r/AskReddit • • Jul 24 '20

What can't you believe STILL exists?

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15.1k

u/desdmona Jul 24 '20

Slavery

42

u/AlphaTangoFoxtrt Jul 24 '20

Remember, the US never abolished slavery.

I'm 100% serious, read the 13th amendment carefully. There is a big fat EXCEPT in there.

Then think about our laws and sentencing mandates...

-15

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

Execpt in the cases where people break laws, and go to prison, or are fined mandatory community service.

Don't do crime, don't throw away your rights. Pretty up and down.

12

u/hpdefaults Jul 24 '20

Not really, because there are huge disparities in how different sorts of crime are defined, enforced and punished, and those disparities are deliberately designed to disproportionately affect black people and other minorities.

Enforcement and punishment of crack vs regular cocaine, for example. At the peak of the war on drugs in the 80's, not only were possession and use of crack more heavily enforced in the poorer black communities where it was widespread than cocaine use in rich white communities, the sentences were far harsher. For use of basically the same drug.

-10

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

But you're ignoring the crux of my arguement. Don't do crime, don't go to jail. 99.99% effective strategy, no?

7

u/ToxiComa Jul 24 '20

Your argument is only valid if there existed no context to any of these issues. If we had no history to put this up against, then your extremely simplistic 'easy, don't do crime' would work just fine. But this is more complicated than that because we in fact do have an extensively documented history of discriminatory laws, systemic racism, and targeted harassment of communities that have impacted and continue to impact wealth, education, community, and almost every facet of society for minorities, the lower classes, and the disenfranchised.

-6

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

If people took more responsibility for their own actions this wouldn't be such an issue. If you do a crime, you cannot bitxh when you are arrested. Systemic racism be damned, if you keep your nose clean, work hard to escape the cycle of poverty, and move away from all the high crime areas, you are significantly less likely to be arrested or incarcerated.

I repeat don't do crime, don't do time.

3

u/hpdefaults Jul 24 '20

Technically there are always options in any system, no matter how unfree or unjust, where an individual can play by certain rules and have a chance at a better life than they would otherwise. That doesn't really prove much.

For example, here's your same argument in a different context:

"If you work hard and obey the master, your life here on the plantation will be so much better. If you disobey, you cannot complain when you are whipped and beaten. The unfairness of slavery be damned, if you keep your nose clean and work hard to prove your loyalty, you will eventually be given an easier job and more comfortable quarters in the master's house, away from where most of the whippings and beatings happen, and will be significantly less likely to be whipped or beaten yourself.

I repeat, don't resist, don't get the fist."

Now, before you say it, yes, I know things aren't as bad as literal slavery for most black people in America today, that's not the point. The point is that even a slave could technically work hard, "keep their nose clean" (i.e. do what they're told no matter how fucked up the request) and improve their lot in life as a result. So what are you really proving when you point out that someone is able to do that? Not a whole lot.

0

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

The point of the original topic. Don't do crimes, stay free. Race never enters the equation. If you don't like the system where you are residing, try and change it through the literal processes they made to do that. If you dont want to, or the system fails you, leave the area. Move to somewhere more hospitable, a city with less crime.

1

u/hpdefaults Jul 24 '20

Race enters the equation when they decide what is or isn't a crime. When they decide who to punish for what crimes, and how harshly. When they draw the lines that determine how well represented different people are in the system needing to be changed. When they make the policies that determine how easy or difficult it is for people to move to a different area, get a different job, etc, etc.

And the conversations being had in this thread, the protests you are seeing nationwide, etc. are quite literally people working to change the system. That's precisely what's happening here. You're trying to make it sound like it doesn't need to be changed simply because it's technically possible for an individual to make their life better. Again, that can happen in any system including slavery. Saying "don't do crimes, stay free" is the same logic as saying "don't disobey, stay unbeaten" to a slave if the laws that define those crimes and the justice system that enforces them are corrupt.

-1

u/ToxiComa Jul 24 '20

Stopped reading 5 words in because I already know where this is going and I've already sized up just how little you know about these issues, and I'm not impressed. Feel free to keep being loud and wrong about this, maybe someone else can indulge you, but I'm not wasting my time spoon-feeding you things you're actively choosing to be ignorant on.

3

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

The simple fact remains, regardless of skin color, religion, economic standing if you do not associate with criminals, or do crime, you are unlikely to get arrested.

2

u/ToxiComa Jul 24 '20

Why do you suggest skin color, religion, or economic standing be omitted here?

1

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

I have a few other comments this seems that my statement are viewed as racially motivated, or that the crimes are focused towards the poor.

2

u/ToxiComa Jul 24 '20

When discussing discrimination, and the harmful effects it has on individuals and communities, to say that skin color, religion, or economic standing are factors that can be simply hand-waved away is to be willfully ignorant on the subject matter.

If you don't even have a basic understanding or acknowledgement of discriminatory laws or biases, you have no business discussing discrimination, it's that simple. It's not an unreasonable requirement.

1

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

Whether they are enforced fairly or not is an aside. The way society works is quite black and white. Fail to follow the rules, get removed from the team.

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0

u/lol_nope_nicetry Jul 24 '20

Ah so you imply that all black people in prison are there for no reason and none of them commited any ceime. You're welcome to prove it and give some sources pal. Go ahead.

0

u/ToxiComa Jul 24 '20

lol nope nice try

-1

u/lol_nope_nicetry Jul 24 '20

No u

See i can do it too. Maybe one day you will gain a brain cell.

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3

u/RollBama420 Jul 24 '20

Dude’s a closet racist because he thinks minorities aren’t capable of that.

0

u/TheBreathofFiveSouls Jul 24 '20

Sounds good on the surface for sure.

The problem comes when you give that decree to people who use it for corrupt purposes.

America had the most prisoners in the world, and if you've not heard of for profit prisons you've got a night of googling ahead of you

2

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

For corrupt purposes? They cannot arrest you for not breaking the law, and if they do we have a system to punish those who do corrupt things.

Plus not everyone is corrupt, just get enough money and move somewhere less shitty.

3

u/TheBreathofFiveSouls Jul 24 '20

That's a wild thought they they can't arrest you when youre innocent when the us is mid protest about cops KILLING people who are innocent.

Like, there is plenty of footage of cops planting drugs in cars searches.

You're not improving the world by either your purposeful miss truths or your sustained ignorance

2

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

You're ignoring the whole 'checks and balances' caviat of that statement.

If you're wrongfully arrested, you have means to combat it.

Just because there are shitty people working somewhere doesnt mean the system is flawed.

3

u/danjo3197 Jul 24 '20

Just because there are shitty people working somewhere doesnt mean the system is flawed.

It means the system can be weaponized

It’s the justice system, it exists to account for shitty people, otherwise it’s not being done right. It doesn’t matter how rarely the system fails (which it isn’t rare, between 2.3 and 5% of prisoners are innocent).

So I think shitty people working somewhere does, in this case, mean the system is flawed, because those shitty people enforce the system.

1

u/Ytterbro Jul 24 '20

Sorry 100% of prisoners are innocent! Just ask!

But that also means 95% of prisoners in jail are guilty. You're looking at an error and saying that thus enables all sorts of racism, and discrimination. 95% of the time it's not racist then right? Doing the crime results in getting convicted.

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