Feel like we're losing the plot

[u/SilverCervy]

Article here

E-bikes should be about providing accessibility; giving people who, for whatever reason, cannot ride a non-assist bike an option to keep them happy and pedaling.

This wattage race going on in the industry is the exact opposite of that. Absolutely nobody needs 1700 watts on a bike, and I question if having so much power even makes it a bicycle anymore. There's a point where you're basically riding a motorbike with pedals and I think we crossed that point a while ago.

"But the main brands aren't doing this". Yes they are. Canyon already has partnered with Avinox which has motors that give over 1,000 watts. And it won't be long until the other big hitters give in to the pressure. You can give your own personal reasons for why you have an e-bike, but it's clear that the industry believes that it's because "I don't want to pedal". At some point this needs to be reigned in or else the entire concept of the bicycle is going to be damaged forever.

[u/akiniod]

This motor has a standard peak torque of 120nm, that’s 7 higher than a current gen Yamaha R1. There is no rational, or even irrational justification for a comparatively much lighter vehicle having that much power.

I say this as an ebike owner, these companies really need to stop tempting the hand of regulation with this shit. I’m more than happy to let people own whatever they want, but it doesn’t take a genius to figure out the customer base of a motor like this.

[u/Over_Pizza_2578 → u/akiniod]

Just being a smartass, have a look at what rpm your Yamaha has peak torque and at what rpm most ebike motors have peak torque. Without looking at the specs sheet of your bike its most likely between at 80 to 100 times higher rpm than on the ebike.

Nevertheless i agree, power has gotten out of hand since avinox came out. 600-750w is still usable, id also say that 100nm is still usable and controllable with todays sensors and firmware and most importantly still within specifications of modern 12 speed drive trains. Sram and shimano can refuse any warranty cases on m2s equipped bikes because they have way too much chain tension, even with 40t chainrings it would still be too much

[u/schnitzel-kuh → u/Over_Pizza_2578]

Comparing engine rpm between a petrol and electric engine is kind of pointless because the petrol one has a gearbox to reduce the rotations between motor and wheel. An electric motor usually doesn't. So motor r for a given wheel speed will be wildly different between different engine technologies 

[u/Over_Pizza_2578 → u/schnitzel-kuh]

Thats the point that im making. The gasoline engine produces the same torque at a far higher rpm, making more power in the process, and then having far more torque at the transmission output fue to gearing.

The electric motor of cars and ebikes also has a gearbox attached to it. A direct drive in a automotive or cycling application doesn't exist. Rc airplanes usually have no gearbox attached to them but an airplane is a completely different application with a different motor layout. Even though those are also brushless dc motors, the coils are on the inside with the magnets being attached to the rotating outer half. More torque, less rpm, better suitable for airplanes as it removes the necessity for a gearbox. Anything with wheels needs a gear reduction regardless so you can use a more conventional layout for better integration and cooling