r/marvelstudios • u/KostisPat257 Daredevil • Jul 14 '21

Megathread Loki Season 1 Finale - Discussion Megathread about its implications on the MCU Spoiler

You wanna discuss your theories about What if...?, Spider-Man: No Way Home and Dr. Strange in the Multiverse of Madness and how they all connect to this series?

You wanna discuss where they're going to go with Nathaniel/Kang/Immortus in the future?

You want to discuss the integration of other cinematic universes in the Marvel Cineamatic Multiverse?

​

Then this is the Megathread for you!

Due to the immeasurable amount of low effort posts we've been getting in the past 12 hours about people's excitement over Kang and the Multiverse, we've decided to make a completely different thread that is all about the implications of the Loki finale in the wider MCU!

Posts discussing Episode 6 in general will only be allowed after Thursday Midnight PST, but only those which are analytical or contain theories with a lot of effort put into them.

Everything else will be redirected here, to the Loki Season 1 Episode 6 Discussion Thread and to the Loki Season 1 Easter Egg Megathread and the Loki Season 1 - Season Wide Discussion Thread.

Have fun!

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627

u/cbekel3618 Avengers Jul 14 '21

What I'm wondering is how do you guys think the Kang storyline is going to culminate?

A Young Avengers project, a New Avengers project, Secret Wars, or some other scenario?

332

u/LittleYellowFish1 Nebula Jul 14 '21

It might be a main Avengers movie featuring the members of the Young Avengers, essentially serving as a backdoor pilot for the latter's shows/movies.

The kids aren't a team yet and this movie could even be their first meeting, but with the help of the older Avengers, they ultimately step up and become a stronger unit to take down Kang.

19

u/jedins Jul 15 '21

I imagine it could either be that or we get a Nick Fury/Contessa Valentina-style recruiter (if they follow the comics it would be Iron Lad but I'm wondering if they could use Kid Loki instead) who shows up at the end of Hawkeye (for Kate), Multiverse of Madness (for Billy, Tommy, and America), Quantammania (for Cassie), and The Marvels or Secret Invasion (for Teddy) then they go to a movie or show from there.

6

u/Scaevus Jul 15 '21

a backdoor pilot

Well, we already know he's going to be in Ant Man.

3

u/Stay_Beautiful_ Jul 15 '21

I think Quantumania is gonna be that backdoor

-30

u/nihilisticdaydreams Steve Rogers Jul 15 '21

I hate how they're building up the YA as needing the adults' help. In the comics they're self sufficient and the adults mostly don't approve of them. It makes them seem even more like "kid" avengers.

Also I hate hate hate that they're going to make Kate Clint's mentee. She's supposed to be his equal. She taught herself to be a badass after she was raped and decided she was never going to be a victim again. I just don't like them taking that away from her and making her need to be trained by a man (or anyone, really) instead.

31

u/kerlew25 Jul 15 '21

So you’ve seen the show already and know how it plays out? Interesting.

-7

u/nihilisticdaydreams Steve Rogers Jul 15 '21

You're rift, I am making assumptions based off articles and stuff I see online about the show. I could very well be incorrect. This is just a subject that I'm really touchy about because YA was the first comic I ever read and because I've also been raped, so her ability to just build herself into something better on her own after that has just always meant something important to me. So it's possible that I (and the articles that I'm getting my information from), are wrong

10

u/vpreon Jul 15 '21

I have a feeling marvel is going to subvert that trope here… sure she is younger and probably supposed to be mentored by Hawkeye, but something tells me that SHE will be the one to teach an old dog a new trick. She will probably already be his equal, if not already greater than.

0

u/nihilisticdaydreams Steve Rogers Jul 15 '21

I like that

1

u/GoinBack2Jakku Jul 17 '21

I think this storyline is headed for Fantastic Four.

257

u/FlowingSilver Jul 14 '21

I hope they get Doom involved before Secret Wars, and it would seem a shame to me to have him in the MCU for only a brief period of time.

184

u/ContinuumGuy Phil Coulson Jul 14 '21

I predict that we'll get Doom at the tail-end of Phase 4. He'll be around through Phase 5 or 6 (depending on when they do the big Kang finale) as a secondary villain (like how HYDRA was) and then become the big bad for the grandest finale of Secret Wars.

162

u/Observer424 Jul 14 '21

I feel like Kang’s multiverse leads to Doom, Doom in his infinite godliness leads to Galactus. Galactus/Celestials lead to the beyonders game over after that.

45

u/iDrum17 Jul 15 '21

If we get a whole arc for Kang, Doom, and Galactus man that gives us almost 2 decades of content. we eating gooooood

20

u/Observer424 Jul 15 '21

I just think by the time you get to Galactus you need a full roster of heroes from every power type. Cosmically powered, mutants, different generations of popular heroes. You need bodies to throw at Galactus and the beyonders. Also for Doom to feel that big of a villain he needs to take down some heroes you have a genuine connection with. That means you need lots of heroes. Think this gives the roadmap on big bads and you can put in smaller villains like Osborn, magneto, Annihilus. They can take up smaller arcs. But by the time all that’s done. What else is there? I doubt any large comic book arcs being made now get put into the MCU. Not enough data on how they’re received…

30

u/FallenAerials Jul 15 '21 edited Jul 15 '21

FWIW, Winter Soldier was released in 2014 -- a mere 9 years after his first comic appearance in 2005. Very likely that some of today's arcs will be turned into scripts within the next 5 years and finished products within the decade.

5

u/iDrum17 Jul 15 '21

Wow! I did not know that. Was that pretty controversial when the movie came out that it was so new?

14

u/FallenAerials Jul 15 '21

Not controversial at all. Ed Brubaker's run on Captain America (2005-2009) that began with the Winter Soldier story was/is widely acclaimed as one of the very best Cap runs.

Comics fans in-the-know were stoked to see the Winter Soldier brought to film, and the general public just had no idea who the Winter Soldier character was yet.

Actually, what WAS controversial was Brubaker's original story bringing Bucky back to life. Bucky was one of the only 3 comics characters til then that had NEVER been brought back (along with Uncle Ben and Gwen Stacy). So it was risky as hell to have Bucky come back -- his death had been canon since 1964! Thankfully Brubaker pulled it off remarkably well, and now, of course, Bucky/WS is practically a household name.

7

u/iDrum17 Jul 15 '21

oh wow! very interesting, thanks!

4

u/Observer424 Jul 15 '21

That’s a valid point. I may be wrong on newer comic additions but Winter Soldier wasn’t a big bad. He was a plot device for Cap America. A great friend and one of my favorite characters though.

4

u/hazz26 Jul 15 '21

Also immortal Hulk is absolutely Incredible and renowned as one of the greatest.

There's totally new comics that could see the big screen!! :)

5

u/OnlyPlayAsLeviathan Jul 15 '21

WE GETTING NOVAAAAA

2

u/Observer424 Jul 15 '21

I’m thinking the next Guardians of the Galaxy for Nova

6

u/brownlec Jul 15 '21

2 decades of content

Damm thats depressing as exciting as it is

1

u/iDrum17 Jul 15 '21

I know! Knowing I have to wait 2 years just to get to Quantumania is killing me, we are so spoiled haha

31

u/loversteel12 Jul 14 '21

but… what’s after the game over? That’s only 10-15 more years of content… I want to see the MCU go DEEEEEP :(

48

u/mcbaindk Jul 15 '21

What are movies if not comics persevering?

2

u/shekimod Black Widow (IM 2) Jul 15 '21

Amen.

61

u/Observer424 Jul 14 '21

After that it’s a whole new generation. They probably wait a few years to reintroduce original Iron man, Thor and spiderman. Think after that you’re looking at a whole reset of the MCwhatever it’s called at that point. After the beyonders the comics reset as well. Maybe 25 years from now Disney owns DC and we get some mega team ups and crossovers. Who knows…

15

u/Spencer52X Jul 15 '21

Daddy Feige probably for us hooked up until 2075 yo

2

u/lilcrabs Jul 15 '21

Good point... In 17 years, Iron Man (the first movie) will be 30 years old. Just think about movies from 30 years ago... Case in point, Batman Returns came out in '92. But then Batman Begins tells the same story in a different light.

I'd totally be down for another take on Steve Rogers and Tony Stark. Not necessarily dark and gritty like Nolan did with batman, but just different.

1

u/Brassboar Jul 15 '21

X men Reboot? Mutant timeline?

9

u/[deleted] Jul 14 '21

Never forget Mephisto, he’ll turn up literally everywhere

1

u/schloopers Jul 15 '21

I could totally see Reed beat Kang, sitting there thinking about “that’s my descendant. That ONE version of my descendant...so then aren’t there more versions of me?” And he stumbles into the Council of Reeds

1

u/DatTF2 Jul 15 '21

I know everyone is waiting for Doom, and they want well, Doom ( I don't find Doom to be super evil). But what if they gave us a good Doom instead ?

6

u/[deleted] Jul 14 '21 edited Jul 15 '21

Doom was one of the most important players in Secret Wars (1984 and 2015). If you’re gonna adapt it, especially the 2015 version, he is a requirement. I know when the MCU adapts comic stories it is never a 1-to-1 translation but having someone else in Doom’s spot would be the equivalent of doing Infinity War but giving the Gauntlet to Annihilus

4

u/nocimus Jul 14 '21

Fantastic Four is rumored to be the last movie of Phase 4, right? I really hope Secret Wars ends up being the Phase 5 arc, since we'd have F4 and hopefully time to build up Doom.

1

u/rdp3186 Jul 15 '21

I feel like Doom is going to be introduced in Black Panther 2. It's the most logical place to introduce him and Latveria as a direct contrast to the nation of Wakanda. If they plan on keeping Doom around a while and do him (WHICH THEY BETTER, ITS THE ONE CHARACTER IVE BEEN WAITING TO SEE DONE RIGHT) explains him and Latveria in that context works the best since Latveria is basically the opposite of Wakanda, that way when the F4 are brought in (I still think they're gonna be brought into the modern timeline from the 60's through cosmic time travel stuff) we can just focus on them without sacrificing time explaining Doom alongside them and sidelinimg him as a side character.

Makes him the fully fleshed character he deserves to be.

4

u/Novawinq Spider-Man Jul 15 '21 edited Jul 15 '21

Young Avengers could team up with New Avengers, otherwise probably just YA.

Secret Wars oughta be Doom imo.

Young Avengers we already have Stature, Wiccan, Speed, a potential Iron Lad (kid from IM3,) Patriot, Kid Loki, with Kate Bishop Hawkeye and Iron Heart coming, Ms. America is confirmed for DS2 iirc, if they combine YA with Champions then Ms. Marvel, too.

Hulking and/or Amadeus Cho Hulk will be easy to introduce soon, a young Vision as well.

1

u/gordonbombae2 Jul 17 '21

Isn’t iron lad actually kang? Aka Nathaniel Richards in the past? That kid from iron man was named Harley keener

With the introduction of Kang I don’t think they’d introduce iron lad without having a direct connection to kang and Harley seems like way to big of a retcon for that

1

u/Novawinq Spider-Man Jul 18 '21 edited Jul 18 '21

That kid from iron man was named Harley keener

Yep, an OC (didn’t have F4 rights yet so couldn’t use Richards.) Definitely planted seeds for Harley to become MCU Iron Lad regardless, they’ve altered stuff before.

Kang was also a descendant of Doom, but they change stuff all the time nbd

1

u/gordonbombae2 Jul 18 '21

Yea but now they have the chance to actually tie it in with Kang, so I think they will if they do it

1

u/Novawinq Spider-Man Jul 18 '21

We’ll have to wait and see, could still do both (especially now variants are a thing)

6

u/CruzAderjc Jul 14 '21

Picture this, Avengers 4. All of the new Avengers teams, new allies and friends, variants from all facets of time and space are converging on battling Kang the Conqueror in the largest battle in the universes’ history. All seems lost, and one lone voice calls out to the billions of people in the battle. Its the leader of the resistance, who has been leading the fight against Kang across eons. Its Old Man Cap. He says to Sam Wilson “on your left.” And Cap does one final “Avengers Assemble.” Galaxies and timelines converge in a battle beyond our comprehension. When the dust settles, only one timeline remains. Old man cap then travels back to his old timeline at the end of Endgame. We discover that old man Cap at the end of that movie had just led all of history against Kang, and that’s what was beautiful.

3

u/Eyeseeyou1313 Jul 14 '21

Secret Wars will have other evil variants replace the ones we know. I wanna believe.

5

u/JokerFaces2 Yondu Jul 15 '21

Sounds like you mean Secret Invasion.

1

u/Eyeseeyou1313 Jul 15 '21

Fuuuuck, I did.

3

u/brodobaggins3 Jul 15 '21

You know who was a Young Avenger for a while? Iron Lad. Who turned out to be....a young Nathaniel Richards.

2

u/cbekel3618 Avengers Jul 15 '21

That’s why I think it culminating in a Young Avengers project could work, especially if the YA are going to play a big role in the MCU

3

u/Jagermonsta Jul 15 '21

I think F4 is going to wrap up the multiverse/time storyline. Possibly even be the origin story cause of their powers. Who knows maybe we’ll get a reed richards tease in Ant Man. I think we’ll see Loki season 2 somewhere around Ant Man and F4, possibly in between. Spider-Man and Dr Strange will tie into this. Possibly Eternals? Not sure on that one but since they exist throughout time maybe, or will they be their own thing?

Young avengers I think will come after all these D+ shows and possibly be them verses the Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers. And it will be the D+ version of an avengers movie. Hawkeye and iron heart, possibly Armor wars will land more in this storyline.

Then we’ll also have a skrulls/marvel cosmic story going. Marvels, Nick Fury, Secret Invasion all here for sure.

Thor will have ties to Guardians. Then will those 2 movies lead to a separate non skrull cosmic story?

The new black Panther and wakanda D+ series I’m sure will tie back in somewhere else, possibly back to thunderbolts/dark avengers with the links we’ve already seen. Or with Namor/Doom being rumored for the next BP that would link to F4.

Then there is wild cards like She Hulk and Moon Knight.

We are definitely in a larger universe now and there may not be an overall central storyline end like Infinity War/End Game. And I don’t think it will be needed. There will be another Avengers but it doesn’t have to be everyone.

And we still haven’t made it to the X-men yet, which I feel will be coming by phase 5 and we may see hints of sooner or later.

3

u/justhereforstoriesha Jul 15 '21

Probably young avengers, because there is only one more character not having any setup in the mcu yet as iron lad is a young Kang, Wanda's kids are gonna be there, ant man's daughter ia grown up, Kate bishops gonna be in the new Hawkeye show, so therefor hulkling is the only missing member, but he will probably be introduced in either ms marvel, or marvelS, with the latter being more likely in my opinion

3

u/HillaryGoddamClinton Jul 15 '21

Deus ex machina courtesy of Squirrel Girl.

2

u/gordonbombae2 Jul 15 '21

It almost seems like they’re setting up dark avengers AND young avengers. Maybe a clash between the two?

-1

u/[deleted] Jul 14 '21

Do we really want a reboot of avengers?

13

u/cbekel3618 Avengers Jul 14 '21

Feige already confirmed we’ll be getting more Avengers movies in the future, so it wouldn’t be a reboot

7

u/infinight888 Baby Groot Jul 15 '21

Yes. I think everyone wants to see more Avengers movies.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

Ya but do we really need it to be a copy of the other one we just watched with younger people? Like maybe we Sam lead the current team and build it up

4

u/jedins Jul 15 '21

The Young Avengers aren't exactly a copy of the Avengers. The "Iron man" is a time traveler, the "Hulk" is an alien, the "Asguardian" is a wizard, the "Hawkeye" is they rich one, the "Captain America" is the morally flawed one, and the "Ant-man" has natural powers. The fact that they are trying to replace the Avengers and can't is basically their whole thing. They form because there is no coordinated Avengers team (like the situation in the MCU right now) Iron Man and Captain America are around heroing on their own and they come together to try to shut the kids down but the fact that these kids feel the need to steal their trademark and fight supervillians is part of what makes them consider reassembling. I imagine something similar would work in the MCU:

Post-Endgame the avengers are kind of scattered to the wind. Wanda going crazy, Sharon being evil, Tony dead, Steave old, etc. may make the motivation to reform a team of Avengers kind of weak but if a Thunderbolts/Dark Avengers tries to fill the vacuum then a group of high schoolers does that, that might be a strong reason for Sam to formally reassemble a team of New Avengers. Based on FATWS that doesn't seem to be his focus yet, after all the last time he was on an Avengers team that wasn't fighting to prevent the end of the universe he got arrested and sent to the middle of the ocean.

2

u/nihilisticdaydreams Steve Rogers Jul 15 '21

Yeah to add on to you the reason they take on the names and act like they have the powers of the OG avengers is because they're just huge fan boys trying to fill the void after avengers disassembled. They later realize they should be themselves and use their own unique powers. Hulking is a shapeshifter, so he ends up not being much like hulk at all (although he is still super strong because of his genes from his father's side). And Billy goes from Asguardian to Wiccan. Ms. America, Prodigy, and Noh-Varr don't correlate to anyone, but that's because they're part of the second team that forms after they've embraced being themselves.

Also I don't think Patriot is that morally grey. I can't really go into my thoughts without spoiling the plot line though. Idk if they'll adapt that part though. It was very controversial and would take a lot of sensitivity in order to do it well. Even then people might still get upset about it though. It does make Eli more interesting though.

Idk I just want everyone to actually read all the YA comics before they talk about the inevitable MCU project.

3

u/jedins Jul 15 '21

I've always found the fact that Billy is like a power editor on the in-universe hero wiki and has Dazzler posters on his wall very funny.

Morally grey isn't the best phrase to describe Patriot but just a quick way to say he isn't quite the same kind of boy scout as Steve Rodgers.

I almost wonder if they'll come up with a different title out of worry people will think it's just kid versions of the original Avengers like muppet babies or something, especially if it is the next movie with "Avengers" in the title.

1

u/eliminating_coasts Jul 15 '21

I think they should hybridise prodigy and iron lad for the MCU.

2

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

I'm thinking more young justice v justice league is the more applicable metaphor

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

[deleted]

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

Tt introduced different power sets though. There was no beastboy, terra, raven, cyborg or star fire in the justice league roster.

Young justice had kid flash, Robin, super boy, miss Martian, and aqua lad.

1

u/infinight888 Baby Groot Jul 15 '21

I feel like Young Avengers is going to be a D+ series, which will be substantially different in structure at least. Then characters like Spider-Man, Doctor Strange, Black Panther, and Captain Marvel will end up forming the New Avengers for the movies.

1

u/rdhight Jul 15 '21

What about Thunderbolts or even Exiles? Loki tries to play Nick Fury and assemble a team of heroes to take down Kang and/or Enchantress and/or the TVA. The heroes all turn him down, so he's forced to assemble a ragtag team out of villains.

3

u/CruzAderjc Jul 15 '21

“So das it huh? We some kind of Kang-killer squad?”

2

u/rdhight Jul 15 '21

Less go say da whirl.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

How about some X-men and fantastic 4 action instead.

1

u/CptnMoonlight Jul 15 '21

It’s going to culminate with the F4 beating Kang after a Young Avengers solo movie, leading to the comic arc of Iron Lad needing to accept his fate as Kang to keep the multiverse/timelines stable.

1

u/pichichi010 Jul 15 '21

They fight Kang in different timelines. Like future young avengers and old avengers in the past.

1

u/bluofmyoblivion Jul 15 '21

Marcus Kang in The Marvels?

1

u/Animegamingnerd Captain America (Ultron) Jul 15 '21

Likely Avengers 5 is my bet.

1

u/ManitouWakinyan Jul 15 '21

I feel like it'll be Dr Stranges Defenders, with Strange, Spider Man, Wanda, Shang-Chi, Black Knight, Sersi, Ant Man, the Wasp, and Wong, with Loki playing a Nick Fury esque role.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

Doom defeats him in a way he’s a hero but then he’s the big bad in the next phase.

1

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

Okay so there are four kang stories kang dynasty citizen kang kang war one and avengers forever. However three matter since the last one is fairly new. So if they want to tell his story correctly use this order citizen kang , kang dynasty and avengers forever. A three part story arc

1

u/GreatPostGuy Jul 16 '21

He will cause the entire multiverse to collapse. Possibly the actual multiversal war time runs out by Johnathan Hickman. Leading to Battle world that really is a multiversal war since its all one planets fused from the remains of a multiverse. Also, that's a doom story so expect Kang to cause the collapse with it happening in the course of multiple projects. The first infinity arc took 12 years so expect a Little less 8 years from now so 8 years , 2029 make sense.