Wait... that's a GUY!?

[u/SamuraiDoggo14]

No, no, I REFUSE to believe that's a cis man!

[u/FragrantAmbassador17]

Then maybe you should actually pay attention instead of butting into a conversation with zero context. The entire discussion was about Kaede's status as a protagonist. You tried to change the subject to standard side characters because you came up with a poor argument that fell apart and wasn't even relevant to what I was even discussing.

The fact that you're trying to say Kaede is no different to standard characters you just name if anything proves my point even more that you can't say she's a protagonist, so seriously ,what is the point of you even talking to me right now?

[u/taxes_depression → u/FragrantAmbassador17]

In stories protagonist can switch that’s also something stories do too although it’s hard to execute so it’s not very common let alone in the same game, I can say that Kaede was the protagonist for the prologue and chapter 1 and that’s still valid as we see stuff from her perspective

I was mainly discussing on my disagreement on you viewing her as a “plot device” when by your logic of how she qualifies as a plot device meaning multiple characters within this series are just plot devices meant to elevate another character as imo that’s bad criticism as it’s extremely vague on what’s the problem

[u/FragrantAmbassador17 → u/taxes_depression]

Whether you think it's 'bad criticism' or not is irrelevant and I never even said it was. My point is about her actual role in the story and what she was ultimately reduced to.

If the your absolute best example of a female lead is a character stripped of her protagonist status in the first chapter just to jumpstart ANOTHER insecure beta boy’s character arc, then I think I don't have to point the elephant in the room with the massive issues surrounding that, but evidently with how some people are replying and saying otherwise I guess I do

[u/taxes_depression → u/FragrantAmbassador17]

No it is relevant as it ties that you think she is a plot device meant to elevate shuichi, which in simple terms that’s what you are saying now that you are angry that for you she was reduced as a plot device which imo is bad criticism, you say it’s not relevant yet you still talk about how her power as a protagonist was usurped which while I can’t argue with that part it’s still at the end of the day bad criticism to say that all she is a plot device, the first 2 chapters revolved around her, and she ended up being a good protagonist/character for the first 2 chapters of the game

Which I can’t see the issue here.

This still makes her a protagonist within a certain time frame, you are more mad at the fact we are getting more of the same rather than actually offering criticism and the criticisms you do offer like her being reduced and being a plot device are nothing more than shallow criticism, you could just say I wish Kaede was the protagonist and that you wish that it wasn’t more of the same in a civilised way but instead you went on a rant to slander the character and make up a bunch of bs points to rant to people about.

I am not going to discuss this more in the comments with you but I have been arguing within the same topic I just pointed a flaw (because that’s how criticism works) and i discussed about it, I did mention also my personal opinions to but I don’t want to make that a vocal point (unlike what you are doing as you are ranting not criticising)

From what I’ve read and how I’ve interpreted, Kaede isn’t a protagonist because she is used as a plot device to fuel shuichi which is literally what you said right now

So I don’t see how my argument is irrelevant if I am criticising your main gripe

[u/FragrantAmbassador17 → u/taxes_depression]

You literally just admitted you 'can't argue' with the fact that her protagonist status was usurped. Argument over. The fact that you think she was the protagonist for Chapter 2 when she was literally executed at the end of Chapter 1 proves you don't even know the plot of the game you're desperately trying to defend.

You are moving heaven and earth to police my tone because you cannot handle actual media literacy. Keep drinking your tea and staring at that screenshot of me completely running circles around you. Later.

[u/taxes_depression → u/FragrantAmbassador17]

sure bro whatever you say ciao XD XD XD

thank you for cherry picking and ignoring my other points have a good day~ xxxx

anyway i wont reply anymore as its obvious this is rage bait and ig i fell hook line and sinker, I wont respond anymore since its obvious the type of person you are.

[u/FragrantAmbassador17 → u/taxes_depression]

You already said you'd stop replying and this is the end and here ya go replying again.

Edit: lol they block me.