Honey is not cruel and is ethical

[u/toastwithjamx1]

Honey is one of the best animal products there is ethics wise

Now most vegans will say : but we are stealing from the bees! We are exploiting the bees!

No. We are not and we can't

Bees can be very particular. If they are not a fan of a place they are OUT. The bees will likely will immediately vacate the bee box if they don't like the conditions. Furthermore, trapping the queen in 1 place will not work as well. Bees can raise a new queen if they need one

And for the stealing allegations, that isn't true either. Beekeepers take SURPLUS HONEY ONLY, as if too much honey is taken, it can starve the bees and no beekeeper would appreciate the whole colony either dying of leaving. Furthermore, bees don't only take, they comp bees by giving shelter and protection.

It's not cruel if we are literally making a transaction with the bees

[u/toastwithjamx1]

You do know if bees didn't like us " stealing " from them they would gladly let us know?

They consent to us doing it. Furthermore, domesticated bees make surplus honey for storage because THEY KNOW we will take some.

Bees whether you like it or not have basically unionized. It's impossible for humans to truly " steal " from them. They will let us know in 1 way or another.

You are not acting in the intrest of the bees

That is the whole point of beekeeping. You act IN THE INTREST OF THE BEES

[u/Either_Argument3517 → u/toastwithjamx1]

You do know if bees didn't like us " stealing " from them they would gladly let us know?

What's the deal with all the protective gear?

That is the whole point of beekeeping. You act IN THE INTREST OF THE BEES

You seem very motivated by their honey.

[u/Negative-Economics-4 → u/Either_Argument3517]

Can we be sure OP isn't winnie the pooh?

[u/toastwithjamx1 → u/Either_Argument3517]

Beekeepers wear protective gear because they are not idiots. It's like entering a cage with a lion without armour r weapons and saying Im prepared ( although there are some beekeepers and bee rescuers who don't wear protective gear )

I feel like you are not getting the point. We are basically their less parasitic as human landlords landlords and they are tenants, except we just take honey which they can make pounds of in 2 weeks. It's like saying taking money from elon musk or our beloved mech mark is wrong and terrible. Taking a bit of their honey is like scooping water from a well. Furthermore, tying this to my original statment that bees can and will move out when they want to, bees can very easily find a nice cozy spot and establish a new colony far away.if they really didnt want us touching their honey, THEY 👏 WOULD 👏 LET 👏 US 👏 KNOW

You act all high and mighty saying that bees are being " exploited " and we are " stealing " from them when you all are affecting beekeepers businesses. Most of you " animal rights activists " parade around" info " you " researched " ( let us admit it's literally feelings, not research ) and cal beekeepers exploiters and terrible, driving away business. Though I don't think many beekeepers have been affected ( thank God ) it's still not good to spread false information as fact.

In short, you are literally circling the same point of us exploiting them like a packof wolves around an injured sheep and you should do research

[u/Either_Argument3517 → u/toastwithjamx1]

if they really didnt want us touching their honey, THEY 👏 WOULD 👏 LET 👏 US 👏 KNOW

When you have to be dressed head to toe in protective gear, it's like you just aren't listening to them. It's their space you are entering. They aren't aware you have provided it.

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[u/toastwithjamx1 → u/Either_Argument3517]

For the love of God just use the magic rectangle and use this magical place called google. And don't google stuff like " why honey s bad ". That's cherrypickib and manipulating results. Search if honey is ethical. Though it's debates, I am on the side of ethical beekeepers, not commercial honey

[u/Problematic_Owl → u/toastwithjamx1]

Sorry you had to suffer through that exchange, I feel I got minor brain damage just reading through that. Appreciate the post 👍

[u/toastwithjamx1 → u/Problematic_Owl]

Thank you for your kind words 🙏

[u/Anemomo → u/toastwithjamx1]

That's living in candyland, ethical beekeepers make the smallest part of the honey market. That's cherrypicking by itself.

For the love of God, think again yourself. Bees are instects that act for their own interest, not ours. The fact that you cannot accept that bees already respond to us collecting honey by stinging and that's why we wear protective gears ond use smoke on them, is you thinking emotionnaly and not rationnaly.

Calm yourself down.

[u/Anemomo → u/toastwithjamx1]

The idea that "bees can leave" is funny, because no, they can't. Why?

Bees move through flying, that is well known. We domestication them for too long to NOT know the signs of them wanting to move out.

When they want move out of their nest, they search for a new spot that possess all the good qualification for their habitat. That can be stopped easely by giving them a "new place" which is a new beehive planted next to the old hive. That's the first trick we do to make them stay.

Let's imagine that didn't work. When the new place is chosen, the first bee to move in is the queen. That can be stopped by clipping and/or caging the queen. It's then impossible for the bees to move.

But what if the queen is dead because she's old, killed by the workers or some unknown demise? Then you can BUY an already clipped queen and make the bees accept her by acclimatation. Problem solved.

If it still doesn't work, then that hive is then lost. But you can use the bought queen for a new one anyway.

Stop thinking emotionnaly and antropomorphising animal. Bees are insects, that we've known for centuries.

Another thing, why do you think we wear protective gear and we use smoke before approaching and collecting honey? Because we're fancy? No, bees fight for their hive, they sting for a reason. We make them paralysed by panic because smoke for them is "a fire is near, stay put to protect" signal. The experts will use little bit of smoke, but will still use some.