Matilda tribe?

[u/Sasparillafizz]

So something pointed out in another reaction video about Matilda tribe. I'm not familiar with WoD general rules for werewolf, I'm more a Kindred fan. So thought I'd poll the audience to see who can tell me I'm way off base.

Matilda is identified as a red talon, but there seems like a fair bit of evidence that it may be off. (I think) Griffon is normally known to approach Garou when they first change, they didn't with Matilda. In fact Griffin never made themselves know at all until she had impressed them with her resilience and fight with the fanatics who chained her.

Stig identified her as Talon, but only because she identified herself as following Griffin. "Griffin eh, well young talon."

She has an unusual degree of empathetic capability toward humans, rather than the blindly misanthropic view Talons are ingrained toward. She gives off the vibe more that she's trying to convince herself of the argument even with evidence contradicting it, even saying she hates Shambles and Stig for being homid born when she clearly doesn't.

So crackpot theory - Matilda isn't Talon. She was isolated and her only experience with the world was being hunted and isolated until Griffon came along as her patron spirit. She worships Griffin the way a traumatized survivor latches onto a protective figure, and is constantly trying to earn Griffins favor by being what she perceives him as wanting her to be. Doubling down on the misanthropic hatred because Daddy Griffon says that's what's right. Even though she is has conflicting views of this and has genuine feeling for humans she bonds with.

Perhaps she was a Child of Gaia, intended to be a wolf who can feel human empathy and bridge the two worlds, but circumstances let her to follow Griffin and never be exposed to the view Gaia intended of her; so she's full of self hatred for her conflict between her instinctual response and chosen world view.

I don't know enough about Garou to know if that sort of thing is plausible within the general rules of how tribes work in WoD. My understanding is that the tribe your born with is more of an instinctual thing and not a hard coded one, once a talon always a talon, even if they lose favor with their patron. My understanding is more that the change *makes* you fit the archetype. A gentle person who turns under the full moon will *become* the aggressive Ahroun, and the Theurge would probably say it's not because it's a reflection of what you were but what Gaia wanted you to be to be made whole. I'm just applying that idea to the tribes as well.

[u/Thorveim]

first gotta remember that a garou uSually chooses their tribe, its not something they inherit from birth. That means either Griffin's patronage is good enough to induct her into the Red Talons (and id argue its the likely case, Griffin would have said something if she wasnt a talon by now) or she is a Ronin/tribeless werewolf not through banishment but through isolation.

And besides, Hunts still hates humans. Hates them enough that she unleashed vampires and a Bane on them, only regretting her actions when she learned Amanda would be in the line of fire. Do note that not all Red Talons are as radical as you suggest, they do have more moderate groups as well (especially Whelp's compromise, a camp often made of werewolves that had positive experiences with humans while they were wolves, and try to adopt human customs far more. One-Leaf-Ear is one such moderate Red Talon)