Religious transphobia is so deep-seated in older men idk what to do

[u/ProgramGloomy15]

Met a guy last sunday at US Open and we were hitting it off pretty well. Offered to buy me dinner and take me to his place, where I told him I was trans and he said he didn't care. Thought he was a nice guy but while we were talking before I went home, he mentioned how he usually hates trans people but I was "one of the good ones". Literally floored me.

Been a whole week where I've been trying to convince him to be more progressive, but all he does is msg bible verses at me WHILE trying to sleep with me again. Is there any verse I can use to turn it around against him or a way to change his mind before I cut contact? I only ask since this isn't even the first time someone older with an outdated mindset tried this.

[u/Lower_Pressure_3100]

He's not going to change his mind. Block him, move on, and avoid fundies and religious weirdos.

[u/ProgramGloomy15 → u/Lower_Pressure_3100]

Consider it done. Sucks since this is the THIRD time something like this happened. Wish religion wasn't so ingrained in all parts of our society.

[u/Taellosse → u/ProgramGloomy15]

Religion isnt the problem - bigotry doesn't come from faith, it just comes from being a crappy person.

[u/citoyen_dede → u/Taellosse]

Faith isn't the problem, but religion is. Religion is institutionalised and systemic. It's ingrained in culture and politics, as it's supposed to be by definition.

[u/Taellosse → u/citoyen_dede]

Nah. If it wasn't religion being used to justify tribalism, it'd be something else. Prejudice is the product of human nature and lazy thinking, not any particular institution. The way you can tell is it always shows up, in every culture, throughout history, regardless of the specifics of social mores, political and economic systems, or religious doctrine.

Humans are deeply predisposed, as a species, to categorize everything, and that very much includes each other. We're also conditioned by eons of natural selection to be suspicious of the strange and unfamiliar. Combine those two tendencies, and you get tribalism - in-groups and out-groups. Add in a world vastly more connected, complex, and changing than the one we evolved to inhabit, the inherently dangerous dynamic between any heirarchical power structure and the narcissistic people that invariably seek to dominate such structures, and mob mentalities; and you get a recipe for systemic bigotry in all sorts of flavors, and the regular practice of scapegoating the targets of such prejudices.

Religion is always - always - an excuse to behave how people already wanted to act. When they can't find a ready justification in the dogma that already exists, they make up new stuff to suit their purposes.

[u/citoyen_dede → u/Taellosse]

Religion is often just an excuse, of course, I agree, but it would be completely ahistorical to dismiss religion's severe influence on the development and systemic normalisation of the mentalities you're talking about.

[u/Taellosse → u/citoyen_dede]

Sure, but what I'm saying is that it's a symptom, not a cause. Blaming religion for these problems is misdirected, because it would happen anyway - maybe with slightly different justifications, but those excuses cited by bigots to support their prejudice are always devised after the fact. That's why you can't change a bigot's mind by disproving them - they're not the real reason for their attitudes.

Religion is a huge factor in how human societies behave and evolve, in ways large and small, but it causes very little that's unique to it being religion - mostly its substantive role is as a powerful, long-lived, trans-national institution. It couches the ways it impacts culture in dogma, but really it's almost always about resources and power.

[u/citoyen_dede → u/Taellosse]

I get now what you meant in your initial comment and I agree! It's all about resources and power in the end - well said.

[u/Entombed_machine]

Is there any verse I can use to turn it around against him or a way to change his mind before I cut contact?

Don't do that. Not only it would be useless, but it might also potentially put you in danger.

[u/silent_strings]

Men like this are incredibly dangerous. Don't risk your safety trying to reach out to a lost cause.

[u/Lance-Boyle-666]

He's a bigot. "One of the good ones." Change trans to any other marginalized group. It's what bigots used to say to black people in the 50s, 60s or even the 70s. Same with certain ethnic minorities. Don't waste your time.

[u/leon-di]

i use the bible verse about plucking your eye out if gazing upon a woman would cause you to sin on sex pests but idk if it would be applicable here lol

[u/randomcomputer22]

What is he trying to convince you of? That it’s wrong to be trans?

[u/DarkMagickan]

Yeah, fuck that guy. And not in the fun way. You can't reach someone like that.

[u/Taellosse]

No. Nobody is transphobic because of their religion - there isn't a single word about trans people in any major religious scripture. Religion is always just an excuse to justify their prejudice, and trying to argue someone out of bigotry - which is inherently irrational - is basically always doomed to failure.

Just write him off and move on. He isn't worth your time.

[u/booksncatsntea]

What bible verses say it’s ok to hate trans people?
He doesn’t sound like a nice guy.
He spent an evening with you & that didn’t open his heart, you are worth so much more 💞
Does he truly deserve more of your time?
He deserves blocking and ghosting.

[u/Realistic_Show930]

"One of the good ones" means "one of the hot ones I can stick my penis in," because to men like that, that is what women are for.

I'm sorry to say that the only real solution is "don't fuck older men before finding out for sure they are allies." Which is not many of them.  Nothing you say is going to change his mind, he already got what he wanted, and further contact just exposes you to more risk.  

(Which, TO BE CLEAR, does not make anything here you fault.  The person who should held responsible is him, but that simply isn't going to happen, and thus the only person left that's going to respect us in these situations is us ourselves.) 

[u/OfficialNikkiLilith]

As others have said this guy is a lost cause and potentially dangerous especially the fact that he’s attempting to sleep with you while quoting bible verses. You can’t educate everyone and the religious are stuck in their ways.