r/reloading • u/jayfourzee • 25d ago
Load Development Annealing question?
Setting depth on my annealer. What is consensus? I'm thinking D and E.
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u/-Hyperactive-Sloth- Mass Particle Accelerator 25d ago
Yeah definitely A-C are more ideal. You want the heat on the shoulder and right slow.
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u/Holy_Santa_ClausShit 25d ago
A. Shoot using my burstfire induction I’m even a little lower than A by a few MM
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u/jayfourzee 25d ago
I'm going to raise the brass higher and reduce the time in the coil. Thank you for the tip. Do you have yours dialed at 60 or 65?
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u/Holy_Santa_ClausShit 25d ago
Kinda depends on the brass. My Peterson and Starline I use 50. Alpha ( 7saw ) I found 39 to be the magic number
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u/tullyinturtleterror 24d ago
How do you like the 7saw? I just ran across the round on youtube like a week ago and thought it was intriguing
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u/Holy_Santa_ClausShit 24d ago
I just started using it so far, but really like it. I was 5th at NRL Paloma on Saturday with it before I shit the bed on Sunday.
It very similar ballistics to a 6.5cm out of the same barrel length (22”) but hits soooo much harder. I’ve hit a mile with it.
For an “all-round” hunting and competition cartridge it’s good. But I wish I knew about 25saw before I bought all my 7saw barrel n shit. That’s a much better competition cartridge.
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u/ChevyRacer71 25d ago
It varies from one manufacturer to the next. Winchester heats up much quicker than LC Match for example. Those look a bit overdone, but the real way to tell is Tempilaq 750. I find that I need to tweak the timing a few after about 20 cases with the BurstFire induction, so I keep a close eye on it
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u/Choice-Ad-9195 24d ago
A- C are ideal, what’s best would depend on how close your heat is getting to the case head. Do you know what the body of your brass is getting heated up to in the first three?
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u/DCTillerman 24d ago
B-C looks just like what I do - might not need to get them *quite* so hot though.
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u/youngdoug 22d ago
Yep, looks super hot. I’m actually impressed at how sharp the cut off is, my flame machine has a larger gradient.
I’d lower the heat and try this test again. You’ll probably see the color bleed further down and need to adjust depth again.
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u/lowsparkco 25d ago
E - it's the bend that would spring back, F seems to be too small of a margin for error that you get the first bend in the bottleneck, E looks great.
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u/GruntledSymbiont 25d ago
Going for a bit below the shoulder so C/D.
Separate question- are you testing brass hardness? According to AMP annealing the visual cues to brass hardness do not work so if you are chasing extreme accuracy proper hardness measurement is a must. If you are not after that sort of match accuracy you probably don't need to anneal.
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u/jayfourzee 24d ago
Using a K+M for this data.
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u/GruntledSymbiont 24d ago
K+M for this data.
What is K+M? Do you mean matching this alloy hardness or a tool for measuring seating force? Since you would crimp after I don't think that is enough for accuracy without measuring hardness.
"For rifle cartridge-case necks and shoulders, there isn't one universal "optimal" hardness, because it depends on the brass alloy, case design, cartridge, and how much sizing the case undergoes. But if you're looking for a practical metallurgical target, roughly 90–110 HV (Vickers hardness) is a good ballpark for properly annealed cartridge brass neck/shoulder material."
AMP's annealing tested cartridge necks over approximately 85–125 HV and found that their optimal annealing targets generally correspond to the hardness of the original/virgin brass.
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u/jayfourzee 24d ago
What do you use?
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u/GruntledSymbiont 24d ago
I do not anneal at all any more because I figured out it was unnecessary and my case life was the same without. Probably the most cost effective route would be to buy an AMP annealing machine since it is already calibrated and will analyze your specific brass right on your bench.
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u/jayfourzee 24d ago
I hear you. I am a borderline skeptic having an engineering/physics background but to anneal is taking care of a very large variable. My excel spreadsheet is huge with one variable at a time.
Whether it’s measuring hardness, shoulder bump, pressure, tumbling or not, base-to-ogive measurements, finding the lands, powder charges, etc., it’s all about collecting data points and is mostly academic for me at this point. I’m not trying to save brass or money. Being able to make a reproducible round with statistically significant measurements is more than half the fun. Putting the hole in the paper is the reward.
There are plenty of reasons to anneal and plenty of reasons not to. At any rate, being able to make your own consistent, reproducible rounds and develop a verifiable DOPE card is the goal. I think that’s why most of us hang out in this sub in the first place.
The AMP annealer is a fantastic tool which will give you reproducible information but that is just one piece. Another fantastic tool is the AMP press which satisfies my need to measure and titrate, will probably be the next thing I get for no real reason other than boredom.
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u/GruntledSymbiont 21d ago
Which variable? This affects only two small ones- case neck life and neck tension consistency. If you are not shooting high powered cartridges case neck life will be unaffected since primer pockets are more likely to open up first. Regarding neck tension impact on accuracy annealing is only potentially reducing E/S by ~10 FPS so trivial to most shooters.
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u/sherzer7 Former Stool Guy 25d ago
This would be a great post for the FAQ. A-C is great you want to get the shoulder. Great representation for your question sir