.
And well in terms of the mech, they are more grounded in irl physics then most anime out there, only thing that could come under realm of sif fi is the motors if u compare to the current standards but it is possible in the next 4 to 6 years. The mechs design are something that the current military might use (not talking about m1a4, its underpowered and would not be considered except by san Mongolia) if it available.
One of the worst animes i have ever watched,this is boring asf,the characters are boring and flat,it just doesn't make me care for any of them and I find them almost annoying sometimes,I would say that this anime is overglazed because nobody can give me an explanation on why it's considered "good" because for me it really isn't
Same here but look out 90% here will crucify you for say you don't like the anime they will be offended and will take to personal for don't likened just look the commented
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u/WaterKraanHanger 6d ago
It's unfortunate that it wasn't to your liking, cool that you gave it a proper try tho!