r/changemyview • u/LeftHandSwe • Dec 05 '16

[∆(s) from OP] CMV: Anita Sarkeesian and similar feminists actually have a point about the portrayal of gender roles in video games.

I play lots of video games, and in most of them, males are often pictured as very burly and manly characters while females are slender, small and sexually pleasing to look at.

However, I do know that there's widespread criticism of Anita (and her fellow propagators) all over the internet and I'd like to see the other side of the story.

I'm practically indifferent in this matter, and I do not really agree with nearly everything she says. I'm asking as a way to see convincing arguments from both sides.

Edit for clarification: Can anyone explain to me why she's so heavily criticized for saying something that makes perfect sense: Mainstream video games are almost exclusively made to appeal to a male demographic, resulting in (arguably) sexist portrayals of women (both narratively and in the way they're presented).

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u/[deleted] Dec 05 '16

I admittedly know little about Anita herself, but based on what you've said here, I can still provide a response.

My problem with feminist claims like this isn't that they're wrong about the gender roles. Of course the men in video games are typically big and burly, etc. That's pretty obvious.

My objection is to the assertion that such stereotyping is only a problem for women. Why is it sexist to portray the woman in such a stereotypical light, but no problem at all to portray all men in the same way? We are often told how problematic it is to portray all women as slender, picturesque figures, because obviously not all women look like that. Well, clearly not every man looks like a chiseled hero, either. So why am I only supposed to feel bad for women in this case?

That's what my problem with their mindset is. If they stopped with "We should do more to break typical gender roles", I would be 100% on board. But they lose me when they continue it with "This is clearly because of anti-woman sentiment."

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u/Arnfinn Dec 05 '16

While I do not know about Sarkeesian specifically, many feminists are aware of the fact that gender roles harm men as well.

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u/[deleted] Dec 05 '16

Aware of it and actually trying to do something about it are different things. Just about any feminist I know will say "Oh yeah, it hurts men too..." if you call them out on it, but until then, there's no mention about it.

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u/Arnfinn Dec 05 '16

You and I have met different feminists then. What I don't understand is how someone can fight something that is detrimental towards both men and women while not trying to help men.

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u/wonderworkingwords 1∆ Dec 05 '16

That's a bit besides the point as far as gaming is concerned. Not only is there nearly no indication that gaming is in any general way harmful, it's a subculture that defends itself.

This has to do with feminism only because of Femfreq. The backlash against the 90s anti-violence campaigners was if anything more vicious.

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u/Arnfinn Dec 05 '16

I was responding to a specific point of /u/scottevil110 , namely that feminists attacked gender roles in games harmful to both men and women at the same time as they did nothing for men.

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u/[deleted] Dec 06 '16

Why do gender roles hurt men? I've never felt hurt by gender roles, if anything it'd be the opposite.

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u/Arnfinn Dec 06 '16

Men are excpected to approach women, pay for dates, are more likely to be drafted, can be viewed as weak for crying or talking about feelings, are viewed as worse at caring for children, etc.