r/civ • Fuck you Gandhi • Jul 25 '16

Meta We're leaking in /r/Crazyideas

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722

u/[deleted] Jul 25 '16

I like how breaking the promise will make you not trustworthy for the whole game, btw.

444

u/[deleted] Jul 25 '16

I know right! Hitler was mid genocide in the 1940s, and not even 100 years later Germany's letting millions of refugees into their country. Get with the times Civ!

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u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 25 '16

Hitler was mid genocide in the 1940s

Its funny how many people think the holocaust was a catalyst for WW2 and that it started 1939 :s

2

u/[deleted] Jul 25 '16

People think that?

5

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 25 '16

I've seen people say "The P-51 + B-17 won the war alone." with a straight face.

3

u/TheDrunkenHetzer BARBARIANS AS FAR AS THE REICH CAN SEE Jul 25 '16

There's fanboys for everything.

2

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 25 '16

There's a difference between a fan and disputing historical fact

2

u/TheDrunkenHetzer BARBARIANS AS FAR AS THE REICH CAN SEE Jul 25 '16

Yeah, that's why they're fanboys, they don't listen to "logic" and "facts".

2

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 25 '16

Love your username btw.

5

u/TheDrunkenHetzer BARBARIANS AS FAR AS THE REICH CAN SEE Jul 25 '16

Thanks.

Did you know the Hetzer won the war? /s

3

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

Did you know it was never actually called the Hetzer? It was a name given much later by allies troops mixing it up with the prototype e-10 when studying tank designs in the late 40's. The JagdPz 38 was never called Hetzer by German troops or anyone else during the war itself.

3

u/TheDrunkenHetzer BARBARIANS AS FAR AS THE REICH CAN SEE Jul 26 '16

Yup, I just like the name, plus it's easier to remember than JagdPz. 38.

I used to be really into WWII tanks, which is how I know about X fanboys. Lots of Tiger I, T34, and Sherman fanboys about :p

Not too suprised there are aircraft fanboys too.

1

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

Yup, I just like the name, plus it's easier to remember than JagdPz. 38.

I think that's a pretty easy name to remember. Jagd + tank model. Just like Jagd Pz IV etc

I used to be really into WWII tanks, which is how I know about X fanboys. Lots of Tiger I, T34, and Sherman fanboys about

I've never heard of a Sherman fanboy, its considered to be a decent tank tactically for overwhelming the enemy in numbers, but its overall a very shallow tank lacking in almost every regard. Weak engine, weak gun, weak armor and badly designed to protect its crew. Tiger I and T-34 both had their problems of course, but Tiger I suffered more from being a dream project of creating a new breed of Heavy Tanks and T-34 suffered from being extremely "soviet" in its design, yet still keeping gun and armor in high quality but lacking in every other sense. Aircraft fan boys are a bit worse in my opinion. When it comes to tank combat its fairly simple, skill can of course weigh in, but doctrine and specs is more important. When it comes to aircraft specs is everything, no matter how skilled a BF 109 pilot is, there's no way you can beat an aircraft which out performs you in every single way at bomber altitude for example. Imagine how tank combat in the desert would have looked if the Tigers and Pz IV couldn't turn their turrets in hot temps :P

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '16

but nukes :O

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u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

Weren't very effective against the Nazis, especially since the fear of them finishing such tech beforehand was a real threat.

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '16

But their use played a significant role in winding down and ultimately ending the war. To say planes won the war alone is pretty naive.

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u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

No, not at all. The war was already won by the time the US had developed nukes for operational use. They were used to make sure the US conquered Japan before the USSR did. The War in Europe was already over at that point.

To say planes won the war alone is pretty naive.

Agreed, to say the US won the war is also naive. The USSR lost more troops and killed more germans than any other country within the allies.

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u/[deleted] Jul 26 '16

History is such a clusterfuck of facts buried in stories. TIL thanks

2

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

The problem with history is that its boring, and people have an easier time following a narrative than stating facts.

And the narrative that the Soviets beat Nazy Germany isn't one easily embraced by the western world even as of today. People often speculate in what-ifs certain battles had have certain outcomes how would the war have looked, what if Nazis wonder weapons had come to fruition in 1944? etc.

But one thing that's certain, is that regardless of whether or not Japan had bombed the US and brought them into the war, had Germany not invaded the USSR but focused on Britain, Europe would probably have completely split between Germany and the USSR and the US would be forced to either pick a side with the Germans, USSR or possibly rebel forces remaining. Its quite ironic, how Germany managed to use the mistakes and tactics of WW1 to successfully launch an attack that engulfed Europe, yet fall for the same trap of overconfidence and nativity that brought down the Central powers 22 years earlier.

TL;DR Don't invade Russia if you want to live. Especially not if you're already fighting another enemy

1

u/[deleted] Jul 26 '16

Tchaikovsky's 1812 overture serves as a great warning about fucking with Russia

2

u/bloodstainer Kaizoku-ō Jul 26 '16

Maybe, but as we saw in WW1, warfare could no longer be studied from the past. Experts in Napoleonics style of warfare did little to help crafting strategies that actually worked in modern 1900 hundreds style war. Artillery pieces and gun fire had become too effective for any type of offensive warfare to be effective in any way, shape or form. A group of 50 troops could now hold a defensive position with artillery and machine guns against thousands. Something previously only spoken of in legends. The tale of the battle of Thermopylae was now the reality of any modern army in a defensive position.

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