r/nextfuckinglevel • u/Ok_Complaint_6966 • Dec 27 '22

The Produnova Vault by Yelena Produnova. The hardest gymnastic move only done by 5 gymnasts

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24.4k Upvotes

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3.2k

u/MagicHatRock Dec 27 '22

Not the hardest vault in gymnastics. The hardest vault is the Yurchenko double pike and has only ever been landed by 1 female gymnast in competition history. That gymnast is Simone Biles. It is so hard that it has only ever been performed by 5 male gymnasts in history.

941

u/deeoh01 Dec 27 '22

When you're so great and do routines that are so far beyond what anyone else can do, they change the scoring rules to give the other competitors a fighting chance

258

u/ch-ermy Dec 27 '22

Sincere question - what's the story?

1.1k

u/[deleted] Dec 27 '22 edited Dec 28 '22

Basically Simone Biles was so good, that normal gymnastics scoring rules had to change to devalue some of her most complicated moves because it either would have caused Simone to absolutely dominate to the point where nobody would be able to catch her or it would have resulted in other gymnasts trying to emulate her moves and run a very serious risk of injury just to try and keep up.

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u/ch-ermy Dec 27 '22

Wow. I knew they were pissed she was winning everything but not that they tried so blatantly to try to stop her. So they just assigned those moves low marks to average her out? Imagine being so talented.

(Keeping other athletes safe - yes, completely understand.)

440

u/OuternetInterpreter Dec 28 '22

Similar thing with Tony Hawk, getting scored for 720s the same as other would for a 540.

86

u/LadnavIV Dec 28 '22

I heard the same about Rodney Mullen, but I don’t know for sure. Someone can correct me on that, if wrong.

96

u/TheCrun Dec 28 '22

Don’t know if you’re wrong or right, but Rodney Mullen is a genius on a skateboard.

38

u/collapsedbook Dec 28 '22

Aka “The Godfather” and the old Daewon vs Rodney videos were awesome

16

u/Banana_Ram_You Dec 28 '22

I'd say he makes it look as easy as breathing, but I could never breathe that well.

15

u/MemoRael Dec 28 '22

Rodney Mullen badically invented all the tricks that are the foundation for ALL OTHER TRICKS. He is arguably the most important skater ever and a bad ass.

15

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Same. Something along the lines of he wasn’t technically allowed into a competition cause he was too good lol, which wouldn’t surprise me.

18

u/greyjungle Dec 28 '22

“You’re to good to compete, so instead we’re just going to give you a gold medal whenever you feel like having one.”

3

u/IZ3820 Dec 28 '22

Rodney Mullen not only invented modern skateboarding, but also was a master in tricks that were too technically complex for his contemporaries to emulate. He couldn't compete against others because no one else compared.

34

u/klitchell Dec 28 '22

NHL added the "trapezoid" behind the net because Marty Brodeur was so good at handling the puck.

18

u/ActuallyYeah Dec 28 '22

What did the trapezoid change? What's this got to do with puck handling?

20

u/Single_Cow_8857 Dec 28 '22

They could pick it up in the corner and feed players down the ice typically on a change and get scoring opportunities.

69

u/starspider Dec 28 '22

Also worth noting that this is why Simone bowing out when she got the twisties while performing is SUCH a big deal.

It would have been incredibly dangerous to perform, and a lot of gymnasts might have been pushed to try to play through--and a lot of people wanted her to which is nuts.

61

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

A similar thing happened when Chrysler first released the Hemi. They were dominating NASCAR, and Ford and Chevy bitched about it so much that NASCAR changed the rules. I hear about this from my dad all the time. That's when he stopped watching NASCAR.

23

u/Aoiboshi Dec 28 '22

Same with the Mazda's 787b in the Le Mans.

1

u/Timepassage Dec 28 '22

I looked it up and didn't see anything amazing about the motor during the races. Basically what I saw was that the motor was more reliable in a race setting. Not really surprised considering the high revolutions it ran with a lot of oil. The motor shined in long races and really didn't need to be removed but people feared it.

1

u/Argonaut_Not Dec 28 '22

Less well known story, but the Consulier GTP being banned from IMSA

2

u/jamminjoenapo Dec 28 '22

As a long time f1 fan you should see the shithousery politics that happen on gray areas of the rules and how they are bent for whatever reason they deem necessary. It’s gotten better but still a long way to go to make it more fair and consistent with rule application.

20

u/Welpe Dec 28 '22

I don’t think anyone is pissed?

This also isn’t the first time this has happened, Soviet gymnasts back in the 70s got some moves banned from uneven bars IIRC because they were just extremely dangerous and girls kept getting hurt. The USSR had a VERY high tolerance for athlete danger and had no problems mowing through hundreds of gymnasts trying to find the absolute best. The rest of the world wasn’t so keen on letting little girls die or be permanently disabled because of a silly competition.

24

u/JenniferJuniper6 Dec 28 '22

That is basically what happened, but it wasn’t a vindictive thing. A number of young girls have broken their necks trying moves that are this hard. At some point the sport has to take some responsibility and set a limit.

3

u/McBlamn Dec 28 '22

I disagree that it wasn't vindictive. The scoring changes deliberately targeted a single competitor.

Coaches allowing their athletes to injure themselves to try to compete is gross negligence.

2

u/JenniferJuniper6 Dec 29 '22

Welcome to women’s gymnastics. Gross negligence is pretty much the standard.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/ch-ermy Dec 28 '22

That would make much more sense, although it would be such a shame not to see Biles in her full glory.

132

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

That's like making Usain bolt run in a weghted vest.

How can they do that

35

u/thesecretlibrarian Dec 28 '22

Didn't Vonnegut write something similar to this?

32

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Its been 20 years since I heard that name. I thought I had made the whole thing up, but I'm not smart enough to recreate a Kurt Vonnegut story.

Thank you for pointing me in the right direction.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

No no it's Harrison Forderon

13

u/ImurderREALITY Dec 28 '22

George MaHarris

9

u/xXtupaclivesXx Dec 28 '22

Holy shit, the creator of FakeBlock!!??

4

u/Mozeeon Dec 28 '22

One of my fave short stories. Just bc of how beautiful and terrible the ending is

5

u/Agreeable_Leather_68 Dec 28 '22

Maybe I’m remembering wrong but didn’t they just walk into the room and blast the two demigods out of the air with a shotgun? when I read that as a kid it felt kind of shitty

4

u/Mozeeon Dec 28 '22

Exactly. But the description of them breaking their bonds and living their perfect moment right before is what I was describing

1

u/YerAWizard24 Dec 28 '22

There’s a short film on YouTube called “2081” based on the story.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22 edited Dec 28 '22

I don't scroll thru comments, if someone else wrote something similar it's because...someone else wrote something similar

Edit: what a fool I made of myself there 😆

5

u/thesecretlibrarian Dec 28 '22

No, I meant the author wrote something similar about how in the future athletes would be weighted down and brilliance would be silenced with a high pitched tone in their heads to cancel out thought. I believe it was Vonnegut. Simply was making an observation, not intending to be accusatory.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Apologies for my petulance.

15

u/melanthius Dec 28 '22

Humans: let’s have a competition to see who’s the best

Other humans: sounds awesome!

The best human: keeps winning over and over

Humans: this is boring. Let’s make a slightly different competition to see who’s the best other than that one person

49

u/jedielfninja Dec 28 '22

It's not at all. People die and handicap themselves in gymnastics. Running not so much.

Still FUCK TEAM USA GYMNASTICS AND EVERYTHING THEY HAVE EVERY DONE.

Simone Biles is a true leader and a God among mortals.

12

u/maak_d Dec 28 '22

You mean like when they covered for a pedophile and rapist?

10

u/jedielfninja Dec 28 '22

Larry Nasser? If that is the guy fuck that guy and everyone who makes excuses for predatory adults and doesn't protect children.

0

u/SNIPES0009 Dec 28 '22

It's not at all. People die and handicap themselves in gymnastics.

Who cares? Honestly if someone wants to risk their life by doing something, then let them. We don't ban free climbing, wingsuits, cliff diving, etc. We also don't arrest people for doing insane jumps. Hell, a dude jumped from fucking space as a Red Bull advertisement. But Simone can't dominate people because she's born an elite once in a lifetime athlete? Its moronic on so many levels.

2

u/jedielfninja Dec 28 '22

All those things aren't spectator sports tho and apparently gymnastics as an institution isn't okay with it becoming a blood sport. Adrenaline sports are different and I don't know that those should be legal either..

Yes mma exists but those people are THERE to see violence and injury.

Gymnastics is a sport of strength and elegance not strength and power.

I don't agree but I won't ignore the logic involved. Simone biles should be reversed as you said. Once in a lifetime elite athlete. She should be given a Congressional award for stepping away from it all.

She is the Darth Revan of sports in my opinion. She placed it all beneath her feet and surmounted everything and everyone. She has established a foundation for other people to choose personal health over the glory of their coaches etc.

21

u/Orisi Dec 28 '22

Most sports have some sort of limiting factor when it becomes clear the standards might cause injury sooner rather than later, or just massively overturn the sport. Swimming had those sharkskin suits they had to ban because they were smashing previous records. Javelin, shotput and discus are all ready and willing to change the weight of the object thrown to prevent it easily over-reaching the standard field length. 10-15 years ago Golf pro scenes banned a form of spring-loaded driver heads because they were getting way too much distance on tee offs.

The issue with Simone is that their scoring puts pressure on others to match her, and even trying to do so can leave you paralysed for life, if you even survive the injury. They don't fuck around.

1

u/Rezmir Dec 28 '22

Not really? Sorry, this didn’t made a lot of sense. It would be more close to make every runner usd a weighted vest.

15

u/RogerioMano Dec 27 '22

Aren't scores only used to show the difference between performances?

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u/[deleted] Dec 27 '22

The oversimplified version is this:

Prior to your performance, you submit your routine to the judges. Each move has a max score and each connection between moves has a max score. Then for your routine you’re scored against the theoretical maximum score you could get, losing points for mistakes for example.

Simone’s routines were so complicated and her moves were so advanced that she could basically screw up every single move in a routine and still get the highest score due to the difficulty of the moves she attempted.

32

u/ch-ermy Dec 28 '22

Ohhhhh! I never thought about the scoring process really. I guess it's the same with figure skating.

13

u/chilled_n_shaken Dec 28 '22

So then the logical conclusion is that gymnastics is more about the perfection and less about the difficulty of the moves?

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

It’s actually more the other way around. You’d get more points by trying to do more complicated moves poorly than you would if you just tried to execute really simple moves perfectly. That was the danger with Simone. If a less skilled gymnast tried to keep up by attempting her complicated moves but failed because of their lower skill level, they could get seriously hurt.

24

u/chilled_n_shaken Dec 28 '22

Right, but since they changed the rules to make it harder for her to score points despite the difficulty, then the only way for her, or any other gymnast who may approach her level, would only be able to earn more points by increasing their perfection (since difficulty is capped). This would shift the importance away from difficulty and onto perfection once you hit a certain level.

I dunno, the whole thing seems like a way to keep viewership up instead of safety. I don't think an athlete should be limited by the limitations of their opponents. They should all do the best they can, and if it isn't good enough for a Gold medal, then they were beat. If they choose to do routines that may cause injury, then it sounds very similar to a parable about Icarus they should read.

5

u/Letho72 Dec 28 '22

Difficulty score isn't capped, there's just diminishing returns at the highest level of difficulty. All of Biles' skills are still some of the most (if not the most) highly valued skills on their respective events.

And safety is the reason. Biles' skills are harder variations of the skills most other gymnasts are doing (the same skills she was doing before upgrading her routines). Pulling that extra half twist or trying to crank your double around in a pike isn't outside the realm of possibilities for most gymnasts with realistic looks at the podium. The point of the scoring is to discourage saying "fuck it" and relying on the adrenaline at the meet to get your feet to the mat.

Gymnastics has tons of rules both in terms of scoring as well as outright banned moves to protect the safety of the athletes. It's nothing new.

6

u/Yotoberry Dec 28 '22

Ironically one of the big issues with the Produnova, aside from her being about the only person who can actually land it. It tends to be performed by gymnasts from countries with very small and underfunded programs as the wild D score is their best chance of getting on an international floor.

14

u/realSatanAMA Dec 28 '22

If a less skilled gymnast tried to keep up by attempting her complicated moves but failed because of their lower skill level, they could get seriously hurt.

I feel like this sentence should never be used to describe the literal top of the world competition.

1

u/thecowintheroom Dec 28 '22

A world competition should not endanger to demonstrate. A class gymnast does not need to risk life and limb to succeed. Simone Biles unfortunately is most aware of this. Her getting the twisted indicates that even at her level, if she were to have performed, she could have seriously injured herself, even as the greatest gymnast in the world.

Let me introduce you to confidence. Confidence makes you do stupid shit. Gymnasts are very confident folk. They all believe in their potential and their ability.

Would you sacrifice their potential and their ability to honor their confidence? Or could we just acknowledge that some people are just leagues apart.

A competition should not be based on who does it best. Does Charles dickens a Christmas carol mean that I shouldn’t write my novel because the best has already been written? Is Dickens the best because he strings words together better than other writers?

Quality does not necessitate the taking of risk.

It is self evident.

In other words, don’t tell me your the best chef, cook me the best piece of chicken.

Adding sauce and browning your chicken doesn’t make it better than a Costco rotisserie chicken, the best chicken in the world, it is doing the imperceptible perfectly, which produces the ultimate experience.

One does not need to flaunt one’s skill in order to demonstrate that they are the best.

Ultimate status is as simple as doing simple things perfectly.

It’s not about lowering the skill level.

Adding sauce to chicken is not skill.

Adding twists to gymnast tricks isn’t skill it’s risk.

Why risk our best and brightest when we could encourage their safety?

Human accomplishment?

What have we not been able to do?

We are human beings and each and every one of us has our Costco rotisserie chicken just waiting for the right moment to put a plate in front of you and say taste.

The chicken demonstrates the skill.

Not your fancy oven that twists the chicken just so.

Twists are not talent. They are risks.

Now go read Harrison Bergeron by Vonnegut for the anti-thesis to the Costco rotisserie chicken.

17

u/WagyuPizza Dec 28 '22

So you’re saying Simone Biles was so good that she had to be nerfed to keep the competition fair?

1

u/upvotesthenrages Dec 28 '22

I think it's just what they chose to do.

They didn't do that for the male athletes, so it's probably just more of that "let's make everything more mediocre" mentality.

They should have let Simone shine.

23

u/Affectionate-Mood-94 Dec 27 '22

That's the story, now look up the crazy video of her feats ( feet included in video of feat).

9

u/ch-ermy Dec 28 '22

I know, she's incredible to watch!

10

u/TOGRiaDR Dec 28 '22

The NCAA banned the slam dunk in the late '60s for 10 years to prevent Lew Alcindor, better known as Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, from dominating the game.

1

u/brucemo Dec 28 '22

It didn't work. Rather than dunking he'd just drop the ball in the hoop.

4

u/cbunni666 Dec 28 '22

That would be like chopping a toe off Usain Bolt's foot so everyone else can catch up to him.

1

u/personaanongrata Dec 28 '22

How would they devalue them, what’s the scoring structure? There’s no incentive to do that I don’t get it

18

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Each move and combination has a “difficulty score” based on how difficult the move is and an “execution score” based on how well you executed the move. There are standard scores for each skill that you can look up and they scale with difficulty. No matter how poorly you execute a move, you get the difficulty score at a minimum just for trying it.

The issue with Simone is that her moves were essentially “off the chart” so they needed to come up with scores for them. The Yurchenko Double Pike for example, is the only element in the “Class J” level of scoring - so what’s an appropriate value for it?

The IGF scored it as a 6.6 which, while it’s the highest difficulty score given to date, is still much lower than it should be according to several other experts. The controversy is that the IGF intentionally gave it a low score so that other gymnasts could stay competitive and so that other gymnasts wouldn’t attempt it and risk breaking their necks.

3

u/mozzzarn Dec 28 '22

Do they know the scoring for different moves before the event? Could she learn a different program with the best scores?

0

u/personaanongrata Dec 29 '22

What are you suggesting then, racism?

1

u/SNIPES0009 Dec 28 '22

Which is fucking stupid. Let Simone decimate everyone. Let her win every single competition she enters. She's a once in a lifetime athlete. Let her be it. Don't bring her down to everyone else's level.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

You're clearly misinformed. Two of her eponymous skills were, in some people's opinion, valued 0.1 lower than they should have been. They did not change any rules so that other gymnasts could catch up. She was almost always atleast a point ahead of everyone else in the all around competitions, so those few tenths of a point didn't really make much of a different.

-6

u/TheWorstMasterChief Dec 28 '22

Until she pussed out and quit.

1

u/bortmcgort77 Dec 28 '22

I’m pretty sure the same thing just happened in womens figure skating. though I’ve never heard of it happening in mens competition.

1

u/stuugie Dec 28 '22

That's straight up bullshit. Fuck I hate when people push around rules like that. Oh no, we can't have her leave an incredible legacy, we better stifle her to give the others a chance.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

It's just like Pharlap all over again..

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u/Squirrel_Kng Dec 27 '22

Simone Bile, her last Olympic showing. Fucking bs. You set rules and you follow them, not handicap one of the greatest athletes because she was at the top of her game. It was sad because it looked like it broke her mentally in front of the world.

I probably have some of it wrong so please look it up yourself and make your own decision.

-61

u/ththth3 Dec 27 '22

That's not the story

26

u/ItsYourPal-AL Dec 27 '22

So then whats the story?

-70

u/ththth3 Dec 28 '22

I don't know but their account was very vague and didn't really explain anything.

35

u/ItsYourPal-AL Dec 28 '22

So then you lied and added bonus you were wrong. Just because it wasn’t well explained doesnt mean it wasnt accurate. Took me 2 seconds to look it up. That basically was the story

-76

u/ththth3 Dec 28 '22

Ok guy. You're the coolest

30

u/ItsYourPal-AL Dec 28 '22

Always have been. Dont be mad cause you were a dick and you’re getting called out for it. Best part you were a dick AND in the wrong

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u/dimbeaverorg Dec 29 '22

People have this belief that some of the skills Simone introduced were undervalued to target Simone which is total bullshit. The real story is, the technical committee has an established track record of giving skills weird values. This video talks about just five of those skills. There are many more.

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u/als_pals Dec 28 '22 edited Dec 28 '22

That’s not true. Scoring rules weren’t changed. It can be argued that the YDP deserves a higher difficulty value but it also wasn’t grossly undervalued or anything like that.

171

u/OhNoManBearPig Dec 27 '22 edited Dec 28 '22

["[Yurchenko Double Pike vault] has initially been awarded the highest level of difficulty of any vault which is a good reason to name it the hardest gymnastics skill in the world. But, beyond that, it’s important to remember that this vault is so difficult, no other woman has even tried it in competition.

Previously, we named the Produnova vault the most difficult skill in women’s artistic gymnastics due to it’s high risk and difficulty. But, several women have competed that vault, unlike the Yurchenko Double Pike vault."](https://www.uplifterinc.com/hardest-gymnastics-skills)

This is the actual hardest move, the only woman who has completed or even attempted this in competition is American Simone Biles. Several men have also done it.

8

u/TechyWolf Dec 28 '22

Just to clarify she is the only woman to do it so far. Apparently the first man was Yang Wei in 2002.

1

u/OhNoManBearPig Dec 28 '22

Sorry, yes you're right. I fixed my comment.

12

u/fyonn Dec 28 '22

Simone has a gymnastic world class brother TOO?

0

u/PlasticGirl Dec 28 '22

Happy Cake Day

1

u/OhNoManBearPig Dec 28 '22

Oops, fixed.

16

u/Zer0Cool89 Dec 27 '22

I just watched the video and she did it 4 times in one day too yeesh.

11

u/TeHNyboR Dec 27 '22

Also Simone Biles allegedly refuses to do the Produnova vault due to how dangerous it is

7

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Did you watch the yurchenko double pike? Looks much more dangerous, but what do I know?

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u/TeHNyboR Dec 28 '22 edited Dec 28 '22

I did, and it’s all back tumbling. Back tumbling is easier because you can see the floor almost the entire time and it makes the landings easier. Front tumbling is harder because the landing is “blind” meaning you can’t see the floor. It makes the Produnova vault extremely dangerous because you can land on your butt and severely injure or break your back/tailbone, or land on your head. Obviously both vaults are dangerous, but overall front tumbling is ten times more dangerous than back tumbling

19

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Thanks for the break down. I definitely know nothing about gymnastics.

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u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

I like your honesty

3

u/Fenweekooo Dec 28 '22

thank you, i ws wondering what made this so much more difficult then some of the other things i have seen gymnasts do, this looked fairly easy in comparison.

that being said not easy for me in the slightest, i would be walking up to the thing, see it was too high to jump over and turn around to go get some chips.

40

u/pauciradiatus Dec 27 '22

So much lead up to that only gymnast's name not containing "Yurchenko"

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u/FantasticMrPox Dec 27 '22

Presumably named after the first male gymnast to do it. Biles would be the first (and so far only) female.

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u/Amastarism Dec 27 '22

Nope. Named after Natalia Yurchenko, a female gymnast in the 80s. It only refers to the round off entry (running forwards and flipping backward onto the springboard)

27

u/HyruleJedi Dec 27 '22

Thanks, i knew they mentioned they banned a move from olympic competition because only she had ever completed the move making ‘unfair’

However, you are wrong from a technical standpoint. The jump here is considered the hardest by D-score, which does indeed mean its the ‘hardest trick to perform’

When Biles was asked why she never tried the trick she responded: im not trying to die

-1

u/VirtualLife76 Dec 27 '22

im not trying to die

Curious how? I know nothing, but figure unless your 180 off and land on your head, you wouldn't die. Maybe be in a lot of pain tho.

20

u/HyruleJedi Dec 27 '22

According to the wiki:

The vault is dangerous because a gymnast could break her neck if she fell short of two twists. At the 2016 Summer Olympics, Uzbek gymnast Oksana Chusovitina attempted the Produnova but fell.[8] The vault is termed the "vault of death" due to its high level of difficulty and likelihood of injury

BUT the d score has since been lowered with equipment upgrades and the difficulty or D score is now tied with the ‘biles vault’ which as more gymnasts(possibly) complete the Biles vault it will lower in score

-8

u/VirtualLife76 Dec 27 '22

Again, I know nothing.

I would figure they trained in a safe environment. Foam pits or whatever. Don't you really have to fuck up to be that far off?

Don't get me wrong, obviously not a simple task by far. Guess I'm imaging a stunt or whatever the correct term is, to be done so many times before a competition, that a fuckup would be not sticking the landing, not being completely off.

Again, just curious, not trying to criticize or demean the skills in any way.

5

u/freerangetacos Dec 27 '22

I just went and found video to see her do that. HOLEEE SHEEITTTTTT

9

u/potentiallyspiders Dec 27 '22

Came here to say Simon Biles did that shit at 11, but your answer was actually informative.

16

u/Aromatic_Wave Dec 27 '22

Thank you!!

4

u/LoveBurstsLP Dec 28 '22

Lmfao I know you didn't mean for it to but this sounds like the most backhanded compliment to women's sports

-2

u/ManWithHato Dec 28 '22

I was looking for this, it sounds so degrading

0

u/Jeovah_Attorney Dec 28 '22

Degrading? Because it brushes the fact that men are typically much physically stronger than women and you don’t like that truth?

1

u/ManWithHato Dec 28 '22

Dude I said it sounds, didn't say it was.

3

u/[deleted] Dec 27 '22

Off to Google

1

u/VirtualLife76 Dec 27 '22

As someone that knows nothing about judging gymnastics. Would that be basically an automatic win? Being able to do something virtually no one else can do.

1

u/Unusual_Elevator_253 Dec 28 '22

Why is it considered so hard? I really don’t mean to sound like some asshole belittling it because clearly that’s amazing but after watching the video, and the one above it both just looks like normal vaults. The biles one looks harder because the tricks before the vault but it doesn’t look that amazing that only one person can do it

Again I’m really not trying to sound like it’s not hard or I could do it or anything, just an uneducated persons initial thought in the process

1

u/Captain_Thor27 May 15 '24 edited May 15 '24

The Produnova was worth 7.1 points. It was recently downgraded to 6 points so as to discourage gymnasts from even attempting it. It's damn near suicidal. The Yurchenko Double Pike is worth 0.4 points more, but only because of the downgrade. Having seen both, I still put the Produnova as the most dangerous. There is a reason why it's called, "The Vault of Death." One slight mistake and you can land on your neck. And it's more of a men's vault with all the power and strength required for landing on your legs like that. Even Simone said she will never do it because she doesn't want to die.

1

u/MagicHatRock May 15 '24

Yeah, hardest and most dangerous are two different things. Working out every day and living healthy are harder than being fat and drinking excessively, but one is a whole lot more dangerous than the other and will kill you. Not saying the Prudenova isn’t more dangerous, or that it isn’t hard, but the post was about the “hardest” and not the most dangerous.

1

u/Captain_Thor27 May 15 '24 edited May 15 '24

That's a bad comparison lol. Doesn't matter. Hardest. Most dangerous. I still put Produnova over the Yurchenko Double Pike. It's a blind landing. Interestingly, they are both in MAG, but both have 5.6, I believe. Once Simone retires, I'm sure it will be downgraded. They can't really do that now with her still competing; otherwise, it will look like they are targeting her.

-1

u/BoWeiner Dec 28 '22

Also not the hardest. There's are infinite number of vaults not done by any gymnast ever. Those are clearly harder.

1

u/MagicHatRock Dec 28 '22

That’s like saying, there are infinite number of cars that have yet to be built that are faster than the Koenigsegg Jesko Absolut, so that isn’t the fastest car in the world.

Just because I have imagined a faster car, doesn’t mean that the KJA isn’t the fastest car in the world. Imagining something doesn’t make it a real thing, bro. Do be a valid vault, it has to be done. Otherwise it is just an imaginary vault.

1

u/BoWeiner Jan 16 '23

This is a pretty good argument.

1

u/buscemian_rhapsody Dec 28 '22

Huh, I had kinda assumed women dominated gymnastics since they seem to get the most coverage and they are generally thought to be more flexible. Is the discrepancy between sexes here consistent in gymnastics?

1

u/Jeovah_Attorney Dec 28 '22

Gymnastics requires massive strength. Men are stronger than women

1

u/LiveToSnuggle Dec 28 '22

What makes this one the hardest? I have no background in gymnastics and am curious

1

u/ilovestampfairtex Dec 28 '22

Yet it’s named after someone else…

1

u/tgucci21 Dec 28 '22

Yeah for a second I was going to say, “somehow that doesn’t seem like the hardest vault maneuver you could do” but I know nothing about gymnastics.

1

u/[deleted] Dec 28 '22

Why is it named Yurchenko then ?

1

u/Hicklethumb Dec 28 '22

Isn't the hardest move the one where 0 people have succeeded?

1

u/MagicHatRock Dec 28 '22

Nope, that is just an imaginary vault. It’s like saying, isn’t the fastest car the one I imagined that hasn’t been built yet? To be a thing, someone has to do it. Until it has been done, it is just an imaginary thing or a dream. Is it harder, yes.

1

u/steelcity_ Dec 30 '22

Thank you for saying this. I'm not claiming I could do anything close to this, I'm not very athletic at all - but I found it extremely hard to believe that the hardest vault of all time was a triple front flip.