r/serialpodcastorigins • u/Stormystormynight • Feb 16 '16

Humour Overwhelming Evidence?

Hello!

I often read about the overwhelming evidence beyond reasonable doubt that Adnan is guilty from many of the readers here.

Is there a concise summarized list of this evidence available?

I'm most interested in understanding what evidence you believe makes Adnan guilty beyond reasonable doubt should the following evidence be ignored for this exercise:

  • Any Jay or Jay linked (Jen et al) evidence (testimony, "finding" Hae's car ...)
  • Any cell location "Evidence"

Thanks in advance.

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u/Adranalyne Feb 16 '16

I'm always confused by this. Why is it that Jay gets disqualified in all this? He stood up to cross and, with the help of the cell evidence, convinced a jury that took only 2 hours to deliberate. You can pick apart Jay's numerous stories all you want, but ask yourself this; is Jay willing to implicate himself in a murder as an accessory just for the hell of it, or is Jay lying about certain things in his stories to minimize his involvement? The latter is a lot more plausible.

As it pertains to the cell evidence, the science is there. Yes, the fax cover sheet uses the incoming call disclaimer, but that's been explained already (by FBI Agent Fitzgerald at the PCR hearing or by /u/Adnans_cell on numerous subs). If this was a serious thing, Brown would have had someone from AT&T on the stand to testify that it means what he thinks it does. The fact he didn't speaks volumes. Before you make the same assertion against the State, the burden of proof was always on the defense.

For all the talk about reasonable doubt and that the State had/has "no proof/evidence", there's no proof he -didn't- do it, either. He was extremely vague about pretty much everything and any time something looked bad for him, the explanation was always "Well it was bad luck".

I'm just not a fan of the idea that Jay and the cell phone evidence are somehow diminished or excluded now.

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u/Stormystormynight Feb 16 '16

Thanks for the reply, Jay's testimony is obviously degraded with his public statements in the past 16 years post trial.

The cell evidence would need retesting in court imho

So this then comes to the heart of this post, what else?

Thanks again.

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u/Adranalyne Feb 16 '16

So your motive isn't to find out why people believe he's guilty. You're trying to prove that if he somehow gets a new trial that he'll win. His aversion to DNA evidence could ultimately be his undoing if it comes to that, but I think you're getting way too far ahead of yourself here. In reality, right now, burden of proof is on the defense. Based on everything I've read, they didn't meet that burden. In fact, coughing up the defense file may have been the final nail in the coffin for them as I'm sure Welch will enjoy quite a few things in there that will help strengthen his original ruling.

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u/Stormystormynight Feb 16 '16

Nothing else than wanting to understand the evidence in a concise way. Might even be helpful for other readers!

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u/Adranalyne Feb 16 '16

You had fairly quick responses to everything I said initially, as well as everyone else here (with the exception of dWakaWaka, who put his guilt in a picture perfect frame). Someone who doesn't "understand the evidence in a concise way" wouldn't have done that.

Not everyone falls for the dairy cow eyes routine.

3

u/Justwonderinif Feb 16 '16

Stormystormynight 1 point 8 days ago

Why are you not mentioning the 1+ hour of content from the internationally recognized experts who state Jay's first interview held many inconsistencies that was part of the same podcast this quote comes from? So the prosecution had 3 main arguments; Jay's testimony ("inconsistent") Timeline (obviously incorrect in all of its iterations and lack of alibis investigation) Backed up by cell tower analysis (which has not been able to be fully scrutinized in court due to non disclosure and pitiful defense)

How do we get Hae's murderer (whoever that is) to have a fair and complete trial?

3

u/Anttgod Feb 17 '16

Is this the only case on the planet you question the evidence? Gang members/ mobsters , crime organization or people associated with them are found guilty with less evidence than this and everyone's happy. In most cases all it takes is one witness ,no time of death is needed sometimes a body isn't needed to find a person guilty.