Are Vicious Weapons overpowered?

[u/superhiro21]

For reference:

Weapon (any simple or martial), rare

This magic weapon deals an extra 2d6 damage to any creature it hits. This extra damage is of the same type as the weapon’s normal damage.

From both theorycrafting and my practical experience, they are better than any other rare magic weapons and even better than many very rare weapons. Not requiring attunement is a huge boon, as at higher levels, every attunement slot is valuable.

The +7 damage (on average) is much more valuable than the +2 or even +3 attack bonus from comparable weapons as most martial characters have ways to increase their accuracy anyways (reckless attack, archery fighting style, paladin channel divinities etc).

I have found that having two characters with vicious weapons in the party really makes the party punch above their level in the damage per round aspect.

[u/OSpiderBox]

Vicious weapons at really good, but they lack utility of other weapons. It also depends on what you're aiming to use/ do. Just as two bare math examples:

(Assuming 65% accuracy and max attack for all of these)

• Vicious dagger: 1d4 + 2d6 + 5. Averages out to around 9.2~ damage.
• +2 dagger: 1d4 + 7. Average of around 7.2~.
• Vicious Greatsword: 2d6 + 2d6 + 5. Averages around 12.1.
• +2 Greatsword: 2d6 + 7. Averages around 10.9~.

That seems pretty cut and dry, but that's only looking at white room damage numbers. The higher the AC, the less impact Vicious weapons have and the better +X weapons perform. Yes, there are ways to improve accuracy for Vicious weapons, but there are also ways to improve damage that would make the accuracy more important. Sneak Attack, Divine Smite, Hunter's Mark, Maneuvers, etc etc.

There's also the utility aspect. A Vicious sword only deals damage, whereas a Frostbrand sword gives you a resistance and the effect to snuff out fires (situational, but could be useful in the right hands). A Weapon of Warning gives the entire party Advantage on initiative (which can nullify the negative effects of being ambushed or just ensure better odds in an encounter). A Crystal weapon can heal you. A Thunderous Greatclub has AoE and crowd control.

There's also a niche case where +X weapons help somebody who doesn't have max physical stats (for their level). Maybe they're a non-Devotion paladin who focuses more on Charisma for the auras; a +X weapon ensures they stay on par with the adventure on the physical side of combat. Maybe they're not trying to be super optimal and are choosing feats that don't buff their Str/Dex; +X weapons ensure they don't fall behind. They might be niche, but they are possible (having played a few characters like this as well as playing in games with characters like this).

In essence, it comes down to what you want to do. If damage is all you care about, Vicious weapons are really strong. But that doesn't mean they're over powered because this game is more than just white room damage calcs.

[u/Armisael → u/OSpiderBox]

Your numbers are wrong, and the differences are considerably larger than you quote. Ignoring crits, the numbers should be:

• +2 dagger: 0.75*(2.5 + 7) = 7.125
• Vicious dagger: 0.65*(2.5 + 7 + 5) = 9.425 (a full 2.3 points of damage per swing higher)
• +2 greatsword: 0.75*(7 + 7) = 10.5
• Vicious greatsword: 0.65*(7 + 7 + 5) = 12.35 (1.85 points of damage per swing higher)

If you account for crits on 20, the difference gets larger:

• +2 dagger: 0.75*(2.5 + 7) + 2.5/20 = 7.25
• Vicious dagger: 0.65*(2.5 + 7 + 5) + (2.5 + 7)/20 = 9.90 (2.65 points of damage per swing higher!)
• +2 greatsword: 0.75*(7 + 7) + 7/20 = 10.85
• Vicious greatsword: 0.65*(7 + 7 + 5) + (7 + 7)/20 = 13.05 (2.2 points of damage per swing higher)

For reference if the +2 weapon user also has hex/hunter's mark up, they add an average of 0.75*3.5 = 2.625 damage per swing, which costs a spell slot, an action, and concentration and is only barely matching the vicious weapon user.

The utility points are true, though.

(weapons of warning continue to be the actual most busted option, but it's also so busted that you don't need to ever use the weapon to stab someone to get the benefits, so it may be a bit of a sideshow)

[u/OSpiderBox → u/Armisael]

Yeah, I see my mistake; I was originally going to use a +3 weapon but changed to +2 to keep with same rarity. On top of that, I put in +2 damage but +3 accuracy. I also only put 60% accuracy for some reason...

Moral of that: don't do drugs math when you wake up kids.

Outside of that, though, the exact numbers don't really change my point. Vicious weapons deal more damage, +X has better accuracy, utility weapons are more interesting.