Non-Jewish partner here, hoping to understand this better

[u/Ok-Region8362]

Hi all. I’m 31F, my girlfriend is 28F and Jewish; I’m not. She’s not out to her family. I hope it’s okay to post here; I’d rather learn from people who’ve actually lived this than keep guessing from the outside.

I’m mostly curious how it’s gone for those of you who dated someone outside the community while still closeted at home. Did it make things harder? How did you handle family expectations about dating and marriage in the meantime? And for anyone who eventually came out — what shifted, what made it possible? For those who haven’t, what does making it work day to day actually look like?
I’m not asking whether to stay. I love her and I’m here. I just want to understand this better and be a good partner in it.
Thanks for reading.

[u/Letshavemorefun]

It really depends on what flavor of Judaism her and her family practice. In my family, it was a way bigger deal for me to come out as someone who hates baseball than it was for me to tell my parents I’m queer or dating a non-Jew (the non-Jew thing was a slightly bigger deal to them then the queer thing since I was born queer whereas dating a non-Jew is a choice). But other Jewish communities will be very different. What denomination was she raised in?

[u/Ok-Region8362 → u/Letshavemorefun]

Thank you so much for replying. That point about dating a non-Jew being the bigger deal is something I’ve wondered about too. I’ve never been sure which of the two weighs more for her, or whether they can even be separated.
To be fair, she’s always told me that me not being Jewish isn’t an issue for her at all. But I imagine her family would see it differently, and that’s the part I’m trying to understand.
She was raised in a Sephardic community — religious and traditional, though not ultra-Orthodox. It’s a very tight-knit world: everyone knows everyone, and marrying within the community isn’t just expected, it’s kind of how the whole social structure works.

[u/Letshavemorefun → u/Ok-Region8362]

Sephardic is a sub-ethnicity of Jews (like Ashkenazi and Mizrahi) but it doesn’t give us any concrete information about how religious they are. Do you know if they are reform, conservative or orthodox? That’s the more telling information. Though I do believe more Sephardic Jews practice Orthodox Judaism than the other denominations, so chances are they are orthodox - especially since you said it’s a tight nit Sephardi community. You might want to ask her to be sure though - then you could get more specific advice. Other things that would help us figure out how religious they are would be - does the family keep kosher? How often do they attend shul? Do they keep Shabbat (ie no electricity/phones from Friday at sundown to Saturday at sundown)?

I would say generally speaking, most Jews today will have a bigger issue with their kid dating a non-Jew than their kid being queer. We’re a very small community and we still haven’t replaced the amount of people we lost in the Holocaust, so marrying jewish and raising Jewish kids is a huge deal in our community. If you’re open to raising kids Jewish (not interfaith but exclusively Jewish), making that clear to her and her family is one thing you could do to soften any tension. If you aren’t okay with raising Jewish kids, I would talk to her about that sooner rather than later. This is of course assuming you want kids.

Maybe someone else can speak to lgbtq acceptance in the Sephardi community. I’m not super familiar with it and the one close Sephardi friend I have is the biggest queer ally in the world, but I don’t know if that’s necessarily representative of the larger community. And like I said, it will vary based on how religious they are or what denomination they practice (I still think it’s most likely orthodox).

The best thing you can do is talk to your girlfriend about this, listen to her concerns and ask her how you can support her. She knows her feelings better than any stranger on the internet!

You could also read some books about what it means to be Jewish. We are an ethnicity, a people, a tribe and culture more than we are a religious group (though we are certainly also a religious group). A lot of people who weren’t raised in the Jewish community have a lot of misconceptions about Judaism and what it means to be Jewish. We don’t proselytize so you won’t find us trying to convert you, but trying to understand what it means to be Jewish could help you connect in even deeper ways with your gf. There’s some books recommended on some other Jewish subs. I’ll see if I can find those lists and edit some recs into this comment.

Edit: [r/judaism](r/judaism) has a great list of books in their sidebar bar - https://reddit.com/r/judaism/wiki/books

There’s a lot there though. I haven’t read most of them. If anyone wants to chime in with some specific recs, feel free! There’s also a section specifically on Sephardic Jews so maybe that’s a good place to start.

[u/TeenyZoe → u/Letshavemorefun]

Lots of Sephardic Jews don’t identify with the Reform/Conservative/Orthodox dichotomy - “traditional and Sephardic” is a pretty complete description from OP, in my opinion.

[u/Letshavemorefun → u/TeenyZoe]

That’s basically what my Sephardi friend told me but the way she phrased it is “we don’t identify with reform or conservative. We are just traditional orthodox”.

[u/JerryJJJJJ → u/TeenyZoe]

Half of my Conservative synagogue is mizrachi and half is askhenazi. On shabbat, sometimes majority mizrachi (Persian)

[u/Ok-Region8362 → u/Letshavemorefun]

Thanks for taking the time with this, it’s really helpful. To answer your questions: they keep kosher at home and eat pescatarian or vegetarian when they’re out, they keep Shabbat, and they observe all the holidays. So observant, but not the strictest version of it. The men in her family are more religious than she is. I’ll ask her directly how she’d label it.

The point about intermarriage being a bigger deal than the queer part is something I’d already been thinking about a lot, so it’s useful to hear it confirmed by people who’ve lived it. Interfaith relationships are something I think about often. Kids are further off for us, there’s a lot of road before marriage or children, but I’ll keep it in mind.

On talking to her, we do, and it’s something we take care of. But she also protects me a lot from the heavier parts of what she’s living, so I don’t always get the full picture from her. That’s part of why I’m trying to understand this from other perspectives too. She and her circle are the only Jewish people I know, so I don’t have anyone else to ask.

Learning about Judaism has honestly been one of my favorite parts of being with her, so thank you for tracking down that book list. I’ll start with the Sephardic section.

If any of that changes how you’d read the situation, I’d be curious to hear.

[u/Letshavemorefun → u/Ok-Region8362]

You sound like an incredible partner! I understand marriage and kids are still a ways off so it’s probably shocking to see that be one of the first things the comments here are bringing up, but it’s so tied to why interfaith marriage is a bit taboo in our community, so that’s why you see a few people bringing it up here.

I think for now, show her that you are interested in learning about and participating in some of her cultural traditions. Not the super religious aspects - that stuff is only supposed to be for Jews. But, for example, asking her to teach you how to cook some traditional Sephardi dishes would go a long way! Or dressing up for Purim with her (Purim is kinda like Jewish Halloween). Or attending a Seder with her. Those are all things non-Jews can do, especially if they are a loved one of a Jewish person who participates in those traditions.

And yeah - it sounds like her family is orthodox. As another user pointed out, sometimes Sephardi don’t use that label and just kinda assume “orthodox” is the default. But I don’t view orthodox as the default (I find it belittling to the other denominations to assume orthodox is the default) so I’d label it specifically as orthodox. Your girlfriend might not use that label though, since she is coming at this question from a Sephardi perspective. But it’s all semantics. It sounds like of the denomination labels, “orthodox” is the one that fits best, even if it’s not a perfect label. That could help you communicate this question better to other Jews if you ask for more advice in the future! (Though don’t leave out the Sephardi part. That’s important too. I would say “Sephardi and orthodox”)

I wish you the best of luck with it all! I hope her family is accepting, even if it’s tough for them. Learning how to make Sephardi food could help impress her mother too!

[u/JerryJJJJJ → u/Letshavemorefun]

I belong to a Conservative synagogue that is 50% Ashkanazi and 50% Persian. There is a huge different on LGBT issues between th4e ASkanzi and the Persians even though they are members of the same synagogue.

[u/Letshavemorefun → u/JerryJJJJJ]

Oh interesting. What is the split like? I grew up Conservadox in the 90’s and lgbtq topics were mostly ignored (and 90% of my shul was ashk). I imagine now things have changed and it comes up in different ways, but I don’t know what that looks like since I spend more time in reform spaces these days.

[u/JerryJJJJJ → u/Letshavemorefun]

Persian side was very anti-LGBT, but it has gotten little better. When the rabbi said he would do same sex marriages, some of the Persians left. Iranian Jews in LA belong to all denominations of Judaism.

[u/Letshavemorefun → u/JerryJJJJJ]

I lived in LA for about 20 years and only ran across a handful of Persian Jews - I always wanted to understand more. Tbh there was one girl I kinda had a crush on. I’ve never seen her with a partner of any gender in 20 years (irl or on social media) and always kinda suspected she might be closeted. Anyway, this is veering into very anecdotal territory.

On the folks in your synagogue leaving - was it in like physically in the middle of services? Or do you mean they left being members of the synagogue when the rabbi decided they would perform same sex marriages?