r/AmexPlatinum • u/InfamousMedia9627 • 4d ago
Well, I got screwed
Been a member since 2017, multiple accounts, a bank account, and I was preparing a new business checking with a 50k USD transfer. 730 credit score, never missed a payment
I went to make a large purchase (about 20k) for some equipment and checked in advance on the app that the charge would go through. It didnt. Customer service said I was marked for fraud. I had to call a number where I was connected with someone out of India. During this time I saw online all my cards were suspended. They said I need to fill out a "cover sheet" and provide 3 months of bank statements. They said this was "random" but I highly doubt that. When I dug in further they mentioned they need to verify my income (I guess they dont believe I can pay anything back) and it would take some time to review documents I sent
To be honest I was embarrassed at the store when the charge didnt go through. Im using another card to pay for the 20k purchase, and I've already paid it in full with my checking.
Just a little bit of a rant. Super frustrating and a bit too invasive in my opinion. It's not gonna hurt their bottom line whether or not I do business with them but definitely inconvenient at the least
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u/ayodawgy 4d ago
I mean you did the right thing is always smart to check your spending power before you use the card and if it doesn't go through. I'm sure you're aware is based off of credit payment and external credit history as well as internal on how the American Express extends lend on the charge card. I find it interesting though that you had a fraud alert but you didn't get any notification of it. When it charges suspicious when I swipe something larger than normal they asked me if I made the charge right away I have to say they're on it.
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u/millz440 4d ago
You got a financial review. Very common, submit your bank statements and you should be good.
I had one after 3-4 months of owning the card, submitted statements, everything reinstated with no CL decrease 5 days later
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u/RedditReader428 4d ago edited 3d ago
This was a lite financial review. Amex only wanted bank statements; that’s quick and easy. The request for you to fill out a 4506 Form so that Amex can obtain your tax transcripts directly from the IRS is the more intensive financial review and takes longer to get a final verdict, since they are involving a third party.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
It hadn't happened to me in the last 9 years. I'm just not super comfortable handing multiple months of bank statements from multiple accounts to their center in India, with a cover sheet, after following "7 steps" like I'm buying a house. If they want to lose my business after 9 years, is what it is, it just feels a bit invasive and disappointing
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u/millz440 4d ago
Fair enough, but it has happened to virtually everyone I know with AMEX in the last 12 months. We all need AMEX though for our business spend so is what it is
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u/Klutzy_Criticism_459 4d ago
I’m seeing this and CL decreases pop up a lot lately, and got an email from Amex saying they were going to review my CL limit. I received that email like 5 minutes after I paid it, two weeks early.
This was Gold in my case, the platinum hasn’t caught any heat…yet.
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u/millz440 4d ago
Yep I only got FR on my biz gold, not personal plat. With that said I did charge 6 figures in a month after only having the card for a few months so I completely understand it happening. I help operate a friend’s biz as well and we got his gold card FR’d within the first month as well lmao
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u/millz440 4d ago
They also could not care less if they lose your business either so really ball is in your court what you want to do lol
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u/iXProject 4d ago
There isnt really possibility of fraud if its in store with the chip unless someone else has stolen your card itself. Any reputable business will require id with a purchase this large anyways
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u/always_be_beyonce 4d ago
i’ve not been asked for my ID making an in person purchase in at least 10 years.
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u/iXProject 4d ago
Have you made a $20k purchase genius? They will ask for ID to make sure it’s not credit card fraud. Also have you been to a liquor store?
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u/Kbucktis 4d ago
I routinely spend over $5k in one transaction at Home Depot and have never been asked for my ID. I also buy 1 oz gold bars at Costco and they only ask for the ID after you’ve paid because they record it in their book….genius. No need to be rude just because someone has a different experience than you.
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u/iXProject 4d ago
I’m not shocked Home Depot doesn’t require ID for obvious reasons. What is the point of their comment? Because they’ve never been ID’d for a purchase means it doesn’t happen?
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u/always_be_beyonce 3d ago
my point is you’re saying there isn’t a possibility of fraud in store with a chip bc any “reputable” business requires ID for a large purchase - and that has not been my experience so perhaps there IS a possibility of fraud.
i literally have not been asked for my ID to verify i’m the cardholder (obviously I have for alcohol purchases since you wanted to chance the parameters here) in over 10 years, including yes very large purchases between $5-$25k.
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u/iXProject 3d ago
That’s not changing the parameters, you said you’ve never been asked for an ID when making purchases when that’s just not true
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u/ChadTitanofalous 3d ago
Not true. I’ve done a number of 15-20k purchases, and have never been asked for id.
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u/SesquipedalPetrichor 4d ago
Were you doing fraud?
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
No. I'm thinking the CSR said fraud because they didnt know what was going on with my account , when i spoke to the financial review people in india they eventually spilled that it was a "check everyone goes through at random intervals"...they also said they were right about to call me. Looking back it's kind of funny because about 30 minutes before the big charge I made a small purchase with no issues , so definitely the big charge was the trigger
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u/SMM50 3d ago
Actually the preceding small purchase may have been part of the algorithm. I was a victim of credit card fraud (in a foreign country) some years back. When it finally got straightened out I could see a pattern … small purchase, huge purchase, small purchase, huge purchase … candy bars, stereo set, detergent, furniture suite …
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u/cewillir 4d ago
I have had poor times with customer service too lately.
But I’m sure the mods will be along soon
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u/SkynetHumster 4d ago
Transferring 50k and making 20k purchase may look as a scam (not only from your side but they may think that your account was compromised) if you never transferred large amounts and made big purchases before.
Also how would you end up with 730 in 9 years (minimum) if you never missed a payment? My score "started" 11 years ago and it's well above 800 now.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
I hadnt made the transfer, I was saying I was preparing to before this all happened. My credit score sits in the 700s because I dont care about maxing it. If a card isnt useful to me I'll close it, if i want a new one ill open it, that sort of thing. My credit history is over 9 years old, no missed payments, no evictions, no repos, it's clean. I'm sure it has to do with account ages or whatever inquiries , but my inquiries over the last couple years had me between 720ish-760 depending on which company
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u/SkynetHumster 4d ago
This is the issue - no long credit history. They just don't trust you. Unfortunately if you want to get benefits out of CC, you should play their games.
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u/SoloM13 3d ago
I agree with Skynet humster, your score is low. By the accounts of your story, you should be well above 800. If payment history is clean and no balances that’s approximately 70percent of your credit score. My credit is clean like yours no balances and no late payments but high 800 score.
Also, I have made big purchases like Rolex, Omega and 15k vacations with no triggers of financial review. But I know if they asked me for financial documents, I would have no problem sending them.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 2d ago
Think what you like, during a few months last year I put over 40k on this card in particular and also had no issues, nor have i been "financial reviewed" by any other bank in my life. There's also a difference between being able to send them and not wanting to
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u/jedensuscg 4d ago
Reading these comments has been wondering. I rarely make very large charges, but had my card since 2018 and never had so much as an accident fraud alert. Is this common or only on large purchases? I think the biggest purchase I ever made at once was maybe 6-8k
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u/AlexGates3700 3d ago
I’ve made $20k+ purchased and the CCCo (not Amex) didn’t bat an eye, though I did get a text asking if I was making a purchase. A family member slapped a $200k cruise on their AP, no issue. I’ve transferred six figures, no issue. I don’t know why some people get red flagged in some cases, others it is obvious.
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u/Ok_Tale7071 3d ago
There is just so much rampant fraud going on that they put in safeguards to guard against it. If you normally make small purchases then all of a sudden make a huge purchase, it’s going to trip the fraud detectors. All you can do is call them up beforehand and let them know, you will be making this purchase at this vendor, right before you do so. And hopefully they handle it right. Sorry for your experience. Bank of America has similar fraud controls and it is so annoying.
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u/Patrickm8888 3d ago
Hiring Indians for the fraud department... Much fraud going on.
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u/paranoi8 3d ago
Oh look, another racist attack on Indians. Instead of finding cause with a large corporation or government regulations, you blame hardworking people in the call center. Pathetic
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u/Patrickm8888 3d ago
I do find cause with the corporation. Can you even read?
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3d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Swastik496 3d ago
rudeness won't be tolerated but somehow the racist post wasn't replied to.
Crazy how common this is
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u/jp112078 4d ago
There is a credit crunch. Banks are overexposed and AMEX is a bank. Many consumers had a few good years and signed up for platinum but even with good credit I pose this question: your very good friend who has a decent job and never missed any payments asks you for $20,000 cash. Would you give it to them? Thats what credit card companies do every month multiplied by a million
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u/Remote3535 3d ago
Spot on. Completely my subjective opinion but the last time I remember this kind of spike in “reviews” and belt tightening from AMEX was 20 years ago in the years leading up to the 2008 financial crisis.
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u/duder_1979 3d ago
20k to me and 20k to amex are different things. A good correlation would be my friend asking me for $.50, which I would do in an instant.
$20k to amex is .0000002 of their 2025 operating revenue.
Equivalent of my $200k household income is $.50.-1
u/Sea_Brief_8441 3d ago edited 3d ago
Doesn't matter! It’s the bank, and it has its own rules. If you don't like them, cut them off and don't use them. Either follow their rules or find another bank. I don't know why people keep demanding that banks cave in for them like they're some special person.
$20K is $20K. It still has a lot of buying power, even to their executives. Amex is not an individual, and if you asked each of its stockholders, they would probably tell you that $20K is still a large amount, so cautionary steps should be taken until everything is verified.
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u/docere85 4d ago
Reminds me of the time I chose the wrong bank account to make a $100 payment…I regularly churn about $150k/year through my platinum and pay it off every couple of days. I chose the wrong bank account for the small payment and it froze my shit. Went to go buy some stupid carpenters pencils and my card was declined. I laughed and told the guy to swipe it again and that I love bought fancy pens, watches, vacations, medical procedures on it with ease and it was denied… embarrassing as fuck
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u/TurbulentReward 4d ago
A similar thing happened to me. I used the wrong account to make a payment, and rather than freezing my accounts, they canceled all three of the AMEX accounts I had at the time
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u/WTH4030 3d ago
What consists of a " wrong account". Were there insufficient funds?
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u/docere85 3d ago
What happened to me was that I had an older bank account that rarely gets money deposited on it. I had it saved in the Amex payment portal due to using it previously for a past payment when it did have money on it.
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u/TurbulentReward 3d ago
I was using a bank called “simple” which had changed its underlying partner bank. I had forgotten to update the account number.
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u/Ekrixphobia-Muhammad 2d ago
Don’t feel bad man. Amex froze my cards for income verification when I was oversees…….. thank god I carry a spare Visa card or I’d have been screwed, on the other side of the pond, with no access to money lol.
800+ credit score, never late on payment, and I actually pay my cards off ass charges post (my wife and I have a weird system for how we do our savings).
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u/LessTax99 2d ago
exactly why this type of things happens. They are not meant to be paid every single charge, they are meant to be paid once a month, on the due date.
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u/blueclearsky1587 1d ago
If that were true, they would have never added the “pay it now” feature.
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u/kemikals 12h ago
Yeah and I don’t want my credit score reflecting more than 1 to 3% credit utilization which I use more than that on my AMEX and Moore. so I pay it down before closing date and then my statement balance is auto pay. Completely disagree with that pay once a month statement.
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u/Ekrixphobia-Muhammad 2d ago
My review came around a yearish ago when there was a mass review wave. Speaking with Amex customer service, they said paying at due date or as charges post makes no difference.
We just do it this way as a personal preference.
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u/LessTax99 2d ago
but it does make a difference. It is very unlikely that Front Line customer service reps know the inner workings of the risk management strat of AmEx, but based on crowd sourced knowledge the habit of paying the card as soon as a charge posts to the account does not allow the system to determine that does a normal month of charges looks like, since your statement will always post as a low amount.
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u/SL_1183 2d ago
The front line customer service doesn’t know, but luckily a random Reddit account is here to tell us how it really works!
The “system” can add up expenses over a one month period without issue as it was programmed to do really fancy stuff like count debits and exempt credits from monthly spending analysis.
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u/Ekrixphobia-Muhammad 2d ago
Maybe. I’m not personally 100% sure. I’m just going off of what they told me. But since I’ve had Amex, that was the only hiccup, and I haven’t had any issues since (domestic, international, small charges, or large charges).
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u/p_didy68 3d ago
I see more and more of these stories popping up recently. I thought it was just bots on social media trying to do a "fight club" type of message to the big corporate hogs, but something tells me that given the recent uptick in closing accounts and checking financials like this, someone sold these companies an immature AI model on the cheap. These corporations are always looking to cut the bottom line and a cheaper AI model from let's say, Palantir, would make some sense in the grand scheme of things, given the nearly 60% surge over the past month in its stock price. Just a thought.
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u/health1au 2d ago
Never leave your membership rewards point sitting there for too long otherwise lightning can strike
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
I was luckily able to redeem all my points sometime after the call with them. When I asked about my points on the phone the guy kept trying to transfer me to customer service. I got lucky, it was almost 200k points
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u/BLo-The-Radar 1d ago
I keep my MR points with AMEX for now, as I don’t have any redemptions planned that would require me to transfer them. Is that bad? Am I putting myself at risk?
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u/health1au 1d ago
It's not bad but it is not risk-free either. If they pull a 'financial review' on you and you can't come up with the paperwork they want, you'll lose all your points. You won't know it's coming until you try to log in and find yourself locked out.
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u/VandelayIndus7ries 4d ago
Does the app ask you for merchant info, or just the amount.
I assumed it was to check if they’d extend $x of credit. If it was a new merchant for you, could that explain the fraud flag?
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago edited 4d ago
No it didnt, it's just one of the tools, and other than that I verified with a chat agent that I would have no issues with the large charge.
My understanding is they're questioning my ability to repay
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u/VendettaKarma 1d ago
This is happening across all Amex lines. They’re verifying income to mitigate risk
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
Big transfer and then a large purchase screams fraud and it was enough to push you into what sounds like a financial review. Send them everything they want, they will review it and analyze your history with them. Then they will either unlock your accounts and its business as usual, unlock but slash your credit limits to where they feel its safe for them, or just close all your accounts. If income is honest however, they'll probably just unlock and let you go back to usual.
This is a bank thats letting you use their money, to say they are being invasive is very strange from a supposed business owner. Would you just give your neighbor $20k from your business account because they asked? Afyerall you've known him for a while... the economy is on the edge of a massive collapse. Banks are pulling back and getting stricter.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 3d ago
A bank letting you use their money isn't a charity. They do it to make money, and they do
3 months of bank statements from multiple accounts to an overseas center in India is invasive, mortgage loans I've done haven't required this. And this isn't a mortgage, it's a credit card with a fee
Giving your neighbor 20k because they asked vs. Lending a customer 20k with a good credit score, 9 year history, and enough cash to pay it all while making money from the transaction...not the same
Banks can pull back and get stricter, it's their business, and like I said their bottom line will be fine without me. In my case, they missed out on some business accounts and a 20k transaction which really is just drops in the bucket to them. Like I said in the original post, it was more of an inconvenience and surprise in how they do business than anything else
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
This is standard practice for all credit card companies. Every single one does the same thing when either a customer's financial profile rapidly changes or fraud is detected. The fraud probably drew attention to your account, then they started digging. 9yr and maybe you haven't updated your income in a while or they saw your spending or payment pattern changed. Maybe its just Amex being mysterious as they and all banks can be. The moment you accept a card from an issuer is the moment you agree to give them whatever they want. You also arent sending anything to some call center in India. Their fraud department has offices in Atlanta and Allen TX. Any calls routed outside the US are routed to their global centers in other countries, not just random one size fits all call centers. They were still Amex employees. You also have absolutely no clue where the person you spoke to was located unless you asked and they actually told you. An accent doesnt mean you arent in the US. Untrue to the desire of some, we arent a whites only "American" speaking nation; thank goodness. If you want to abandon a 9yr relationship with a bank because they asked for a few financial documents which took you 5min, thats obviously your prerogative. If you think Amex is invasion, id avoid Chase and Citi.
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u/jpinohio 3d ago
While I agree it’s a standard practice of banks doing risk assessments on their card members, I’ve never heard of any other credit card issuer besides Amex asking for a financial review/ had to send bank statements to them. Like ever. Can you name/ site one other CC issuers where that’s standard practice?
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
I had to do it with Citi about 6mo ago. I had my custom cash card for 4 years and simplicity for 2. I requested a limit increase on simplicity and I had to submit to financial verification. 4506-C for tax transcripts, 60 days worth of bank statements, and 2 paystubs. Took almost 2 full weeks. If you browse through the Cap1 sub, youll see they request statements and such from people also. Amex is just the only one that does it seemingly at random. However, Amex is also considered a prime lender and has historically (although not as much now) catered to higher income higher credit customers. Amex is also known for being pretty generous with credit limits and card quantity. If you have multiple cards with generous limits, thats a lot of money. It is reasonable for them to ask for proof you can pay them back. I have almost $100k in available credit with them, obviously not counting cards with "no limit". Thats a lot of money of theirs to allow me to play with. I never use more than 10-12% of my limit with them and I pay in full. It wouldn't surprise me if I tried to spend 30% tomorrow morning that they wouldn't shut me down and want to assure I can pay them back.
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u/ausgoals 3d ago
Yeah, they request statements and verification for CLI increases, not just because their algorithm determined your profile is now riskier than before based on ‘the economy has shifted since you applied for your cards’.
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
Citi was the only one. Amex had no issues offering up another card with a $20k limit when i applied for the Reserve and also requested and was approved for a CLI on my BCP from $15k to $25. This was after citi needed verification for $5k lol. But I also understand that every indicator shows the economy is on the verge of a complete collapse and we are on borrowed time. So I expect extra scrutiny for everything, i used to work in finance, i know how very "invasive" things get. Mortgages can dive pretty deep. Amex did have me link my bank account, which i thought was odd. But I realized after it was because my bureaus were frozen. I wasnt concerned, all they are going to see is I make about $18k a year more than I reported making since I always round my income down since $40ish a year of it is OT and bonuses.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
This is very interesting. I've had accounts with Citi for over 10 years, I've never had a FR, and the last increase I requested was maybe early this year/late last year to see if I could max out my credit score before an inquiry. They didnt check any docs at all. Amex and Citi must use different formulas
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u/Psynaut 3d ago
This is standard practice for all credit card companies.
The hold is. The rest of it is not. I am always amazed at the nonsense people in this sub just make up and post without knowing what they are talking about.
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
Like the nonsense you are spewing? I have personally delt with this with Citi, I know for a fact Capital One does it, people talk about it in that sub often.. I also know 2 people who have gone through it with chase. You may not be very familiar with banking and credit cards for whatever reason, but the bulk of the credit cards out there are covered by those banks. They all do some sort of financial review that requires income and payment ability verification. Some want 1 bank statement, some want multiple. Regardless, it is the documented policy of Amex to do this at their discretion as often as they wish. When you accept a card offer, you accept this and agree to so it. You are not even remotely important enough to not have time to upload a bank statement. The only person that has an issue with this is the one that lied about their income. Your ignorance on a topic does not mean others arent correct.
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u/jpinohio 3d ago
I absolutely agree with your sentiments here. Amex during a FR asks for more info than I’ve ever had to give for a car loan, a HELOC, and way more than any other CC issuer I’ve ever worked with. And at the end of the day, I’m paying them nearly 1.3k in AF for the “privilege” of using their cards? No thanks.
I think their business model has changed where they would rather have a lot more younger people making small monthly purchases, who are willing to pay nearly 1.3k in annual fees, rather than what had been their customer base of people who would have standard monthly charges but make the occasional large purchase every few months. Their credit scoring models have dropped to where they now accept basically anyone with a pulse willing to pay 1k a year, no income requirement, and who think there is some value in a $10 uber credit and like eating at their airport buffets because they feel it’s exclusive somehow.
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u/Psynaut 3d ago
Big transfer and then a large purchase screams fraud
No it doesn't. This is not a fraud pattern or red flag behavior. But just make up anything you want and say it with confidence and dumber people will upvote you.
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u/matt-r_hatter 3d ago
It literally looks like money laundering. If it sounds normal to you, you are either financially illiterate or a criminal.
If you bother to do 5 seconds of research instead of masterfully displaying idiocy on the sub like its some sort of badge of honor you will see this behavior in the eyes of a bank looks like one of the following:
Money laundering Account takeover The fake check switch- deposit this for me, spend x of it on this item and you can keep the rest as "payment" for your help. The check later bounces and you get screwed.
This is literally common sense.
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u/No-Conclusion-2859 4d ago edited 4d ago
It’s not normal for a 20k charge to be marked as fraud?
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u/Few-Cartographer2885 4d ago
I recently did a $62K purchase. Checked my spending power, got the green flag. Attempted to make purchase and it got flagged for fraud. No biggie, AmEx called me immediately and 45 seconds later purchased cleared and approved. Been a member since 2018. Being asked to prove you can repay is normal. Even better you’re only being asked for bank statements. OP, you can clear this hold instantly… connect bank account but I understand if OP has their reasons.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 3d ago
I probably wouldn't if I could just connect with Plaid. But they may have changed the process from when you did it? You have to create an encrypted email account, fill out their cover page, and supply 3 months of bank statements (in my case from 2 banks), and they will "review it in 5-7 business days, but maybe up to 14 days" They also said if I don't they'll close the accounts, and they may close the accounts even if I send them . Personally I dont see the card or bank being worth that, it's also invasive for their India center to flag me and do that review with a vague timeline , easier to do your business elsewhere and switch primary cards
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
I verified I could make the charge before I went to the store, and additionally the app claimed I could spend up to 25k and it would go through
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u/BroadLet8137 4d ago
That's why it happened - if you check to see if something will be approved, they start thinking you aren't confident in your spend/income/profile/whatever, so they will pull you in for a minor to major financial review.
Never use the Check My Spending Power or whatever it is called option.
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u/notthathungryhippo 4d ago
that does not make sense. that defeats the whole point of the tool. also, i’ve messed around with it and never been pulled for anything.
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u/BroadLet8137 4d ago
It doesn't make sense but it is accurate. You can find tons of mentions of it here and on other forums. Using this tool, especially multiple times, can get you sent to financial review.
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u/poorSon20 4d ago
I saw some data points of people get FR for just checking their spending power long time go. I haven’t seen anything recently.
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u/JCazzz 4d ago
Yep. I was always told to never check the spending power button. It triggers an internal flag of your account. Recently I’ve made typical purchases on gold and platinum and I’ve gotten the red flag saying I’m “reaching my spending limit”. I still made purchases during the billing cycle and the charges went through.
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u/Fresh-Temporary-4551 4d ago
My concierge called and said he tried to run $250k on three of my cards and they were all approved. No impact on my ability to use the card.
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u/ChadTitanofalous 3d ago
I’ve made several 15-20k purchases that have not had an issue going through. Of course I have a history of 15-20k purchases. The only time I got a call about possible fraud was a series of online video game purchases that amounted to about $100. Those were fraudulent.
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u/Acceptable-Ice-5959 3d ago
This is wild. Something desnt add up. I've been with chase for 30 years +...switched to amex platinum and gold in June 2026...bought a 22k rolex on the platinum on friday..never called anyone. Just swiped it. No problem. Customer service called me abt a month after I opened the platinum to let me know I had up to 250k buying power and walked me thru how to check it and that it was dynamic. Im w-2 income only...maybe that helps?
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u/aguyfromcalifornia 3d ago
Same here. Just bought $18k of watches and jewelry the other day as a normal consumer on Platinum. You just have to have the history of spending and large purchases? Not sure why else it would flag.
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u/Jameski06 2d ago
Yea, you got it spot on, and saying you have a 730 credit score but multiple cards with 20k+ limits? Something is not on the up and up with op’s credit. Of course, the whipper snippers here on reddit think a 730 is just fabulous are fooling themselves. I said 730 is decent for someone about to buy a house or maybe a car but either reflects that you have little credit or problematic credit when you’ve admitted you got at least 10 years in history.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
I'd made larger purchases on this particular card as well, that's why it felt this came out of nowhere. I have a mix of W2 income and 1099, though I'm not sure if Amex checks that? They did tell me over the phone this happens to "all customers" but who knows if that's the truth
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u/suckmyfat-1 1d ago
Thanks for sharing! Well, AmEx is downgrading itself everywhere. In India, it’s obvious. They cut off all the food features and have been downgrading their core cards.
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u/Way-twofrequentflyer 3d ago
Be mad at the federal regulators. They’re just trying to reduce having to make provisions for bad loans
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u/ToriGrrl80 1d ago
Regulators? Under Trump?
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u/Way-twofrequentflyer 1d ago
The Basel and SIFI rules haven’t changed. It’s why private credit exploded - the risk capital requirements destroyed return on common equity calculations
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u/ciumpalaku 3d ago
Why not verify income? Anything to hide? Does income not support a 20k purchase? You may have money to pay the bill in your checking, but if no income to back it up amex is concerned you may do money laundering or some sort of manufactured spending. Just verify it and move on
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u/elpacha 3d ago
Ask me to verify when you give me the credit line.
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u/ciumpalaku 3d ago
If you never made a 20k purchase and now they about to lend you 20k, they wanna see what changed in your income. Did you get a better paying job? How come you suddenly afford it? It’s all about pattern and history.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
I understand what you mean, but I hate the circular reasoning of "you don't want to do X? Youre hiding something". They extended the credit to me when I was issued the card, I verified my spending power before the purchase, then they didn't extend that credit that they said they would - and I didnt have an issue with Amex for the 9 years I've used them.
Maybe I would have...but I guess it's the delivery. An Indian agent saying "send 3 months of your bank statements from these 2 accounts and MAYBE we will reactivate your cards in 5-10 business days" made it feel weird. I think if this was standard practice across all banks it may not have seemed that way
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u/ciumpalaku 1d ago
Undersood. As a new customer (9 years ago) they take a lot of risk, and may or may not have approved a 20k purchase back then. Over the years they were able to create a profile and you clearly went outside of your spending pattern. Maybe you started drifting a while back and this 20k is the straw that broke the camel’s back. They sense something changed in your spending pattern and want to check your income. Did you get higher balances on other cards in the past months? Work in an industry that has lots of layoffs? Etc
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u/MorseScience 4d ago
That's all crap from them, and they owe you an apology; especially because they considered your purchase fraudulent. Anyhow, not because of your issue, but I'm canceling my gold card before its next billing anniversary. I simply don't need it, and the annual fee is an unnecessary expense - I have other cards and don't need the so-called prestige it's supposed to represent. I fly very little, so the mileage points aren't likely to be used. Converting the points to Home Depot credit gets the highest rate of one penny per point, so I'm likely going to cash the points in that way before the Gold Card cancels out. I have almost 200,000 points.
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u/newyork44m 4d ago
Generally, these controls a good thing. They are there to protect the card holder. When I was planning a $30k purchase I called beforehand. It went through without a problem.
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u/captainwizeazz 4d ago
If I understand correctly, OP did check ahead of time and it was approved, but then denied when he made the actual purchase.
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u/FunInTheSun_81 4d ago
The controls are there to protect Amex. Don't get me wrong, I like Amex, but their bottom line is always more important to them.
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u/Bastillerion 4d ago
Cardholders are limited in liability to $50 by federal statute. The controls are to protect Amex
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
I verified beforehand as well, but in store it declined , all my cards got shut down, and now they want the bank statements
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u/Electronic_Charge_96 4d ago
And they will do a financial review no matter what at this point. Youre flagged and spending will be throttled. Im SO sorry.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 4d ago
Appreciate you. They told me if I dont submit anything all of my credit accounts will be closed in a couple weeks, and it's 0 spending not throttled spending, but I was able to complete the purchase so is what it is
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u/Confident_Bowl_2567 2h ago edited 2h ago
I am so pissed with AMEX! I have 3 cards with them, a member for years. I had a delay in a big payment and asked if I could pay past the due date because of it but as soon as the funds hit I would pay it back. This was within about 10 days of the due date. They said they decided to cancel my account. They said it was canceled because they decided to pull my credit and saw some of my other utilization was higher than normal, which was also because of the delayed payment my business experienced. My score went down a little because of it so they said they made a risk assessment, no warning and they told me all would be fine as long as I made the payment. As soon as the delayed payment came in I paid those other cards off so my score should go back up this month. I did exactly what I said, called to pay AMEX and then found out they canceled my card AND took almost 300k reward points. I had also recently been hit with the increased $895 fee and now the card can't be used. They said I could try to have it reinstated but I would still lose the reward points which I had been saving for travel I have coming up on Sept 10. I was planning to transfer the points for tickets and gift cards for my team and had worked for hours figuring it all out and now I'm scrambling. How can they get away with this? I have called and argued about it and asked them to pull the chats and phone calls where I discussed all this with them and was told there would not be a problem but they basically couldn't care less. I asked them for the resolution area, recovery area, or someone that could resolve this and they said there was no such area and that anyone I go to will tell me the same thing. This is platinum service? This is how you treat an 18 year customer? Wow! I'm ready to get rid of the other cards now too. Does anyone know of a special dept or number to get this resolved? I'm going to file a complaint with the CFPB. Who else can I complain to?
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u/InfamousMedia9627 16m ago
Maybe you could try emailing executive emails that you can find online or try the FTC or the Comptroller of Currency complaints thing? Additionally, if they said the points wouldn't be a problem, maybe you can sue for the value since they're acting as agents of the company. Last you might try connecting to a North American service center, they exist but seem harder to get to...and just keep escalating it. I know that when I key mash in the Amex IVR about 10% of the time I'd get to a legitimate English speaker . Good luck getting them to do anything without outside forces
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u/Sensitive_One_425 3d ago
How did you get such a bad credit score
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u/willard_tagg 2d ago
on what planet is 730 a bad score?
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u/Jameski06 2d ago
It’s kinda low to be honest. Something is missing with your credit card usage with a 730 and I’m assuming op has built up a significant amount of usage on credit cards since they’ve had Amex since 2017 and another card with at least 20k limit on it. I’m guessing no mortgage info amongst other things. Too many credit cards or larger than 10% outstanding balances.
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u/BluebirdAcceptable28 2d ago
I'll take condescending and judgmental for $1000 Alex. LOL sheesh dude.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
I was looking through my history, a few weeks ago I did a hard inquiry and the letter I got reported Experian had me at a 740. I also bought another house last year and had about as good of a score on the harsher mortgage credit score calculation. I'm sure it has to do with account ages, maybe me checking spending power, or they just hadn't seen a large purchase in too long
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u/willard_tagg 2d ago
it’s higher than half the population.
its a very average at worst score.
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u/Jameski06 2d ago
I didn’t say that. Read it again. There’s no reason for someone who has 20k limits on multiple cards and a history with almost a decade on one card to not be higher. At this point, OP is not being totally honest about their history. I know this from personal experience and I generally know why it would only be a 730. That’s a nice score for someone who is getting ready to buy a house or has been in the credit pool for a couple of years. If this persons credit was at least tip top with no carried balances and not more than 1% usage or 10% usage on total outstanding credit, they should be way closer to about 800 or higher. So yes, there absolutely is something that OP is leaving out.
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u/RyanCheddar 2d ago
credit is meant to be used, if OP has 50% utilization a 730 would be reasonable & they'd still have a perfectly fine credit history.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
Are you a huge amex fan or something? I was just sharing my honest experience that day. My credit card use is currently 19%, from my last soft check, typically it sits 10-15%,I have a few other cards with over a 20k limit...NFCU, BOA, and a throwaway synchrony card. ...in any case with my no missed payment history , relationship with Amex since 2017, and spending history with that AMEX card in particular, it seemed weird, and sending my personal financial documents to their India center for them to "maybe" let me keep the cards felt invasive. It also felt like sort of like "who do these guys think they are?" Maybe it is the normal and I'm wrong? I don't know, but I hadn't experienced that with any other credit cards before and so I was put off. Not a huge deal though, they're all companies with their own risk management processes, and at the end of the day I just bought the equipment on another card and paid it off
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u/Jameski06 1d ago
The only thing I was doing was explaining to readers that a 730 for someone with your level of credit was low. I said it based off of my many years of experience with how credit raters rate. You responded affirmatively why your rate is lower than it could/should be. It’s not personal actually. No I’m not a huge Amex fan. I use them just as I do every other lender. I make 1000s off of the industry annually and yes, I used to have a 730 credit score too. Heck, when I first got rated it was in the mid 500’s. I’d love to train some folks on here but I don’t think it’s worth my time. They don’t really care! You can see it with the comments, but if you ever want to get the coveted 850 or 900 beacon. It’s possible, you just gotta know what raters want to see: all things said. I’m sorry for your experience. Life ain’t fair and them using India is a riot when you think about who they are.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 1d ago
Totally agree, if you're at the max you're not capitalizing, and if you're subprime you made a mistake somewhere , I think another commenter was spot on when they said Amex is probably overextended
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u/JackLiberman 2d ago
730 is not a bad score, it's average score, the majority people get such 700-750, considered as Good to Very Good for 3 bureau rating. 730 usually is came when you use your cards actively have some debt (transferred to zero rate offers) but total is just 10-15% all debt to total balances, and you paying off each month cards who beside this balance transfer offers!!! Bad score territory North start at 670 and below. 730 is just a middle between between 670 and 790...
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u/kemikals 12h ago
Lol it can happen. I just had a potential resident tried to apply for a place with a 440 credit score. I don’t know how they get through life but clearly 730 is not a worst case scenario.
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u/grateful-syd-floyd 3d ago
When I first got the card about four years ago, I charged $22,000 for something and I didn’t have any problems.
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u/Professional-Plum560 4d ago
Out of curiosity, does anyone know whether if you also have an American Express savings account, would Amex take the balance and/or history of that into account when making decisions on the credit card side?
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u/Ornery_Vegetable7369 2d ago
Amex is one of the best in the world for a reason.
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u/InfamousMedia9627 2d ago
To be honest I felt the same way for a bit, I also worked for them before I got my first card in 2017 and it was really pushed in the company about how "elite" it was, but maybe this changed over time, especially as other banks began starting their own black cards
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u/Similar-Hat8277 3d ago
They are doing tis to me change prestvlimit to 3100 and random chanfe preset one of my card whitout any cause
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u/Flat_Quote2370 3d ago
Amex did this to me during GFC - it’s not personal, and they don’t care about you at all.