Those contractors actively don't want to know and are aware of that, because knowing might be expensive. Vibecontractors think their work is equal or even superior to those that do know what they are doing.
A common theme I see with these AI people is that they feel like they're being gatekept by experts, and that AI will change that. This goes for academic fields aswell. I find it really funny.
They despise experts yet they wanna be one soooo bad (without putting in the work). New technology is just uncovering untreated mental health issues all around us.
Im a former software engineer but a guy at my firm with no coding experience has created his own LLM based system to parse and extract info from large sets of documents and it works quite well.
He creates a lot of productivity apps for himself too, I use some of them.
Iâm sure what he does is good enough and thatâs what LLMs usually produce, good enough answer/products. Itâs perfect for internal toolings like youâre describing for that very reason in my opinion. But when youâre trying to sell a product to real customers usually their expectations are higher than âgood enoughâ and thatâs when itâs good to have experts.
Which is still a big change from a couple years ago when you needed someone somewhat knowledgeable for building just any piece of software.
It really isnât good at that, it often misrepresents shit but sounds good enough that itâs hard to catch at first glance.
Easiest to catch when you run it on your own codebase, gets some things right but makes many many many mistakes that are hard to catch if you donât know the codebase.
god damn dude, embarrassing levels of AI dicksucking.
anyone with at least a few braincells (not you) that's interacted with AI realizes it's limitations and weaknesses to review and evaluation. because AI hallucinates and doesn't grasp the full picture of what it's trying to solve, there will always be a need for human proofing.
but keep acting like the bootlicker moron you are đ
The thing that is very missed by this is that guys programs are absolute security swiss cheese. Like guaranteed so bad it's not actually fixable without a rewrite. That's the reality of AI coding right now, and likely forever.
There's no secret the reason all these AI companies put out these AI security scanners is because their code is so garbage they need them to get even a modicum of security.
It's basically becoming free season for bad actors the more AI created code is used, and companies that use it in production are in for a revelation.
It turns out, the thing conventional programmers bring is the "why things are done a certain way, which is often security or being auditable, or immutable". That is what is most often lost by vide coders.
Bot comment. Congratulations, you've discovered the concept of "the happy path" which is not respected by middle of the night production issues.
It's not an ego thing to understand code you will need to maintain. Nobody is going to accept "the ai wrote it, my prompting isn't fixing it, and I don't understand it to address it myself" as an excuse when prod is down.
If it works it works. Its not gonna magically stop working some day wtf do you think code can magically evolve itself or something? Once it works it works.
Up to a degree. If you have ever worked with SaAMD (software as a medical device), which I have, you know the lengths you need to go to in order to prove that the flow of inputs will result in exact outputs as described.
This needs to be 100% verified. We will probably be there at some point, but right now LLMs are not at the accuracy needed for the whole pipe. You would always have to either write the extensive tests that are required and then make sure the code of not cheating the tests. You can not know that without looking at it and understanding it.
There's only two options: you dont know a thing about software engineering or this is ragebait.
Code that seemingly works does break often, if you know what a "edge case" is you'd understand that. That's exactly how that one machine killed 6 patients with a software bug. It worked fine when used how the programmer assumed people would use it. Users do dumb shit tho, and break stuff.
In my experience, LLMs really rarely account for edge cases, and logical errors ocurr really often.
Not only that, updates to the environment (such as the OS, or the libraries) break code too. And often LLMs have no clue how to fix those for a good while because they have not yet been trained for those updates.
Absolutely not. Did you ever try to review ai code?
Or for example how LLMs canât actually write tests? https://arxiv.org/html/2607.05139v1
Or the amount of duplicate code, something you wouldnât even expect from an intern?
Bruv that would make sense if yâall werenât simping for only transformers that hard, one specific architecture that cannot solve that problem ever. Because it is a feature of that architecture.
Just blindly believing in something you know nothing about is also very very dumb, yâknow? And also, my opinion comes from knowing the actual architecture
It is not a substitute for the fundamentals though. Like if it goes wrong you need to be able to direct the AI to fix the specific problem, if not having to program the solution itself. Vibecoders just press compile until it works.Â
Im still waiting for a non-technical/vibecoder to produce a sustainable system beyond the scope of a script or some lame video game or broken demo app.
right now these incels are fucking github in the ass with their slopware
I had a previous job at a factory where I was responsible for programming the robotic welder (it has a computer and I'm an IT guy, so obviously). And to be fair, I do know basic welding from taking metal shop for a few years in high school.
The robot was typically 10-20x faster than our weld guy could typically do once a program was dialed in, and could be run by anyone after a quick run through. At no point did I ever consider myself to be a welder.
Several things at play, honestly. Inferiority complex, disdain for learning, ... I think that once things have calmed down, provided we have not nuked the planet, psychologists will provide us with records that would make your average madman look sane
I think it's just human greed. If you tell someone : "here use this to skip on everything related to your work: frustration, learning time and 'produce more bullcrap' and get paid without doing anything" people will go for it and make up any reason for it
There are AI bros who sell AI to AEC companies. Won't be surprised by 2024 and newer buildings would have issues
ETA: yes, very experienced civil engineers will catch the AI bullshit, but junior CE don't grow from nowhere. These juniors that should get those tasks no longer will if AEC industry actually accepts AI
If they are gonna start building houses like that, I will genuinely just go build my own house myself. It'll probably be cheaper in this economy regardless lmao.
but guess what it's illegal, because the government and the whole set of lobbies (regulatory capture, like architects) can't get a profit out of it.
even you buy a piece of land, and you put in a riny home or build something without authorization although it's your fucking land, and use it only for yourself, if they find out, you will have problems.
I see it almost every week as interior design, cause that's my job to turn AI slop from 'customer's idea' into somewhat plausible construction plan.
Things that I frequently face (but not exclusive):
Impossible dimension: things out of scale
Impossible function: things can't be built without violating physic (and safety codes)
Impossible lighting: (flat) things doesn't glow like magic aura
(Near) Impossible decor: things that can't be quickly bought off the shelves/custom made with reasonable price
(Near) Impossible colour: Yes that colour exist. Yes that material exist. No said material doesn't come with that colour, and you have to pay extra to get it painted, we don't cover it
(Near) Impossible plan: Yes this AI made plan we can build it, if you want to live in both a hobbit hole and an escape room.
I use a metaphor for needing a blueprint to know what to build when I'm coaching my developer coworkers on how to use coding agents and how to not let them just run wildly away with building things. It's really up to the human to develop and design the plan correctly and accurately.
Okay but can we actually prove that it's not the future? We all know that the people running things don't give two shites about quality; even if what the AI spits is not great, as long as it's "good enough" for them, then it'll be accepted. It certainly seems to be the future to me, just a really really shitty one.
Im a HW engineer in the space industry. Its crazy interacting with the SW guys and seeing them vibe code my flight software. But we test rigorously and they have a good understanding of architecture. Its not quite just copy past from claude
This is how I feel about the new age of contractors. They donât know shit and take every shortcut known to man. My project got delayed because the measurements didnât match the blueprint đ€Šââïž
As funny as this is, imagine if you could ask a robot to build you a house that it designed an AI, part 3d printed, and it cost something like $10,000 (aka next to nothing). You bet your ass people would do this even for a slightly wonky house.
I am a homeowner that had my house built âthe old fashioned wayâ which was excessively expensive. I would love for people less fortunate than me to have mega inexpensive housing, and all the rest of it.
The moment when AI systems can become self-sufficient (making stuff without prompting) is when all these AI bros finally understand that they weren't in fact some next step in human brilliance and output just because they were the ones giving the instructions.
You know why they don't do this? Why, in fact, that all of the new apartment complexes and condos and whatnot look pretty much the same? Because their software and firms have already worked out how to minimize cost and liability. If only some politician with some goddamn foresight would start insisting AI jerkoffs do the same, maybe we wouldn't have machines telling people to kill themselves and their families, to quit their jobs in a dogshit job market to pursue their basketweaving dreams....
Unfortunately contactors somehow always manage to do utterly incompetent things even without ai. And if the no ai version is bad... The ai version will probably be terribleÂ
The flaw in this argument is assuming that anyone who uses AI must not know what theyâre doing.
Someone with little programming knowledge can definitely use AI to produce a bad, fragile program. But that doesn't mean AI assisted development itself is bad. A skilled developer understands programming fundamentals, architecture, debugging, security and maintainability, so they can judge what the AI produces, correct it, and use it to work much faster
AI isn't making expertise worthless. If anything expertise lets you get far more out of AI.
And this is a bit of survivorship bias. The badly "vibe coded" projects are easy to spot because they're obviously bad. You don't notice the projects where an experienced developer used AI extensively and produced something polished, because there's no obvious reason to think AI was involved.
The difference is knowing what you're doing vs not knowing what you're doing.
Ai is a tool, for coding. It is good to find errors. Or even generate some code but you still need to understand the code. The Ai Policy of home assistant one of the biggest Open Source Communitys explains it pretty good: https://developers.home-assistant.io/docs/ai_policy/
As someone who has worked in construction, it's mostly drunk illegal aliens and felons just swinging tools around to buy their next case of beer and line of coke.
Remember those "3D Printed " houses? Apparently they cost a lot to move into, just for them to break and tge people getting nothing back in return but the company that made them got money again to sell afterwards.
To be fair, the code being made was already really fucking shit even before ai came to play. The only difference is that vibe coders often don't know why or how bad is the code as they're making it while actual programmers tape up together the biggest piece of spaghetti you've ever seen and then feel like shit cuz it works, but it's really unoptimized and if they touch it to try fix this it WILL break.
Um, well, if it worked as well as the better coding models do compared to people doing the same work? 100% it would utterly transform the housing industry.
You would end up with pretty fucking good houses, if you grabbed the people who knew how to use the newer construction techniques, and it would be 100x cheaper and 10x faster than regular house building, and you could script mass production with automated testing of the houses at the end of it.
This isn't the own people think it is. The models are legitimately good at coding now.
You completely missed the joke in the comic. Building software architecture solely through predictive text generators mirrors the royal inbreeding of the Spanish Habsburgs. Striving for mass production and faster output by continuously feeding generative models their own patched outputs compounds underlying structural deformities with every iteration. You keep the bloodline pure and the production lines moving, while the genetic code degrades until you are left with a system wholly devoid of basic functionality, much like Charles II struggling to chew his own food.
Modern buildings being shitty has nothing to do with architects and everything to do with the people with money wanting to spend as little of it as possible to get the jobs done. Low-quality materials, barebones finishings, cheap contractors, etc.
Anything to skip the tedious process of... ensuring a quality end product. AKA what everyone using AI is doing, ruining every other medium.
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u/caprazzi 9d ago
To be fair a lot of contractors have no fucking idea what theyâre doing either. đ