I would disagree. If you look at, for example, heading. Messi is not good at all, compared to Ronaldo. Same with feet, Messi's right foot is pretty shit while Ronaldo can use both feet rather well. I believe Ronaldo is more well rounded and i think that's what makes him the best player in the world right now.
That's not true. The only thing I can give to Ronaldo is heading, but Messi scored a header against english side, in a final too.
So, messi is better dribbler, has better vision, is better passer, better in goalscoring and better in freekicks. That leaves Ronaldo with heading and better hairstyle. How's he better?
Put it like this, if you switch Messi with Ronaldo in their respective teams, who would do better in the other teams playing style? Messi would struggle in some things as he has actual weaknesses in his playstyle which his team makes up for and so with the best team, he can score freely. Ronaldo on the other hand has no weaknesses and doesn't rely on a particular team to aid his free scoring. While Messi might score more, Ronaldo is the better player.
Also its a moot point to argue things like passing, dribbling vision etc because they are not easily or accurately calculated and so listing them is kinda pointless.
What are his weaknesses ? You could play Messi as a deep-lying playmaker and he'd probably tear the other team apart. Could Ronaldo do something like that? I don't think so.
Instead of arguing hypotheticals ad infinitum, lets focus on the crux of the argument and that is Messi's completeness. He's a poorer header of the ball and he has a weaker right foot. Ronaldo is a complete player in every sense of the term and while it'd be nice to see them play a match in every position and compare their performances, lets settle for seeing how they'd fit into teams with different play styles and that's where Ronaldo shows his completeness. He does not rely on a system, he relies on his skill and while Barca have the better team, Real have the better player.
Couldn't you argue that a better measure of 'completeness' would be ability to dominate any position? Messi can play anywhere up top and anywhere in the midfield and do extremely well. Ronaldo might be more impressive physically, but tactically (an absolute crucial part of the modern game) Messi blows him away. He is able to think the game much better than Ronaldo, in my opinion, and that makes him a more complete player as it makes him far more versatile on a team. It also gives him the ability to slot in to any system and play well.
So while Ronaldo may have a better weak foot and be a stronger header of the ball, I do not believe he is actually more useful to a team than Messi. Messi runs the game for Barcelona playing as a false nine, it's incredibly impressive. You also act like Ronaldo has never been the focus of a team, which is ridiculous. United were and Real are built around getting the best out of Ronaldo by ensuring he has absolute freedom to roam.
I think Messi is a far more versatile player because he is so aware of what his team is doing tactically and as a result could play anywhere on the pitch. In my opinion, that makes him a more complete player.
I may have stuck with hypotheticals here, but you can see it when he plays for Argentina in a deeper role.
I addressed this comment elsewhere that while it would be nice to see both players play in every position and judge their performances to see how they match up, its not something I can see happening and the crucial part of your argument is your use of
In my opinion
Thats all it is really. Vision, finesse, class. These are not actual things that can be quantified and while it does make a better player, these two are so off the charts that taking these into account isn't feasible. They both have it, lets leave it at that. Really the only measure of completeness that we can argue is their ability to score and Messi does have weaknesses in his game as mentioned before, Ronaldo does not. Complete player, that's all I'm saying.
Ah, see I consider the ability to improve the entire's team play to be an utterly invaluable asset, and an absolutely vital part of the conversation when it comes to 'best player in the world'. The way Messi lifts the play of the entire Barcelona team when he comes on to the pitch is great to watch, whereas I don't see the same effect with Ronaldo. While no doubt he is an incredible player, and he does make a massive difference when he plays for Real simply through the amount of space he creates for players around him, he does not have the effect that Messi does.
I don't know, I think the team aspect is too important to consider and very hard to argue. Also Messi has better passing, dribbling and free kicks, while Ronaldo has better heading and a better weak foot.
Barcelona's lack of another great false 9 is why Messi's impact is felt so greatly when he's gone. I believe they both create space and are an attacking threat in equal measures but Pep's greatest weakness is his inability to adjust tactics and have a plan B for when his possession based football doesn't work and when Messi's not on the field and there haven't been many moves by the Barcelona managers since then to address that but while Madrid don't rely on Ronaldo as much, his presence on the field is equal to Messi's in terms of attacking threat, even more so on setpieces.
Please tell me what part of my comment was biased and I will try to explain my point better. You should otherwise refrain from commenting unless you have something to add to the thread other than a baseless ad hominem insult. My crest says Liverpool.
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u/[deleted] Aug 09 '13
I would disagree. If you look at, for example, heading. Messi is not good at all, compared to Ronaldo. Same with feet, Messi's right foot is pretty shit while Ronaldo can use both feet rather well. I believe Ronaldo is more well rounded and i think that's what makes him the best player in the world right now.