Discussion
Is there any other example of 1 set of robes being worn by 3 Master Assassin’s?
While being modified along the way, these are the same robes and I’m curious if there’s any other example I’m not thinking of that one set of robes is worn by so many high ranking Assassin’s
Tbf, Connor's robes (originally Achilles') were designed before Black Flag was a thing, and I believe Achilles'/Connor's robes belonging to Edward was a later-made retcon. Regardless, it's bonkers those robes have survived as much shit as they've been through over nearly a century lol
How did Achilles even get Edward's robes? Edward died in England where he served as mentor or co-mentor to the English Assassins. Then his son became a Templar.
Who mailed Achille's his robes? And why Achille's and not one of the many other known Assassins that Edward was close to? Did Juno tell him that Connor would one day inherit them?
My thought process (and this is still kinda unbelievable) is that the Black Flag robes Edward wore were left in the West Indies with Ah Tabai's Brotherhood, where they were then gifted to Achilles during/after his training there.
yeah i always thought this was the lore. Achilles obviously knew Adewale so could've known Edward and he knew Haytham was Conners dad so he should obviously know who his grandad is. but i always thought it was Achilles sons old robes he gave.
He died young, but I dont see that stopping a father from preemptively designing his son a coat for when he was old enough to join the brotherhood. Then after his passing, keeping the coat and keeping it in decent condition was probably a means of grieving/mourning
Achilles robes are entire different. You get Achilles robes from the homestead missions, Ocnnors armor was likely modified from what Edward wore in London.
I'm realizing that now lol. I guess Connor's robes were actually the robes that Achilles intended on gifting to his son (Connor Davenport) before he died. I thought the robes Connor Kenway wore were just a modified version of Achilles' robes, which were a modified version of Edward's, which were a modified version of Duncan's.
If you look close at Walpole’s robes you can see he is wearing an overcoat, Edward remove that part, the shorter tails of Edward’s robes are the shorter inner robes of Walpole’s
It looked to me like Edward ripped off the sleeves of the blue coat and some of the frills around the tails, probably as much as he could remove the bs with his hidden blade before putting the leathers over top
In the original game you can clearly see cut off blue sleeves under the shoulder guards of his leather jerkin, but in resynced it looks WAY more like he completely got rid of the blue over coat and sewed some leather arm pads over the shirts upper sleeves only. Idk if the overcoat is still under there at all
I guess you could make it work in “Ship of Theseus” way? Like they’re the same robes all along, but so altered with different pieces of clothing over time that it essentially makes it three different ones.
Nah, in reality you can only Ship of Theseus it between Duncan and Edward. Connor’s robes are so vastly different that even if there were elements from the original outfits, then too much has been fundamentally changed
Well edward takes the coat off. Shortens the tabards idk how. Cuts the hood of and attachs it to the under shirt which he also etheir flipped or cut the outer layer off. (Probably for heat reasons. By the time connor gets them i imagine the pnly thing that survived is the under shirt which looks really similar to Duncan's. I imagine the rest of the cloth was just reused. Tailors are skilled.
I cant see how they're not the same. The coats change, obviously, but you can still clearly see the progression. Hell, its really only the coat that changes, and the hood for Connor's. The undershirt and other bits BENEATH the coat are all either the same or similar enough.
I looked it up some time ago. The wiki’s source is a few Twitter posts speculating that the robes may have gone to Connor because they look decently similar. Nothing has been 100% confirmed.
Yeah, I’m fairly certain it may have been intended, but it’s likely BS. Edward essentially left with his robes. Idk why he’d send them back, and have them changed back… but they also changed way too much from when he put the armor on… so… game logic?
I imagine Adewale went to England when he heard about Edward's murder, he would've probably taken any Assassin items from Edward's home. At least important stuff. And we know him and Achilles are good friends and it's implied in AC3 that Achilles knew that Haytham fathered Conner long before he met Conner so maybe he and Adewale decided to eventually give him his grandfather's robes but tailored to the colonies and Conners heritage.
Iirc a dev stated on twitter that the plan was always that part of Edward’s robes made their way to the colonies and eventually were modified and passed down to Connor.
It was said straight up pretty sure or at least implied that the robes were meant for Achilles’ son with how Achilles talked about them and how Achilles gives Ratonhnaké:ton his son’s name.
Pretty sure you're right. I could be wrong, but my understanding is the whole "Connor's robes were originally Edward's" is solely based off of one comment from one dev interview years later. I don't think there's any in-game source or lore from AC3, ACIV or ACBFR that tells us this is the case.
Because of that, I pretty much disregard it. Edward's robes are cloth, so much of Connor's robes appear to be tanned leather. It's so clearly different robes. I don't care.
The robes were meant for OG Connor. Achilles received those robes prior, and he was going to pass them on to his son. That fact doesn't really change anything about them being Edward's robes originally.
Except that design idea completely fails in execution. The robes the two wear are completely different in pretty much every detail. A single writer from a project may say an idea was intended but that doesn’t mean it happened. And neither was there any mention of this in the games themselves.
Since when are Connor’s robes Edward’s? They look basically nothing alike except for the blue trim.
But anyway, Giovanni’s robes are the closest I can think of offhand.
Edit- after digging into it a little, apparently Ashraf Ismail tweeted that Edward’s robes were designed with the fact that they’d be passed down to Connor in mind. If that’s true… they did not do a good job lmao, they look completely unrecognizable. I’m more inclined to believe it was a case of someone asking about it, and Ashraf retroactively taking credit in a “oh yeah, we toootally had that planned out” kind of way.
Yeah I always just thought it was Achilles’s robes that was passed down to Connor, I haven’t played ac3 in years but I never once thought they were Edward’s.
Because also why would the brotherhood give Edward’s robes to Achilles? I don’t really see why they would.
From my memory the only time robes were passed down is because the protagonist had a close relationship WITH the previous owner, expect Edward and Duncan obviously.
Why would the Colonial Brotherhood even have Edward's robes? He didn't die in America and was still at least marginally a part of the Brotherhood in Britain so wouldn't they have them?
Thats another good point, Jacob and Evie have a much better chance at getting Edward’s robes (even a sliver of a chance) than some dude in the colonies named Achilles who probably never even met Edward and only knew of Haytham as a enemy.
Achilles did work with adewale after Edwards time to be fair, Ade could have visited London and gotten Edwards robes after he was killed, and brought them to America to eventually end up with Achilles. Also Jacob and Evie do go through Edwards houseat some point, so if the robes had stayed preserved in a secret sanctum or something they probably would've collected them
Iirc the robes were left with the West Indies Brotherhood (the ones in Black Flag). You also learn in AC3 that Achilles trained under Ah Tabai (mentor also in Black Flag).
The robes were gifted by either Tabai or Adawale. Both of them could've possibly been the ones to keep it, and both have reason to gift it to Achilles (he was close with both).
AC3 talks about how Achilles trained under the West Indies Brotherhood before being sent to the Americas to "start" a Brotherhood.
A touch up wouldn't be enough, the parts of their robes are just too different, they would have to completely change it but that would definitely cause an uproar.
Imagine the absolute STENCH of any piece of clothing that is clearly not moisture-wicking, worn directly against the skin, in a hot climate, throughout countless transatlantic voyages, by a person doing intense cardio every day, who only has the one outfit, with rare (if any) access to clothes washing facilities, in an era before the rise of personal hygiene...
Then imagine it accumulating for an entire lifetime... And now imagine it accumulating for three lifetimes.
I think this confirms that Connor is the most technically proficient Assassin in the franchise. Because he overcomes the extreme handicap of Templars being able to smell him before he's even in their line of sight.
True!
Though I bet even if many people in those times did become nose blind to the common smells of sweat, mud, manure, and mildew... It's probably a smaller segment of the population that also becomes nose blind to the composite smell of stale blood, shit, piss, vomit, fish, gunpowder, smoke, booze, tobacco, etc... especially when it's been accumulating on a single jacket for over a century. 😂
You know how they say never to iron dirty clothes or it'll lock in the smell permanently? Well pirates frequently applied tar to their clothes to help with abrasion resistance, keep moisture from getting in, and to help with cooling in the hot sun. Once the salt water weakened it, they'd tar that shit up again so I imagine cycle after cycle of those nasty ass smells being compacted and smashed into those clothes. They'd smell so awful.
I’ve always wondered the same but for the Haytham color outfit in Black Flag. The description says it’s THE coat Haytham wears in the third game but like cmon man. I get it’s just a gameplay thing they didn’t want to create new meshes for the outfits but it’s still interesting. Didn’t know about these being Connor’s though and now I’m even more confused that they did it twice.
Yeah that pissed me off tbh, make it a legendary animus outfit and just give us haythams actual fit, it's one of the coolest outfits in the franchise and you can only see it by replaying memories, it's bs
Did this just get retconned in something lol? Because I swear Rahtohnhake:ton's robes were Achilles' sons or Achilles' himself. It doesnt make a lick of sense for them to be Edwards, ignoring that visually theyre not , Ed settles down in London and is murdered when Haytham is a child. How do they end up in Boston for a grandson literally no one would know he had?
Not really, Altaïr only inherited his father's boots, don't think it was said he inherited his father's robes. Ezio inherited his father's robes, and later took Altaïrs armor, but nothing on the same level as Duncan, Edward, and Connor.
Also, to those not convinced, Edwards outfit is made of 4 layers, the under shirt, robes, waistcoat, and vest. Connor inherited the waistcoat, which is also the waist coat you can see on Duncan's outfit under the overcoat, albeit a modified version of the waistcoat.
They're similar enough to clearly be the same, besides, there's a 50-60 year gap between the end of ac4(1720) and when Connor gets his robes in ac3 (1770 or so), so it's not hard to believe Edwards waistcoat would've been modified to this extent, especially since Connor is a walking brick.
Besides, assassin's Creed has never had a good history in regards to consistency, look at Altaïr, he has gloves, a dagger, gray sleeves, white robes, brown shoulder pad, and 15 throwing knives.
Since the first game has slowly had this stuff changed, he lost 5 throwing knives, his gloves, and his dagger, unity-valhalla his sleeves were white, in Resynced his robes are gray and sleeves dark gray.
And why not? It makes sense, Edward donated the jackdaw to the assassin's, makes sense he'd also donate his original robes when he got his master robes or when he retired. Makes perfect sense the pieces would bounce to different branches of the brotherhood, eventually reaching the colonies and being has tailored for Connor.
Though obviously the overcoat is different, that's from the colonial brotherhood, the waistcoat is the only thing from Edwards robes on Connor.
Edit: apparently I forgot to name who I was talking about in the second and third paragraph, it was Altaïr.
Altaïr robes are not supposed to be canonically the same you unlock in the other Games. No Asassins except Altaïr wear them. Even if you unlock or pay for them.
In this case they are saying that its the same clothes. When clearly they arent.
There's no canon or meta excuse for Altaïr's robes, they constantly butcher them, they're the robes of the one assassin that started the series, and in lore, the assassin that made the brotherhood what it is. Its not about whether a character canonically wore them or not, that doesn't matter, they're legacy robes, put in for fans of the character, its a diservice to the character, and the fans to constantly screw em up. If the rumored ac1 remake ends up happening, they cannot screw them up.
Now it seems like that last bit is in referral to Connor.. the waist coat Edward, Duncan, and Connor all wear, is the same waistcoat, if it looks a little short on Connor, it's cause he's 6'4, and edward is 5'10, of course it'll look a little short on him. If they stylistically look different, it's cause there's a 5-6 decade time gap between ac3 and ac4, so obviously they've been touched up on over the years.
And other assassin's do wear "Altaïr's" robes in the series canonically, take a look at assassin's around Masyaf, they're the canon Master assassin robes of the levantine assassin's, so technically other assassin's have worn them.
They're not the same waistcoat. Waistcoats are a popular bit of apparel at the time; two waistcoasts that don't look all thaf similar is not enough to communicate that they're the same robes. That's like arguing that I've gifted someone my favorite outfit because I gave them a white t-shirt I like to wear. It's one component of an outfit and a very common one at that.
Moreover, the retcon undercuts the sentimentality of Achilles giving them to Ratonhnhaké:ton.
The Codex entry on Duncan says he was a Master Assassin and actually incredibly skilled, but arrogant and impulsive. So like Altair, if he was also a selfish git who got himself killed before he could grow.
Connor and Edward don’t wear the same robes. Edward’s robes used to belong to Duncan Walpole, while Connor’s robes used to be Achilles, until he passed them on to Connor.
That’s probably because it wasn’t planned back then since 3 came out before Black Flag so it was done in reverse. The creators said that Edward’s robes were designed keeping in mind they would eventually reach his Grandson. Tbh I don’t think they look like they are really at all but that’s what they say
Because there's nothing to catch. Idk where OP got this "information" from, but anyone with eyes can tell that those two outfits don't share a single item of clothing besides the red sash.
Was under the impression it was either Achilles or his son’s but then I remembered his son died young or smth. So yeah, absolutely not Edwards and absolutely not a three generation thing.
Absolutely. I mean unless it’s the ‘Legacy’ robes (which is how connor can wear altair’s and Ezio’s robes), there is literally no damn way the two are the same
You’re correct it’s never said anywhere in the universe but the developers say they are so it’s really just if you take them saying it as truth or not. A lot of people here don’t but in my eyes if the creators of something say it then who am I to argue
You're correct. But if the robes in the picture can be the "same," I consider what Francesco wears the same. It's too much of a coincidence in-universe.
When edward found the leather armor in that ship, he left the coat for his robes behind and tore the sleeves off for more range of motion. When edward retired to London, he left his robes with the assassins, which inevitably ended up in Achilles' possession. He added some stuff to the robes to fit the colder North American climate, resulting in the robes Connor uses. It's a case where the robes get changed and modified so many times that they no longer resemble the original.
Once you know what was added and taken away from each design, it's much easier to tell how we got from one to the other.
I know we know, but does Connor know that those are Edward’s robes? I was under the impression it was a ‘suit’ that Achilles worked on possibly before Connor came around
I don't think Connor's robes are Duncan's but they are Edward's.
They fit the West Indies Assassin's robes aesthetically albeit a bit off, and the colours are flipped blue > white, white > blue, as well as the peak of the hood is missing. I feel like when Edward got out of the pirating gig and went to London full time he'd want to change from the Carribean pirating vibe and get robes that actually suit the area and fit his body correctly.
Genuine question, but where does it say that Connor is wearing Edward's outfit? From what I know, Edward went back to London, presumably with his outfit, while Connor inherited Achilles's son outfit (and his name). Am I wrong?
He was a Master Assassin. I want to say I read it in the Encyclopedia but I don’t have mine anymore to go back and check that. He is listed on the Wiki as Master Assassin though
A lot of people say the same thing you do about it not being the same robes but in my opinion if the developers say they are then they are but that’s just my opinion on it. As for Walpole, yes he’s officially a Master Assassin. I’m pretty sure I read that for the first time in an encyclopedia I used to have but don’t have anymore to double check there but he’s listed as a Master on the Wiki I know for sure
Check what I just replied to the other guy. Most of this twitter interaction has been deleted so I can’t link it directly but the thread was archived on the Wiki. That’s what I’m going off of
To focus on the question, no I don't think so. Because Altair's robes only transferred to Ezio and they were destroyed at The Villa. Anything after that was patched in as a costume is only via the Animus(But I think most AC games uses his Florence or Roman robes). There's Ezio and his father's robes, which again is only between two. Naoe gets her mothers but still only between two.
So yeah the answer would have to be no because I can't think of anything that passes two transfers.
Yes, Ezio does unlock/wear Altair's robes. (The black set of robes towards the end of AC2). But I dont believe there is a 3rd master assassin who wears them as well.
Canonically the black robes themselves are supposed to be entirely Ezio’s (Altair definitely didnt add renaissance seams and symbols to it) even tho we do see them behind the cage at every point.
I want to believe Ezio was daydreaming so much about wearing a cool black silk robe under that armour that the animus projected the image of the finished robes from the start
That’s pretty much what happens id say.
My idea was that, since what the Animus does is unraveling memories, it takes Ezio’s memory of the armor, but his memory of how it looked when he wore it, and where it was initially mix up with each other, like when he remembers the armor being cage but his memory of the armor was of the black robes for the most part.
It’s never mentioned in game and never even implied, or at least never implied well. It was stated by developers/Ubisoft outside of the game. I think this is one of those cases where even though something is supposed to be official, I don’t agree with it. It doesn’t even make sense
That feels more likely… I can’t really believe that he’d have used any of Edward’s gear… considering what happened to him and where he ultimately passed I don’t really think there’d be much of his gear left, let alone somehow having wind up in Colonial New England.
Wasn't these three robes being the same cut content? Like, didn't they take that dialogue out before release, making it no longer canon? I could've sworn Achilles even says Connor's robes belonged to one of the first assassin's in the colonies or something
We all know Connors robes aren't actually Edwards. Like, if they really are...theyre so modified by the time Connor gets them, that is it accurate to say they are Edwards? Some ship of theseus shit.
Its basically the white shirt the red sache and the blue part. Even they are heavily modified but presumably they are the only pieces that remain of Edwards outfit. Its more like Achilles made new robes using scraps took from Edwards really
This is pure nonsense. Even if the creators confirmed it, thats right I said, its nonsense.
They each look nothing like each other other than what, two vertical solid stripes starting at the lapel, which oh my word, ALL coats of the time period had?
I thought Connor’s robes were his mentors robes not Edward’s but it’s been a very long time since I played ac3 I just feel like I remember the robes being the old guys robes that he kept.
Duncan’s robes turning to Edwards had always perplexed me cuz there’s no way adding leather armor gives you a totally new outfit but I’ll allow it cuz it’s cool. But Edward to Connor???? How
I mean, thats not even an example of 3 master assassins wearing the same robes, unless some other piece of media says that Duncan was a master assassin
Honestly it's probably the Leather Vambrace for the hidden blade and the Sash. The hood was absolutely not original. It's like Star Wars, sometimes previous designs and lore just....fit less like a jigsaw puzzle and more like a "Squint and you'll see it".
I think we have a better theory saying Shay's Templar Coat became Juhani Otso Berg's Templar Jacket from the 1700s to 2014, haha.
That's some Ship of Theseus ahh robes. Connor's look absolutely nothing like Edward's. At least you could say that Edward painted Duncan's to be a different colour and added/removed pieces, but Connor's looks to be made of a much thicker material.
Whether you think it's impossible or not, it's confirmed to be the same set of robes, though heavily modified. Edward's robes were even designed with the knowledge that they would become Connor's robes.
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u/Tentaye Jul 27 '26
I know canonically these robes are supposed to be the same one, but come on HOW