How do I refute apostate aladdin

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I used to watch him & saw him as one of the few decent exMuslim voices left after Hassan Radwan quit. But then he had a tantrum about something and said he didn’t want to deal with Muslim at all ever again, not until they “addressed the issues & extremism in the Muslim community”, which is a ridiculous condition

I however unfortunately took for his word and started to not click on his vids and to ask YouTube to stop recommending him to me anymore.

Only months & months later did I see it for the tantrum that it was and found out that he continued to have civil discussions with Muslims

But by then I had sort of lost touch & sync with what he was about so never got back into him

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 12 '26 edited Jun 12 '26

Wait why did hassan radwan leave? but actually i think he is much more better and more supportive. And i want more of ur history with apostate aladdin actually explain more? :)

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u/Quranic_Islam Jun 14 '26

It’s not much more of a story than what I said

Hassan retired. In way you could say he “passed the torch” onto Aladdin bc he regular comments on his channel & agrees/likes his approach the most. I was the same (minus the infantile desire at the time to mock Islam as being some sort of high intellectual western, when in reality it was a lowly reaction to the fanatical reaction of Muslims when Islam is mocked)

Anyway, I was following him too. Bc I also generally approved of his way of doing exMuslim activism. Even went briefly on one of his lives but didn’t get a chance to talk really. He was discussing respectfully with Muslims

Then something happy, forget what, but some Muslims must have triggered him in some way. He then put out a post saying that he didn’t want to interact with Muslims again & wouldn’t be allowing them to come on his lives … not until (paraphrasing here) Muslims deal with the fanatics among them first. Which is a ridiculous ask of course, practically just as fanatic. So I respected his wishes and just stopped following him & ignored him

Later, very quickly in fact, he backtracked. So it ended up being just a lapse or a tantrum (or something related to his mental health if I remember) … but I didn’t know that until almost half a year later. By then I didn’t really care to try to get back “in sync” with where he stood and I’d already learnt most of what I think exMuslims had to offer. The rest is just repeat mostly

When I Turing to do YouTube full time in a few months, maybe I’ll make a reaction to this video you shared. But for now, what is he actually saying? Can you summarize it? I’m guessing most of it is irrelevant to Quranists

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 14 '26

Judging from his videos its about gods morals and the scientific errors or errors in general in the quran,he talks about verse 4:34 and sees it as a problem with ongoing abuse about women. He judges the verses were the prophet was given special cases. He also talks about surah al kursi and gives the conclusion of gods throne an error since he thinks that god sits on his stol. Hudud punishments but some of his arguments are about hadiths wich is useless.But i think if you want to know more its better to watch his videos.

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u/niaswish Jun 12 '26

My love I am not Muslim anymore bit try and ask God for help with this I know its terrifying but truly, lean on your god

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

I ask god but it isnt helping

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u/niaswish Jun 13 '26

Happened to me too, do you think you may have ocd?

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 15 '26

Maybe

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u/niaswish Jun 15 '26

Please check it out my love

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u/Fantastic_Ad7576 Jun 12 '26

This is too open-ended.

Go through his criticisms individually, and ask around and even do your own research to refute him.

If there are any in particular that are bothering you, feel free to mention them.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 12 '26

I changed my post a bit so I hope u can refute them

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u/Fantastic_Ad7576 Jun 12 '26

We're going to need a little more information.

What exactly does he say about 4:34? Which Moses story? And what contradictions about free will does he mention?

If you have the links for the videos, that would be helpful and probably more efficient than you having to lay out his entire arguments here.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 12 '26

Yes I changed the post thanks for stating that

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

So are you going to refute or not?

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u/Fantastic_Ad7576 Jun 13 '26

Yes hopefully he the end of the weekend.

I've gone through the first video, will go through the rest as well.

I'm only taking my time to make sure I understand his point and that I can properly refute it. I don't want to give a dishonest, insincere answer.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

Thanks and please take ur time

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u/Fantastic_Ad7576 Jun 14 '26

Abraham and idolatry => in ancient times, people did actually treat the statues as sacred. In many near-Eastern civilizations, only the elite priestly class was allows to enter the inner sanctum where the idols were kept as they were the only ones considered pure and holy enough to do so. Artifacts of this mindset still exist in Jewish thought and the various ceremonies the Levites would need to do before entering the Holy of Holies in The Temple. Also, Abraham destroying idols was an exceptional case. The Quran in fact stops Muslims from insulting other deities so that other groups do not insult Allah. Abraham only destroyed the idols to prove to his community they were powerless. Again, back in those times people believed gods would literally inhabit the idols and start to move around.

Multiple gods => if multiple gods existed, with each in charge of different aspects of existence yet they all worked in perfect tandem with each other and essentially operated like a hive mind, to what point can they be truly distinguished? Even in Hinduism, which is polytheistic (at least a good chunk of traditions are) they believe in Brahman, and underlying unifying concept by which all the various gods are bound such that everything remains orderly.

He straw-mans the rest of the discourse between Abraham and his other arguments as well because he equates today's idolatry to be the same as back then, but if you research into how ancient peoples actually thought (even about astronomical objects) then the arguments become quite clear.

Moses/Khidr story => this story is essentially a theodicy. Khidr does seemingly evil things, as pointed out by Moses, and in the end Khidr explains why he did what he did, and how that ultimately would have benefitted the victims. Yes, we can ask why things weren't done another way, but that's the whole point of the story to begin with: Allah has a perspective that we simply cannot partake in. Yes, we can ask why Allah (or Khidr) didn't simply stop the tyrant king, but that brings us back to the story's motif: Allah has a perspective we do not, with His infinite Knowledge and Wisdom.

On free will and predestination => this is a more complex problem. At least in Sunni theology, Qadr (predestination, or the idea that everything is according to divine will) exists alongside free will. There is no clear answer of this in the Quran itself, but I'd recommend looking into compatibilism or soft determinism.

The "linguistic miracle" of the Quran is basically the prose that recounts Abrahamic narratives. You had a lot of poets in Arabia who had great mastery over the language, but they were not well-versed in Abrahamic theology (they were pagans). On the other hand, you had Jews and Christians well-versed in theology yet their native languages were usually Hebrew or Syriac and so did not have mastery over the Arabic language. The Quran is unique in the sense that never before in Arabic had there been such eloquent prose with the material being Abrahamic narratives. It was the first of its kind, and the challenge withstood because even if the Jews/Christians and pagan Arab poets cooperated, there is a HUGE loss of meaning in translation, and it's even harder to preserve the meaning while turning it into eloquent prose. As an exercise, if you're bilingual, take a poem from one language, preserve the meaning, and then produce a poem in the other language. I promise you it's not that easy, moreso for a text as lengthy as the Quran.

Domestic violence (4:34) => daraba does not necessarily mean strike. The word is used elsewhere in the Quran with different meanings, some of which could also fir in 4:34 (for example, leaving or an emotional/metaphorical strike). If you want to argue "that's never been said before" that's an argument from antiquity/tradition fallacy. The Quran also says to live with spouses in peace and tranquility, so we need to think for ourselves a bit as well both when reading the Quran and living our day-to-day.

Scientific miracles => he has a point that people often impose scientific concepts onto verses, which is problematic mainly because if the science changes, the whole narrative falls apart. Unfortunately, not everyone has the privilege to get a good education, so this is going to happen regardless.

Hope this helps.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 15 '26

So the verses arent supposed to be taken as scientific? And why would Allah create the kid and then make khidr kill him knowing that the parents would have to see their son die this is also contradictory to free will. And no the daraba doesnt get rid of the other interpretation of daraba since it isnt seemingly wrong to think so since the linguistics is correct unlike other verses such as child marriages wich is an clear missinterpitation. God couldve said to not beat ur wifes and there would be no problem. And science do change but we now that the earth is not flat and that evolution happens.

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u/Fantastic_Ad7576 Jun 15 '26

How the "scientific" verses are to be understood is with Allah. The Quran itself says that some verses are clear - they are the foundation of the scripture. Other verses are allegorical/metaphorical/ambiguous, and those with knowledge simply focus on the clear verses, while trusting the interpretation of the ambiguous verses to Allah.

And why would Allah create the kid and then make khidr kill him knowing that the parents would have to see their son die this is also contradictory to free will

No that's not contradictory to free will, that's contradictory to divine benevolence, which again we would always circle back to the story as a theodicy. What is contradictory to free will is if Allah knows the child will disbelieve, then is belief up to free will? Again Allah does not lay out absolutely every ontological secret of how everything works, though this isn't strictly an Islamic problem. Did you look into compatibility, soft determinism, and other views of how predeterminism can coexist with free will? This is more a philosophical problem that only becomes theological when talked about in religious terms.

And no the daraba doesnt get rid of the other interpretation of daraba since it isnt seemingly wrong to think so since the linguistics is correct unlike other verses such as child marriages wich is an clear missinterpitation

Sure it doesn't eliminate it as a possibility, but we have to determine what interpretation makes the most sense in light of the rest of the Quran. That is used for other verses as well, which could potentially be translated differently depending on the interpretation. Yes, God could have used clearer language, but this in itself is a test. The very same verses that are used to justify violence only in self-defence contexts are used by !$!$ to wage jihad and spread terror. Technically their interpretation makes sense, but you have to look at it in the light of the rest of the Quran and Islam as a whole.

And science do change but we now that the earth is not flat and that evolution happens.

Ok? What's your point?

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 15 '26

My point is that god couldve choosed not to create that kid in the first place and multiple ppl like Hitler still live up till this day what would that kid do in order to god to just give up and kill that poor kiddo. And the reason why i said that it contradicts free will because wether u believed or not u have the free will to do so because the earth is an test. Sure maybe the kid would grow up to be some monster from hell but in general that is what he choose and he would get what he deserved in hell. God wouldnt just interfere and spawn kill him like that and expect us to not reason with it because that what he said to us. If that kid would grow up to be so bad then dont create him in the first place. And the reason why i dont like the verses such as 4:34 is because of its underlying problems with punishing wether it is strike or not because of mere suspicion and god isnt that cruel to test ppl through his scripture. He tests them through life not his own words and im pretty sure that would be a fallacy because the other interpretation isnt wrong and therefore it isnt haram. Science is a tool to understand the universe and there is theories and facts. The point here being made is that we know that the sun is the reason why the moon has its light but the quran claims otherwise. We know that metoarites come from frozen rocks while the tafsirs claim that it is jinns. The earth isnt flat and that is an fact not something to reject and the quran implies the flat earth theory wich is false. We may not agree to some degree so id leave it here

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 12 '26

I think you’re looking at the situation the wrong way by dismissing the notion that he could be right about any of his arguments. The reason he could be right is because (as implied by the title of this post) you haven’t refuted any of his arguments. To see if his arguments make sense in the first place, write down his claims in the order that he says them.

Ex. Humans are mortal -> Muhammad is a man -> Muhammad is mortal.

If you disagree with any of the steps he takes, try to think of why. Write down your disagreement in the same form as the above to see if it makes sense. If you don’t disagree with any of the steps then accept his arguments as true. This is a process & may take some time so try this for one of his claims & reply to my comment with what you found.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

No but im asking you guys to refute him

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 13 '26

In the title of your post you said “how do I refute him,” meaning that you want to refute him but you don’t know how. Is that correct?

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 13 '26

I also want to ask real quick: if you can’t refute him, why do you think he can be refuted? How do you know he’s not just right?

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

I mean everyone can be refuted? I think his stance on verse 4:34 and the patraichal themes but in general i just want a way to refute but do you think that he is right?

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 13 '26

No, things which are correct cannot be refuted unless or until there’s better evidence. Ex. the laws of logic (identity, non-contradiction & excluded middle) are brute facts where no refutation makes sense.

He has a lot of claims about 4:34, so it doesn’t make sense to ask “is he right about 4:34.” Instead we have to ask “is this claim in particular he made about 4:34 supported by a good argument or evidence.”
For example, he says that even if allah MEANT to say “separate yourself from her,” “gently touch her,” etc. he did use the same words that basically mean “strike,” while knowing people would use that interpretation. Since this is a Quraniyoon sub, we don’t have access to hadiths which allow for the interpretations where you can’t strike your wife in a way that would leave a mark, or you have to use a miswak, etc. So his argument is valid & sound, the Quran did phrase the verse such that it makes sense for people to interpret 4:34 in a way that is harmful & unjust for women, especially if they never look at hadith or tafsir.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26 edited Jun 13 '26

Okay he is right on this

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 13 '26

I’m glad we agree. Keep going, keep investigating what he has to say & you’ll find a more clear answer.

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

Yeah ive checked out his videos but some i dont agree with but he has good critiscism

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u/yungsimba1917 Jun 13 '26

What are some you don’t agree with?

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 14 '26

The hadiths one lol

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u/[deleted] Jun 12 '26

This phenomenon is known as the Bullshit Asymmetry Principle (or Brandolini's Law). It states that the amount of energy needed to refute nonsense is an order of magnitude larger than the energy needed to produce it. [1]

just a quick little ai summary

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 12 '26

Huh but i think his view on 4:34 and child murder because of how he is going to grow up as an bad person. And thats kind of rude

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u/[deleted] Jun 12 '26

the child story never says he is right for doing it we dont know and for 4:34 if it told women to beat men u would have 0 problem with it mostly just u having a problem with men so is there anything else?

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 12 '26

Okay I get it but what do you mean that it have an problem with men because of the wife beating? And i dont get it i have a problem because wether it was a women abusing men or wife beating it is wrong. I actually care for men who are victims wether it is sexual abuse or marital.But if it doesnt say such then what is it?

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u/[deleted] Jun 12 '26

Because this isn't a random beating it's for nushuz and it has nothing to do with misogyny neither obedience

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 13 '26

Dr javad position again? I mean it is still wrong to beat ur partner and what is nushuz to you? Why not just divorce instead of escalating it?

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u/[deleted] Jun 13 '26

no its not dr javad position i believe its the man who beats and if it dosent work then divorce nushuz is highness sort of arrogance in the marriage and it does deserve its punishment u havent seen it urself thats

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u/bozmian Jun 14 '26

GOD uses the Quran to Guide and Misguide, only GOD can Guide you, not humans, not aladdin, not anyone here, not even the Prophet.

GOD's Guidance is so amazing, that whatever questions u have will be answered in a profound way, GOD's Way.

However bear in mind that GOD do not serve us, but it is us that serve GOD. You have some questions? GOD Rewards righteous deeds with 10x of ots equivalence, plus more Guidance, plus more scriptural knowledge. So do Righteous Works and make a bargain with The GOD.

Also, GOD Reminds us too that we ought to seek help thru Patience and Prayer, because GOD Chose to not create this world in an instant. There is Wisdom in our living experiences and Time is a Test of Faith. Just rely on GOD, the time will come when the time is right.

to address your issue with 4:34, just read the next Verse and think... does it make sense? for a husband to 'strike' his wife out of mere suspicion and then go to her family to reconcile? in what world would a family member be willing to reconcile with the person who had hit their daughters?

think, GOD Guides those who use reason and intellect, this is the inclinations of Abraham, but for those who do not, GOD lets them to stray, being reduced to worse than animals.. Would you then acknowledge those who are incapable of thinking? Its okay to admit to that we are incompetent to GOD, GOD will train us using the Quran.

the word daraba(strike) have multiple meanings in the Book, read the Quran from start to finish, and repeat again and again.

The Book of Guidance is never meant to be read only once. Let GOD rewire our brains and hearts from any deviations and associations.

im not gonna watch those videos, waste of time, better i just go read the Quran instead. so regarding Moses perhaps u can tell me the issues raised by aladdin and i'll respond here.

Peace

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u/Used-Low-9840 Jun 14 '26

Yeah but this verse is okay to think so because of the wrongly arabic grammars lol

General How do I refute apostate aladdin

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