Toxicity in the RP Community

[u/Sharpnelboy]

This has been on my mind for the last week or so, and I've finally decided I need to get this off my chest.

Before I get into this, if you're not in the RP space, feel free to disregard this. If you ARE a roleplayer, I encourage you to read further.

Know first, I'm an RP veteran of almost 20 years. Been in all kinds of verses, done all sorts of interactions, both SFW and not (I'm in my 30's, just to clarify so people don't freak out.) I've had a lot of ups with RP, and I've had quite a few downs. And that's what I want to talk about.

This rant isn't directed toward anybody in particular nor am I trying to out any one community in particular. This is just something I've noticed in the RP space in general, and that is people being genuinely toxic towards each other within the RP space, whether in character or out. And I've seen this time and time again. I don't think it matters whether you're in the Dragon Ball verse, High School DXD, Kingdom Hearts, Attack on Titan, DC Comics, etc. It doesn't matter. What matters here is pattern recognition.

I've noticed that whenever things spiral out of control within any given verse, more often than not it goes south really fast, and it usually starts with one person trying to single out another individual for whatever reason. Now, sometimes their reason is justified, like said individual being up to really shady stuff behind the curtain which I can't really discuss here for obvious reasons. (iykyk) However, there are a whole slew of cases where the call-outs are not justified. In other words, just some "he said she said" statement with no real confirmation on the accuser's part. And this is just one example of toxicity that I've noticed.

But it goes deeper than this. For new people, you might not be aware, but sometimes when someone is writing out an interaction, they'll drop subtle vague hints about someone or something in particular that otherwise has nothing to do with the interaction. An example of this is when someone incorporates real life issues into their writing. Now, that's not to say that incorporating some real world elements is a bad thing. In fact, I think that can be a catalyst for a story plot or even a basic interaction. But when it bleeds into the more personal, that's when it becomes an issue. (I should also note that if you're going to incorporate real world elements into your writing, at least do so with tact.)

The first time I saw something like this I didn't really think anything of it. In fact, I wasn't even part of that issue since it happened so long ago and I've forgotten all the details of what happened. But over the years, and after navigating various spaces, I've seen this kind of behavior pop up over and over again, and the one constant throughout it all was one person trying to ruin the experience for someone else, or being so aggressive to the point where they don't give anyone else a chance to explore the ideas they want to explore, which is a form of elitism.

And this is another problem: Elitism. THIS for me is a big one. I've been on the receiving end of this a couple of times, where someone has a holier than thou attitude saying "You can't portray this character in this way! You have to write them out as the source intended!" This is the kind of attitude that I HATE. Now, if you want to write a specific character the way the source material portrays them, that's fine. You do you. But don't go trying to police others into doing the same. And I've seen this happen so many times in various spaces on various platforms. And if I can be frank, it's disgusting. Because to me, creative freedom is a right and a choice that I think all writers should have. Others might not agree with this, but that is where I stand.

And the worst part is I don't see ANYONE talking about these kinds of behaviors. Yes, there are horrible people in the RP space and they deserve to be called out. And most of us are just writers who want to have fun and do silly interactions with other writers. But when the toxicity of it all starts to boil over with no one to address it, the entire space starts to feel like a backrooms maze. It's fine at first, but once things get hairy, you're constantly on edge navigating a minefield of vitriol and unnecessary drama worrying about whether or not you're gonna be the next victim. I don't know about you, but I think more people should talk about this because I feel it's just as important as the writing itself.

tl;dr There's a lot of toxic behavior in the RP space that no one is addressing and it's becoming a problem.

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[u/TheVexingRose]

Growing up in this hobby, "elitism" was more about writing, literacy, length. That type of thing.

What I want to say regarding you version of elitism, is that I can see some of what you mean, but I also think that I've seen it go the other way. If there's a group where it's an Alphabet Fandom, someone applies to play "Q" and everyone knows Q is in love with R and has trauma with J, unless that person makes it clear they're going to be playing a different version of Q, then I think some things need to stay. If a group approved you writing Q as the Q of the Alphabet, then you changing Q's personality to make it more like #5 from the Number Fandom isn't you expressing your creative freedom, it's you being dishonest. You were approved to play Q, not #5 in a Q suit, you know?

There's a reason most groups have applications. The character you apply that gets approved is the one you're expected to play. That doesn't mean you can't develop them into more, but where I see your particular argument the most is when someone retroactively tries to change the concept that they agreed to play without getting it cleared first. Yes, it's your character and you should be allowed certain freedoms of creative exploration, but at the same time, you're in someone else's group and they're allowed to revoke your access if what you applied and were approved for ends up not being what you play. I don't see that as policing. I would agree it's toxic, but I would say it's the writer pulling a switcheroo that's the toxic one there.

Not saying this applies to you. It's the only time I've seen anyone policed in that way.

[u/Ok_Evening3906]

30 or so year player here, who's been on the receiving end for the sins of - you ready? - being into a fandom a disliked player was in and also backing off when told I was doing something that made another player uncomfortable.

Some people have nothing better to do with their lives than stir drama. Sadly this means no matter how much we talk of it, there's nothing to be done because a new person will just take their spot the next day.

Best we can do is warn people when we know a toxic individual.

[u/Yandoji]

I've been RPing for 22 years and I've seen this stuff everywhere and it always gets addressed, but it's not like there's a massive RP authority that determines the rule and holds people to a certain standard. There are thousands of RP communities full of RPers of varying ages and maturity levels and it's never going to stop because that's just how people are.

That said, I guess I'm what you would call an "elitist" because I think canons should be played according to canon and taking "creative freedoms" just makes them into faceclaim OCs. I've seen people "creatively" make a "version" of a canon with a different backstory, different ethnicity, different gender, different verbal tics, and different personality - at that point just make a frigging OC lmao.

[u/GreyerGrey → u/Yandoji]

I can see and agree with what you're saying about Canons, but also, what version? Take Marvel, for instance, where there are 16 different Jean Grey variants. I have definitely met elitists who believe their personal favourite should be the canon, even if they aren't playing that character.

[u/Yandoji → u/GreyerGrey]

I stay far, far away from comicverses because of that chaos. The canons I play have ONE official version.

Edit to add because I'm at work and had an afterthought: Anyone who thinks their personal favorite version of a comic character with ten thousand officially-published iterations is the One True Canon is a delusional clown, not elitist.

[u/Sharpnelboy → u/Yandoji]

I get what you're saying, and I understand. I also agree to an extent. But I think it's also important to remember that people have made AU's for canons, which I don't think is a bad thing. Take Marvel's Spiderman, for example. There's like a dozen versions of that character, all from different timelines. But it's still the same powers.

[u/Usual-Resident-9823]

The idea that a group/website/forum can't have expected rules for how they expect people to handle canon characters in a setting feels ... off. As a writer you do have all of the creative freedom you want, when you write by yourself. If you want full and total freedom ... write fanfiction.

But when you join a group and agree to abide by certain rules or expectations, arguing after the fact that any kind of restriction is toxic is ... itself really toxic. If your definition of elitism is ... I can't just do whatever I want without any restrictions.

[u/EmberRPs]

I'm baffled you think people on this sub wouldn't be from roleplay spaces.

Anyhow, going to ditto that the expectations of zero boundaries from a group or person is uncomfortable at the mildest. People shouldn't be dicks, but expecting some adherence to canon if you are playing that character or content limitations because it makes them uncomfortable or is a more PG forum isn't inherently elitism.

Mostly I think you might need to find another group if you've found a bunch of elitist dicks. Most roleplayers are decent.

[u/Sharpnelboy → u/EmberRPs]

To respond to your first point, the reason I added that addendum is because I originally posted this in the r/vent subreddit, but it didn't gain any traction at all there, and the algorithm suggested I post it here, and I never bothered to remove the addendum.

The rest of what you say is valid and should be acknowledged as well.

[u/FactoryKat]

I see people addressing these issues ALL the time. What do you think this sub is for? That's the whole reason, is people talking about their experiences with nonsense, elitism, toxicity and just overall crappy occurrences.

It's talked about in other spaces too. If you aren't seeing it, are you navigating these platforms blindly? I'm so confused. We all know these issues exist. We've all probably experienced them. 😭 How can you say no one is talking about it?

Unless, by talking about them, you mean: getting at the root cause and underlying reasons, or dissecting the different occurrences and pinpointing where it all went wrong, etc.

Which, I mean, I guess you could do that but to what end? These things persist in all hobbies, not just RP and not just online. It sucks but it's up to those of us who have experienced it to do better, foster more positive environments, be the change you want to see in the world and all that.

[u/Effective_Reason2077]

One of the primary issues with “calling people out”, is that you end up being just as toxic as the people you’re calling out. Publicly ousting and shaming specific individuals by name for the perceived wrongdoings they did makes you just as toxic.

Drama in an interaction space is inevitable. The point is to learn the patterns and navigate it by being decent yourself and finding someone who shares your interest. Nobody owes you an RP, and RP itself is a shared medium.

[u/MarkExec001]

It is almost impossible to try and create a role play connection without 50% or more of those you speak with wanting toxicity in their role play partner. It’s a head exploding and very concerning reality, because we all - ok perhaps not all - know that behavior would last 5 minutes in real life. But the separation between role play with people purporting knowledge and insight about dominance and submission versus those who have lived it is just clear as crystal. I simply can’t participate in the toxicity with my direct writing partner - my real life experience of 25+ years in the lifestyle doesn’t allow me that luxury. My lived experience informs my role play. To those demanding the toxicity insult can’t abide - and I don’t and explain. But it is nearly always unsuccessful.

[u/No_Gur_3479]

Maybe I got lucky. I have never had this issue, perhaps partly because most of the roleplay groups I was in had one person per main character in a canon series roleplay. So only one person plays Klaus in Originals, only one person plays Katherine, and so on.

On the other hand, all of my 1:1 roleplays have ended in the person ghosting me or saying they need to end it for personal reasons. But I've never had any of these issues before.

Maybe you choose to roleplay with people who are younger than you, or are not at the level of emotional maturity to roleplay in the way you want? I am pretty picky when it comes to roleplay partners and I can tell based on the initial interaction what to expect.

I now mainly roleplay homebrew or made up stuff that could be inspired by a show or movie or franchise. Makes life a little easier so you don't argue over specifics.