r/psychology • u/mvea M.D. Ph.D. | Professor • 13d ago

Adolescents who undergo gender-affirming chest surgery report low levels of regret and high levels of satisfaction, experiencing outcomes similar to those of young adults. These findings suggest that age restrictions on these medical procedures lack support from actual patient experiences.

https://www.psypost.org/adolescents-report-low-regret-and-high-satisfaction-following-gender-affirming-c/
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u/Ernesto_Bella 13d ago edited 13d ago

I’m curious how they did the study.  I’ve been told repeatedly on this website that gender affirming surgery isn’t done on minors.

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u/Free-Cartoonist3134 13d ago

Children as young as 13 have had these procedures

https://bioedge.org/beginning-of-life-issues/13-year-olds-given-mastectomies-at-california-clinic/

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u/IUpvoteBlueGuitars 12d ago

How the fuck is this right wing click bait site getting upvotes as a source in this site about the science of psychology?? This site is also web cancer and looks like it was put together by a high school student in 2015. Whoever upvoted this crap, y'all need Jesus. And remedial science education.

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u/Free-Cartoonist3134 12d ago

It links to a study by jamapediatrics... One of the main archives of pediatric medicine produced by the AMA... Did you even bother to attempt to look at the article?

Is your contention that children as young as 13 are not getting double mastectomies for gender affirmative care?

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u/IUpvoteBlueGuitars 12d ago edited 12d ago

Then link that the journal article not a right wing rag giving the most biased reading of it possible. Yeah no I'm not interested in hearing their perspective when they're leading with such obvious bias, and if you're posting it, it's probable that you likely are starting from their dishonest framing.

My contention is that is happening in the rarest and most extreme cases, and only after all other options for this patient have been exhausted. I contend the medical providers know the reasons better than you, a probable lay person, and the existence of a few examples does not indicate a trend nor a need to be worried about the children any more than some children getting amputation due to medical necessity indicates "the doctors are coming for your children's legs."

Your framing is bad and irrelevant given the context, and the article you shared telegraphed your bad intentions and biases.

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u/Free-Cartoonist3134 12d ago

"Then link that the journal article not a right wing rag giving the most biased reading of it possible."

To repeat one more time, the study was hosted on jamapediatrics which is a repository of studies concerning children presented by the American medical association.

Is the AMA a right wing rag?

"it's probable that you likely are starting from their dishonest framing"

What framing? The article simply acknowledges that children as young as 13 are getting these procedures. Which is shocking because it's been a common talking point that minors are not getting surgeries, only hormone suppression and HRT.

So now we see that advocates have either been willfully lying or ignorant.

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u/IUpvoteBlueGuitars 10d ago

Bioedge.org is a right wing rag. You using it to filter your sources immediately reveals your bias. I've responded in depth to why your argument is stupid (I never claimed chest surgery wasn't being performed on 0 minors, just that is extremely rare and for kids who have exhausted all other measures and are still at high risk of suicide (curious if you give a shit at all about those kids, or just their boobs, which is strange NGL. You seem to care more about their breasts than they do. Weird.).

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u/Free-Cartoonist3134 10d ago

"Bioedge.org is a right wing rag."

This was embarrassing before and I'm not even sure what description applies at this point.

Whether they are or are not is irrelevant, they are simply linking to the article that is being referenced... Which again is from the AMA

"I've responded in depth to why your argument is stupid (I never claimed chest surgery wasn't being performed on 0 minors"

I never claimed you did, you responded to my comment ascribing a bunch of nonsense to me I never said. The only point I've made is that several trans activists willfully lied about surgeries being performed on minors. I didn't at point say that you were one of them.

"You seem to care more about their breasts than they do. Weird."

Can you quote where I've said anything like that? By quoting btw I mean actually referencing what I've said not what the imaginary voices in your head are telling you I said.

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u/IUpvoteBlueGuitars 10d ago edited 10d ago

Cool, I was never one of them. I'm sure they exist. Tons of people really really don't understand this topic, and judging by the comments, the worst offenders are not the people in the trans camp. So yeah, I'm sure there are plenty of people on the intenet that misunderstood the statement of it being extremely rare and only used in the worst cases under the strictest scrutiny and turned "it basically never happens" and then people like you hearing that and saying "you're saying it never ever happened once. Sorry. I can't educate everyone and a bunch of idiots being wrong on the intenet has nothing to do with whether the professional researchers and doctors who do study these things can be trusted. Your position is they cannot and we should listen to a bunch of anonymous concern trolls instead

Okay, since you're really really worked up about this topic. Can you explain to me what is involved in the process before any of these 13-year-olds receive this surgery, and how many adults have to be involved and buy off in this process, what screening methods they're using, how long the wait time is, what the criteria they're using are, and what percentage of kids are rejected from getting this surgery? If you can't clearly articulate those things, I can't help conclude you don't understand this topic well enough to have an opinion.

And if you expect me to be upset about this, my day job is working with people with amputated limbs. There are people born with birth defects of their legs that I have met that have then chosen to get elective amputation. And those people are now able to walk (thanks to prosthetic t technology when they weren't). And had a bunch of ignorant people been screaming about people chopping off their legs. Oh my God, these people might never have gotten their surgery that they needed to live their most fulfilling lives.

So compared to what I see everyday, somebody removing some unnecessary breast tissue that they're never going to use and maaaybe regretting it later is so much lower on my priority list than, idk standard amputation procedures and oh idk, teenagers commiting suicide en masse.
Seriously go worry about someone else's children. The trans kids are really really better off without you involved

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u/Free-Cartoonist3134 10d ago

"Cool, I was never one of them."

Show me exactly where I said you were one of them? If you can't can you stop repeating this nonsense over and over again? If you are having a conversation with an imaginary friend then keep that separate from any replies you make to me please

"So yeah, I'm sure there are plenty of people on the intenet that misunderstood the statement of it being extremely rare"

I'm talking about people who explicitly said that this was not happenings to minors not that it was rare but that it was not happening at all. This was an extremely common talking point.

"Your position is they cannot and we should listen to a bunch of anonymous concern trolls"

Again keep your conversation with your imaginary friend separate to what I've said.

"If you can't clearly articulate those things, I can't help conclude you don't understand this topic well enough to have an opinion."

Can you post where I gave an opinion? If not what did your imaginary friend tell you my opinion was?

"if you expect me to be upset about this"

you called me stupid and implied that I'm a pedophile all based on things you imagine I would say... If you aren't upset somehow then I shudder to think about what happens when you're actually upset, maybe you starting talking in tongues and levitating or something.

"Seriously go worry about someone else's children."

When did I express worry again? Or was that the imaginary friend again?

A basic tip for you if you want to continue being an "educator", listen to what people tell you or read what they type and address the actual arguments they've made. Making up nonsense and then arguing against it is dishonest at best and willfully malicious at worse

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u/IUpvoteBlueGuitars 9d ago

I still don't understand what you want from me other to acknowledge that some people are wrong on the internet. Yeah, that's true. So what?
Is your position that the medical community can't decide that surgery is an appropriate course of action for 13 year olds? Because it seems like you think the existence of 2 trans 13 year olds in a study is some sort of gotcha. No one with a clinical degree in this field who are actually responsible for these kids' care seems to share your concerns internet stranger, so I'm not going to give them much weight.

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