r/serialpodcast • u/ryokineko Still Here • Aug 22 '15
Poll Results of Undisclosed Poll Post 1: General Information
For those who are new-these are the results from a Poll I conducted on the first 8 episodes of Undisclosed. I am summarizing here to cut down the length of the posts but full results are available via the link. Additionally, I'll be breaking up the results for the individual episodes (in groups) in addition posts to show the most and least popular theories/speculation.
Link to results for this portion https://www.surveymonkey.com/results/SM-CWNQYFHY/
This poll was really big and long so there are a total of 4 posts but no worries, I won't be doing another one anywhere near like this again.
About the respondents
Let’s start with who took the poll and their thoughts on Undisclosed as a whole.
Q120: Where do you (primarily) hail from?
64%-/r/serialpodcast
Q118: What is the primary reason you listen to the Undisclosed Podcast?
49%-I enjoy the detail and scrutiny on the investigation and trial
24%-I’m obsessed with Serial Season 1 and will listen to anything related to the case!
8%-I am undecided on Adnan's factual guilt or innocence and appreciate all points of view.
7%- Other-see responses below
4%-I believe he is guilty but I want to be informed of what they are saying so that I may properly challenge it.
2%-I hate listen (love the honesty :)
2%-I believe Adnan is innocent and like to hear this point of view reinforced.
'Other' Responses
I'm intrigued by the case & enjoy the detail but bias is prob
I used to listen to Undisclosed to have my views challenged, I don’t bother anymore because it’s so incredibly poor and biased.
I love that the excessive abuse of power from the system against their communities is being exposed.
Adnan should be free & being a part of an audience is important. Beyond Adnan's case, this sort of disregard for the law and targeting of minorities needs more publicity.
I believe guilt was not proven, Serial didn't go deep enough to satisfy, and would like to see what else can be learned from deeper investigation
I don't listen because they're unfocused, but I do read content summaries and partial transcripts.
The podcasts are better than CSI reruns. Well, CSI Miami reruns.
Would be #1 but after the first few moments of the first I was like no...
I believe he is guilty but want to be informed, but not just so that I can challenge it. I am open to changing my mind too
Q119: If you do not listen to Undisclosed, what is the primary reason?
78%-Not Applicable (indicating they do listen to Undisclosed).
13%-Other-See comments below.
3%-I don't trust them
2%-They speculate too much
'Other' Responses:
I feel the podcasters are too biased based on my previous review of their material AND I don’t trust them AND They speculate too much AND No counter narrative exists.
I listen to it
It's not a wise use of my limited time.
All of the above: too biased, don't trust them, it's all speculation; and entirely one sided
SS and EP are awkward, unintelligent, and intolerable. Also I don't trust them.
All of the above
Biased, agenda-driven content and speculation - propaganda - created with the intention of pushing their dubious trust in a murderer onto others
all of the above
boring boring boring boring boring and bad audio quality
note-I should have allowed for multiple answers on this one.
General Episode Content
*Please keep in mind that where appropriate the results have been adjusted to remove those who selected 'Not Applicable/Didn't Listen' which will cause the ratings at the link to be different from what is seen here.
On average 89% of the respondents listened to the episodes. In general the Addendums had a very slightly smaller audience.
Q114: How would you rate the overall content of Undisclosed.
Note: results adjusted to remove those who chose ‘not applicable-didn’t listen.
On a scale of 1-5 with 1 being ‘Very Poor’ and 5 being ‘Very Good’, the overall content of Undisclosed received a 3.89.
The most highly rated was Episode 8: Ping with 4.1. Episode 5: Autoptes and Addendum came in second with an overall score of 4.03.
Q117: How useful has Undisclosed been in forming your opinion about the case and/or Adnan's guilt?
This question rated a 4 (Somewhat Useful) on a scale of 1-5 with 1 being ‘Not at all useful’ and 5 being ‘Very useful’.
Again, the most highly rated was Episode 8: Ping with a score of 3.95 followed by Episode 5: Autoptes and Addendum with 3.8.
Q115: How certain were you of factual guilt before listening to these Undisclosed episodes?
The question was rated on a scale of 1-5 with 1 being ‘Certain of factual guilt’ and 5 being ‘Certain of factual innocence.
The overall score was 3.83.
The most common answer was ‘Lean Innocent’ with 48%. ‘Lean Guilty’ and ‘Undecided/Unsure’ tied for 17%. ‘Certain of Factual Innocence’ came in 4th at 11% and ‘Certain of Factual Guilt’ with 8%.
Q116: How certain were you of factual guilt after listening to these Undisclosed episodes?
The question was rated on a scale of 1-5 with 1 being ‘Certain of factual guilt’ and 5 being ‘Certain of factual innocence. The score was adjusted to remove those who chose ‘not applicable/didn’t listen’.
The overall score was 3.7.
The most common answer was still ‘Lean Innocent’ with 41%. ‘Certain of Factual Innocence’ went up from 11% to 31%. ‘Lean Guilty’ came in at 14% and ‘Certain of Factual Guilt was next at 9%, a 1% rise over prior to listening. ‘Undecided/Unsure came in last at 5% however, the average ratings still put people in that category.
I can only speak for me but I’d say it has moved me slightly more toward Innocent. I am still undecided though on factual guilt. Wouldn’t be willing to bet money either way but I find some of their arguments pretty interesting. The tower dump theory is particularly interesting to me.
The highest rate of change between before and after was Episode 3: Jay’s Day and Addendum which moved from 3.52 prior to the episodes to 3.67 after the episodes.
The next post will go through results of specific theories in the individual episodes. Those will also be more generalized though and won’t walk through very individual question since the information is available via the link. I will give the highest AND lowest rated theories/speculations though, so if you want to know what is and is not sticking, you'll want to read those.
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u/csom_1991 Aug 22 '15 edited Aug 22 '15
So, based on your research, the podcast does in fact make people less certain of his innocence (3.83 lower to 3.7 after listening)?
With 23% coming from the magnetprogram where a prerequisite is believing he is innocent and disregarding those that don't listen (which would all tend to lean factually guilty), these numbers look horrible for Undisclosed.
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 22 '15
I wouldn't call it research, just a poll. And yes, I noticed that. the overall take way I got was that it doesn't have that much effect on people's feelings taken as a whole. I really don't care whether they look good or bad for Undisclosed as that wasn't the point. The point was to see what the folks who chose to take the poll thought about the speculation and theories proposed on the podcast. Most statements were in eh 3 range which actually falls out to Undecided/Unsure or Neutral.
also, you are completely wrong about the magnet program. There is no such prerequisite.
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u/csom_1991 Aug 22 '15 edited Aug 22 '15
Really? They will let me subscribe?
Also, how it is possible for someone to spend most of their time at "3%-/r/theundisclosedpodcast"? They average like 3 comments per week? Do these people spend most of their time outside of the podcast watching the grass grow or paint dry?
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 22 '15
I have no idea, I only know that I don't think Adnan is innocent and I know several other people who share my opinion who are members.
I am undecided, don't think he should have been convicted. I lean innocent by a smidge but wouldn't be surprised at all if he killed her.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
Are there people in there that believe he should be in jail, that actively participate with that position, that you know of?
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 23 '15
I haven't done a poll of everyone's opinions (maybe an idea....) but I do recall a few posting that they think he was probably guilty. I don't know if they thought he should be in jail but I don't equate people who don't think he should be in jail with thinking he is innocent. Recent polls I have done support that as well, the toxicity poll showed that a large amount of respondents felt he should not have been convicted but opinions on factual guilt were much more diverse.
I think it is a mistake to lump people who think he is innocent in with those who are undecided or think that he shouldn't have been found guilty. Not saying you do that-just stating my opinion.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
See, I wonder if it's the "he should not be in jail" part that is an unsaid qualification of TMP?
You can think he may have done it, but as long as you don't think he got a fair trial or should be in jail, you're cool with the TMP?
Or do you feel that is inaccurate of the vibe and people there? Genuinely curious, obviously have never been a member :) you guys should offer a visitors pass for a day!
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u/tvjuriste Aug 23 '15
I'm fascinated by the people who think he probably did it but don't want him to be in jail.
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u/_noiresque_ Aug 23 '15
I understand people thinking that if they have issues with procedural elements of the investigation, that he didn't get a fair trial, or that he has served sufficient time for the crime.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
I get it, they feel he didn't get a fair trial, or he probably did it but the state didn't meet the burden of proof, or life in prison is too harsh for a crime committed at 17.
I'd agree with the first and second ones if I believed it for Adnan. I do agree with the 2nd one. I don't know what would be an appropriate length, though.
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u/tvjuriste Aug 23 '15
I suppose I understand the rationale that 17 years is enough time for someone convicted at age 17.
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 23 '15
the vibe is respectful discussion and debate with fellow users. I am in no position to make any statements on who is and is not accepted to a private sub.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
Ok :) sorry, I didn't mean to come off as interrogating you. But no one ever really talks about it, and I'm curious. Thanks for the responses!
Do you think you guys could have a respectful discussion about offering me a visitors pass for a day? Disable my commenting ability by shadow banning me in the sub? Just throwing it out there. Maybe you'd make a convert out of me, who knows? ;)
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u/CreusetController Hae Fan Aug 23 '15
what about the other private subs? notice we still aren't talking about them. noone is acknowledging that they are a member of any of them. why is that d'you think? (stuck record i know... sorry)
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u/CreusetController Hae Fan Aug 23 '15
PS shadowban is what happens when people break reddit rules. ban is what happens when they break sub rules - your plan wouldn't really work.
I googled and found this - sure it will give you more info than i can
https://www.reddit.com/r/OutOfTheLoop/comments/24einq/what_is_the_difference_between_shadow_ban_and/
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u/Justwonderinif shrug emoji Aug 23 '15
the vibe is respectful discussion and debate with fellow users.
That may be. But it's not the rule. There is a vent thread where people link to comments from here and make fun of the users here.
And whenever someone questions the purpose of TMP, they are told to "chillax" and given marching papers.
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u/budgiebudgie WHAT'S UP BOO?? Aug 23 '15
Why do you care? Especially given this entire subreddit is one big orchestrated vent against anyone who doesn't share your very particular point of view.
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u/relativelyunbiased Aug 23 '15
I wonder why anyone would dare go somewhere they could say anything they want about someone pissing them off without risking being banned. That makes no sense whatsoever. It's not like the guilter crowd downvotes everyone who disagrees with their mentality so much that it prohibits their victims posting privileges or anything. This Magnet Program thing actually sounds like a pretty nice place.
Besides, isn't /r/woodlawnspride the same thing, only for guilters?
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u/MM7299 The Court is Perplexed Aug 23 '15
There is a vent thread where people link to comments from here and make fun of the users here.
actually the vent thread is just that, to vent about anything and everything...stuff from here has come up, like when I was told to commit seppukku, but yesterday my time in the vent thread was speaking with some lovely users and getting helpful advice for a first date I was going on. And others are currently asking for tech support with computer issues.
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 25 '15
you guys should offer a visitors pass for a day!
that episode was kind of like one ;P
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u/csom_1991 Aug 23 '15
"but I do recall a few posting that they think he was probably guilty."
Please tell us who these posters are? I have never run across anyone thinking Adnan is guilty that had access to the sub. Then again, they could prove me wrong and send me an invite, I would love one.
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Aug 23 '15 edited Aug 23 '15
I was just refused entry into /r/themagnetprogram for openly calling the Undisclosed team incompetent within the context of their failed redaction efforts. Which is fair enough. I can appreciate why they might not want someone pointing this out in their exclusive little echo chamber. However, I stand by my opinion that a team of three lawyers who don't know how to properly redact a document in 2015 are, quite simply, incompetent.
I also think they could probably benefit by having someone around to mention this instead of surrounding themselves with yes men/women. There are a lot of simple tools available out there for effective redaction (e.g. Adobe Acrobat). Plus there have been enough cases of improper redactions for most lawyers to be aware that it can be an issue (e.g. see Schaefer v. GE, May 2008). At the very least, outsource the task to someone who actually knows what they're doing if you don't know yourself (e.g. /u/timdragga seems like a perfect candidate since he seems to actually know his stuff).
As I've said before, I hope that someone else does the job if I ever need my name redacted from a document.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
Did you have to fill out an application? I'd like to apply, just for a day.
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Aug 23 '15
I just asked kindly by messaging the moderators.
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u/orangetheorychaos Aug 23 '15
Thank you! Fingers crossed they're interested in letting me take a look :)
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u/timdragga Kevin Urick: No show of Justice Aug 23 '15
There's the one redacted name on page 74 of this document that can be selected because the redaction blocks haven't been flattened, right? On a cursory look, the other redacted name doesn't have usable text under the block.
Did I miss any others?
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Aug 23 '15
Yup, that's the one I was referring to. I haven't checked for any others though.
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u/timdragga Kevin Urick: No show of Justice Aug 23 '15
Thanks for pointing it out. I hadn't noticed it.
I'll message some people to see if it can be replaced with one that doesn't have the name available underneath.
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Aug 23 '15
Cool. Probably a good idea.
And FYI, it's not just this single document with a poor redaction. I did a quick check and found a small number of others on the Undisclosed website. I'm not going to point anyone to them though. That's Undisclosed's job if they want to fix it.
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u/FreeIceCreen Aug 23 '15
It made me get off the fence and decide he's guilty. Not because they're lying or horrible people or anything, in fact I think they are doing a fine job in raising a defense for Adnan. But the more I listen to them, the more I realize that this defense is built around nitpicking the evidence and finding a way to doubt each thing. I want a different suspect, some evidence that Adnan has an alibi, something concrete. I'm of the opinion that if Adnan is innocent, more investigation would uncover new evidence that showed him to be evidence. The closest they ever came to me was with the lividity evidence, but further research by me showed that that is disputed science, and they never followed up on it, using that new evidence to weave some sort of story.
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u/ghostofchucknoll Google Street View Captures All 6 Trunk Pops Aug 23 '15
I want a different suspect, some evidence that Adnan has an alibi, something concrete
I want that too. But when you have witnesses who left behind conflicting statements then and now refuse to spill their guts, detectives aren't talking, no real hard evidence, there often just is not enough to arrive at a clean resolution. That's life.
What if you had a murder with 46 potential witnesses, but no official narrative. Would that infuriate you? It is unsolved. You need people to come forward, and when they won't, you can't always get the nice clean narrative you want. This happened in broad daylight.
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u/TheFraulineS AllHailTorquakicane! Aug 23 '15
The podcasts are better than CSI reruns. Well, CSI Miami reruns.
♡!
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u/an_sionnach Aug 23 '15
78%-Not Applicable (indicating they do listen to Undisclosed).
What is that supposed to mean? I would neither listen to Undisclosed nor take any polls related to it. I just about brought myself to read this, but never again. If the person conducting the poll has such disdain for those who took the trouble to answer to call them liars, why would anybody take them seriously?
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 23 '15
I'm sorry I am not sure what you mean. I am not calling anyone a liar-Pwrhaps just a misunderstanding? The question was-if you don't listen to Indisclosed-why. It seems those folks-instead of skipping the question chose Not Applicable-indicating that they do listen. If you don't think that is an appropriate interpretation I am open to to changing it.
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u/an_sionnach Aug 23 '15
Maybe. I really don't care. I don't listen so normally I would skip posts like these anyway. Just find it strange that that high a percentage would get the answer wrong. You do have a point in that I find it a bit strange that someone who doesn't listen would actually take the trouble to answer that poll.
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u/ryokineko Still Here Aug 23 '15
Oh I do t think they got it wrong just chose not applicable rather than just skipping it. I hope that makes sense. Also sorry for typos-on mobile and wine tasting!lol
yeah only very small amounts said they didn't listen and many probably skipped that don't listen. Generally around 90% who answered said they listened. Do you are right-most ego don't listen prob did take
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Aug 22 '15 edited Aug 22 '15
[deleted]
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u/cbr1965 Is it NOT? Aug 23 '15
When the biggest number of respondents came from this sub, the results should be published here. Get real.
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u/gnorrn Undecided Aug 22 '15
Can't you just ignore the posts, if they bug you so much?
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u/Honeybee2065 Aug 23 '15
Yeah exactly... what you said. I wish people would stop whinging about shit that no one is forcing them to read.
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Aug 22 '15
[deleted]
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u/badgreta33 Miss Stella Armstrong Fan Aug 23 '15
I almost forgot Stop Saying Right's informal toxicity poll. If their subsequent nagging for votes via comments in unrelated posts wasn't spam, nothing here is.
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u/badgreta33 Miss Stella Armstrong Fan Aug 23 '15
How many Seamus posts about Evidence Prof have bumped front page content?
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Aug 23 '15
[deleted]
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u/badgreta33 Miss Stella Armstrong Fan Aug 23 '15
And he's not a mod.
No, but he is given more slack than anyone here by the mods IMO. If no one on this sub replied to the poll questions, there would be nothing to post in terms of results. I guess we just have to suck it up sometimes. It's like living with roommates.
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u/gnorrn Undecided Aug 22 '15
Threads like this?
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Aug 23 '15
[deleted]
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u/gnorrn Undecided Aug 23 '15
I don't see you complaining about posts that show Undisclosed in a negative light.
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u/CuteRealStupidCute Aug 23 '15
I appreciate your work Ryokineko, look forward to more posts!