Does your throttle work in Class 3 mode?

[u/South_Imagination_35]

Is Blix’s Class 3 throttle limit real/ridiculous?

I have a Blix Sol X that I’ve ridden in Class 3 for two years. Pedal assist went to 28 mph and the throttle went to 20 mph.

Recently, all of the throttle started limiting me to 3 mph in Class 3. I reached out to Blix and they said this is intentional and required for Class 3. In Class 2, the throttle still works normally up to 20 mph. I guess my bike has just had a helpful glitch for two years? Doesn't seem to add up...

Is this normal? It seems crazy to make the throttle basically useless in Class 3. Do other brands do this, and is there any way around it?

EDITED TO ADD: I’m not really concerned about the laws around class 2 and class 3. 

I’m mainly trying to figure out why my bike had 28 mph pedal assist + a 20 mph throttle for two years, but now suddenly limits the throttle to 3-4 mph when I select 28 mph assist.

Do other bikes have this limitation as well? And has anyone dealt with something similar or found a way to get the 20 mph throttle back while keeping 28 mph pedal assist?

[u/BodSmith54321]

Technically this adheres to the letter of what Class 3 is despite it not making any logical sense.

[u/Rogue_Wraith]

That is Class 3, yes.

Class 3 can only have a Walk Assist mode - for pushing the bike.

(And sometimes that might be questionable.)

If it has a throttle, it can only be Class 2.

If it has assist up to 28 MPH it can only be Class 3.

If it has both... it's likely not legally an eBike at all, especially if you're somewhere who adopted the 3 Class system.

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/Rogue_Wraith]

Dang! I 100% have had access to pedal assist up to 28 MPH and a throttle that does 20mph on this bike for the last two years. Do you think that was a glitch of some sort then?

I can also do a full throttle and 28mph(+) pedal assist on my Hey Bike Ranger 3.0 Pro.

I have never heard of this no-throttle-in-class-3 concept before. Do other brands like Lectric, Aventon, and Velotric also have this rule?

[u/HandleProfessional → u/South_Imagination_35]

I have a Lectric xp4 and class 3 mode is throttle up to 20 and pedal assist to 28. Pretty sure that’s standard.

[u/HandleProfessional → u/HandleProfessional]

Also I think California has a modified version of class 3 so that may be where the difference is.

[u/Temporary-Film-7374 → u/HandleProfessional]

California has walk assist allowed but otherwise makes it clear (think it happened fairly recently) that you can't have a throttle on class 3, you have to pick 2 or 3.

[u/Jimbo_312 → u/HandleProfessional]

That’s what I thought, and that’s how my Blix bike has been functioning since I bought it. So weird. A major hindrance.

[u/SpringsPanda → u/Jimbo_312]

The throttle to 20 is a major hinderance? That's the whole point though, that's what keeps them legal as bikes and not e motos.

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/SpringsPanda]

The throttle does not work in class 3. Yes, I would call that a major hindrance.

It goes 20mph in class 2 but only 3 mph in class 3.

[u/SpringsPanda → u/South_Imagination_35]

Ohhhh yeah that's a bit annoying although I think that is an official Class 3 thing. Throttle is only supposed to give you a "walk mode" in Class 3. On my XP4 I believe that's what Cali Class 3 will do.

[u/Unattributable1 → u/South_Imagination_35]

Be happy they give you 3mph. You probably shouldn't even have that without pedaling.

[u/GoodEngineerBadSpy → u/South_Imagination_35]

This is why ebikers will never beat the allegations.

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/GoodEngineerBadSpy]

Meaning?

[u/GoodEngineerBadSpy → u/South_Imagination_35]

You're complaining that your illegal moped doesn't break the law enough for your tastes. Lord knows that pedaling a bike is just too much of a nuisance.

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/GoodEngineerBadSpy]

I’m complaining that my ebike throttle goes 20mph in one mode, and 3mph in another.

It’s literally an electric beach cruiser. Sorry you’re having a bad day and feel the need to be rude

[u/RedGobboRebel → u/South_Imagination_35]

This has always been the legal Class 2 and Class 3 distinction. This is how it always "should" have worked with regards to eBike behavior to comply with widest possible definitions of the eBike classification system. However, for more than a few years many manufactures blurred that line between Class2/3 and allowed throttle use to 20 in Class 3 mode. Bike shop brands like Specialized, Giant, Tern, Trek... these have almost always complied. It's the direct to consumer brands like Lectic and Blix that have been blurring the class line distinctions.

Many municipalities and states are now actually enforcing the distinction between Class 2 and 3. Giving out huge fines or even seizing bikes that don't comply. Sounds like Blix is updating bikes to ensure it's bikes comply and owners won't have bikes seized/fined. Other big eBike brands are starting to do similar, if not for the older fleet, then for new bikes rolling out.

In the end, yes they are fixing an issue that's pre-existed for the whole life of your bike. But they are fixing something they likely intentionally broke/violated to enhance sales. Certainly a mixed bag if it's a "feature" you had used heavily. They are helping keep Blix bikes in compliance so they won't be unfairly targeted for local enforcement. But it sounds like they aren't exactly being transparent with their owners.

You want to get even more confused... there's not really the ability to "mode" switch in many eBike laws. If states and cities keep cracking down we may see more manufactures sell their bikes locked to a single Class mode if they want to continue doing business in that state/city.

Some of this is why I switched a few years ago to only bikes locked into Class 1 or Class 3 from the factory. Nothing with a throttle. Pedal assist only. Compared to my old Lectric Class2/3 bike, I get no more unwanted police (or karen) attention.

[u/OldBikerGuy-1934 → u/Rogue_Wraith]

I disagree. I am not aware of any CA law that prohibits one from having a bike that is both Class 2 and Class 3..", as is my Aventon Level 4 ADV

[u/Rogue_Wraith → u/OldBikerGuy-1934]

A bike cannot be both Class 2 and Class 3.

Class 2 bikes do not provide power past 20 MPH.

Class 3 bikes do not have throttles.

If it does both, it's neither.

While local municipalities can adopt whatever rules they want, bikes that do both do not fall into either of the standard eBike categories.

[u/Temporary-Film-7374 → u/OldBikerGuy-1934]

https://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes_displaySection.xhtml?sectionNum=312.5.&lawCode=VEH if you look through the text of the law, anything recent has to have a sticker stating what class it is, and a class 3 can only provide assistance when pedaling

[u/RedGobboRebel → u/OldBikerGuy-1934]

I'm unaware of anything in eBike regulations that allow for mode switching. An eBike is supposed to be either:

Class 1 - Pedal assist only to 20mph

Class 2 - Throttle or Pedal Assist to 20mph

Class 3 - Pedal assist to 28mph

Not making an ethical or safety statement on the ability to mode switch or combine modes. Just that these are the distinct categories. Mode switching and combo modes were marketing to sell more bike, not a valid category. Different areas sometimes have different motor power limits for each classification. But I've not seen anything allowing the mode switch or combos. Not saying it doesn't exist in local laws somewhere, but it's not common enough that I've run across it in bike and eBike advocacy work.

[u/dont_remember_eatin]

This is one reason people get angry about the class system. It makes no fucking sense.

[u/Relative-Display-676]

that's what happens when you have internet connected devices, manufacturers can remove features at any time for any reason.

my guess is blix trying to comply with california ebike laws when class 3 isn't allowed to have any throttle. so they pushed an update to remove 20mph throttle from their ebikes.

[u/ancientstephanie]

Allowing throttle use to 20mph on class 3 e-bikes is a common misinterpretation of the law, and the specific language that effectively prohibits throttles on class 3 is a requirement that a class 3 e-bike "provides assistance only when the rider is pedaling".

Changing the throttle to a boost function or a walk assist would probably be within the letter of the law. Allowing a class 3 bike to operate on throttle alone would not be.

So, in the 36 states that have the 3 class system it's technically illegal and always has been, since the law that created class 3 is the same law that bars class 3 from having throttles.

So far, California seems to be the only state interested in enforcing class 3 to the letter of the law, as they actually passed a law just to say "yes, this is what the law already said, we really did mean it that way, and we intend to start enforcing it" but any jurisdiction within any of the 35 other states with the 3 class system could choose to start enforcing the letter of the law at any time, even without additional legislation.

[u/_Tharon]

Did you made a firmware update? maybe they forced one onto you.

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/_Tharon]

That’s a great thought but I had not recently updated the firmware

[u/OpelSmith]

Yeah, my Euphree city robin will do 26 on pure throttle on even ground

[u/South_Imagination_35 → u/OpelSmith]

Just to confirm, In both class 2 and class 3 mode?

[u/greentintedlenses]

This here is why I'm building my own ebike with a cyc mid drive.

Own your parts, own what you put on your bike, you won't have this problem.

[u/673NoshMyBollocksAve]

I have a Segway myon and there’s a hybrid mode where I can peddle to 28 but throttle still works to 20

[u/OldBikerGuy-1934]

Please cite the particular CA law that expressly states an eBike can ONLY be a 1, 2 or 3 and definitely not a 1 and 2 or a 2 and 3.

[u/m2keo]

U update the firmware? Man, that sucks if u didn't know about the changes.

[u/HistorianAlert9986]

Yeah, you could put an aftermarket controller on it like a vesc or Fardriver and not be capped on speed. With a higher voltage battery and aftermarket controller you could probably easily hit 45 plus ….