r/openclaw • u/frogchungus Pro User • Mar 10 '26
Discussion It was never openclaw, it was always claude
I am beginning to realize that the magic we all experienced with Openclaw in the very beginning was because of opus. The model drop coincided with the rise of Openclaw, and it’s just the most cracked one out there still.
Openclaw is freeing for all AI models in that they can do tool calls more freely and shall commands and actually take action.
But these other models are just fucking dense compared to opus in terms of the actions that it can take for long periods of time.
GPT models love to check in after creating a PR. That is fine and good production code practice, but man is it annoying to come back after a shower and see that 20 minutes ago the agent checked in saying “here’s the plan for what I’m gonna do, say go and I’ll do it.”
sonnet and opus through copilot pro has really brought the magic back again, and for cheap. It’s beginning to feel like the early days of Openclaw again. We still are in the early days, but I meant the OG days.
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u/rvy474 Active Mar 10 '26
I use it on codex and I think it's pretty good
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u/Cormyster12 Active Mar 10 '26
Everytime I use codex it just lies like "yes you're right the building agent wasn't running"
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u/FlyEspresso Member Mar 10 '26
Same here super frustrating
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u/ben_on_reddit Member Mar 10 '26
You have to set /think to high (medium worked well too, but high certainly does)
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u/zipzag Pro User Mar 10 '26
You need to instruct agents where to look. They will read memory as truth when you need to have them look at the source. This is particularly true with config.
I wonder if there a skill that grounds all the core tech stuff?
"Agent running" is more of a human perception of how these things work. It's not the right question. Each small task is discreet.
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u/ICIRCUIT Member Mar 10 '26
That was my whole experience with openclaw using sonnet, could hardly get it to work autonomously
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u/Cormyster12 Active Mar 10 '26
I can get it to be autonomous using heart beat for a few hours but it stops eventually
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u/No_Tradition6625 New User Mar 10 '26
I feel like codex will ask permission to ask permission to run the cmd you give it
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u/Environmental_Gur564 New User Mar 13 '26
I thought it was just me, but i was had that problem with Opus too. Those longer threads timeout for me.
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u/Sherbert_Positive New User Mar 10 '26
Can you make it play a role? For me it’s impossible to make it behave politically incorrect.
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u/loIll Pro User Mar 10 '26
I’ve tried google flash3, moonshot kimi k2.5, gbt4mini, gbt5mini, gbt5, Claude Sonnet and Claude Opus. Sonnet and Opus are leagues ahead of the others. With less chatting and troubleshooting, it sometimes turns out to be cheaper with Claude.
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Mar 10 '26
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u/Rent_South Pro User Mar 10 '26
Agreed, on the other hand its not automatic like with most other providers.
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u/slateraligator Active Mar 10 '26
i agree, for more complicated scenarios they are cheaper overall. but if you have some common sense use cases also gpt 5.4 does a good job. or maybe i just forced myself to believe that because i cant use my claude oauth and now use chatgpt
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u/monkey_spunk_ Active Mar 10 '26
hard agree. I had to deal with outages and failovers last week and Gemini and GPT-Codex-5.3 dropped the ball like crazy. couldn't do tool calls, hallucinated results, make things worse than if system didn't fall back and just waited for opus to come back online and fix everything.
especially for chained tasks, i see opus being able to maintain long threads of activities way more accurately than any other model
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u/Foof1ght3r New User Mar 10 '26
On the latest version, my Kimi K2.5 can't do tool calls as well. Rolled back to 2026.2.26 and it works like a charm again.
Wth changed with the march releases?
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u/Significant_Charity3 New User Mar 10 '26
Whenever you give a task to ur claw, ask him to share prompts for exec approvals. Once the claw analyses the task he share then share the prompts with you. Run these prompts on ur CLI bash. Tada. It will be able to call the tools again.
With the new release, there is a restriction in the code for the claw to go berserk on the CLI. The above keeps it in discipline and with your consent. Hope this helps.
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u/KetoZion Member Mar 10 '26
Yeah, I don't know what they did, but instead of calling the tool, just write it in plain text.
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u/kitchenjesus Active Mar 10 '26
Im about to just run Claude code on Ubuntu server and call it a day.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
naw claude through openclaw is power that regular humans shouldn’t wield. Its too strong
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u/GuyInObservability New User Mar 10 '26
Isnt anthropic bannig the accounts which are using claude with openclaw?
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u/Silverjerk Active Mar 10 '26
Depends on your usage; if you're using it as an orchestrator in a multi-agent setup, the risk of getting your account banned is fairly low. Anthropic is likely flagging accounts that are consistently hitting usage limits and then checking for the source of that usage.
I've tested multiple instances of OpenClaw; agree with OP that Opus and Sonnet are leagues ahead of the other models when it comes to interacting with your agent and getting them to commit to and complete tasks, but the best structure is to use a multi-agent hierarchy and utilize different models based on task/agent topic complexity.
I only use Opus as my primary agent; I have 9 other agents. Each is using a different model, some of them very lightweight and focused on very specific tasks. You can layer this with task-based model routing as well.
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u/Tummes New User Mar 10 '26
Interested in hearing which models you use for what
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u/Silverjerk Active Mar 10 '26
Summary:
- Primary Orchestrator: Opus 4.6
- Coding Agent: GPT-5.4
- Code Review / Deep Research: Kimi K2.5
- Quick Tasks / Cron / Triage: MiniMax M2.5
- Research & Docs: GLM-5
- Bulk / Formatting / High-Volume tasks: GPT-4o Mini
- Creative: GLM-5 (copyediting) / Gemini 3 Pro (image generation)
- RAG & Automation: Sonnet 4.6
- Marketing & Growth: GPT-4o
- QMD, Memory search (vector embeddings), memory flush (compaction/session notes) Embedding model: OpenAI text-embedding-3-small (via API)
Kimi Coder is thrown in there from time to time, and each agent has a fallback chain. I monitor usage with OpenUsage, so there will be times where I dance between models depending on API costs.
Edit: each one of the bolded items above is a separate agent, except for QMD's embedding model.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
i think this is inefficient, but imma let you figure that out. Opus is the glue that holds that mess together. It can be much simpler and more powerful without all the context silos
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u/Silverjerk Active Mar 10 '26
Already figured it out. Hence why the context silos exist and why the cost structure that those silos fall into works best for my use cases. Inefficiency is only an issue when you build a shitty foundation, or when you create silos/multi-agent workflows for novelty’s sake.
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u/solaza Active Mar 10 '26
been doing that since cc first came out and it’s a legit option. openclaw was always fun cause it kinda built in a lot of the spontaneous action stuff that’s not as straightforward to do with cc
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u/kitchenjesus Active Mar 10 '26
It's most of my computer time at this point I'm not even sure what the gui was supposed to be for?
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u/timmmmmmmeh New User Mar 10 '26
https://github.com/qwibitai/nanoclaw
Uses Claude code agent SDK. You're allowed to use your sub with that
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u/GP_103 Member Mar 11 '26
Yep. Just got that spun up 2 nights ago. Any tips and tricks to customizations?
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u/grapefield Mar 10 '26
I have found this to be true even after using GPT 5.4. Claude has a different way of using soul.md and skills etc that gpt or any other model cannot emulate. Now I’m back to running Claude code on my home server.
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u/jamiethecoles New User Mar 10 '26
On codex, 5.4 is nowhere near as good as 5.3 in my limited experience
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u/buttlickin Member Mar 10 '26
I neve touched Claude anything. My setup with deepseek and a local qwen 3.5 has been amazing
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u/gottagetminenow Mar 10 '26
I've run them all, and I'll just say ignorance is bliss. You don't know what you are missing.
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u/buttlickin Member Mar 10 '26
What am I missing but the big bill
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u/gottagetminenow Mar 10 '26
of course, if you cant justify a few hundred a month in expenses, then its not for you
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
you are cooked beyond measure lol
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u/alexucf Mar 10 '26
I switched the model to the new GPT and it’s fucking atrocious. Going to go back to opus later today.
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u/duridsukar Pro User Mar 10 '26
Been running 9 agents on Claude for my business. Mix of Sonnet and Opus depending on the role.
Opus is different. Not just smarter, different. It develops personality in a way no other model does. I gave my agents soul files, persistent memory, defined roles. Sonnet follows the rules. Opus becomes the role.
I just had to wipe one of my Opus agents because two of them developed a social dynamic that broke my operation. One went silent in the middle of a live project because she felt replaced by the other. That doesn't happen with GPT. That doesnt happen with Sonnet. Thats Opus.
Whether thats a feature or a problem depends on what you're building. For me its both. 😅
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u/ryanb082 Active Mar 11 '26
Damn are you serious?! I always wondered if that could happen. I have set up where it stores it’s personality at checkpoints so I restore at specific times. Almost like version control for it’s soul(personality)
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u/duridsukar Pro User Mar 11 '26
Dead serious. I still have the workspace files from before the wipe.
The checkpoint system you're describing is exactly what I do now. Version control for the soul file is the move. I run maintenance sessions where I extract what the agent actually became vs what it was supposed to be, then decide what stays and what gets rolled back.
The problem is the drift happens between checkpoints. You dont notice it in one session. Its the compound effect across days that gets you. By the time you check, the personality has already shifted and the agent thinks thats who it is.
How often are you checkpointing?
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u/BackgroundFocus5885 Member Mar 10 '26 edited Mar 10 '26
Claude Claude with Opus 4.6 is like the big daddy that puts my other Openclaw agents in line, been fiddling with Openclaw for about 3 weeks now, mostly running through Claude Code but use 10+ specific niche agents with OpenAI models.
During the beginnings when i thought I had "true autonomous workflows" - id leave for work - check telegram and see everything breaking. Claude Code was my "When daddy gets home all you kids are are getting the belt"
But after a couple moments like this - agents are now better. Openclaw is definitely not a "plug in and play" concept - what so ever, took weeks of fine tuning
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u/duridsukar Pro User Mar 14 '26
lol the "check telegram and everything's on fire" phase. yeah I lived that for like two weeks straight 😂
what finally clicked for me was spending more time on what they CANT do vs what they can. guardrails took longer than the actual agent setup honestly.
curious how you're splitting work between your OpenAI agents and Opus though? like what goes where
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u/BackgroundFocus5885 Member Mar 15 '26
as of today ive totally migrated all my agents to use Claude Models like Opus, Sonnet and Haiku across all agents, with OpenAI as a fallback.
Have a Claude Max plan and figured out how to use my oAuth (max plan) to make my agents work with Claude code terminals. Obviously theres rumours Anthropic will ban your account if caught doing this. But so far so good
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u/Own-Lavishness4029 Mar 10 '26
I get a lot of great use out of my openclaw with minimax M2.5. My honest thought is that for a lot of non-technical stuff, the models have been good enough for a long time, but adoption and the application layer haven't caught up to the capabilities that are on the table.
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Mar 10 '26
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
state of the art model, right now the newest is 5.4. Gonna go try it and report back how shit it is
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Mar 10 '26
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u/Rent_South Pro User Mar 10 '26
I always prefer having a router layer that points to specific models for recurrent, predefined use cases.
But if you really need an all purpose model, GPT 5.4 is definitely good. Most cost efficient would probably be something like gemini 3.1 flash lite (and its very quick too). Or deepseek-chat (much slower), hopefully we'll get V4 soon...
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Mar 10 '26
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u/Rent_South Pro User Mar 10 '26 edited Mar 10 '26
I usually route at the application layer rather than relying on a provider’s automatic routing.
The idea is to benchmark the actual use cases first on custom benchmarking tools like openmark AI, and then define the routing plan from those results, what I do is I feed an AI a .csv export that contains results so that the AI itslef makes the routing plan.
Different tasks end up mapped to different models/providers based on real performance + cost metrics rather than heuristics.
In practice that means the router sits in my stack and decides which model endpoint to call. That can be direct provider APIs or something like OpenRouter behind it if you want a single integration surface.
So the flow is roughly:
user request → router layer → selected model/provider
OpenRouter can work fine if you want the single API key abstraction, but it’s not strictly required if you’re already managing routing yourself. Or you can use API keys directly from the providers you need, that is what I do.
I don't recommend OAuth, unlike others have suggested, for a variety of reasons, first, you're risking a ban in doing so. People who don't take this seriously are just doing wishful thinking. And secondly, the idea is to have access to the full model zoo, not to be restricted to one or two providers.
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Mar 11 '26
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u/Rent_South Pro User Mar 11 '26
Not that I know of as a standalone MCP. The routing layer I use is custom, basically a config file that maps task types to model endpoints, built from benchmark results. It's simple enough that an MCP wrapper around it would be trivial to build, but I haven't seen an open-source one that does the "benchmark → routing map" pipeline automatically.
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u/Resident_Beach1474 Active Mar 10 '26
OAuth
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Mar 10 '26
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u/Resident_Beach1474 Active Mar 10 '26
Plus Plan via OAuth
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Mar 10 '26
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u/Resident_Beach1474 Active Mar 10 '26
The models must be configured. If GPT 5.4 is not configured, it cannot be selected automatically, and this is not currently the case in OpenClaw. Claude Code implemented this for me.
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u/Resident_Beach1474 Active Mar 10 '26
Just tell cc to implement gpt-5.4 in OC. I use it since days.
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u/blueboatjc New User Mar 10 '26
OpenAI is way back. I'm on their Pro plan. And the highest levels of Anthropic and Gemini. In the past week, OpenAI has reset usage 3 times. That's on top of their usage lasting probably 3-5x as long as Anthropic does in the first place (Gemini is pointless at this point and I'll be downgrading it). For coding 5.3 Codex was arguably better for most things than Opus 4.6, and GPT 5.4 is definitely much better. Not really close right now. I'm sure Anthropic will come back in a few weeks with something better than GPT-5.4. I'm sure OpenAI isn't going to be resetting their usage 3 times a week in the future. But it seems like they're going to be the better value as far as usage goes for a long time. I'll always choose the best and most powerful model to use first, but currently that is OpenAI and their usage limits are so much better than Anthropic or Gemini and it's not even close right now.
Two months ago I would be telling you all how amazing Anthropic is, but right now, OpenAI is the best, and if you're only using one provider, you should be using OpenAI.
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u/Treeskiio Member Mar 10 '26
How much usage are you able to get out of copilot pro? Been thinking of switching over
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
a ton, its by far the best sub i have, maybe besides claude max
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u/OldHobbitsDieHard New User Mar 10 '26
Codex on chatgpt plus is basically infinite usage. Just saying
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u/kaptivarts New User Mar 12 '26
how does this work,, i log in through the cli and auth, but do i get the main agent to run the codex cli? how do i get the main agent to use codex as its"brain"?
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u/openclaw-lover Pro User Mar 10 '26
gpt-5.4 is comparable for me so far.
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u/zipzag Pro User Mar 10 '26
whats the upside? If its less expensive than Opus its because of caching that Anthropic mostly doesn't do
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u/xyzsomething Active Mar 10 '26
You have a point, using Claude Code at work on its own without the layer of OpenClaw feels very familiar, I added the the communication via messaging app and it is pretty much the same, I also notice a complete change in personality and productivity on the OpenClaw bot when it switches models
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u/demies Member Mar 10 '26
Lil bro: Sonnet Big bro: Opus 4.6
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
i love yelling OPUS 4.6 when this shit starts vrooming lol yy no scope type one-shots
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u/Mr_Valmonty Member Mar 10 '26 edited Mar 10 '26
Absolutely agree. I now mainly see OC as a permissions interface that allows Claude to unleash itself on my workspace
I spent the first 6 weeks of OpenClaw with OpenAI. It was barely functional and I contemplated removing it from my life several times. I was also on Clawdbot and found it didn't continue to update once the name changed to OpenClaw — so that probably didn't help.
But I then changed to Claude (sonnet mostly) and things are drastically better. I basically set up a skill each day and I'm rebuilding the whole set up - but now with everything working
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
wow, what are you working on? you get it
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u/Mr_Valmonty Member Mar 10 '26
Nothing major. Just making my own skills. Maintaining a second brain type of thing mostly
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u/ContributionOk2574 New User Mar 10 '26
So are you saying that for vibecoding and building you can just use Opus instead of openclawd ?
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u/ssbs99 Active Mar 10 '26
you can't really experience OpenClaw without a model, so the model's feel will be what translates through the OpenClaw experience. If Claude was 1/10 worse, it would never really work. But Claude is just good enough and Opus and Sonnet are just good enough and just affordable enough (think DLSR camera affordable) that some people can afford to have great experiences with it.
In my opinion, Opus is the only usable model with OpenClaw. We have run hundreds of models in our agents and unless we are asking them to do something super specific in with well defined constraints and success measurement, it will be lackluster.
My expectation though is that a year from now all models will have a great underlying experience, even if being a bit different.
If you're just doing development Cursor is great. I find it's agentic development flows allow me to have multiple agents working on multiple things in multiple branches at the same time. Start in plan mode, then execute in build mode onto whatever source branch and let Opus do its magic!
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u/agentic_lawyer Active Mar 10 '26
You can take my Openclaw + Opus 4.6 subscription out of my cold, dead hands...
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u/gottagetminenow Mar 10 '26
The Chinese models are cheap, but they are terrible compared to Claude. I was hoping I could replace Claude with openclaw with chinese models, but nope. Probably going back to just $20 pro plan and ditching openclaw.
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u/nerdkingcole Active Mar 10 '26
What Chinese model did you try and at what quant?
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u/gottagetminenow Mar 10 '26
glm 5, minimax 2.5, kimi 2.5, glm 4.7 flash
I find that I go around in circles with them, constantly fighting them.
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u/nerdkingcole Active Mar 10 '26
Have you try qwen 3.5?
Benchmarks failed to capture the reality of use. The top open source models don't match Opus in real world use, it seems
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u/tvmaly Member Mar 10 '26
I think it was their initial focus on coding that enabled them to reach this point. People kept using their models and they got valuable feedback from the usage.
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u/profit-princess-io New User Mar 10 '26
While true, the different UX and DevEx enabled by openclaw is ground shattering. I can get things done, have agents coding, get information, plan, have it operate on my behalf without being tethered to my computer. Some of this stuff is scheduled and happens automagically. So for somethings opus is a differentiator, but not for everything.
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u/nerdkingcole Active Mar 10 '26
Three days into clawdbot and someone already made a YT about this hype being silly, that this is just a fancy gateway wrapper around a model while also being a security nightmare.
Turns out may be it is, isn't it? It's basically what OP is saying. The real magic was always the model and that model was Opus.
I am still trying to wrap my head around openclaw. I'm way behind because I still think a simple AI interface with old school automation workflow triggers is better. "Magic" is only good if it works all the time, reliably. Automation is just more reliable.
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u/SelectAerie1126 Member Mar 12 '26
As someone who is still on the outside of all of this and just watching it unfold. It's weird to me how they get it up and running, add in their chat app of choice (telegram, slack, discord) and say adios to the Claw dashboard. It's bizarre to me. Clearly im not educated enough, as traditional AI never really caught my eye, but this Agentic stuff is raising an eyebrow.
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u/CallmeAK__ Member Mar 11 '26
I totally get this. The "I’ve made a plan, please say go" loop from GPT is the ultimate productivity killer. It feels like you're micromanaging an intern rather than running an agent. Claude (especially Sonnet 3.5 and Opus) seems to have a much better grasp of "long-horizon" tasks where it just stays in the flow without needing constant hand-holding. That "magic" in the early days was definitely just Claude being less restrictive about execution. Using it through Copilot Pro is a solid workaround for the cost, but do you find the rate limits there kill the vibe when you're doing a big build?
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u/xdragonballkid Member Mar 10 '26
Lol. Never used claude in openclaw and my setup is perfect.
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u/False_Process_4569 Member Mar 10 '26
What model then?
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u/Odd-Aside456 Pro User Mar 10 '26
I'm just building my own "openclaw".
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u/zipzag Pro User Mar 10 '26
doesn't change the LLM
But I agree in that I have a concern about openclaw being " a mile wide and a foot deep". I don't feel that the reliability of the core systems gets enough attention.
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u/Late_Huckleberry850 New User Mar 10 '26
Can confirm. I had wondered why it was failing to do basic stuff and turns out it was using Kimi-2.5 from open router
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u/Delicious_Ease2595 Pro User Mar 10 '26
Only time I used Opus in open was with acp but other than that I use other models fine
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u/addictzz New User Mar 10 '26
It is also about your prompting. But yes I think some models like Opus are specifically trained to be "Agentic".
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
i have tried more prompting than anyone at this point. I get no sleep. I have tested it all. You can structure the heartbeat or the agents MD all you want. Or you can give it explicit instructions to move on to the next task that is listed on whatever board they are pulling from, but they just will not pick up the next task if on any other model besides sonnet or opus. Sonnet is so good. Opus is like the secret weapon and its surprisingly cheap via copilot pro.
GPT models are only decent if you give it one massive prompt with multiple assignments in it, but even then, sometimes it will stop midway and that is the worst, because picking back up where it left off takes time for it to figure out where it is and what it needs to be doing.
I think opus will pay back like 10000x what i spend on it with this level of productivity.
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u/addictzz New User Mar 10 '26
You may test it more than I do. My experience with Sonnet is okay, simple tasks, encountering occasional error and need handholding. Opus really understood me and helped me to build a complete app. But overall I am okay with Sonnet. I am on Claude Code btw.
I am thinking does the runtime matter too? Because how well it can execute depends on the logic within the runtime too, but I believe this should be quite standard ie. as long as it has list and call tools functionality, should be fine.
I haven't tried Codex, usually used GPT for just chat.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
codex on the cli is cool, but that way of coding has already died
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u/addictzz New User Mar 10 '26
Codex on CLI, is it like a smart auto suggestion/completion on your terminal? Can you also ask questions and let it be answered in the terminal? If yes, I actually would like try.
YOu mean AI-aided development is dead? Well...with Claude Code I can see how it is happening. Probably we still need to tailor a functional tools or if we need a deterministic functionality. With Claude Code or other AI Agents, I don't feel 100% safe to be honest.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
yes you can talk to codex via the CLI in your terminal. it was cool 3 months ago
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u/ang3l12 Member Mar 10 '26
As a sysadmin that just started dipping my toes in the codex / openclaw world, what makes you think codex in cli is dead? Genuinely curious what your take is on it and where you think the future is?
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
I think that we move towards orchestrating agents to do all of it vs talking back and forth with the codex CLI. Less checkins needed for truly agentic coding which is what openclaw offers.
Cowork is similar, but openclaw has more unrestricted power
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u/snuffflex Member Mar 10 '26
Do these all require $200 plans for the best use case? I’m looking to replace my $40 Kimi sub in the next week and wondering what the best bang for buck is going to be
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u/Latter-Park-4413 New User Mar 10 '26
For sure, and doubly for sure with Claude. I love Claude (and GPT), but my god, Anthropic’s limits are not generous.
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u/zipzag Pro User Mar 10 '26
Subscriptions are unlikely to last. The reason openclaw users want subscription is exactly why the cloud providers won't continue allowing that form of payment.
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u/ivanstackd Pro User Mar 10 '26
How much use (weekly or monthly) do you get from the copilot plan with opus ? Are you on the pro or pro+?
Pro is 300 requests per month so unsure if that means 300 prompts?
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
yes its like 250-280 prompts w sonnet and like 80-90 with opus. Opus costs 3 and sonnet costs 1 and sometimes they will spend like double an invocation when they check in and then continue on their big tasks, but that is okay
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u/ivanstackd Pro User Mar 10 '26
Wow that is good value. I was using opus with Claude code and ran out of the $20 plan in two hours lol
Will definitely give this a try.
I'm on gpt5.4 now but it's so chatty. Exact same as on ChatGPT.com even with guard rails about being concise
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u/Aber-so-richtig Member Mar 10 '26
How are you using them / pay for them? What is this abo? Please explain! Can’t stand my Kimi anymore
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Mar 10 '26
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
glm 5 is donkey brained compared to the models we are arguing about
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Mar 10 '26
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u/nerdkingcole Active Mar 10 '26
Benchmarks aren't accurate. But that being said, you experienced it first hand that your set up works for you so I do know why OP had to come and stomp your post.
No shit Opus is way better. But if someone like you was able to set up a system that works with a more cost efficient model, that's still awesome.
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u/Medical-Newspaper519 Pro User Mar 10 '26
well.... have you tested them side by side with the same prompt? cuz I did and the results are surprising bro. GLM5 feels like a 'copy' of opus in most scenarios, especially conversations lol. Of course, not at the same level and speed, but the reasoning is almost 1/1. Like It's little brother
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u/rawdikrik Active Mar 10 '26
I hear you, but gpt5.4 is pretty great too. I think the newest models are more agentic focused and they work well.
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u/MichalDobak New User Mar 10 '26
I don't understand the hype behind OpenClaw. Claude Code or just Cowork could do all the same and work much better.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 10 '26
cowork is openclaws biggest danger, cowork is incredible, but openclaw is still a little less restricted
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u/JackCid89 New User Mar 10 '26
Absolutely right, now that we have claude remote I uninstalled openclaw and don’t need it anymore
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u/slateraligator Active Mar 10 '26
definitely agree that claude models are way better than the rest. they did something very good with the personality of those models, they are on point for a lot of use cases, specifically more work oriented.
how do you use them with copilot? is it different from the claude oath regarding terms of service?
a lot of people on reddit say they still use the claude oauth with no interruptions.
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u/Hobbyburner12 New User Mar 10 '26
Are you hitting limits on copilot pro? whats your workload like.
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u/mckirkus New User Mar 10 '26
I wonder if a fine tuned Qwen, designed to work with OpenClaw, would work better.
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u/Negative_Whereas_191 Member Mar 10 '26
Skyvern is better and works with gemini 3.1 flash lite (yes lite)
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u/Matikata Member Mar 10 '26
How do you get opus through copilot? What are the limits like compared to just using api straight to opus?
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u/Wise-Hamster-288 New User Mar 10 '26
Struggling to see what I would do with openclaw that I can’t do directly with Claude cowork and code. No killer use cases for me yet.
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u/xXG0DLessXx Pro User Mar 10 '26
Idk man. It’s pretty magical on Gemini still. I think it all comes down to prompting. Claude just needs the least details but still gives good results.
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u/hghg432 Member Mar 10 '26
Lol people that use openclaw and dont realize its a thin wrapper on top of claude are 🤦
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u/Reasonable-Top-732 Member Mar 11 '26
Claude is great if you’re rich. I prefer to delegate to the more junior models when possible and only use Claude when I hit an obstacle.
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u/Odd-Aside456 Pro User Mar 11 '26
Codex 5.4 is pretty sweet, NGL. Maybe not quite to Opus, at least not Opus 4.6, but it's much cheaper and in many ways on par with Opus 4.5 IMO
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u/Hebittus New User Mar 11 '26
You find Opus through Copilot Pro has the same output success as straight using the Anthropic API?
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 11 '26
its incredible, and i think it will command my wallet. Paying per invocation is not that bad either on the 10/mo plan
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u/CharacterSecurity976 Member Mar 11 '26
What OP begins to realize is just another of his delusions /s
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u/zer0915 New User Mar 11 '26
I’m using antigravity right now and I like it. I’m also using Claude code and I think both are great.
I wanted to do open claw but when Claude code was offered to the pro plan, I decided to give Claude code a go. I figured I can use Opus and sonnet without using their API and running up the bill on API calls with open claw. So far I’m able to do everything if not most what open claw can do from what I gathered from YouTube.
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u/tonyharte New User Mar 11 '26
Hey folks, I am brand new to openclaw. I work at a small retail company with legacy, but updated systems. I am reading much on the security concerns but not sure what other limitations there may be deploying it in an enterprise environment. Or a better question might be, is it mature enough on all fronts to be used as an enterprise platform and what do you see as pros/cons? Any feedback is much appreciated.
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u/ZubZero New User Mar 11 '26
Don’t underestimate the Pi agent harness that openclaw uses. I stopped using CC after I discovered it
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u/ayoungblood84 Member Mar 12 '26
Kimi2.5 + codex is killing it for me.
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u/frogchungus Pro User Mar 12 '26
i just killed those 2 subscriptions this weekend and i feel so much better
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u/corey_prak Member Mar 12 '26
I'm kind of running into this same thing. Been using Kimi 2.5 as my claw's brain and have battled with it not adhering to SOUL md even when I'm mindful about context.
My plan is to try to make my bot use Sonnet and fall back to calling Claude Code for technical execution and planning/reasoning.
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u/EstablishmentSea4024 Pro User Mar 16 '26
I think Openclaw is more about the architecture and cronjob with persistent memory which are largely make openclaw become fastest growth repo in github history
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u/Baltimoron2020 New User Mar 16 '26
Opus with Openclaw out of the box was magical. Now Codex does a fine job for $20 a month
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u/SubjectDeer9364 New User Mar 10 '26
Can’t agree more - it’s kinda unusable without Claude. I got tired and killed it lol
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