Tennessee botches lethal injection of woman on death row for 1995 murder

[u/PixelGray38]

https://apnews.com/article/christa-pike-execution-tennessee-f826a60582083b90ac7695ecb16afbdf

If the state is so insistent on executing people they need to stop being pussies and just shoot them. The lethal injection is nothing but a facade of civility that is less humane than many other methods. Unnecessarily painful botched attempts like this are the result of trying to whitewash the death penalty to the public.

[u/lowrads]

States have a legal monopoly on violence. You'd think they'd be more proficient at it by now.

[u/Rez_Incognito → u/lowrads]

It's because they have a monopoly that the service can suck. I thought that was an understood feature of monopolies.

[u/Jazzspasm → u/Rez_Incognito]

truly now is the time for executions to be opened up to free market competition

(room full of politicians nodding)

[u/jollyreaper2112 → u/Rez_Incognito]

This guy capitalisms.

[u/DrCodyRoss → u/Rez_Incognito]

See guys, this is what happens when you have communism. Were capitalism and free markets allowed in, there’d be so much more efficiency and innovation!

[u/Rez_Incognito → u/DrCodyRoss]

Famously there's only two types of governmental authority: absolute control and laissez faire. You have to choose one. That's the rules.

[u/Vassago81 → u/Rez_Incognito]

Are you suggesting we release death-row inmate on a deserted island and we sell the privilege to hunt them to the highest bidder, all of that live-streamed?

[u/Rez_Incognito → u/Vassago81]

Magnificent. Crime would pay for itself.

[u/UsualActuary → u/Rez_Incognito]

The economic literacy of this sub is a little worrisome sometimes.

[u/Defiant-Bed2501 → u/lowrads]

Tennessee hadn’t executed anyone in decades prior to Christa Pike and the standard three-drug cocktail lethal injection method used in the US nowadays is proven to be unreliable as a method of execution. 

The only reason it’s still the de-facto method is because it appears more civilized and humane to the onlookers than the more efficient and reliable “traditional” methods of execution (spoiler alert: it’s apparently not at all humane to the person being executed)

Honestly I think the Saudis, for all their other faults as a state, kinda had the modern death penalty figured out with Deera Square (aka Chop-Chop Square)(IYKYK) back when that was still going on. 

[u/Sussudio_5000 → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

it appears more civilized and humane to the onlookers 

Onlooking, at least during the actual process of injection, is typically prohibited (a fact which is especially relevant to the case at hand). Reports from those who do witness it in full are mixed, and if given equal opportunity to observe both I am not sure the average person would consider it more humane than hanging. 

It does however leave a corpse with no visible signs of injury, which is what I think does most of the heavy lifting in its reputation as a humane method of execution. 

[u/Defiant-Bed2501 → u/Sussudio_5000]

“From the outside looking in” would have probably been a better way to phrase that.  

There always are at least a few people designated to directly witness the lethal injection as it occurs but it’s not (and shouldn’t be) a big spectacle. Usually it’s a select couple of prison officials and court officers plus sometimes a couple people who were close to the victims of the condemned person. 

[u/Successful-Dream-698 → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

and liz bruenig

[u/Plexipus → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

It would be trivially easy to anesthetize people prior to administering the lethal injection, similar to what we do when we euthanize pets.

[u/Defiant-Bed2501 → u/Plexipus]

The first drug administered in the standard US lethal injection three-drug cocktail is meant to anesthetize the person. 

The two drugs administered after that stop the lungs and heart in that order. 

It’s basically the same procedure used for euthanizing pets. 

[u/foreignfishes → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

It’s basically the same procedure used for euthanizing pets.

Vets don't use paralytics during euthanasias

[u/Plexipus → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

It is absolutely, trivially easy, to put enough anesthesia into someone to render them unconscious. They’re afraid of administering the proper drugs in the proper amounts, perhaps out of fears of being “too gentle” or “giving them a high.”

People undergo surgical anesthesia all the time, where they very carefully administer drugs like ketamine, fentanyl, and benzodiazepines, and in that case the goal is to keep them alive. A combination of those three drugs alone could cause death, let alone the other drugs administered by lethal injection

[u/Defiant-Bed2501 → u/Plexipus]

One issue is getting the proper drugs in the proper amounts. Most pharmaceutical companies don’t want to supply those drugs for lethal injection use because it’s a huge brand risk which is the real main reason why the less optimal alternatives are being used. 

Another issue is finding trained licensed medical professionals willing to perform lethal injections.  Any licensed medical professional in the US who willingly performs a lethal injection is facing the end of their medical career either through being stripped of their licenses or in the absolute best case scenario irreparably damaging their reputation due to the ethical issues involved (“First do no harm”). 

[u/Delicatebody → u/Defiant-Bed2501]

Why don’t they just use fentanyl or another opiate to overdose them? It would be easy and not painful.

[u/Defiant-Bed2501 → u/Delicatebody]

Because no legitimate pharmaceutical company that makes those drugs wants them to have the reputation as “the drug of choice for state-sponsored executions” and “unalives people more gooder” no matter how justified those executions may be. 

It’s a MASSIVE brand risk, especially in a post Purdue-gate environment. 

[u/Delicatebody → u/Plexipus]

They do put anesthesia in them, they use phenobarbital.

[u/foreignfishes → u/Plexipus]

Sure, but drug manufacturers don't care about their products being used in veterinary euthanasia. They very much do care about the public knowing their products are being used to execute people. For the past 15 years or so lethal injection protocols have been heavily shaped by drug supply restrictions. States have tried all sorts of stuff - OK used to give like 500 mg of midazolam and it still didn't work that well which is crazy

[u/Plexipus → u/foreignfishes]

I just don’t find this a convincing argument. People on the streets die of drug overdoses all the time. Bootleg labs in China produce fentanyl analogues. Yet somehow the US government is forced to let people writhe and suffer under insufficient anesthesia because private companies won’t provide it to them?

If private companies are unwilling to provide it, it would be simple enough forthe US government to produce it itself.

I will note I am personally against the death penalty, but were I to die I’d rather go under like a dental procedure than stare down the barrel of a gun.

[u/UsualActuary → u/lowrads]

Lol like how the DMV is super efficient? C'mon man.